Rushdie knighthood
Printed From: IslamiCity.org
Category: Politics
Forum Name: Current Events
Forum Description: Current Events
URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9551
Printed Date: 26 April 2024 at 5:06am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Rushdie knighthood
Posted By: Delta
Subject: Rushdie knighthood
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 5:59am
Iran condemns Rushdie knighthoodThey say that this person is the most hated of the muslims, because he insulted Islam I wonder why http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/asiapcf/06/17/iran.rushdie.ap/ index.html |
Replies:
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 6:11am
| Search salman rushdie in the net...You will know. |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 6:24am
Be aware that may be offensive to you Read this : http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9180& ;KW=360+gods and then this : http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9171& ;KW=360+gods |
abuzaid wrote:Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 12:04pm
|
What's offensive to me?? I do not understand. I saw both of these threads. I don't think we muslims gets offended so easily. There are many other website where people have concocted many more accusaion against Islam. |
Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 3:39pm
|
Frankly, Salman Rushdie would not be nearly so "famous" if the Ayatollah hadn't issued the Fatwa to have him killed. He would have faded into being a obsurity as a 'jaded' ex-member of a faith. I see literature tearing apart my faith everyday. What makes Rushdie "special" is the calls for assasination. No offense abuzaid, I do feel that "SOME" (not all) Muslims do get offended too easily. Or I should say, react poorly to being offended. One should be offended by any derogatory statements, but fatwas calling for assasination and burning effigies is extreme. What good comes out of rioting? Nothing. Rushdie himself has done nothing deserving of Knighthood. There are many more accomplished artists and authors deserving of that honor. The only reason he got the recognition is the overreaction of others to his babbling. |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 9:28pm
|
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 18 June 2007 at 9:47pm
Your link is no good from my end! I cant get to the contents so I can't help you -- keep wondering as please! Iranian condemnation is just a cheap propaganda ploy against the Muslim territories under neo colonial sl. And that part is OK. The condemnation mean squat after all these years gone by. But you know just like there are some no nos across the board and this was the one the Brits forgot. If the Ayatullah really meant what he said we wouldn't be discussing this right now. The Diablo face would be with real master the Devil himself than with earthly devils. He should have declared the mission accomplished and he would be the true hero.He did make some cheap points. But he was what he was a great propagandist. What was the use of the Fatwa when the subject was beyond his jurisdiction and could not be executed! This old bag of a queen has lost her mind to give the finger to some of her subjects while she forgot in her old age about what happened to their pet Raj Pal at the height of their Empire in the subcontinent? Go read & then we will talk about it! ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 1:35am
Do you think that there is some truth in that anti-islam sites ? |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 2:12am
|
Which anti-Islam site are you talking about. That's an discussion thread on an Islamic forum by name Islamicity.com?? If you find any truth in that, you can discuss there itself |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 3:46am
|
No, you said that you wont be angry or get offended to easy. And you said there is other websites that aren't so good to islam I asked you, do you believe that is some truth in that websites, i.e., anti-islam ones ? |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 4:08am
|
If I believe something is true I will accept it first....and I am yet muslim. However, people have their own standard for truth and sometime their standard itself is wrong. So, I think instead of discussing such thing you tell me what's wrong you found in Islam |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 4:36am
|
You are wise to read the other part in this content between Christianity and Islam. There is good people and bad people in both sides, but our soul is only what matters. THE TRUTH, is what our soul needs, to you and to me and to anyone Why to be a Christian or to be Muslim just because I have born so ? they can't be both true...no way, they can't, they deny each other I not only do read Islam sources, but also the other dark side ( anti-islam websites ) Here is one I'm reading now, it quotes many, many verses of the Quran and gives a overall overview about this religion It is not good, and may be EXTREMELY offensive, so I must give you this warning again. This site is well known, and is a critical study about Mohammad and Islam Warning : EXTREMELY offensive content http://www.prophetofdoom.net/Prophet_of_Doom_Letter_to_the_R eader.Islam ( remove blank spaces if there is some ) If you are not offended in your believes, we may discuss some ideias with open mind |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 5:15am
|
no.. no letters or articles.. take one single issue and discuss it. I am not going to write an answer to this letter. |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 5:23am
|
It says Islam is paganism. Its upon you to prove this. |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 5:32am
|
Well, read and I will give my answer not so "offensive" or biased like that one, I just can't accept Islam But I agree with Islam World, the West is engulfed in apostasy and in a spiritual mess, but that was foretold in the Bible with a lot of others prophecies Is up to you to find God, His true nature There is a answer of Paul of Tarsus in the Bible Read Galatians epistle Why Paul the Tarsus ? well he was the apostle who preached in arabia world in Christianity childhood - It says so in the bible |
