seed of David.

Jesus can both have a mortal and a spiritual father. Take the example of Solomon, who was both the son of David and the son of God. In 2 Samuel 7:12- the prophet Nathan delivers the words of God to King David;
�When your days are fulfilled and you rest with your fathers, I will set up your seed after you, who will come from your body, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for My name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. I will be his Father, and he shall be My son. If he commits iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men and with the blows of the sons of men. But My mercy shall not depart from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I removed from before you. And your house and your kingdom shall be established forever before you. Your throne shall be established forever.�

David repeats these words to his son Solomon in 1 Chronicles 22:6-10;
Then he called for his son Solomon, and charged him to build a house for the Lord God of Israel. And David said to Solomon: �My son, as for me, it was in my mind to build a house to the name of the Lord my God; but the word of the Lord came to me, saying, �You have shed much blood and have made great wars; you shall not build a house for My name, because you have shed much blood on the earth in My sight. Behold, a son shall be born to you, who shall be a man of rest; and I will give him rest from all his enemies all around. His name shall be Solomon, for I will give peace and quietness to Israel in his days. He shall build a house for My name, and he shall be My son, and I will be his Father; and I will establish the throne of his kingdom over Israel forever.�

Solomon was therefore the son of David, but also the son of God.


A man can also be given two mortal fathers. Throughout the history books of Kings and Chronicles in the Bible the Kings of Judah are called 'son of David' regardless of who their immediate father was.
For example 2 Kings 16:1-2
In the seventeenth year of Pekah the son of Remaliah, Ahaz the son of Jotham, king of Judah, began to reign. Ahaz was twenty years old when he became king, and he reigned sixteen years in Jerusalem; and he did not do what was right in the sight of the Lord his God, as his father David had done.
And again in 2 Kings 18:1-3;
Now it came to pass in the third year of Hoshea the son of Elah, king of Israel, that Hezekiah the son of Ahaz, king of Judah, began to reign. He was twenty-five years old when he became king, and he reigned twenty-nine years in Jerusalem. His mother�s name was Abia the daughter of Zechariah. And he did what was right in the sight of the Lord, according to all that his father David had done.

Thus Jesus can have two mortal fathers - David & Joseph, and also be the son of God.

Edited by Lachi - 26 February 2014 at 1:46pm

Lachi wrote: Jesus can both have a mortal and a spiritual father. Take the example of Solomon, who was both the son of David and the son of God. In 2 Samuel 7:12- the prophet Nathan delivers the words of God to King David; �When your days are fulfilled and you rest with your fathers, I will set up your seed after you, who will come from your body, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for My name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. I will be his Father, and he shall be My son. If he commits iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men and with the blows of the sons of men. But My mercy shall not depart from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I removed from before you. And your house and your kingdom shall be established forever before you. Your throne shall be established forever.� David repeats these words to his son Solomon in 1 Chronicles 22:6-10; Then he called for his son Solomon, and charged him to build a house for the Lord God of Israel. And David said to Solomon: �My son, as for me, it was in my mind to build a house to the name of the Lord my God; but the word of the Lord came to me, saying, �You have shed much blood and have made great wars; you shall not build a house for My name, because you have shed much blood on the earth in My sight. Behold, a son shall be born to you, who shall be a man of rest; and I will give him rest from all his enemies all around. His name shall be Solomon, for I will give peace and quietness to Israel in his days. He shall build a house for My name, and he shall be My son, and I will be his Father; and I will establish the throne of his kingdom over Israel forever.� Solomon was therefore the son of David, but also the son of God. A man can also be given two mortal fathers. Throughout the history books of Kings and Chronicles in the Bible the Kings of Judah are called 'son of David' regardless of who their immediate father was. For example 2 Kings 16:1-2 In the seventeenth year of Pekah the son of Remaliah, Ahaz the son of Jotham, king of Judah, began to reign. Ahaz was twenty years old when he became king, and he reigned sixteen years in Jerusalem; and he did not do what was right in the sight of the Lord his God, as his father David had done. And again in 2 Kings 18:1-3; Now it came to pass in the third year of Hoshea the son of Elah, king of Israel, that Hezekiah the son of Ahaz, king of Judah, began to reign. He was twenty-five years old when he became king, and he reigned twenty-nine years in Jerusalem. His mother�s name was Abia the daughter of Zechariah. And he did what was right in the sight of the Lord, according to all that his father David had done. Thus Jesus can have two mortal fathers - David & Joseph, and also be the son of God.

