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Reason why there are no homosexuals inIsl |
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Akhe Abdullah 
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Male Joined: 19 November 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1252 |
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 Posted: 06 April 2009 at 4:06am |
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Salams All,Lets not forget if one converts to Al-Islam all his past sins are forgiven.I can understand if we (people are unable to forgive)If we cant forgive others how can we ourselves ask Allah to forgive us?Allah Knows Best.
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Mansoor_ali
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Male Joined: 25 September 2008 Location: Pakistan Status: Offline Points: 584 |
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Posted: 06 April 2009 at 4:40am |
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If the Islam defines the death punishment then it is also mentioned in Bible.So what's problem? |
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Doo-bop
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Joined: 04 March 2007 Status: Offline Points: 531 |
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Posted: 06 April 2009 at 5:58am |
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So now at last we have some clarity on the subject from you, and if you could supply some more detail on the matter, from muslim scriptures, that would be helpful (for instance, are a certain number of witnesses required, as in the case of rape?)
And now we can say that this muslim preacher is a true follower of Islam, at least in the matter of homosexual practice. Islam orders the death penalty for homosexuals.
And since Islam orders it, muslims must want it, and do their best to bring about the necessary conditions to enforce it.......... Edited by Doo-bop - 06 April 2009 at 2:13pm |
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"Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" - John the Baptizer (John 1:29)
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believer
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Joined: 08 January 2008 Status: Offline Points: 1397 |
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Posted: 06 April 2009 at 1:44pm |
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Loving the sinner of all the horriific crimes listed by shasta yes-
This does not mean that he does not have to be punished! Putting them in jail letting them, teaching them the errors of their way. Many ministers work in prisons across the country trying to help prisoners see the light and turn their lives around.
Many criminals have turned their lives around and become productive citizens.
There is a huge reward for the victim when they forgive the criminal.
LOL!! mansoor - Muslims always seem to forget that Jesus came and lived the life that is the Gospel.
Who is the better judge of a sinner? God or another man that is also a sinner?
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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. |
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Gulliver
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Posted: 07 April 2009 at 5:10am |
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Dr Nooh Al-Kaddo ........ The Muslim leader, who is the head of the Islamic Cultural Centre in Dublin Oh I wonder if I saw this man. I have been to the Centre a few times when in Dublin. I love it there. Gorgeous place and the food is MMMMMMMMMMMM. So quiet, peaceful and great for 'contemplation.' I used to visit a monastery and it reminded me of that. There were a lot of crows, ravens around the roof - the minaret (?)
The monastery was the same. So peaceful and quiet - beautiful nature around, and always crows and ravens about.
I wish there were a centre like that here in Derry. I'd be in it every day of the week.
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Shasta'sAunt
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Posted: 07 April 2009 at 5:47am |
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There is nothing in The Quran that orders Muslims to kill homosexuals. The Quran tells the story of Lot and how God killed the inhabitants for their actions, just as the Bible tells this story.
I found this info on the web, easily googled if one really wants to know and is not just trying to make some sort of a point:
In Sunni Islam there are eight madhhabs, or legal schools, of which only four still exist: Hanafi, Shafi'i, Hanbali, Maliki. The main Shia school is called Ja'fari, but there are Zaidi and Ismai'ili also. More recently, some groups have rejected this tradition in favor of greater ijtihad, or individual interpretation. Of these schools, according to Michael Mumisa of the Birmingham-based Al Mahdi institute:
It should also be noted that the punishment for adultery requires four witnesses; by analogy, all schools, require four witnesses to the physical act of penetration for the punishment to be applied.But if otherwise any other proof is found through modern methods such as DNA testing or so the punishment can be implimented. Treatment of homosexuals within Islam: According to a pamphlet produced by Al-Fatiha, there is a consensus among Islamic scholars that all humans are naturally heterosexual. Homosexuality is seen by scholars to be a sinful and perverted deviation from the norm. All Islamic schools of thought and jurisprudence consider gay acts to be unlawful. They differ in terms of penalty: The Hanafite school (currently seen mainly in South and Eastern Asia) teaches that no physical punishment is warranted. The Hanabalites, (widely followed in the Arab world) teach that severe punishment is warranted. The Sha'fi school of thought (also seen in the Arab world) requires a minimum of 4 adult male witnesses before a person can be found guilty of a homosexual act. Doo-bop: here we have the clear difference between our religions. The Quran does not order Muslims to kill homosexuals. The Shariah orders that they be punished as adulterers, just as any adulterers would be punished.