Posted By: abuzaid
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 5:59am
|
You proposed an website.. and this website says that Islam is paganism, prove it. This is YOU who proposed the webiste. |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 6:15am
|
No, you are not a pagan, but your origins are But first read that, and read a good rebuttal article of a Muslim Brother http://www.answering-christianity.com/islam-questions_rebutt al.htm ( remove blank spaces ) In that page Search for "360 gods" 10- Did the Arabs in pre-Islamic times worship 360 gods? Yes Your Brother answer : - YES And that is the truth, and only the archaeological and historic truth Mecca was the site of 360 gods, all destroyed by Mohammad..... No, you are not pagans, but you are in my point of view just a.... read all that and I give you my answer |
Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 7:56am
|
Who cares if Salman Rushdie is knighted? Who cares if he insulted Islam? Who cares if he is popular? Muslims Do! Like Angela said he is popular because of the reaction of Muslims but this is no different than what others do openly in europe, america, wherever. Yes, Muslims are too easily offended especially when, an Ayatollah calls for his murder for something which is called "free speech." Nobody believes in allowing God to be judge in this world. Who cares if someone opens their muzzle against Islam? God is the end to all affairs. So let it be. This has nothing to do with the West, this has something to do with one man and his opinion. Besides, why is this in the interfaith section? This should be current events. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 9:27am
|
Arise, Sir Salman!!!!--------Rushdie deserves this honour. He stands for freedom of speech and thought in the very face of death, as well as being a brilliant novelist (or so they say, I have only read one of his books) Let every non-Muslim take careful note of the reaction in the Muslim world to this business. It proves yet again that if there is one thing hated by Muslims, and disallowed by Islam, then it is freedom of speech and thought. Which is why we must do everything in our power to disallow any vestige of Sharia law in the west. Sadly, it is here already - at least in the UK.... |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 10:34am
|
Everyone, Not complying with guidelines and posting posts and comments to provoke the feelings and sentiments of any community will not be tolerated. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 12:55pm
|
Doop-Bop, Rushdie is no brilliant novelist. Yeah, I briefly reasd some of his books and clearly unimpressed as a philosopher. His only success, was pissing off the Muslim community with his rhetoric. |
Posted By: Reepicheep
Date Posted: 19 June 2007 at 5:27pm
|
Israfil wrote: Rushdie is no brilliant novelist Well, his second novel, "Midnight's Children", was awarded the 1981 "Booker Prize". And in 1993 Rushdie won the "Booker of Bookers Prize", when "Midnight's Children" was declared to be the best novel to ever have won the Booker Prize. The Booker Prize "is a literary prize awarded each year for the best original full-length novel, written in the English language, by a citizen of either the Commonwealth of Nations or the Republic of Ireland." So clearly, Israfil, not everyone shares your opinion of Rushdie. |
Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 20 June 2007 at 2:18pm
I said as a Philosopher I'm clearly unimpressed with some of his work (with respect to allocating his works with philosophy) especially the "Satanic Verses." From my understanding he tried to incoporate Philosophy (and some Psychology) in his writing which both are my field of study. I care not about other aspects of his writing. So with respect to philosophical writing (which is by far the second most difficult type of writing under mathematical science) is very poor. |
Posted By: BMZ
Date Posted: 20 June 2007 at 7:28pm
I will go with you on this. The Brits have knighted quite a few Muslims and ex-Muslims previously at very opportune times. They are good at that. Actually, I am waiting anxiously to see when Ali Sina will be knighted? The queen needs a real shoulder to put the blade on. Ali Sina, btw, is a decagonity or dodecagonity. Cheers BMZ ------------- Shasta's Aunt: "Well, there's the difference you see. The Bible was written by man about God, The Quran was revealed to man by God." |
, Angela.Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 21 June 2007 at 10:05am
|
Assalamu Alaikum, Freedom of expression is very good, but that doesn�t mean that one should be allowed to express anything at will to slander, defame, and bad-mouth fellow human beings and their beloved faith. For example, how would you feel if your beloved one, who has caused no harm to anyone, is slandered and insulted on a global TV being viewed by the whole world? And this pattern keeps repeating endlessly. . . . It is natural to get offended by that. Why shouldn�t anti-Islam and anti-Muslim stance be treated equal ( or at least similar ) to the anti-semitic crimes? Instead, we see the opposite . . . Salman Rushdie, who slandered the symbols of Islam�loved and revered by more than 1.5 billion Muslims, has been awarded the "knighthood" in the name of so called "freedom of speech," but will the same rules apply in other scenarios . . . as well? Can they insult, for example, any other community at such a public and official level? Will they honour Salman, or another author of similar talents, in the same manner if the insult was directed to a community and faith other than Muslims and Islam? I don�t wish that any community is insulted and humiliated in such a manner, but the point is to show the blatant hypocrisy that prevails here. . . . Furthermore, it seems they are playing their cards now to deal with many pressing issues at hand: 1. To divert the attention of the fellow citizens from utter failure of invasion and occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan where there is no real peace, security, stability and democracy as promised in the beginning. The deteriorating situation day by day has already caused much more dissension of local masses to the extent that even Blair will be quitting shortly. 