Did Jesus have a father????? or was he born without a father????was his mother a virgin or was he born of intercourse??? that should answer your question.

iec786 please note these verses that you quote;

Genesis 38 (New International Version)

11 Judah then said to his daughter-in-law Tamar, �Live as a widow in your father�s household until my son Shelah grows up.� For he thought, �He may die too, just like his brothers.� So Tamar went to live in her father�s household.

14 she [Tamar] took off her widow�s clothes, covered herself with a veil to disguise herself, and then sat down at the entrance to Enaim, which is on the road to Timnah. For she saw that, though Shelah had now grown up, she had not been given to him as his wife. 15 When Judah saw her, he thought she was a prostitute, for she had covered her face.

24 About three months later Judah was told, �Your daughter-in-law Tamar is guilty of prostitution, and as a result she is now pregnant.� Judah said, �Bring her out and have her burned to death!� As she was being brought out, she sent a message to her father-in-law. �I am pregnant by the man who owns these,� she said. And she added, �See if you recognize whose seal and cord and staff these are.� 26 Judah recognized them and said, �She is more righteous than I, since I wouldn�t give her to my son Shelah.� And he did not sleep with her again.

Tamar is not the wife of Judah's sons, she is a widow and not even living in Judah's household. She is not the wife of Shelah, despite what the custom might have been. Nowhere in any Law of God does it prohibit a woman having sex with her male-in-laws after her husband has died. A wife is prohibited, but not a widow.
Hence it is not lawful for a man to sleep with his brother's wife:
Leviticus 18:16 You shall not uncover the nakedness of your brother's wife; it is your brother's nakedness. & Leviticus 20:21 If a man takes his brother's wife, it is impurity. He has uncovered his brother's nakedness; they shall be childless.
But a man is allowed to sleep with his brother's widow:
Deuteronomy 25:5 �If brothers dwell together, and one of them dies and has no son, the wife of the dead man shall not be married outside the family to a stranger. Her husband's brother shall go in to her and take her as his wife and perform the duty of a husband's brother to her.

Tamar was therefore not committing incest, because she was a widow and not married to any of Judah's sons.


However the argument from Mosaic Law is pointless when attached to those who lived before the Mosaic Law was declared by God.

Abraham married his father's daughter;
Genesis 20:12 Besides, she [Sarai] is indeed my [Abram's] sister, the daughter of my father though not the daughter of my mother, and she became my wife.
PROHIBITED - Leviticus 18:9, You shall not uncover the nakedness of your sister, your father's daughter or your mother's daughter, whether brought up in the family or in another home.

Jacob married two sisters;
Genesis 29: 21-30 Then Jacob said to Laban, �Give me my wife that I may go in to her, for my time is completed.� So Laban gathered together all the people of the place and made a feast. But in the evening he took his daughter Leah and brought her to Jacob, and he went in to her. Laban gave his female servant Zilpah to his daughter Leah to be her servant. And in the morning, behold, it was Leah! And Jacob said to Laban, �What is this you have done to me? Did I not serve with you for Rachel? Why then have you deceived me?� Laban said, �It is not so done in our country, to give the younger before the firstborn. Complete the week of this one, and we will give you the other also in return for serving me another seven years.� Jacob did so, and completed her week. Then Laban gave him his daughter Rachel to be his wife. Laban gave his female servant Bilhah to his daughter Rachel to be her servant. So Jacob went in to Rachel also, and he loved Rachel more than Leah, and served Laban for another seven years.
PROHIBITED - Leviticus 18:18 And you shall not take a woman as a rival wife to her sister, uncovering her nakedness while her sister is still alive.

Amram married his father's sister;
Exodus 6:20 Amram took as his wife Jochebed his father's sister, and she bore him Aaron and Moses, the years of the life of Amram being 137 years.
PROHIBITED - Leviticus 18:12, You shall not uncover the nakedness of your father's sister; she is your father's relative.

All these relationships are prohibited under Mosaic Law, yet these couples were not punished. In fact they were honoured with blessed offspring (Isaac, Joseph, Moses, etc), and their descendants to the tenth generation (which included Moses and Aaron) were not prohibited from the congregation of the Lord. The same goes for Judah and Tamar.



Edited by Lachi - 20 March 2014 at 8:57pm

The real question here should be , How did Mary have a male child without a Man , Without all the spook-ism !!!