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Musharraf declares jihad against extremis

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Rezz View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rezz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 9:03am
Originally posted by Whisper Whisper wrote:

Mockba, why are you teasing our Rezz? The poor chap has to spit his venom somewhere. What's wrong about letting him float in the racist fallacy that all other places in the world than the ones they inhabit have a higher %age of criminals.

It's an absolutely beautiful country with some of the most docile peace loving people I have known in the world.



Whisper, my response to Mockba was meant to be tongue-in-cheek.

I haven't been to Pakistan, and yes, maybe my views have been coloured by our recent experiences with members of the Pakistani community in Britain.

I'm sure it is a beautiful country, with lovely people. But it does have nuclear weapons. Therefore, you must understand why the West would have an interest in whose finger is on the button.

I admit that l feel safe knowing the nukes are in the hands of a Western puppet like Musharaf.

I'd feel safer however, if the nukes were under the control of a real democracy with the sorts of checks and balances Western democracies have.

What wouldn't make me feel very safe would be an Iranian style anti-Western  Theocracy. Can you blame me?

And Whisper, challenging the culture and ideology of Islamic countries isn't racist.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whisper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 12:38pm

Yaarem Rezz, keh tu Farsi fehemedi?

It would have been easier for us to talk if we did that, but brother could I ask you just two questions and a half? How many "experiences" have you had with the members of the Pakistani community, recently or otherwise?

How long does it take for a "western puppet" to say choke on a cookie or, for his own body guard to relieve him of the dishonour he has brought the army? The nukes were with a democratic govenment. The P M promoted a differnt general (as his constitutional responsibilty) to take over charge from this brave chief. He took his guns out to sack the government.

Now that the half question. Iran was quite a kool place in the 50s. It was known as the Paris of the Mid East. Is it possible that the 1953 US invasion, sacking of an elected government and then running of the Takht e Taoos (by a Colonel Roosvelt from an ante room in the Shah's palace) had anything to do with making of Khomeni?

West will be safe only when it stops slaughter and invasions. These slaughters and invasions will keep multiplying extreme elements across the globe. I am sure you must have heard of an opposite and equal reaction? It doesn't just apply to physical objects but to the whole of our life processes.

Braderem I will embrace your criticism of all things Islamic the day you balance it with just a fair look at how our Washington and London have behaved in these past few centuries. And, mostly under the guise of charitable concern!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whisper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 12:40pm
Colin, it's jsut Whisper between friends. Thanks a million, I had just about forgotten all about their noses!

Edited by Whisper
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote b95000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 1:08pm
Originally posted by MOCKBA MOCKBA wrote:

Bismillah

When Musharraf and his droids exhaust themselves killing their own brethren under the guise of 'war on terror', they will be laid on the tray to be mercilessly devoured by the very Idols they worshipped - the deceitful "allies".

That will be the time when he will look for help from his people, only to find ashes and bones he has left behind... This is not conspiracy theory. This has happened before... this is the conquest of Central Asia a la XI century.

 



Ah Mockba, you can decipher for us who is pure and who is not...isn't that something.."the deceitful "allies"...so, you think the Pakistani madrasses have their 'house in order?'

"...and his droids exhaust themselves killing their own brethren under the guise of" a 'holy war'

Hmmm, who does that sound like?!  So are you really siding with the extremists teaching in some of the madrasses in Pakistan?  I hear no deliberation in your commentary, nor concession to the facts at hand - only an appeal the the 11th Century.   That is unfortunate Mockba..perhaps you'd like to tell us what should be done now as facts emerge about the London and other homocide bombings..


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whisper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 3:35pm

Mockba please save your breath. There's no need to respond to such usual rhetoric and spin. As if it's just Madrassas on their own and the Hag Low Sexnon illegal invasions and occupations have nothing to do with it.

Why wouldn't you let the poster satisfy himself with just his own words. He holds no points at all. He is here just to score some.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote b95000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2005 at 4:09pm
Originally posted by Whisper Whisper wrote:

Mockba please save your breath. There's no need to respond to such usual rhetoric and spin. As if it's just Madrassas on their own and the Hag Low Sexnon illegal invasions and occupations have nothing to do with it.