2. This step may help create more gap between many non-Muslims and Muslims because of strengthening the idea of "clash of civilizations." 3. It may attempt to divide Muslim masses even further due to the absence of one powerful body that is effectively prepared to deal with such issues of ummah that keep coming up every now and then on the world stage. 4. The catastrophic situation in Palestine�with millions of starving Palestinians and ongoing political developments there�and elsewhere�may be thrown in shadows, at least for the time being. Seeing the trend, therefore, it is important that the entire humanity in general, and Muslims in particular, wake up from the deep slumber and evaluate the whole situation. This gross neglect of very fundamental rights of more than 1.5 billion Muslims should not be allowed, otherwise entire humanity may become subjugated to the perpetrators of such heinous crimes. What should Muslims do? Well, protest intellectually and educationally using educated and Islamic mind set without any violent reaction. ( Please remember that any violent reaction on your part will be tremendously magnified by the media. At the time of cartoon crisis, media delivered full coverage to some violent reactions, but the silent and peaceful demonstrations of the majority was not made the headline news. Furthermore, we should always act within the bounds of Islam and avoid doing unislamic things regardless of the degree of provocation, and keep in mind that Allah is watching us all the time, and He is in full control of all the affairs, whether or not we are being watched by others. ) Educate everyone that Islam is not what Salman Rushdie tells us; it is the beautiful message of peace and submission to Allah, the Creator and Sustainer of the entire universe. May Allah guide us all. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 21 June 2007 at 11:03am
It's funny What about Jesus Christ Superstar ? What about all slanderous books and writings and documentaries about Jesus and Christianity ? Did you gave any warning or said something about the Thread of Tomb of Jesus ? did you ? no, although I as a Roman Catholic find that extremely offensive to our believes...but did you care about that ? of course not...because it didn't touched your believes But I don't blame you, Freedom of expression, that's what it means ====== Salman Rushdie, who slandered the symbols of Islam�loved and revered by more than 1.5 billion Muslims, ======== And what if 1.5 billion people are living a BIG LIE ?Why CAMERON or someone from HOLLYWOOD' producer don't have guts to make just a single movie about MOHAMMAD ? Why ? Do you know How many warnings I got in Islam forums ? a lot of themI'm not allowed to say nothing about the Koran or Mohammad, well....I don't have guts for that either...just like Hollywood |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 21 June 2007 at 9:17pm
|
I am certain this Portuguese Catholic has absolutely no understanding of the subject other than wants to cut his nose to spite his face. He doesn't even understand the perspective or the history what of Rush-die put in his the Satanic Verses (SV). After seeing Crasss sparring about the western sexual mores (the fornication fest) with the rest of the members, would be right fella to debate this issue. I expected him to do his part, may be he hasn't read the trash. Anyways my observation as follows: Caution this is going to be an eye opener!
------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 8:44am
|
Can anyone tell me exactly why the Muslims object to Rushdie's book, The Satanic Verses? |
Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 9:15am
| I reject it as a Muslim because it is a poor attempt on philosophy. I'd rather read Aristotle's Metaphysics a thousand times than read something that pass as something psuedo-philosophical |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 9:30am
|
so, Israfil, this guy should be killed because he is a bad philosopher???
|
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 9:44am
|
Something else - Sir Iqbal Sacranie, former big-wig of the MCB, who said that death was too good for Salman Rushdie, has also been knighted...... http://mcbwatch.blogspot.com/2005/08/just-how-moderate-is-iqbal-sacranie.html - http://mcbwatch.blogspot.com/2005/08/just-how-moderate-is-iq bal-sacranie.html |
Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 9:46am
|
Doo-Bop, Thanks for putting words in my mouth. Re-read what I previously said as I was simply stating an individual, and personal opinion. I care not about what nhappens to him really. He can live to be 100 years old or die the next day. My point is, he is a bad philosopher when it comes to the Satanic Verses. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 10:00am
|
I'm sorry, Israfil, if I put words in your mouth (I do hate it when it happens to me). So you reject the fatwa issued by Khomeini. Well that is good, and shows you have a respect for freedom of speech, even if you don't like what's being said. (Assuming that you did not mean by "die the next day" that he should be killed tomorrow....) Any other muslims like to say exactly why Salman Rushdie should be killed? |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 10:45am
|
Doo-bop: "What about all slanderous books and writings and documentaries about Jesus and Christianity ?" And how many such writers have been awarded such a prestigious award at public and official level? Can you name one to me? Please be specific. But, the point is not just that. It appears you didn't read my whole post. Please read the whole post, and then we will talk. Yes, I don't discuss outside the rules of the forum. And I don't like to waste my precious time. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 11:32am
What are you talking about? You are not quoting me when you produce this:- "What about all slanderous books and writings and documentaries about Jesus and Christianity ?"
