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AhmadJoyia
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Posted: 16 November 2016 at 8:56am |
Saved wrote:
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
You say:
"Allah makes it clear in the Quran (at least to me) when he states "They do disbelieve who say Allah is the third of three." So, Allah implies that Christians worship Allah as the third person of the trinity,"
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Dear Saved,
Do you read the Quran or just people say? or your own embroider Allah words?
The truth is: "... Walaataquuluu tsalaatsatun (And please do not say God is three) .. intahuu khairallakum (please stop you say it, it's better for you) .. innallaahu ilaahuwwahidun (only Allah, the only one God)" and the next sentence is: "Glory to Allah from the assumption has a son,..."
Most people know that Islam is famous with "Tawheed" and very different with the Trinity (Quran 112:1-4)
Now I want to ask you, what is the name of the religion brought by Jesus when he was still on earth? Nazrani, Christian, Catholic, or are there other names? Thank you.
Regards,
Asep
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Hi Asep:
Jesus didn't teach about religion; He taught us relationship with God through Him.
As for Allah saying "Say not three it is better for you..." I am not questioning that verse. I know about it. I was focusing on who the three are according to or implied by Allah in the Quran.
For instance, Allah also said: "They do disbelieve who call Allah the third of three" Which obviously implies that Christians believe Allah was the third person of the three or the trinity he said not to say; moreover, he questions Jesus saying "Did you say take you and your mother for two gods besides me?"
The only logical inference one can make from this is that Allah implies Christians should stop calling Jesus, Mary and Allah the three with Allah as the third person. But who does that? I know of no Christians past or present who believe in God's triunity in such an abominable way. There are no Christians on earth that believe the son, mother, and father are the trinity.
My question is didn't Allah and Islam's messenger know that the Holy Spirit is the third person of the three that he said not to say to all Christians? I mean you no offense, but I am just a critical thinker. The gospel tells us not to believe every spirit but to check it out carefully and with pray.
Finally, I also know about "tawheed" a term that is not in the Quran just as the term "trinity" is not in the Bible. Thanks for your response.
Blessings,
Al |
Again my brother, not very convincing argument or should I say sheer ignorance about your own faith. Very curiously, my brother, if you happen to read about the status of Mary under various Christian denominations on the web page that I have referred, you should not miss out the specific word "Theotokos" reserved exclusively for her. Just in case, here is the web page http://www.religionfacts.com/denominations-beliefs
Best regards.
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asep48garut60
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Joined: 27 July 2016
Location: Indonesia
Status: Offline
Points: 248
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Posted: 16 November 2016 at 2:31pm |
Saved wrote:
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
You say:
"Allah makes it clear in the Quran (at least to me) when he states "They do disbelieve who say Allah is the third of three." So, Allah implies that Christians worship Allah as the third person of the trinity,"
|
Dear Saved,
Do you read the Quran or just people say? or your own embroider Allah words?
The truth is: "... Walaataquuluu tsalaatsatun (And please do not say God is three) .. intahuu khairallakum (please stop you say it, it's better for you) .. innallaahu ilaahuwwahidun (only Allah, the only one God)" and the next sentence is: "Glory to Allah from the assumption has a son,..."
Most people know that Islam is famous with "Tawheed" and very different with the Trinity (Quran 112:1-4)
Now I want to ask you, what is the name of the religion brought by Jesus when he was still on earth? Nazrani, Christian, Catholic, or are there other names? Thank you.
Regards,
Asep
|
Hi Asep:
Jesus didn't teach about religion; He taught us relationship with God through Him.
As for Allah saying "Say not three it is better for you..." I am not questioning that verse. I know about it. I was focusing on who the three are according to or implied by Allah in the Quran.
For instance, Allah also said: "They do disbelieve who call Allah the third of three" Which obviously implies that Christians believe Allah was the third person of the three or the trinity he said not to say; moreover, he questions Jesus saying "Did you say take you and your mother for two gods besides me?"
The only logical inference one can make from this is that Allah implies Christians should stop calling Jesus, Mary and Allah the three with Allah as the third person. But who does that? I know of no Christians past or present who believe in God's triunity in such an abominable way. There are no Christians on earth that believe the son, mother, and father are the trinity.
My question is didn't Allah and Islam's messenger know that the Holy Spirit is the third person of the three that he said not to say to all Christians? I mean you no offense, but I am just a critical thinker. The gospel tells us not to believe every spirit but to check it out carefully and with pray.
Finally, I also know about "tawheed" a term that is not in the Quran just as the term "trinity" is not in the Bible. Thanks for your response.
Blessings,
Al |
Dear Saved,
Sorry, here I just conclude that in Islam God is only Allah (only one), and not the same as understanding in the Trinity. Now we have the faith each others, and please if that is what you believe.
Regards,
Asep
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Saved
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Joined: 22 October 2016
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 190
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Posted: 16 November 2016 at 8:37pm |
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
You say:
"Allah makes it clear in the Quran (at least to me) when he states "They do disbelieve who say Allah is the third of three." So, Allah implies that Christians worship Allah as the third person of the trinity,"
|
Dear Saved,
Do you read the Quran or just people say? or your own embroider Allah words?
The truth is: "... Walaataquuluu tsalaatsatun (And please do not say God is three) .. intahuu khairallakum (please stop you say it, it's better for you) .. innallaahu ilaahuwwahidun (only Allah, the only one God)" and the next sentence is: "Glory to Allah from the assumption has a son,..."
Most people know that Islam is famous with "Tawheed" and very different with the Trinity (Quran 112:1-4)
Now I want to ask you, what is the name of the religion brought by Jesus when he was still on earth? Nazrani, Christian, Catholic, or are there other names? Thank you.
Regards,
Asep
|
Hi Asep:
Jesus didn't teach about religion; He taught us relationship with God through Him.
As for Allah saying "Say not three it is better for you..." I am not questioning that verse. I know about it. I was focusing on who the three are according to or implied by Allah in the Quran.
For instance, Allah also said: "They do disbelieve who call Allah the third of three" Which obviously implies that Christians believe Allah was the third person of the three or the trinity he said not to say; moreover, he questions Jesus saying "Did you say take you and your mother for two gods besides me?"
The only logical inference one can make from this is that Allah implies Christians should stop calling Jesus, Mary and Allah the three with Allah as the third person. But who does that? I know of no Christians past or present who believe in God's triunity in such an abominable way. There are no Christians on earth that believe the son, mother, and father are the trinity.
My question is didn't Allah and Islam's messenger know that the Holy Spirit is the third person of the three that he said not to say to all Christians? I mean you no offense, but I am just a critical thinker. The gospel tells us not to believe every spirit but to check it out carefully and with pray.
Finally, I also know about "tawheed" a term that is not in the Quran just as the term "trinity" is not in the Bible. Thanks for your response.
Blessings,
Al |
Dear Saved,
Sorry, here I just conclude that in Islam God is only Allah (only one), and not the same as understanding in the Trinity. Now we have the faith each others, and please if that is what you believe.
Regards,
Asep
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No, problem, but I am not sure you have understood my comments. I take it that English is not your first language. I am correct in saying so?
Edited by Saved - 17 November 2016 at 12:06am
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asep48garut60
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Joined: 27 July 2016
Location: Indonesia
Status: Offline
Points: 248
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Posted: 18 November 2016 at 11:51pm |
Dear Saved,
Yes, you are right and I am always aware that English is not my first language, although I've ever worked in one of the major American companies for 20 years.
Regards,
Asep
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Saved
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Joined: 22 October 2016
Location: United States
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Points: 190
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Posted: 19 November 2016 at 7:02am |
asep48garut60 wrote:
Dear Saved,
Yes, you are right and I am always aware that English is not my first language, although I've ever worked in one of the major American companies for 20 years.
Regards,
Asep
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Don't get me wrong; I think your English is great considering it is not your first language.
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asep48garut60
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Joined: 27 July 2016
Location: Indonesia
Status: Offline
Points: 248
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Posted: 22 November 2016 at 3:22pm |
Dear Saved,
Thanks for your kind response.
Regards,
Asep
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Saved
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Joined: 22 October 2016
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 190
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Posted: 08 January 2017 at 10:32am |
Saved wrote:
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
asep48garut60 wrote:
Saved wrote:
You say:
"Allah makes it clear in the Quran (at least to me) when he states "They do disbelieve who say Allah is the third of three." So, Allah implies that Christians worship Allah as the third person of the trinity,"
|
Dear Saved,
Do you read the Quran or just people say? or your own embroider Allah words?
The truth is: "... Walaataquuluu tsalaatsatun (And please do not say God is three) .. intahuu khairallakum (please stop you say it, it's better for you) .. innallaahu ilaahuwwahidun (only Allah, the only one God)" and the next sentence is: "Glory to Allah from the assumption has a son,..."
