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asep garut View Drop Down
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Points: 366 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote asep garut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2018 at 8:39pm
Originally posted by airmano airmano wrote:

Quote Asep
Not all Muslims behave as you said, for example myself, When I read a hadith, I have to search first about the truth of that hadith, because I will only accept and follow the shahih (healthy) hadith, and I believe that not all hadiths come from the Prophet Muhammad.


The problem with this is that people will "choose whatever they like" from the Hadith collection. Or, to be more precise, declare "as being 'true' [only] what, quite literally, suits their book"

For people outside Islam this is often -and in my eyes rightly so- perceived as a shell game.
In this context it also fits that there have been no serious attempts in the Muslim world to "canonize" the Hadiths and to separate "the good from the bad ones", simply because it would take a major degree of freedom away.

The prize is however a severe loss of credibility since "a truth" that can be altered at wish can't be "the truth" anymore.



Airmano

Airmano,

If anyone would "choose whatever they like from the Hadith collection", it is his choice, we can not force them to follow us, but all Muslims should follow all what God has commanded and to forsake what His forbids.

In connection with the hadith, it will be different from the Qur'an where the hadith is not all must be accepted because there are the sahih (valid/healthy) hadith and the maudhu (false) hadith, while all of the verses in the Qur'an must be accepted.
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momo25 View Drop Down
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote momo25 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 February 2018 at 11:03am
hello i'm a new member here. can i ask all of you... how can all of you be so brave to even think about Dajjal? can you share how to do it?.

honestly, everytime i remember dajjal i got terrified. these feelings really make me unstable and just want to give up my life. suicide often come to my mind because i really am scared.

can anyone please help me? soon i will have to do exam for my graduation from high school and because of these feelings i can't even focus in anything. 

i really don't know what to do.. please help meCryCryCry
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airmano View Drop Down
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Points: 884 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote airmano Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 February 2018 at 2:14am
Quote Asep
Not all Muslims behave as you said, for example myself, When I read a hadith, I have to search first about the truth of that hadith, because I will only accept and follow the shahih (healthy) hadith, and I believe that not all hadiths come from the Prophet Muhammad.


The problem with this is that people will "choose whatever they like" from the Hadith collection. Or, to be more precise, declare "as being 'true' [only] what, quite literally, suits their book"

For people outside Islam this is often -and in my eyes rightly so- perceived as a shell game.
In this context it also fits that there have been no serious attempts in the Muslim world to "canonize" the Hadiths and to separate "the good from the bad ones", simply because it would take a major degree of freedom away.

The prize is however a severe loss of credibility since "a truth" that can be altered at wish can't be "the truth" anymore.



Airmano


Edited by airmano - 17 February 2018 at 2:23am
The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses (Albert Einstein 1954, in his "Gods Letter")
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asep garut View Drop Down
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Originally posted by airmano airmano wrote:

@Asep, Peacemaker

I'm always surprised about the confidence Muslims put into the Hadiths. For an outsider they look like the magician who pulls the (white) rabbit out of his hat in case of need.
That there is no "canonisation" or separation of good and bad Hadith's speaks already for itself. Where things get however somewhat ridiculous is when Christians get accused of "forging the bible" whereas the Hadiths are 'venerated' despite the fact that they have been compiled decennies if not centuries after Muhammad's death. Needless to say that the glorification procedure around the prophet had all the necessary time in the world to unfold in order to produce what we call the Hadiths nowadays.

It is highly enlightening to read other historical texts about other ancient kings and prophets to understand that the contemporary and post mortem comments of the respective supporters should be read with a Kilo of salt.    


Airmano

Airmano,

Not all Muslims behave as you said, for example myself, When I read a hadith, I have to search first about the truth of that hadith, because I will only accept and follow the shahih (healthy) hadith, and I believe that not all hadiths come from the Prophet Muhammad.
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asep garut View Drop Down
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Points: 366 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote asep garut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 February 2018 at 9:45pm
Originally posted by Peace maker Peace maker wrote:

Asep

So you truely believe in the Hadiths.

Your concept of believe is based on a religious factor not what you believe in but how many people believe with you in the same thing.

So if the whole world of people say drugs is the right thing to do then its right like voting for a president, and one guy say its wrong than He is wrong! majority rules!

Peace maker,

Firstly, you have to see what the context is, if we talk about drugs then it will be very contrary, let alone with the teachings of Islam, with the government would be also prohibited.