However, the Bible does call for killing homosexuals and there is nothing in the New Testament that states otherwise. Just because Christians choose to ignore this fact doesn't make it so.
So, out of the three monotheistics religions, Islam is really the only one that doesn't call for killing homosexuals simply because they are homosexual. Interesting, wouldn't you say?
Edited by Shasta'sAunt - 07 April 2009 at 5:53am |
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�No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.�
Eleanor Roosevelt |
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Doo-bop
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Posted: 07 April 2009 at 11:14am |
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What a hotch-potch of utter confusion! One says this, another says that. And to think that people's lives are at stake! I am so glad I'm not involved in this scheme of things.
I only wrote what I did because Mansoor_ali said:
"If the Islam defines the death punishment then it is also mentioned in Bible.So what's problem?"
Now I may have misread him, but it seemed to me he was saying Islam called for the death penalty for homosexual practice. But maybe not. Maybe he was just, once again, avoiding the issue. Incidentally, nobody has said that the Quran orders muslims to kill homosexuals. I don't know where you got the idea someone had....or was that just another piece of obfuscation from yourself?
Now you are saying that, under Islam, homosexuals are to be punished as adulterers. Are you saying that adulterers are not to be punished by death?
And yes, I would say that your last two paragaphs are interesting, as you say. Interesting as a piece of deception, sadly. Christians do not ignore the fact, as you falsely claim, that God, under the terms of the Mosaic covenant with Israel, commands the death penalty for those who engage in homosexual activity. But the New Covenant is not a theocracy as the Old Covenant was (and as Islam claims to be). If I see someone commit a crime, do I arrest him and bring him to the church to be tried, convicted and sentenced? No, I report him to the police, who will refer him to the judiciary because the church has no authority to deal with criminals in terms of civil or criminal law. It is the state which deals with this. Individuals, now or in the past, who have tried to accord the church this level of authority, are in serious error.
I am not saying that the church is not to deal with sin of this nature. 1 Corinthians chap. 5 clearly teaches that it must. This epistle shows that the church in Corinth was in pretty chaotic condition, and in this chapter we learn that a man had been sleeping with his father's wife. The apostle, scandalised by this, teaches that this person is to be excommunicated, that is, put out of the fellowship of the local church. But under the Old Covenant in Israel, this person would have been put to death.
Now your last paragraph. Who said anything about killing homosexuals simply because they are homosexual? The meaning is not at all clear, perhaps deliberately so. The law of the Mosaic covenant speaks of homosexual practice, not of any inclination to homosexuality, which could also be interpreted as being homosexual.
Your allegation that christians, living as they are under the New Covenant, have any authority to kill anyone, remains unsubstantiated. Simply because it cannot be.
And another thing. You say the information you give is readily available on the web. But what you have given is not the actual articles of law, but seems to be summaries of articles about the law. In discussions of law, we need the actual words of the law, not quotations from pamphlets and so forth
Edited by Doo-bop - 07 April 2009 at 3:54pm |
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"Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world" - John the Baptizer (John 1:29)
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hat2010
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Joined: 10 October 2006 Location: Neutral Zone Status: Offline Points: 561 |
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Posted: 08 April 2009 at 6:03am |
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Believer's clever question was (exactly) "Is this a man true follower of Islam?" in relation to homosexuals receiving the death penalty by stoning. The answer is no. Believer didn't ask "does he truly follow Islam"? But if he did, the answer would be no. One can more easily see how one might read "true follower" as meaning representative rather than "truly follow". Does he think he is truly following Islam? Yes. Now, is Morocco a Muslim country, with widespread shari�a courts? Yes. Is Britain a Muslim country run by sharia laws? No. How about Welling, birthplace to the "preacher of hate", is it a sharia run Muslim district in the London Borough of Bexley? No. Now, does Muslim Morocco, with it's sharia courts, have the death penalty for homosexuals? No. In fact, the last time the death penalty was used was 1993 for a very crooked police commissioner. Is "the preacher of hate" being disavowed by a part of the Muslim population as detailed in the Independent article? Yes. Aren't all Muslims welcome in mosques? Yes. Then, is he being openly rejected by a popular Muslim leader? Yes. Don't I want homosexuals to be hurt in any way? No. Am I Muslim? Yes. Does anyone in my large Muslim family want to see homosexuals receive the death penalty, public lashings, humiliation, etc.? No. Edited by Jamal Morelli - 08 April 2009 at 6:13am |
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Doo-bop wrote: