Reason why there are no homosexuals inIsl

 

Sorry Sal. I know you're not a fascist ;-) LOL My head's been fried as you rightly pointed out this AM. Sorry too Shasta.  I want to 'belong' but not sure what keeps me from the real belonging.

Not a good example you picked me lad.

Seriously though too here.

It's an interesting topic Sal, forgiveness.


"Lord, remember not only the men of good will, but also those of ill will. But do not remember all the suffering they have inflicted upon us. Remember rather the fruits we have brought, thanks to this suffering: our comradeship, our loyalty, our humility, the courage, the generosity, the greatness of heart that has grown out of this. And when they come to judgment, let all the fruits we have bourne be their forgiveness."

Source: Found on a scrap of paper at the liberation of Ravensbruck Concentration Camp in Germany


I think this is one of the most beautiful prayers I have ever read.

It reminds me of Moses.

When it comes to, 'love the sinner,' Sal.

Just some of my wild thoughts here.

There is a saying, "self knowledge is a sure path to God."  Islam has a similar expression from Muhammad (p)

I think this means - humility is a sure path to God.

With true humility, we truly realise we are no better and no worse than any other human being who ever has existed, or ever will exist. Given the 'right' circumstances, we are each capable of the greatest good, or the 'wrong' circumstances, the greatest of evils. All of us.

'Love the sinner, not the sin' is said to each of us. We are the 'sinner' whom we must learn to love, not someone else.

To love self  - the 'sinner'. In love of self is the freedom from bondage to that which makes of us a 'sinner' - separates us from God/Allah.

It is a command in Christianity - 'love your enemies', pray for those who hurt you.

I think partly what that is telling us, is that when we learn what makes of people our 'enemies' - we realise they are no different to ourselves in essence, and might actually begin a process of learning to love them, even while hating what separates them from us.

Self knowledge is a sure path to God.   Humility the key to the Kingdom within. Where can I get myself a truckload of humility :-)






Edited by Gulliver - 30 March 2009 at 9:01am

As Salamu Alaikum,Brother Gulliver.Thanks for the pm.May Allah mend your heart.May Allah increase your faith in Him.I see that you care alot about people who are considered different,I read what you said about the underdog.So you see where we Muslims are coming from.Maybe we should show more compassion for others that are different.May Allah Bless us all and give us Jannah.I looked alot into Homosexualality and what some of them would say is they were born in the wrong bodies,If it is that way and not a choice,then that is a birth defect.May Allah grant them Mercy.

I do understand the 'underdog' in your context too Akhe. I am one of the 'black Irish'. Irish Catholics have not had an easy ride over the centuries. My name alone on an application form would have told the employers my 'religion' and meant me being denied even an interview, never mind the job.

Trust me, we have far more in common than you realise :-) As much as good ol' Hasan tries to dismiss Catholicism - there are great similarities in Islam and Catholicism - one reason I find Islam so attractive and could adapt so easily.

True Catholicism calls for true submission to the will of God, after the model of Jesus - who told us, "take up your cross (nafs) and come follow Me."

Obedience to God is made perfect through suffering, after the model of Jesus - death to self, mastering the nafs - so the spirit gives true and lasting life to the individual - resurrection.

Something like that.

Wa Alaikum Asalam Brother Nazarene.Jazallah Khieran for your reply. You have an interesting point of view.I am without a response for that but it is interesting.