Why wouldn't you let the poster satisfy himself with just his own words. He holds no points at all. He is here just to score some.



Esteemed members, don't bother with Whisper's quite common diatribes...I've never said that the MNF was perfect.  But there is not acknowledgement of reality with Whisper, no discussion of the OBL problem or Islamic motivated extremism - let's call it the hijacking of some aspect of Islam by extremists or extremists manipulating Islamic teaching to underpin radical heinous, Death Cultic behaviour.  Oh no - no mention of that from our esteemed Afghani, Spanish, British, religiously eclectic friend...he just wants to repeat 'illegal invasions' enough times, over and over again until someone will believe that it is somehow true.  Invasions yes, illegal and occupations, no.  And if you care to discuss the merits of that argument Whisper Sasha - I'd be more than happy to.

"He holds no points at all. He is here just to score some."
That's just funny.  Not true, but funny..

What are you here for Sasha?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whisper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 July 2005 at 12:43pm

Come on, today we are listening.

Tell us what you know of ANY madrassa leave aside the Pakistani madrassas, at all. Are you trying to tell us that the Palestinian or the Kashmiri torture is just fathered by some Imam's sermons and, in actual, these do not exist?

 

I've never said that the MNF was perfect. 

No, it�s absolutely perfect, a perfect fraud and a perfect Alliance of the Billing!

 

no discussion of the OBL problem or Islamic motivated extremism

What is this OBL problem? Why don�t you catch him? He has been sighted enough times by your air force. Why do you keep him lingering in our lands? Just to extend the excuse for keeping those troops there?

 

let's call it the hijacking of some aspect of Islam by extremists or extremists manipulating Islamic teaching to underpin radical heinous, Death Cultic behaviour. 

Be honest what can we discuss, with your presumptions; as if the Palestinian torture was merely fathered by some Imam�s imagination or his vile sermon?

 

As if the US troops in the proximity of Makkah and Medina should have made all the Muslims dance bhangra � from Jakarta to Fez - and not have the effect it had?

 

When you are in the proximity of losing a point, you begin with a mock equation; of Egyptian troops in Iraq with US troops in Saudi Arabia.

 

Is that absolute cultural insensitivity? Just profound ignorance? Or, sheer point scoring?

 

The ball is in your court.

You tell me what can we discuss with you when you just slip away completely from a point in hand if you are not scoring a point?

 

...he just wants to repeat 'illegal invasions' enough times, over and over again until someone will believe that it is somehow true. 

I am so glad you solved this riddle for me.

Now, I understand why you keep repeating liberation and MNF so often and almost in every single breath. Just with the hope that someone might come to believe it!

 

We hold no need to be believed as long as the Iraqis and the Afghans know what they have got. Plus, majority populations even in your most sacred MNF countries know what it�s all about. The Poles, the Bulgarians and even the Italians have forced their governments to announce troop withdrawals by popular demand.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote b95000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 July 2005 at 1:35pm
Originally posted by Whisper Whisper wrote:

Come on, today we are listening.

Tell us what you know of ANY madrassa leave aside the Pakistani madrassas, at all. Are you trying to tell us that the Palestinian or the Kashmiri torture is just fathered by some Imam's sermons and, in actual, these do not exist?

B: Oh, I see.  Sasha only is the authority on faith and life.  No other need apply.  Is it OK if I, or anyone else, read and perceive and understand about things like the Madrasses and extremist theology?  In case you haven't noticed, there's a ton being written and discussed regarding them since the 7/7 tube slaughters.  For the flip side of this question, Mr. Smart One what in the world do you know about ANY little aspect of the United States...yes, we are listening..

 

no discussion of the OBL problem or Islamic motivated extremism

What is this OBL problem? Why don�t you catch him? He has been sighted enough times by your air force. Why do you keep him lingering in our lands? Just to extend the excuse for keeping those troops there?
B: Does anyone else buy this particular tripe, this conspiracy theory, that Sasha is pawning about OBL?  Just curious...

