Challenge for Muslims |
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debatedebate
Guest Group Joined: 15 March 2018 Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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I'm from a mixed background & yes I do have Muslim relatives. I don't identify myself with any 'ism' but just continue exploring. This is M Asad's translation. The one I gave is Mushin Khan. So your implying Asad is more accurate. Ok. Also you reject the gharaniq story even though it is accepted by Muslims and scholars for centuries. Ok now just have a look at the tafsir by the great Imam Al-Jalalayn (which you reject); And We did not send before you any messenger rasūl — this is a prophet who has been commanded to deliver a Message — or prophet nabī — one who has not been commanded to deliver anything — but that when he recited the scripture Satan cast into his recitation what is not from the Qur’ān but which those to whom he the prophet had been sent would find pleasing. The Prophet s had during an assembly of the men of Quraysh after reciting the following verses from sūrat al-Najm Have you considered Lāt and ‘Uzzā? And Manāt the third one? 5319-20 added as a result of Satan casting them onto his tongue without his the Prophet’s being aware of it the following words ‘those are the high-flying cranes al-gharānīq al-‘ulā and indeed their intercession is to be hoped for’ and so they the men of Quraysh were thereby delighted. Gabriel however later informed him the Prophet of this that Satan had cast onto his tongue and he was grieved by it; but was subsequently comforted with this following verse that he might be reassured of God’s pleasure thereat God abrogates nullifies whatever Satan had cast then God confirms His revelations. And God is Knower of Satan’s casting of that which has been mentioned Wise in His enabling him Satan to do such things for He does whatever He will. (* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn Quran 22 52) Now, read the following Authentic sunnah within the context of the above tafsir & Quran 53-19. Did Satan managed to make the prophet to do something else too before Gabriel informed him what happened? Narrated Ibn `Abbas: The Prophet (ﷺ) performed a prostration when he finished reciting Surat-an-Najm, and all the Muslims and pagans and Jinns and human beings prostrated along with him. USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 6, Book 60, Hadith 385 Sahih al-Bukhari » Book of Prophetic Commentary on the Qur'an (Tafseer of the Prophet (pbuh)) Arabic reference : Book 65, Hadith 4862The Muslims have full faith in the prophet & would follow any of his act without question but why would the Pagans who reject Muhammad & Allah prostrate along if it is not to their gods Lāt and ‘Uzzā?and Manāt. Or this Sahih Al- Bukhari hadith is also fabricated? Otherwise please explain this hadith. Thanks
As long one is civil & provide the references for their comments , I don't think Muslims have any problem discussing it. Isn't it they believe Allah & the truth on their side? So why fear? Ok, since you are a Christian here to get educated on Islam, maybe you would like to learn more on the following Quranic verse & Sunnah which touch on Christians. Regards And with those who say: "Lo! we are Christians," We made a covenant, but they forgot a part of that whereof they were admonished. Therefor We have stirred up enmity and hatred among them till the Day of Resurrection, when Allah will inform them of their handiwork. (Quran 5 14) Abu Burda reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying: There would come people amongst the Muslims on the Day of Resurrection with as heavy sins as a mountain, and Allah would forgive them and He would place in their stead the Jews and the Christians. (As far as I think), Abu Raub said: I do not know as to who is in doubt. Abu Burda said: I narrated it to 'Umar b. 'Abd al-'Aziz, whereupon he said: Was it your father who narrated it to you from Allah's Apostle (ﷺ)? I said: Yes. Reference : Sahih Muslim 2767 d The Book of Repentance In-book reference : Book 50, Hadith 60 USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 37, Hadith 6668 |
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Tim the plumber
Senior Member Male Joined: 30 September 2014 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 944 |
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You are on the internet my friend. Here you have come to find people who disagree with you. You have found some. You may well not be used to people openly disagreeing with you. You may find that an affront. Especially when they can support their positions very clearly and effectively. Welcome to the information age. |
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Dr. Aslam
Admin Group Male Islam Joined: 24 February 2018 Location: California, USA Status: Offline Points: 279 |
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Well we should try to have an open mind to understand anything. We should be respectful without calling names and if there is a dispute in facts or in opinion we should recognize it and move forward.
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Best Regards,
Aslam Abdullah |
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Tim the plumber
Senior Member Male Joined: 30 September 2014 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 944 |
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I presume I am not in that group as I have no faith in anything.
1, If you are not here to demonstrate that my lack of faith in any god is false/wrong/unimformed why have any sort of Islam for none-Muslims section etc? 2, How do you present a view without making any claims? Do you not claim that your God is real? Surely you have miss-written this. 3, Please present facts to support your views. If they are wrong don't be surprised when you are told so. We all get things worng and the internet is the best tool ever for quickly showing this. It produces a rough an tumble style of debate. |
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DavidC
Senior Member Male Christian Joined: 20 September 2001 Location: Florida USA Status: Offline Points: 2474 |
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I am a Christian and agree with Dr. Aslam's attitude. The purpose of this board is to provide Islamic education, not to be a outlet for polemics. Christians are welcome guests, but the guest/host relationship should always be respected. Imagine yourself pouring tea for your fellow board members when posting.
There has always been a policy here to include scriptural references whenever possible. New members please take notice. |
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Christian; Wesleyan M.Div.
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Dr. Aslam
Admin Group Male Islam Joined: 24 February 2018 Location: California, USA Status: Offline Points: 279 |
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Apparently, there is a group of people who are here to prove that Islam is anti Christ or a false religion. There is nothing new. Such people have always existed and would always exist. They would pretend anything to make their point. The important thing is not to engage with them in any heated discussion. They are here for a purpoe. They want Muslims to provoke and call names of their religious beliefs and leaders.
We are not in the business of proving anyone false. We are here to present our point of view without any claims. People themselves would realize the truth on the basis of facts. So if my Muslim brothers and sisters ever feel that they are verbally abused or some people are cursing Islam or trying to prove it wrong, be assured that they cannot do much besides what they are doing. If your faith is strong, no one can shake you. These are the people about whom wise people always say that they are quick to raise fingers at others without looking at their own self. People might attribute it to Jesus, but it was added in the Biblical literature some 400 to 800 years after the Jesus.
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Best Regards,
Aslam Abdullah |
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Dr. Aslam
Admin Group Male Islam Joined: 24 February 2018 Location: California, USA Status: Offline Points: 279 |
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Faith is a domain of belief. Muslims are the only people in the three monotheistic religions whose early is preserved in a manner that can be authenticated.
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Best Regards,
Aslam Abdullah |
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akthus
Newbie Male Joined: 13 January 2018 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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The key point is belief. Muslims believe but can not prove that Muhammad was a prophet.
Neither can Muslims prove that the Koran is the word of God because the only person who claims it was was Muhammad. It is all circular in reference. Everybody is entitled to believe what they want and practice what they want. My only objection is that when it comes to Muslim clerics pushing stories and opinions as fact when there is no evidence to back it up. I do not believe Muhammad was a prophet for this reason : When he first encountered the entity he saw in the cave there was no mention that it was an angel. He actually thought he was possessed by a demon. Also God never protected him when he was poisoned and died of it. |
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