|
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 6:41pm
It is obvious that you have not read TSV otherwise you wouldn't have asked this question. I say that most people have not read this trash TSV. It is not a book easily understood by the most people not familiar with the subcontinental history, culture and phrases. As they there are no dumb questions as long as they are not repetitious. So TSV contains the most blasphemies and distortions page after page against the Prophet of Islam, his family and companions penned by an apostate while enjoying the protection of the crusaders and Jews. If the Brits of all walks of life, whites, Jews, Hindus & Americans don't mind being called names and bad mouthed like bastards and MFing etc and what have you that is not Muslim's issue. May be they love to be that way, who knows! This TSV issue had died down cuz it has been almost a generation gone by but the Crusaders have resurrected it for some special reason to start a trouble. And it is strange he has not taken a non Muslim name as yet, I wonder why! Further more I see what he did to degrade the life of all the practicing Muslims in the UK to a miserable state of a no win situation. If they go against him they will be labeled as radicals if not then their faith will in a quandary. For sake of comparison in those days the British MPs were furious and were in an uproar and called for ban on an Irish American actor Mickey Rourke from Briton when he called Margaret Thatcher's economic policies were fxxked up. But when Rushdie name calls in TSV the same Prime Minister half dozen times along with Maggie the B**ch etc, it is was no foul cuz he was doing lot more to Muhammad and his family in the same cover. What a hypocrisy????? Oh, dirty Brits(BTW) these words are from your TSVs sorry I forgot the page number. Finally the Muslims should NOT expect any break from a Jewish run knighthood committee!!!The committee, chaired by investment banker Lord Rothschild, included BBC director Jenny Abramsky, former Sunday Telegraph theatre critic John Gross and former editor of the Independent Andreas Whittam Smith. & this scumbag! Random House Publisher's CEO Gail Rebuck, who is married to Philip Gould, Tony Blair's long-time polling guru. What do you expect from these godforsaken morons? ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: hmmm5
Date Posted: 22 June 2007 at 9:29pm
|
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 6:28am
Sign reader - having fought my way through your multi-coloured, multi-font-sized tirade against Jews and crusaders (?) - just who are the "crusaders" btw - I have learned precisely nothing!! You have said nothing concrete about why muslims object to Rushdie's book, or why he should be killed The only concrete thing you've said is why supporters of the former PM, Margaret Thatcher should object to the book As for Muslims not "getting a break" from the knighthood committee, well, as I pointed out a few posts ago, Iqbal Sacranie, who said that death was too good for Salman Rushdie, is now Sir Iqbal Sacranie. What a disgrace.... And of course there is Lord Ahmad, who I'm sure deserves his elevation to the House of Lords..... |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 6:56am
| btw, Sign reader, I have read the Satanic Verses. But that was a long long time ago, when it just came out. I no longer have my copy, as I've just found out. When I read it, Islam was just a word to me. I knew nothing about it, and did not understand it to be, as I do now, the major threat to our civilisation. Perhaps I'll read it again soon, if I can save up enough to buy another copy |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 10:23am
Doo-bop: You didn't answer my question! You can't keep going on and on without replying questions. Please comply with guidelines. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 10:45am
Once again, peacemaker, I do not know what you are talking about! Are these the questions you are referring to? "And how many such writers have been awarded such a prestigious award at public and official level? Can you name one to me? " If so, please be informed that I have not raised the issue of the writers you are talking about. Which writers were those? Also I did not say this:- Doo-bop: "What about all slanderous books and writings and documentaries about Jesus and Christianity ?" which you are clearly implying that I said.... I don't know what your game is here. But it is not nice..... Actually, if you care to reread page three of this thread, you will discover you should be raising this issue with Delta, not with me....the bit about the "slanderous books and writings" came from him, not me. Now stop wasting my time.... |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 11:35am
|
Which is why we must do everything in our power to disallow any vestige of Sharia law in the west. Sadly, it is here already - at least in the UK.... Really, Where? Where? Do you realyl understand Shirah? If there were Shirah, lifwe would be rather different there then it is now. ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 23 June 2007 at 1:41pm
How could you miss in red unless you have reading problems? What do you mean by concrete? What did you feel about Muhammad and his distorted name form's descriptions & stories as compared to when Muslims say Muhammad they say peace and blessing with it. ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 2:23am
| Well, you tell me what blasphemies, defamations and distortions, and then we will have something concrete.... |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 4:27am
Oh yes, it was from Delta, I am sorry for that�even a slight misrepresentation may upset one�nevertheless, let me assure you that I did that inadvertently. And don�t you agree with what Delta says in this thread? As I see from your posts, you support the official recognition awarded to Salman Rushdie; my question is now directed to both of you. And if you don�t like to answer the post related to Delta, I refer to one I asked in my post on page 3 before Delta's post. "Can they insult, for example, any other community at such a public and official level? Will they honour Salman, or another author of similar talents, in the same manner if the insult was directed to a community and faith other than Muslims and Islam? I don�t wish that any community is insulted and humiliated in such a manner, but the point is to show the blatant hypocrisy that prevails here. . . ." Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 5:28am
There is a Sharia Court in every major city in the UK |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 12:14pm
|
Hey Doo bop. Thanks for letting me know. I know they have some in Canada as well. Let me ask, does that have anything to do with the greater society? It is like in the US, the Amish have their own system of justice. Also, they are exempt from the draft (if there is one). It is also like Orthodox Jewish folks have their own system of justice. Native Americans in the US as well. How is Shirah court any different if people willingly choose to go to that court? Most of Shirah is sort of like divorce court, property, etc. Deals with many type of matters. Are there are lot of whippings or stonings there? I would think if there were it would be all over the news.
------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 2:47pm
I don't think I am going to type the whole chapter but you get the book and read; except couple of chapters which are about England rest is denigrating the Prophet. For starters read, look at chapter # 2 and its heading on down; providing a clear proof that whole project was British instigated affront to the Muslims. As a Muslim I won't type his puke here. If you don't want to make Rushdie, his Jewish publisher and the British exchequer few pounds richer you can find the TSV online then come back to talk about it. You should not be debating a subject your are not knowledgeable about; unless you are simply Islam/Muhammad animosity driven. That hate has literally blinded your sense of fairness & can't see the reality by so called novel! This issue won't be decided by this internet debate anyway. So much fuel has been added to the fires of hatred that someone will get burnt surely. It has already claimed few dozen lives but sure it has also made some in England quite wealthy, sex and violence does pay dividends. All events in modern times had beginning in words coming from Hitler, Bush, Blair, or Rushdie. The corresponding consequences were beyond their control unless they could see their folly just in time and take corrective action but alas that quality was not in their make up in the first place. All these people were using their freedom of speech rights! weren't they? Oh Yes ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 3:48pm
|
"You should not be debating a subject your are not knowledgeable about; unless you are simply Islam/Muhammad animosity driven. That hate has literally blinded your sense of fairness & can't see the reality by so called novel!" Sign reader - you are an angry man - I can tell. I am not debating with you the truth (or otherwise) about what Rushdie is alleged to have said about Muhammad. I merely asked you what he said..... "All events in modern times had beginning in words coming from Hitler, Bush, Blair, or Rushdie." This is not only irrelevant, but nonsense. What about Joe Stalin? Pol Pot? etc. etc. etc.? not to mention Osama bin Laden and Ayatollah Khomeini, Mao zde Dong, Ronald Reagan, General Galtieri.....add your own names to the endless list of those who provoked major events by their words..... |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 7:04pm
cuz you are beating about the bush! http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion2/fr33minds/SalmanRushdie_satanic_verses.pdf - TSV on line OK Doo-bop; here is the link; start at chapter II pp 32, then come back.