Most people know that Islam is famous with "Tawheed" and very different with the Trinity (Quran 112:1-4)
Now I want to ask you, what is the name of the religion brought by Jesus when he was still on earth? Nazrani, Christian, Catholic, or are there other names? Thank you.
Regards,
Asep
|
Hi Asep:
Jesus didn't teach about religion; He taught us relationship with God through Him.
As for Allah saying "Say not three it is better for you..." I am not questioning that verse. I know about it. I was focusing on who the three are according to or implied by Allah in the Quran.
For instance, Allah also said: "They do disbelieve who call Allah the third of three" Which obviously implies that Christians believe Allah was the third person of the three or the trinity he said not to say; moreover, he questions Jesus saying "Did you say take you and your mother for two gods besides me?"
The only logical inference one can make from this is that Allah implies Christians should stop calling Jesus, Mary and Allah the three with Allah as the third person. But who does that? I know of no Christians past or present who believe in God's triunity in such an abominable way. There are no Christians on earth that believe the son, mother, and father are the trinity.
My question is didn't Allah and Islam's messenger know that the Holy Spirit is the third person of the three that he said not to say to all Christians? I mean you no offense, but I am just a critical thinker. The gospel tells us not to believe every spirit but to check it out carefully and with pray.
Finally, I also know about "tawheed" a term that is not in the Quran just as the term "trinity" is not in the Bible. Thanks for your response.
Blessings,
Al |
Dear Saved,
Sorry, here I just conclude that in Islam God is only Allah (only one), and not the same as understanding in the Trinity. Now we have the faith each others, and please if that is what you believe.
Regards,
Asep
| No, problem, but I am not sure you have understood my comments. I take it that English is not your first language. I am correct in saying so? |
Yes, I understand, but what do you mean by Allah is "only one" Does that mean, for instance, he can only be at one place at a time or can he be everywhere? What is only one mean to you outside of the fact that God has no partners or other gods next to Him which I agree?
Edited by Saved - 08 January 2017 at 10:34am
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truthnowcome
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Joined: 05 April 2007
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Points: 1045
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Posted: 12 January 2017 at 8:48am |
Saved wrote:
AhmadJoyia wrote:
Good to know that, if not all, at least this part of history is acknowledged. But Question remains when these scribes (Whosoever they were) wrote from the so called "Oral traditions" and from whom (I can pen down my grand grand grand father's stories and to put credence to my version, I can simply omit the intermediaries)? Of course there were so many other versions of such "Oral traditions", and the question is why picked these 4 and not others and who selected them and on what merit or criteria and rejected others?
Best regards. | The different versions of oral tradition incorporated in the gospel never contradict the central gospel message. God made sure we had that intact. One message that contradicts the central gospel message is the Quran that came centuries after the gospel was written. What I don't understand is the Quran is suppose to confirm the gospel it states Allah sent for guidance and light. I find that it doesn't confirm but attempts to usurp the gospel. I could be wrong but I cannot see how.
The gospel had been plagiarized many times I am sure, but there are couple of examples I can give off the top of my head. Let's say I trust the primary source over a secondary one. Well, I'll give one little example:
The prophet Joseph Smith came up with the BOOK of Mormon. Mormons claim he is the seal of the prophets, but we can see that the Smith's book borrowed from the Bible; he even copied translational errors that are in the KJV of the Bible. I can go on, but I'll stop here. |
Peace be unto you. Saved, you said:
Saved wrote:
The different versions of oral tradition
incorporated in the gospel never contradict the central gospel message.
God made sure we had that intact. | What is the central message? You mean MEN OPINIONS and IDEAS?
Saved wrote:
One message that contradicts the
central gospel message is the Quran that came centuries after the gospel
was written. What I don't understand is the Quran is suppose to confirm
the gospel it states Allah sent for guidance and light. I find that it
doesn't confirm but attempts to usurp the gospel. I could be wrong but I
cannot see how.
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It seems to me some body fool you! The Quran did not conformed what you CLAIMED, but it did conformed the REVELATION that came before it. There is a big difference between the word "BIBLE/GOSPEL" and "REVELATION" What is the gospel according to you and what is the bible? please explain. Thank you! Br. Zainool
Edited by truthnowcome - 12 January 2017 at 8:50am
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LET'S SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT ONCE AND FOR ALL...NO MORE LIES!
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