This is why Palestine will not succeed

(since the Farfur show is what started this thread "This is why Palestine
will not succeed" , I'll stay on that topic)

Peace Bros and Sisters,

Update: Someone somewhere doesn't condone unnecessary violence
anywhere.     And you get a free bag of chips with every other gamy,
flabby and toothless post;.

However, regarding the title of this particular post, (or would you rather
not, Israfil?) let's let someone else check in on the subject

Poster from original response to Farfur video from the Guardian UK:

Actually this video was thoroughly investigated on the "War is Peace"
thread, as GrandOldMan says - and your article brings some extra light
on the issue so thanks for that.
Tijani actually did an analysis of the video (as posted on gyus.org) and
realized that not only were some of the translations skewed, but that the
way the video had been spliced deliberately made the commentaries
sound worse than they were. Here is Tijani's post :
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/nimer_sultany/2007/05/wa r_is_pe
ace.html
Tijani
Comment No. 572780
May 9 19:19
"Overnight, I have had the chance to have a look at the GIYUS originated
"Hamas Mickey Mouse" video clip (as promoted by Apparition and others
on this and other threads).
I was first concerned by the translation from Arabic into English offered
in subtitles in the video clip. In the main, the translation is faily accurate.
The only glaring distortion occurs towards the very end of the 3:27 clip
where the twelve-year-old, Muhammad, calling into the children's
programme on Al-Aqsa TV sings "This is *a* time *of* death"; and not,
as the subtitles have it, "This is *the* time *for* death." The difference in
sense is telling in both Arabic and English.
So, what is wrong with the clip? Well, it is a very crude post-production
cut and paste job, a video-montage constructed out of clips taken from
clips from three episodes of a children's show on Palestinian TV. Whole
sections are edited together with other segments to give the blackest
possible picture. It works like this:
Take a video of a Tony Blair speech. Now cut and paste words, phrases,
sentences together in an order of your choosing. Voila! Tony Blair can be
shown in a single session to have admitted anything. The edits are very
crude in the Al-Aqsa video and are clearly designed to paint the whole
show in as bad a light as possible.
This is exactly what has been done to the video content from al-Aqsa TV.
It is especially obvious at around 0:26 mins when the first segment is
rudely interrupted with a segment from the same show, but clearly
originally not sequential with the first.
Now, one might - and I do - object to the politicisation of very young
children. Even uncut it is clear that this was the ambition of the original
show. I find that very disturbing of itself.However, it is also clear that the
content is hardly as controversial as some would want.
Nowhere are violence, hate or terrorism extolled in any especially overt
or clear-cut way. The claims otherwise are clearly unsubstantiated -
even the subtitled translation cannot be shown to show that such occur
in the video as presented to YouTube by GIYUS. One might not like
Palestinians pointing out that they don't like being occupied by Israel;
one might contest their right to claim East Jerusalem as their capital -
one even might not like their support for the Iraqi people's resistance to
occupation... but such are not calls for suicide bombers, terror or even
jihad. They are statements made by others, every day, on exactly these
issues.
Interestingly, GIYUS are urging its followers to publicise this crude and
rather unsubstantial piece of black propaganda via whatever media they
can find. Presumably the recent spate of references to this video-
montage here on CiF is part of this campaign.
In all, rather a to-do about nothing in particular. If this is the best the
GIYUS mob can muster, really anti-Zionism has little to concern itself
about on that particular Zionist front."


p.s Bro Israfil, I don't know if they have a spell-checker at the prison
computer, but for someone who habitually complains to foreign posters
about their English:   as one of those of us who speak more than one
language AND English, you are an national embarrassment. And I
wouldn't have said that if I didn't know how 'tough' you were and how
thick-skinned we all need to be to deal with your 'opinions'. If you can
invest in a grammar corrector as well, I'll sport for it.   Then if there is
some sense-making software, I'll pay for that, too - if only to avoid the
sea-sickness of someone who can't speak clearly.

p.p.s God knows, but maybe you really are for peace. God bless you.   
There is an Arabic expression, "There is no peace between the wood and
the fire."