What blatant lies did they utter to attack other people? Which countries did they attack? I couldn't care less how did they manage their own nations! BTW how do you put Galtieri, Pol pot into this? Aren't you comparing apples with oranges? on the top you talk about nonsense! At least now you should take Mao's name with respect, his country's economy is bigger than yours  ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 24 June 2007 at 7:27pm
 of course the folks living in glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones. This is what you deserve as blow back for the colonialism neo colonialism & secularism! But don't be paranoid, success doesn't come with simple rhetoric! ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 25 June 2007 at 3:35am
Sign reader, you are quite a man, you know. So now I am supposed to reread the Satanic Verses, and decide for myself what you find objectionable to it?? (I never heard anything so crazy in my life) Ok fine. If you are unable or unwilling to give me at least one concrete example of what you don't like about the book, then so be it. |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 25 June 2007 at 10:10am
I thought to help you out and save you time & money, when you decide to read for your edification is your decision. What I told you will be nothing but concrete proof of his objectionable writing, provided you also knew the Muslim's prayer meaning in your language to see why there is an uproar? Didn't you say that you will read it again soon. Now why are you making excuses? Sounds like Blairspeak? Why would I reproduce his rubbish here? You don't appreciate the free link to it that is OK. Then don't continue the altercation that you got nothing to go by when told you chapter II the whole thing and the some, which you will find out as an evidence! ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: crasss
Date Posted: 25 June 2007 at 8:02pm
I think it is more the provocation that enrages the Muslims. They gave him knighthood not in spite of insulting Islam, but because he insulted Islam. I don't think it was the Queen's personal idea to do that. She was raised in another era, and has other values than the ones who pushed for knighthood. Traditional Christians would refrain from endorsing this. The last traditionally Christian generation in the West has died off or are very old now. The Queen is part of that last generation. All of this makes the British military presence in Iraq and Afghanistan even more controversial. |
Posted By: Angel
Date Posted: 25 June 2007 at 8:08pm
|
Muslims don't support Rusdie's Knighthood, good, that's fine, lets not start a war over it! -------------  ~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
|
Posted By: Angel
Date Posted: 25 June 2007 at 8:18pm
|
aaaaaahhhhhhhh, you got there before I deleted my post, oh well too late. For anyone who wants to know why i deleted, is because i read a couple of other posts and basically agreed a little with them and so i retracted my post by deleting. All i know he is not any different than people speaking out against or don't agree with islam and the Prophet, And its no secret that I don't ageee with all of islam. ------------- ~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
|
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 26 June 2007 at 12:46am
|
Sign reader - since I am not arguing with you about your objections to the Satanic verses, since I don't really know what they are, just what are you on about now?? And how am I to know from your use of the word "event", that you are referring to attacking other countries? Since you are the type of person who does not care what the Pol Pots of this world do in their own countries, it is hardly surprising you are calling for the murder of Rushdie (if thats what youre doing) |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 26 June 2007 at 4:25am
If you didn't know what they are, why did you support the "knighthood" awarded to Salman Rushdie in the first place. Another thing is let us keep the discussion on the track and stick to the thread. Peace
------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 26 June 2007 at 4:26am
Assalamu Alaikum, There are no shariah courts of any kind in Canada as far as I know. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: minuteman
Date Posted: 26 June 2007 at 9:46pm
|
Yes Queen is not guilty of anything bad. She just has to sign the paper be it the knighthood of an abusive rascal Rushdie or it may be a law about he same gender sex. She has to sign it. But the work done by those who recommended the Rusdie was very bad indeed. ------------- If any one is bad some one must suffer |
Posted By: crasss
Date Posted: 27 June 2007 at 3:06am
The Queen is a decent person, and actually, prince Charles is quite decent too, but they have to contend with a generation of vipers. |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 27 June 2007 at 8:30pm
|
Peacemaker thanks for the note.. I remember reading that there were or someone was trying to have some Shirah courts in Canada... live and learn.
------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: minuteman
Date Posted: 27 June 2007 at 9:22pm
|
The subject will drift off topic. The demand for the Sharia laws in Canada cannot be made. There was such a news in England and Germany too. Actually, there cannot be Sharia laws in western countries. The people living there have to live by the law of the land. But when the Muslim population increases too much and they have difficulty adjusting their minds to the requirements of their children and there crop up marriage and divorce cases needing some settlement, then the Muslims look towards their Sharia laws. They feel that their personal affairs may at least be governed by their Sharia laws. That is all. It is not to threaten all the inhabitants, black, brown and white with the laws of Sharia. That can never happen and there is no need too. The Muslims in those countries are like the guests in those countries. They should all abide by the rule of those countries. If they do not like to do that then they should leave that country and come back to live in a country where there are laws of Sharia. But I feel that there may not be such a country where laws of Sharia are presently fully and purely enforced. ------------- If any one is bad some one must suffer |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 10:37am
Assalamu Alaikum, You are welcome, Sister. Yes, Muslims were demanding for arbitration courts on the basis of Shariah laws that would deal with their personal matters/disputes such as family ones affecting them in the province of Ontario ( not entire Canada ), but the decision was made not to allow them, and eliminate all such existing Christian and Jewish arbitration courts. http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2347&PN=5&TPN=2 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2347& ; ; ; ;PN=5&TPN=2 Peace P.S. Everyone, let us stick to the topic now, please.
