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Where Do You Stand?

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Yusuf. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yusuf. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 7:59am

Assalamu alaikum,

I'm a Muslim. I happen to have been born on the North American continent, where an ephemeral political entity called the United States of America exists at present. Therefore I carry an American passport.

Unfortunately, all Muslims living in the US must pay taxes, part of which go to the slaughter of Muslims in the Dar as-Salam. This is a form or treason against the Ummah. Therefore we must either leave the US or actively work toward changing the regime's militaristic attitude. Besides political activism, the best course is incessant dawah, to lead the many misguided souls here to the Religion of Peace.

One day there will be no more United States of America. Islam will still exist. To which does it make more sense to pledge one's allegiance?

"The future is Islam's and Islam's alone." Bediuzzaman Said Nursi



Edited by Yusuf.
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Israfil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Israfil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 12:22pm
Yusuf you can always leave bro all you need to do is pack things of necessity and go to a Muslim country. The one thing about America I do like is the choice to leave this country.
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Israfil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Israfil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 12:37pm
Another thing I wanted to add that Sister Khadijah this subject shouldn't be a problem here. As I can only answer for myself I say I am American this is the land of my birth origin. I pay taxes yes (not all go to Jews and murder) and I live here. I hate it when brothers and sisters in my faith who do not know  our tax system especially state and federal tax use the term "You support Zionist Jews and muder" I hate it very much. When you get your degree in taxation and law please come back and tell me that I am paying for weapons and murder. Til then we are American Muslims who go through the same problems as other Muslims around the world.
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Yusuf. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yusuf. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 6:14pm

Originally posted by Israfil Israfil wrote:

Yusuf you can always leave bro all you need to do is pack things of necessity and go to a Muslim country. The one thing about America I do like is the choice to leave this country.

Assalamu alaikum,

I find an American passport useful for my purposes of dawah at present, and my position in society affords me the ability to influence young people and thereby Insha'Allah affect the future.

But of course you're right, I could leave anytime. However, it is my right not to, and as a law abiding inidividual no one has the right to force me to leave either.

I have a brother in law who is a flag waving republican who looks upon me as some sort of traitor. Yet I know for a fact that he cheats on his taxes. Who is the better citizen?



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Israfil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Israfil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 6:49pm

LOL brother Yusuf touche you are right...

However if you are an American citizen why not like the country youn were born in? Because America is not a Muslim state makes it no less beautiful than Mecca. I believe that through the tragedies of American formation I believe the wonderful thing about this country is the rights that we have as citizens. Frankly, I like not having Muslim ethical police making sure I'm following Islam correctly. Frankly things like that violate Islamic practice and its teachings. Why would we be compelled to follow Islam if God specifically staes in the Qur'an that guidence is from him and that with his signs we either choose or not to follow his word.

I love America because of what it now stands for. I love the American people because its diversity is the most in the world. I like the fact that there is not one culture or tribe as they do in Indonesia, Turkey, Iran Iraq, Qatar etc. I love American law system and I believe that its ethics resemble the Islamic structure. One of the first things on our currency says "In God We trust." Of course Muslims would say "which God" the politicians would respond that its the Creator of humanity. To me that is good enough.

I love the American malls. Even though we are exposed to lustful things there I'm glad is there and it gives me the choice to put my faith to the test. Whether I accept or not I'm glad these things exist so that I'm aware of it. I do not want to make a sinful error and say "I was not aware of that."

I love the American scholastic institution because its the best in the world. I love the American women strong and proud and diverse. I love American food (Well the Halal part of it). I love the ethics of American politics and the system of voting etc. Even though there are things within the givernment I disagree with we the people of America are the ones that run this country. If we are not satisfied we protest and protest more. You see Yusuf its not so bad. I wouldn't want to live in a society that would kill me because my faith is dwindling. I wouldn't want to live in a country that would force me to pray. I wouldn't want to live in a country where women are not seen as my equal and are as respected as I am. I wouldn't want to live in a society where one type of language is spoken (i.e Arabic or any othe Semitic language).

Me personally I love being a Muslim American.

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Khadija1021 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khadija1021 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 7:11pm

Assalamu Alaikum

Brother Yusuf, you say your position in "American" society affords you the ability to influence young people.  How do you influence them?  By passing on your bitter hate and distain for the society which affords you such a valuable position in life, or do you simply thank Allah for the opportunity and means to influence these young people and show them the beauty of Islam?  I may not approve of the way GWB and those who run the US government behave regarding internal or global affairs, or even the materialistic lifestyle that is so widely touted in American society; however, I do know how to thank Allah for the good things in my life and to accept that even in things that I may dislike, Allah may have provide many good things.  Life is not black and white and Insha'Allah that is not what you are passing on to the young people you are afforded the privilege of influencing.  Only Allah knows what is best.  You have no true idea why Allah has you where you are right now in this life and in this world.  All you know is that Allah always knows what is best for us.  So, no matter where we live or in what time, it is our responsibility to live as close to Allah as humanly possible, and if we reach out to others, we should do so in a way that shows them Islam in its true light.    

