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The Moon (Part 2)

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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2015 at 4:15pm
Originally posted by Abu Loren Abu Loren wrote:

Oh no, not THIS diagram again!

Yup, looks like you're gonna have to dodge it again! LOL


Edited by Ron Webb - 31 October 2015 at 4:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 November 2015 at 1:56am
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:


Yup, looks like you're gonna have to dodge it again! [IMG]smileys/smiley36.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="LOL" />


Yup, cos it's garbage!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 November 2015 at 7:34pm
It's basic geometry.

But it's even simpler than that:
- You know that as things move toward the horizon they get farther away, right?
- And as they get farther away, they appear smaller, right?
Which one of those concepts is giving you trouble?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2015 at 2:01am
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

It's basic geometry.But it's even simpler than that:- You know that as things move toward the horizon they get farther away, right?- And as they get farther away, they appear smaller, right?Which one of those concepts is giving you trouble?



I understand the concept. But it doesn't get smaller as the Sun sets, it seems to get larger. I have a theory about this, I'll give messrs. Newton and Einstein a run for their money.
Ok from our perspective when the Sun 'rises' in the East and when it 'sets' in the West the Sun seems to be a lot larger than when it is overhead. Could it be that the Sun is further away when it is right above us? Meaning the Sun takes an 'Ohm' trajectory rather than a straight forward line?
I don't know and nobody will ever know because we can't really test these things.
Of course, I'm coming from a flat Earth perspective meaning that when we look at the Sun we are standing on a flat Earth rather than the global Earth rotating a global Sun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2015 at 6:00am
Originally posted by Abu Loren Abu Loren wrote:

Ok from our perspective when the Sun 'rises' in the East and when it 'sets' in the West the Sun seems to be a lot larger than when it is overhead. Could it be that the Sun is further away when it is right above us? Meaning the Sun takes an 'Ohm' trajectory rather than a straight forward line?

No, it couldn't be.  In the first place, the sun is not larger when it sets than when it is overhead.  You can easily measure it using a pinhole camera.

More important, if it followed the trajectory you suggest, then people a few thousand miles to the west of you would see the sun as absolutely HUGE when it is overhead for them (and setting for you).  But they don't.

The sun and moon are both within a few percent of half a degree wide, for all observers, everywhere and all the time.  There is only one trajectory that can account for this: a circular orbit, with the earth at the centre, and with a diameter large enough to make differences in the observers' locations insignificant by comparison.

Quote I don't know and nobody will ever know because we can't really test these things.

Sure we can.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2015 at 9:36am
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:


No, it couldn't be. In the first place, the sun is not larger when it sets than when it is overhead. You can easily measure it using a pinhole camera.More important, if it followed the trajectory you suggest, then people a few thousand miles to the west of you would see the sun as absolutely HUGE when it is overhead for them (and setting for you). But they don't.The sun and moon are both within a few percent of half a degree wide, for all observers, everywhere and all the time. There is only one trajectory that can account for this: a circular orbit, with the earth at the centre, and with a diameter large enough to make differences in the observers' locations insignificant by comparison.


Thank you! You've just explained perfectly the argument for a flat Earth.

Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:



Sure we can.



You should have looked at the COMMENTS section as they will tell you about the problems with the article.

Another problem is the fact that we cannot for sure know the exact or approximate distance of the stars mentioned.
So it's a failed calculation on all counts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2015 at 11:07am
Originally posted by Abu Loren Abu Loren wrote:

Thank you! You've just explained perfectly the argument for a flat Earth.

Ermm
I'm not even talking about the shape of the earth!

Just explain to me, according to your theory: if the moon moves closer to the earth as it sets in your location, then why doesn't it look bigger to people to the west of you, for whom it is still directly overhead?  Why is it always, everywhere, for everyone, half a degree wide?

Quote
You should have looked at the COMMENTS section as they will tell you about the problems with the article.

There are certain simplifying assumptions, and part of the exercise is to identify them.  There are no "problems" with the general approach.

Quote Another problem is the fact that we cannot for sure know the exact or approximate distance of the stars mentioned.

We don't need to know the distance to the stars.  The distance to Regulus is mentioned (and they got it wrong!Clown) just for interest's sake, but it doesn't enter into the calculations.

Quote So it's a failed calculation on all counts.

It's a simplified calculation, which gives fairly good results for illustrative purposes.  You are welcome to improve on it if you wish.  That's what science is all about. Smile

The point is, we can measure it, even without sophisticated instruments. Thumbs%20Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2015 at 1:16pm
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

Originally posted by Abu Loren Abu Loren wrote:

Thank you! You've just explained perfectly the argument for a flat Earth.
[IMG]smileys/smiley24.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="Ermm" />I'm not even talking about the shape of the earth!Just explain to me, according to your theory: if the moon moves closer to the earth as it sets in your location, then why doesn't it look bigger to people to the west of you, for whom it is still directly overhead? Why is it always, everywhere, for everyone, half a degree wide?
Quote You should have looked at the COMMENTS section as they will tell you about the problems with the article.
There are certain simplifying assumptions, and part of the exercise is to identify them. There are no "problems" with the general approach.
Quote Another problem is the fact that we cannot for sure know the exact or approximate distance of the stars mentioned.
We don't need to know the distance to the stars. The distance to Regulus is mentioned (and they got it wrong![IMG]smileys/smiley8.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="Clown" />) just for interest's sake, but it doesn't enter into the calculations.
Quote So it's a failed calculation on all counts.
It's a simplified calculation, which gives fairly good results for illustrative purposes. You are welcome to improve on it if you wish. That's what science is all about.[IMG]smileys/smiley1.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="Smile" />The point is, we can measure it, even without sophisticated instruments. [IMG]smileys/smiley20.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="Thumbs%20Up" />



This year's Nobel Prize for BS goes to Mr. Ron Webb.
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