Please keep in mind that the Qur'an and hadith are different, one of the differences is the content of the Qur'an are all coming from Allah (all Muslims must obey), and not all the hadiths must be believed because in the hadiths there are saheeh (healthy) hadiths and some maudhu (false) hadiths. Therefore, we must be good at addressing a hadith.
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airmano View Drop Down
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Points: 884 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote airmano Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 February 2018 at 11:39am
@Asep, Peacemaker

I'm always surprised about the confidence Muslims put into the Hadiths. For an outsider they look like the magician who pulls the (white) rabbit out of his hat in case of need.
That there is no "canonisation" or separation of good and bad Hadith's speaks already for itself. Where things get however somewhat ridiculous is when Christians get accused of "forging the bible" whereas the Hadiths are 'venerated' despite the fact that they have been compiled decennies if not centuries after Muhammad's death. Needless to say that the glorification procedure around the prophet had all the necessary time in the world to unfold in order to produce what we call the Hadiths nowadays.

It is highly enlightening to read other historical texts about other ancient kings and prophets to understand that the contemporary and post mortem comments of the respective supporters should be read with a Kilo of salt.    


Airmano

Edited by airmano - 11 February 2018 at 2:13pm
The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses (Albert Einstein 1954, in his "Gods Letter")
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Peace maker View Drop Down
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Points: 314 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peace maker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 February 2018 at 6:19am
Asep

So you truely believe in the Hadiths.

Your concept of believe is based on a religious factor not what you believe in but how many people believe with you in the same thing.

So if the whole world of people say drugs is the right thing to do then its right like voting for a president, and one guy say its wrong than He is wrong! majority rules!
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asep garut View Drop Down
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Points: 366 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote asep garut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 February 2018 at 12:39am
Originally posted by Peace maker Peace maker wrote:

Assep Garut this is what Prophet Muhammad said and you mustn't question cause it was the truth.


In a Hadith narrated by Fatima bint Qays, Prophet Muhammad once gathered the Muslims in the mosque after prayer and told them a story about the Dajjal being chained in a remote Island in the East. In our opinion, if this Hadith is authentic, the Dajjal in this story could be the last Dajjal.

Prophet Muhammad said:

"I have kept you here because Tamim Ad-Dari, a Christian man who has embraced Islam, told me something which agrees with what I have told you about the Dajjal. He told me that he had sailed in a ship with thirty men from Banu Lakham and Banu Juzam. The sea waves rocked them about for a month, and finally drew them toward an island around sunset time. They approached the island and landed. They were met by a beast that was so hairy that they could not tell its front from its back. They said: 'Woe to you! Who are you?' It said: 'I am Al-Jassasah.' They said: 'What is Al-Jassasah?' It said: 'O people, go to the man in the monastery, for he is very eager to know about you.� Tamim said that when it named a person to us we left quickly fearing that it might be a devil.
Tamim Dari said we quickly went to the monastery. There, we found a huge man whom we had never seen before. His hands were tied up to his neck and his legs tied up with with iron shackles. We said: 'Woe to you, who are you?' He said: 'You will soon know about me. Tell me who you are.'
We said: 'We are people from Arabia. We sailed on a ship, but the waves have been tossing us around about for a month, and they brought us to your island, where we met a very hairy beast. It said: 'I am Al-Jassasah.' We asked: 'What is Al-Jassasah?' and it told us: 'Go to the man in the monastery, for he is very eager to know about you.' So we came to you quickly.

The Dajjal And His Mule.

Muslim Scholar Muhammad Ali ibn Zubair Ali says of the Dajjal, � He will travel at great speeds and his means of conveyance will be a giant mule� He will travel the entire world.� 9 As strange as this is, it also bears a faint resemblance to Jesus the Messiah who also rode a donkey as he entered Jerusalem during the final week of his ministry
Ubadah ibn Saamit radiyallahu anhu narrates that the Last Prophet (peace & blessings be upon him) said, �I have explained Dajjal to you, but I fear that you might not have understood. Maseeh-ud-Dajjal will be short and his legs will be crooked. The hair on his head will be extremely twisted. He will have one eye, while his other eye will be flat. It will be neither deep, nor protruding.�
Ibn Umar radiyallahu anhuma narrates from the Last Prophet (peace & blessings be upon him) regarding Dajjal, ��red complexioned, fat, curly haired man, blind in the right eye which looks like a bulging grape.� (Bukhari)
According to the many Ahaadith describing Dajjal, the most distinguishing feature of his face besides the bulging eye will be the Arabic letters Kaaf (k), Faa (f), Raa (r), on his forehead. These letters spell Kufr (disbelief). All believers, regardless of their literacy will decipher these letters.
It has also been ascertained from the Hadith that he will emerge from between Syria and Iraq, and his emergence will become known when he is in Isfahaan, at a place called Judea. He will be of Jewish origin and the Jews of Isfahaan will be his main followers and they will refer to him as the Messiah. As he goes on through the world, Jews and a great number of non-Jewish women will flock to him upon witnessing his false miracles

Peace maker,

The hadiths that you bring up are all in accordance with my belief, because in my opinion those are saheeh hadiths.
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