Jinns are not fiction

"I know my God would approve of such humanitarianism. "

Oh come off it! What a ridiculous thing to say. Most of the former Muslims that I know say that the reason they finally abandoned Islam was because of the awful tortures that your god reserved for people in hell. They simply could not reconcile the supposedly all-loving god of Islam with the monster that supposedly allows humans to suffer the most unimaginable pain for all eternity.

Allah approves of humanitarianism????? I think you've just demonstrated that you are an apologist for Islam by trying to defend such an obviously controversial position.

Well, Bertrand Russell has been dead for decades, so good luck questioning him.

I am questioning you since you are copying or endorsing his views!

Anyway, if the argument doesn't make sense, attack the argument, not the man making it (which would be me at the moment, not Russell). Gosh, this it Logic 101. Shocked Do I really have to explain to you why ad hominem arguments are fallacious?

An accuser of may be guilty of ignorance or equivocation when he is shouting ad hominem. Therefore, my stand is based on sound logic. No, do not bother, I do understand what a fallacy is and when and how it occurs.

That was in a different discussion, and I did respond to it.

I am afraid, not.

No, to nature. We would want to investigate it to figure out how such a natural phenomenon is possible. As a matter of fact, we already know that the reversing of the poles is a natural phenomenon which has occurred many times in the past and (some say) is overdue to happen again. It would be a huge benefit to humankind if we understood it, and could predict it or even delay or prevent it. Secular science may one day provide that benefit. Religion with its knee-jerk "Goddidit" response will not.

I see. So, what do you mean when you say nature? The natural physical world including plants and animals and landscapes etc. A creation that came into existence on its own? Or, are you admitting even inadvertently that Nature is driven by something or someone?


But the Quran is 1400 years old. It is not the scripture that Noah or Abraham followed. Can Islam exist without the Quran? Can it exist without Muhammad as its Prophet?

I know it is a bit difficult to wrap one's head around the idea that Quran and Islam do not have the same antiquity. Particularly, for half-baked scholars who are too lazy to get their facts right. Or, are not interested in facts. I have explained this so many times!

The truth is that Islam dates back to Adam PBUH. Noah and Abraham PBUT both followed the same code that all later prophets did. Submission to the will of Allah. Islam in Arabic means submission to the will of Allah. That is why they were all Muslims. Yes, Jesus PBUH too, was a Muslim.

By the way, Mr. Saint,

I should apologize for the length of my last post to you, which was almost double my usual personal limit (roughly two screen pages).  These discussions can quickly become tedious if we don't keep them under control.  Please feel free to respond only to the most important points, and so will I in future.

I'll respond to your last two messages, plus anything else you want to add, in a day or so.

Ron

By the way, Mr. Saint,

I should apologize for the length of my last post to you, which was almost double my usual personal limit (roughly two screen pages). These discussions can quickly become tedious if we don't keep them under control. Please feel free to respond only to the most important points, and so will I in future.

I'll respond to your last two messages, plus anything else you want to add, in a day or so.

Ron

I am glad you brought-up the subject.

Personally, I do not mind long posts. It is only when I am pressed for time when long posts become a little draggy. Anyways, thanks for the thought.