PAZ, Khadija

Say: 'My prayer and my rites, my living and my dying, are for Allah alone, the Lord of all the worlds. (Qur'an, 6:162)
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Yusuf. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yusuf. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 8:04pm
Originally posted by Khadija1021 Khadija1021 wrote:

Assalamu Alaikum

Brother Yusuf, you say your position in "American" society affords you the ability to influence young people.  How do you influence them?  By passing on your bitter hate and distain for the society which affords you such a valuable position in life, or do you simply thank Allah for the opportunity and means to influence these young people and show them the beauty of Islam?  I may not approve of the way GWB and those who run the US government behave regarding internal or global affairs, or even the materialistic lifestyle that is so widely touted in American society; however, I do know how to thank Allah for the good things in my life and to accept that even in things that I may dislike, Allah may have provide many good things.  Life is not black and white and Insha'Allah that is not what you are passing on to the young people you are afforded the privilege of influencing.  Only Allah knows what is best.  You have no true idea why Allah has you where you are right now in this life and in this world.  All you know is that Allah always knows what is best for us.  So, no matter where we live or in what time, it is our responsibility to live as close to Allah as humanly possible, and if we reach out to others, we should do so in a way that shows them Islam in its true light.    

PAZ, Khadija

Walaikum assalam,

I have no bitterness or hatred! I was raised during the Vietnam War. This latter event destroyed all faith in the American government.

I influence young people by my demeanor, my happiness in life, and by making it clear to all that Islam is what brought this peace to me. 

Just because I like to post on this board from a specific perspective does not mean that is what I am like in person. For quite some time, in fact, I used a series of alter-egos that argued on different webboards from radically different perspectives just for the sake of practicing my rhetorical skills and having to develop ideas from different points of view.



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Israfil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Israfil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 July 2005 at 9:15pm

Yusuf this is the point where I come from! When there is an event (or series of events) in our lives which are negative we tend to shy away from the geenral perspective of life. In this case you mention the U.S government. Well I cannot say how you felt during that period of time because I was raised before and during the gulf war and the present war. I understand where you are coming from bro, I too do not agree how America militarily has acted throughout its history. I don't believe in the tatics and motives of today, but from how you spoke earlier you seem to take such an event and seem to have generalized all of what America is. Let me also add there there is a view you can have about the U.S which can be against what it stands for or you can have a gernal disagreement but to condone murder or hatred or even extreme dislike for the U.S to me in my view is hypocritical I use this cliche because it rings true today.

From what you have said you obviously are older athan me and obviously are more wiser than me in age and experience but the only thing I can offer here is that as one who tries to look at life at different angles I have to say that everything that we see in the world does not need to overshadow our view.

When I mentioned earlier about the taxes going towards murder I truly believe that. I feel that my brethren jump to conclusions when we discuss this issue. Yes a percentage of our taxes goes to the funding of our military, yes our taxes goes towards the funding of weapons and yes our taxes may even support some military campaigns that may go against our beliefs. But let me tell you. There are other areas where my money goes that isn't all about war. Because we pay taxes doesn't mean we iontentionally condone the action of our military. We pay taxes because that is apart of the U.S economy/government. We pay taxes to give the government its share of our labor. We pay taxes for the upkeep of our country.

Not including you in this brother but it would be hypocritical of any Muslim who hates/dislikes America yet migrates to this country for a better life. The same country that supposedly bombs his/her country! I believe in the immortal words of David Hume: "If you have an hypothesis about something test it out yourself!" I believe if you truly believe in your belief about America then leave, but you cannot sit and criticize the country in which you reside and hold all these beliefs because if so, then you yourself condone the very beliefs you loathe. again this is not including you brother but in general.

I'm sure you all heard the Arabic Assassin who was fired from LAX for making a Rap song condoning September 11th. I'm not sure if he's Muslim or not but he's an idiot. I'm sure he's a prime example of what I mentioned. He hates everything about the U.S but works in a baggage claim paying taxes to the very country he hates what a hypocrite! I can understand if you live in Turkey or Iran or whatever then you can have a logical opinion but dont work at LAX and pay taxes and eat here and at the same time spit on the country which you reside its just hypocrisy!



Edited by Israfil
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