Good old MEMRI. They're responsible for the world believing Iran called
for Israel to be wiped off the map ... It's an organisation run by Jews.

Israfil is right to question every source, they each have a bias, just as
most of us do here. We all watch the news reports and read behind those
too, and then we make up our minds. It is not wrong to be opinionated,
but it is dangerous to be unmovable in your opinions, since this will lead
to extremism. However, he must be aware that in the US it is extremely
difficult to get news about Palestine which is not specifically biased in
favour of the official Israeli line.

To ask what good thing Hamas have done is naive in the extreme. As a
local political force, they have won the firm backing of their voters in a
democratic election far cleaner than most US Presidentials i.e no court of
law had to decide who was the winner. The people made a clear
statement in favour of an Islamist party which promised and provided
local services and institutions. This is all they need in a democratic
society, to claim power. However, Al Fatah and Israel, along with the
opinionated International community could not allow democracy to occur,
in these circumstances. Funnily enough, in Iraq, where democracy
brought them the outcome they preferred, they allowed the useless
current government to take power. Abbas and Al-fatah are no more than
lackeys for the Israeli/International community.

When will people start to question why it is that the side which has
suffered consistently (Palestine) is the one which must make all the
concessions? When will the international community recognise a State of
Palestine and stop imposing upon the Palestinians that they recognise the
state of Israel, before starting negotiations, when Israel has no intention
of ever recognising such a state?

Israfil you keep shooting yourself in the foot. You claim to be a Moslem
and yet you sometimes make shocking statements like: "I won't support
Hamas just because they're Moslems" which turn other Moslems against
you.

You are then siding with the likes of so-called 'Moderate Muslims' like
Abbas and his lot, who are kissing pals with Olmert and his lot. The term
'Moderate Muslim' was invented by the west to indicate someone they felt
they could manipulate around to their agenda.Someone who could adhere
to their opinions.

Just because Israel has more firepower and more political clout does not
mean Palestine should lay down their arms and cower in the corner,
wating for the next Red Cross meal. What choice are they given? They're
encouraged to hold elections, and when they do, oops, sorry guys, you
can't have THEM. Just like Egypt, Algeria and Chechenya ...

Israfil wrote: Its quite easy to get lost in ones passion by ignorantly commenting on the wrong thing. If I had long hair I'd be pulling it out. Sigh (or Sign Reader) as far as your concern and others I'm not even Muslim so save the incognito speech about me being "new to Islam." Tara, the first few sentences didn't make sense to me. Where did I say that I am passionate about Israeli children? Can you copy and paste it for me or was that something you simply drew out of my post? My position was, where is the solution to the situation? It is quite easy to go and recycle the suffering of others but what is the solution? Yes so many Muslims talk big about the suffering of a people but no solution, oh wait, let me see its the colonial chain that is holding you back? If you all cheer for their defiqance through violence then that is fine because its what you believe. I surely don't.

 Salaam Alaykum,

I don't know brother Israfil but instead of learning or at least trying to understand the factual representation...you get and still ask for more leaves me confused. The subject of why Palestine won't win and you bring up babies die everday, a mother microwaved her baby, and millions of babies die in Africa. The factual representation that Palestine will not succeed is were in your head? We have presented facts now bring yours to the table or I might be under the impression that you see this as a won lose thing. Thats the thinking that gets Israel/Palestine into lack of dialouge...and us into disagreements. The above mentioned material have won awards worldwide and this book was published by the Oxford press with scores of International Laywers and Middle East scholars. The history is fascinating and surprising how it all came to be an ethnic cleansing. Remember this is our holy land our prophet Peace Be Unto him traveled there by a miracle of Allah SAW. He visited all of the holiest sight in one night and this masjid was one of them. This is our holy land and if you don't want to face the facts that there will be nothing left of the Palestinan people from the current ethnic cleansing than sir you might want to dig deeper into the facts. The prophet Pece Be Unto Him said don't waste your time trying to to teach he who has no interest in knowledge. It is senseless. You have your beliefs and thats fine with me.

Wasalaam

Tara