 

let's call it the hijacking of some aspect of Islam by extremists or extremists manipulating Islamic teaching to underpin radical heinous, Death Cultic behaviour. 

Be honest what can we discuss, with your presumptions; as if the Palestinian torture was merely fathered by some Imam�s imagination or his vile sermon?

B: Talk to us about the Palestinian torture.  Unfortunately, when you're discussing tribal warfare - us and them, the Hatfields and the McCoys to bring in a uniquely American take on this, the question always arises as what came first, who committed the first act, who violated who first?  Then the more important question arises - who will stop the madness and that actually places the first question almost into a non sequitur position - i.e. it doesn't really matter who started this thing 100 years ago, or whatever, or 3000 years ago or whatever...what's important is WHO WILL STOP THIS.  So discuss with us the Palestinian torture, the non sequitur along with the Jewish Problem (as Hitler called it) and I'll discuss with those who would hear, the more important matter which is WHO WILL STOP THIS...it is time to stop the killing between Palestine and Israel..many on both sides, unfortunately, take Sasha's position of leveling blame and not going to the solution..

 

As if the US troops in the proximity of Makkah and Medina should have made all the Muslims dance bhangra � from Jakarta to Fez - and not have the effect it had?
B: If Muslims had taken care of their own house, the MNF would not be in the Middle East right now.  That is evidently clear.  Now what I've said is quite simplistic and there's more to it and perhaps someday, with someone more reasonable, I will discuss the nuances of colonial impact and historical development - but that time has not yet come..

 

When you are in the proximity of losing a point, you begin with a mock equation; of Egyptian troops in Iraq with US troops in Saudi Arabia.

B: What, I've come nowhere near losing a point...hahaha  Only kidding...that's not my purpose here of course.  I simply want to present my point of view, a balanced (I truly believe) American viewpoint.  Yet, the only one doing the mocking, imho, is Sasha, who labels and slams all 300 million Americans as 'stupid' and 'foolish' wich is such inflammatory racist talk.  Really is quite juvenile and yet he persists in it..shame, don't you think, because all of your points could be made without the racist epithets toward Americans..

Is that absolute cultural insensitivity? Just profound ignorance? Or, sheer point scoring?  If anyone cares, they can easily understand what I was saying about Egyptian troops in Saudi, Kuwait and Iraq in reference to Sasha's claims of 'occupation' by the MNF troops.

 

...he just wants to repeat 'illegal invasions' enough times, over and over again until someone will believe that it is somehow true. 

I am so glad you solved this riddle for me.

Now, I understand why you keep repeating liberation and MNF so often and almost in every single breath. Just with the hope that someone might come to believe it!
B: So we have different viewpoints.  I've asked you to define occupation and you refused and let someone else explain it.  Then we were able to discuss the aspects of occupation like 'possession' and such that just cannot be true in this case.  That combined with Iraqi sovereignty just puts the lie to your hyperbolic accusations...but on you persist..my references to liberation and the MNF troops (are you denying this fact?  You enjoy denying facts, don't you Sasha) is my right to speak and I'm entitled to it...you wouldn't also deny me that right - would you Sasha Whisper?

 

We hold no need to be believed as long as the Iraqis and the Afghans know what they have got.


B: Well, it's good that you're posting single source, year old statistics so we can tell exactly what they're thinking, right?

Plus, majority populations even in your most sacred MNF countries know what it�s all about. The Poles, the Bulgarians and even the Italians have forced their governments to announce troop withdrawals by popular demand.

B: Fighting violent extremists is no easy matter.  Good thing the Americans were there to bail out Europe in the last war or the Poles, French, British, and Spanish would be under Nazi rule and reign...but who's figuring on facts, right Sasha..?  Of course you're doing a good job of advocating what - sitting on our butts while the extremist blow us up?  Not a good option there Sasha, not a good option..

Bruce
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