------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 10:51am
|
Doo-bop: Your post was deleted for posting provocatively here in spite of repeated notes by me, and ignoring questions raised to you. Consider this a warning. Please keep in mind that it is Current Events section. Also see the warning thread, please. http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2952&PN=1 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2952& ;PN=1 Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 10:53am
I already gave my reasons for this - Rushdie stands for freedom of speech in the face of death, and is a brilliant novelist I am keeping to the discussion, which is about Salman Rushdie |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 10:55am
I am sorry. I am not one to ignore questions. Please remind me what they were. I was not aware that you were giving me "repeated notes" having read your link, and since I am not able to foresee what will be considered "inflammatory" to muslims, I will stay out of the thread... |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 10:56am
Spamming is not permitted. You posted again. Answer questions that are posed to you. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 11:10am
|
"Spamming is not permitted. You posted again. Answer questions that are posed to you." Yes. I posted again. How am I supposed to answer without posting? |
Posted By: usama
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 12:07pm
|
There is no country today which represents Islam or meets the minimal Shariah requirements. Such a state is historically and legally called a khilafah, caliphate. I agree that the Shariah cannot willfully be implemented partially. Moreover, Muslims are compelled to follow the example of the Prophet (saaw) who did NOT use the authority of preIslamic Makka to enforce Islam. In fact he refused to comply with the Quraishi offer of partial implementation of Islam. Muslim communities in the West are confused by varying positions on the matter. There now exists a chism between the reality and the idea of Islam. Many Muslim scholars and leaders adopt incorrect methodologies in their vain attempts to bridge that chism. The chism is as mentioned previously: there is no society today which meets the Shariah requirements as being representative of Islam. There is no caliphate, no authentic Islamic state which fulfills the Muslim people's collective duty to Allah (AWJ). However, Muslims have not and are not implementing or ruling or judging solely by Islam as Allah (SWT) has commanded. We Muslims are failing ourselves and failing to fulfill this obligation. The mistaken bridge is to use the governing system of other than Islam of a people who are NOT EVEN MUSLIM to implement Islam. No. Indeed, Muslims ARE guests, or dhimmis if you will, of the people who are NOT Muslim, do NOT believe in Islam, and therefore cannot be forced to implement Islam. Instead, Muslims in the West should look to the Muslim world where the people believe in Allah and His Prophet (saaw), who know the Quran, who pray and give zakah and fast, to implement Islam. The foremost of the criterion for ruling is for Muslims to compose the raw power of authority, usually equated with majority Muslim population. The Prophet (saaw) did not have the Islamic state in Madinah until he had the 2nd Bayah of Aqaba: the pledge of the Ansar to use their raw power to defend Islam and obey Allah and the Prophet (saaw). These circumstances already exist within the Muslim world, like in western, eastern and northern Africa, the Arabian Pennisula, Al Sham, Iran, Central Asia, etc. In these regions Muslims compose anywhere from 80% to 100% of the populations, the militaries are manned by Muslim troops and led by Muslim commanders, and their supplies and strategic resources are controlled by Muslims. However, this raw power is controlled by unIslamic regimes and oppressors who intentionally refuse to implement Islam. The obligation THUS falls on Muslims to remove these regimes and replace them with a caliphate. That is the nearest path to implementing Islam and fulfilling the Muslim people's duty to Allah (SWT). But if one closely follows the example of the Prophet (Saaw), one would see that he did not simply advocate a military coup. Rather, he led a nonviolent Islamic movement within Makka and Madinah that moved the people towards Islam and towards living according to Islam. It was when that movement reached the stage of seeking the authority that the circumstances occurred in favor of implementing Islam. The Prophet (saaw) investigated several tribes before Allah (SWT) sent the Ansar of Madinah to him and the pledges of Aqaba took place. And then within Yathrib, the people naturally chose the Prophet (saaw) rather than crown a new king. Insha Allah, when an the next Islamic caliphate occurs, Muslims in the West would migrate to live therein just as the Muhajiroon migrated to Madinah. ------------- Let there arise from amongst you a group inviting to all that is good, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and they are the successful ones. Al Imran:104 |
Posted By: usama
Date Posted: 28 June 2007 at 12:21pm
|
As for the Rushdie knighthood, it was Blair's last salvo over the bow of the Muslim world. Blair retains the old British imperial character, the Kiplingesque White Man's Burden theme towards the Muslim world that says 'the poor heathens need Union Jack to lead them past their God'. Rushdie recently visited Orlando Florida and spoke at a local private university. His lecture showed his deep seated atheism. Yet it also revealed his belief in himself what amounts to self worship- that arrogant drivel which atheists often spout. Ironically, a local baptist minister wrote an op-ed noting that Rushdie's atheism seems to elevate himself as an alternative to God which struck him as perplexing. Is Rushdie worthy of knighthood? Who cares, its a British thing. Does the act of knighting Rushdie connote a clear disbelief in Allah and His Messenger and clearly separates the British govt on the side of kufr and arrogance towards Allah (SWT), and believers? Certainly. As if Britain's long history of fighting Muslims, destroying the caliphate, dividing and weakening Muslims, wasn't evidence enough, they went and knighted an apostate blasphemying wretch.
------------- Let there arise from amongst you a group inviting to all that is good, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and they are the successful ones. Al Imran:104 |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 29 June 2007 at 10:49am
Okay, let me explain further. You posted the same post that I had deleted. Furthermore, posting posts at random, as you did, without replying questions addressed to you also constitutes violation of guidelines. Please see the following guidelines in this respect: 12. Spamming of any kind is not allowed. Any response to spammers will be deleted along with the spam. This includes multiple copies (2 or more) of one message in one and/or many forums. (If this behavior is spotted several times, by the same User we may remove ALL the copies of that message, including all the responses below them.) Spamming of questions or overly large posts will also not be allowed. 13. Posting several messages at random and not responding to the generated questions or dialogue following the original posts may also be considered as spamming. Answer questions posed to you and do not avoid it by changing the topic, as long as that question does not break any of the Guidelines. If you do not know the answer, simply acknowledge this, then move forward. http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4589&PN=1 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4589& ; ;PN=1 Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: mariyah
Date Posted: 29 June 2007 at 12:39pm
Warning: Delta is a possible internet troll: If you read all the threads he has started, you will see he tries to lead you down the same path, to doubt your faith: Read about internet Trolls here at this thread http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7510& ;KW=internet+troll ------------- "Every good deed is charity whether you come to your brother's assistance or just greet him with a smile. |
Posted By: Delta
Date Posted: 29 June 2007 at 1:19pm
|
I don't know why are you reacting that way In this thread I made only a few replies, I'm away from it But WHY don't you make a new topic in "interfaith discussion board" named : "Delta Troll" say what you want, I will try to answer gently, I never offended you as a person, none of you But it is up to the moderators of Islamicity, they know best |
Posted By: minuteman
Date Posted: 29 June 2007 at 6:57pm
|
Thanks Maryah for the warning advice. Delta is a Troll. Thanks. All will be careful now. ------------- If any one is bad some one must suffer |
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 01 July 2007 at 10:59am
|
Delta: When you start a topic, you bear the responsibility to engage in replying subsequent enquiries that result in after the post or comment. Just posting a post and not addressing questions constitutes violation of guidelines. I raised a question in this thread and you ignored it; started another thread "Kaaba a Hindu Temple?" in interfaith section and did the same thing there. Posting posts at random, as you did, without replying questions addressed to you constitutes violation of guidelines. Please see the following guidelines in this respect: 12. Spamming of any kind is not allowed. Any response to spammers will be deleted along with the spam. This includes multiple copies (2 or more) of one message in one and/or many forums. (If this behavior is spotted several times, by the same User we may remove ALL the copies of that message, including all the responses below them.) Spamming of questions or overly large posts will also not be allowed. 13. Posting several messages at random and not responding to the generated questions or dialogue following the original posts may also be considered as spamming. Answer questions posed to you and do not avoid it by changing the topic, as long as that question does not break any of the Guidelines. If you do not know the answer, simply acknowledge this, then move forward. http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4589&PN=1 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4589& ; ;PN=1 Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 02 July 2007 at 9:42am
|
peacemaker - confused is not the word for me right now... and I'll tell you why. You asked me "Why did you support the knighthood of Salman Rushdie in the first place?" I answered this. You erased my answer. You then accuse me of not answering questions. Strange. If you don't like answers, then why ask questions? If I was being over-provocative, then why was I not pulled up for it after my first post on this thread? (I don't think I've added to what I said then re. Salman Rushdie) Bearing in mind that the only other question you asked me was based on another poster's comments, and therefore you had no right to demand an answer from me on that basis. Reread the thread - see for yourself... I have no wish to cause undue upset. But....I think you need to give more clarification of what you're saying.... |
Posted By: Doo-bop
Date Posted: 02 July 2007 at 10:18am
|
[QUOTE=usama]
As for the Rushdie knighthood, it was Blair's last salvo over the bow of the Muslim world. Blair retains the old British imperial character, the Kiplingesque White Man's Burden theme towards the Muslim world that says 'the poor heathens need Union Jack to lead them past their God' Ok, I posted a response to the above. I have erased it myself, having forgotten that I myself had said I would no longer contribute to this thread....must be old age catching up with me....
|
Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 02 July 2007 at 5:32pm
|
Doo-bop: "Bearing in mind that the only other question you asked me was based on another poster's comments, and therefore you had no right to demand an answer from me on that basis." Yes, I have every right to demand an answer from you when you start posting at random in support of this knighthood. You were allowed to engage in discussion. You were warned for spamming, and now you still seem to ignore what is being said. Please comply with guidelines. Peace ------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 04 July 2007 at 6:34pm
|
Hey Jason... as Jesus PBUH said: �Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.�------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |