Works VS Faith
Printed From: IslamiCity.org
Category: Religion - Islam
Forum Name: Interfaith Dialogue
Forum Description: It is for Interfaith dialogue, where Muslims discuss with non-Muslims. We encourge that dialogue takes place in a cordial atmosphere on various topics including religious tolerance.
URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=38396
Printed Date: 29 April 2024 at 3:28am
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Topic: Works VS Faith
Posted By: Saved
Subject: Works VS Faith
Date Posted: 22 October 2016 at 8:59pm
| Do Muslims believe that they have to earn paradise by good deeds? |
Replies:
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 25 October 2016 at 12:38pm
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Yes of course,
Doing good to God Doing good to fellow human beings Doing good to the natural surroundings Regards, Asep |
Posted By: 2Acts
Date Posted: 25 October 2016 at 3:22pm
| how will you know if you have ever done enough to make it? |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 25 October 2016 at 5:19pm
According to the Scripture Allah sent before the Quran he states that salvation is a gift from God and cannot be earned or worked for, but there is a condition. That is to believe Jesus is who he and God claims Him to be. I do. PBUY |
asep48garut60 wrote:Posted By: iec786
Date Posted: 25 October 2016 at 8:34pm
False and that statement you made is a lie. http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/7.htm - New International Version Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?' http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/7.htm - New International Version Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!' Matthew 7:23 |
Posted By: DavidC
Date Posted: 26 October 2016 at 8:47am
|
Matthew 7:21
�Not everyone who says to me, �Lord, Lord,� will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. ------------- Christian; Wesleyan M.Div. |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 26 October 2016 at 12:26pm
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Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 26 October 2016 at 2:39pm
|
Dear 2Acts & Saved,
I'm just trying to keep Allah's commandments in the Quran, and who can judge what I've done is just Allah. Allah created humans and jinn/genie is to worship Him, therefore, we need His forgiveness and compassion. Allah says that whoever the person who runs His commands, then he/she will go to heaven, and if otherwise, then he/she will go to hell. On that basis, someone who wants to go to heaven, firstly, he/she must do Allah's commands, humans can not live as he pleases without the testimony of Allah, and I think all religions have the rules of God to be done by humans. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 26 October 2016 at 2:39pm
|
Dear David C,
Thank you for your kind response. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 26 October 2016 at 3:07pm
PBUY |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 27 October 2016 at 2:53pm
|
Dear Saved,
From where did you know that I don't have the assurance that I have done it well enough or close enough to ensure safety? the answer is I don't know exactly, let alone you, I just run His commandments, and that gives good or good enough is only Allah, not human even not the angels and the Apostles. Allah is the Most Merciful and the Most Compassionate, Allah will forgive the sins of His servants He pleases as long as they do not associate Him with anything as mentioned in the Quran. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 28 October 2016 at 9:47am
When you agree with seeing the truth about this comment of mine, I will be happy to tell you how I know. If you, however, are leading me to believe that you are sure of your hereafter, but not exactly sure how, then please tell me how you are sure even if not exact. Know that God hears you on this matter. |
Posted By: syed_z
Date Posted: 28 October 2016 at 11:20pm
Greetings Saved, Your Topic 'Works VS Faith' for this thread is incorrect. In Islam works and faith go parallel to each other. One cannot do without the other and Quran is absolutely explicit about it: Surah Al Anaam Verse 158: ....... believing will be of no avail to any human being who did not believe before, or who, while believing, did no good works The Quran commentators have explained in the view of the above verse that Belief without works is equivalent to having no belief at all. Even though good deeds is a sign of belief Yet our beloved Prophet Muhammad (SallAllahu Alaihi Wassallam) said the following: "The deeds of anyone of you will not save you (from the (Hell) Fire)." They said, "Even you (will not be saved by your deeds), O Allah's Apostle?" He said, "No, even I (will not be saved) unless and until Allah bestows His Mercy on me. Therefore, do good deeds properly, sincerely and moderately, and worship Allah in the forenoon and in the afternoon and during a part of the night, and always adopt a middle, moderate, regular course whereby you will reach your target (Paradise)." Its the Mercy of Allah, His Grace that we have trust in that will give us salvation on the day of judgment. What is your way of salvation? |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 29 October 2016 at 5:34pm
|
Dear Saved,
I said "I don't know exactly," it's not because I don't believe to my religion, but I don't want to say that I am the person most correct in running all the commandments of Allah, there are Muslims who are better than me in terms religious devotion, only that. Therefore I said "I just run His commandments, and that gives good or good enough is only Allah". Islam is a religion that I believe, but I will not force you to believe in Islam, I only answer the questions you appropriate my belief. Previously I'm sorry that I will not agree to see the truth about your comment, not only to you, even to the comments of the Muslims who are not in accordance with the Quran and Shahih Hadits, I would not agree. I am very confident about the afterlife, therefore, with every effort, I'll keep the commandments of Allah and stay away from all that is forbidden by Him. I have already known that Allah heard me on this, because Allah tells me in the Quran 58:7 and 50: 16,17,18 Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 29 October 2016 at 6:15pm
The Gospel lets me know exactly. The gospel is written so that we can know. John said, "These things I write unto you that you might know you have eternal life and that life is in His Son" Jesus said with his own words "NO one comes to the father (God/Allah)except through me" Of course to be certain of our eternal destination involves certain belief conditions. BTW, it is fine if you don't agree with me for me to say what I just told you. If you can convince me I'd be better off in Islam, I would listen and think about it, but so far I am not convince you have something to offer me that is better than what I have. IMHO, and with all due respect, I believe you have something good, but good can be the enemy of what is best. If you can convince me or if Allah can guide me to see as you do, I would be Muslim in a heart beat, but I am careful about my soul and I am not ignorant of the Devil's schemes as commanded in Scripture. Satan can appear as an angel of light for the purpose of deceiving. he is the Best of Deceivers and the father of lies! PBUY, Al |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 31 October 2016 at 4:28pm
|
Dear Saved,
I won't invite anyone to enter into Islam because it's forbidden by Allah as mentioned in His word, and someone could convert to Islam because he was getting "Hidayah" (guidance) from Allah. This is the same, Allah says in the Quran that muslims have to be careful with the temptations of the devil, because the devil is a real human opponents. Our faith is different, and I will only answer questions in accordance with my belief in Islam. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 31 October 2016 at 5:54pm
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Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 3:34am
|
Dear Saved,
I've said that in Islam, all the descendants of Prophet Adam are eternal life, and that is eternal is only their soul, not their body. They will be eternal both those who go to heaven or to hell. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: DavidC
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 7:55am
For comparison, in the Bible continuance of the soul after death is only for the select. Hell itself is eternal, but nothing indicates souls in hell continue. The Hebrew indicates hell as a place of disposal, like an incinerator. Biblically, if one is consigned to hell POOF!, the soul is gone. The idea of eternal torment is a popular one, but it comes from the fictional accounts of hell written by Dant� and Milton and not from Scripture. God does not torture souls eternally. ------------- Christian; Wesleyan M.Div. |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 9:56am
Hi Asep: That is interesting belief you have there. Christians don't believe Adam was a prophet. As for hell, it is real, and it is the opposite of eternal life. There is no life whatsoever in hell. Eternal life is always a good thing because God is in the details, but hell (Spiritual Death) is the opposite of life. It is eternal damnation and death. The Devil is in the details for hell. Hell is the total absence of God. God doesn't torment people, but demons do. Hell was not meant or made by God for humans; It was made for Satan and his angels or demons. Make no mistake about it, Hell is forever a place of torment, but that torment would be infinitely less painful than being in the presence of a Holy God in an unregenerate state of sin and darkness. May you come to the knowledge of complete truth and life. Best Regards, Al |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 10:13am
Then in v. 15, the Bible says that anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire" I would think it is the same lake of fire forever and ever and people go with their father the Devil which according to Scripture are all who reject Jesus Christ as their Savior, but as a Christian you know these things. There is nothing in Scripture to support the soul goes poof as if you never existed. The soul /spirit goes on and on either to Everlasting life or everlasting shame and contempt. Regards, Al |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 5:29pm
|
Dear David C,
In Islam, there are word of Allah about eternally in hell, among others stated in Quran 43:74 However, any decision about it only belongs to Allah, He knows everything, He is very fair and wise, no one knows about His plans for the next. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: DavidC
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 6:43pm
Most Christians believe the same way. ------------- Christian; Wesleyan M.Div. |
Posted By: syed_z
Date Posted: 01 November 2016 at 10:42pm
|
Greetings Saved, I had asked you how would you gain salvation but you didn't answer. Please provide details as to what will happen on the day of Judgment if I was not a christian and you were then how would you gain salvation. Could you provide details from the gospel? |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 02 November 2016 at 5:44pm
Dear Saved, I respect your beliefs to believe in the religion you profess, and for my belief in Islam about the hell, besides provided for devils also to human as stated in His Word, one of His words is the Quran 66:6. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 02 November 2016 at 5:46pm
Dear David, OK, thanks for your response. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 02 November 2016 at 6:19pm
I too have respect for your beliefs. I am just in dialogue and in search of someone who knows something I don't about the one and only True God. Also keep in mind, that the topic of my thread is "Works vs Faith. IMO, according to Scripture Works will always lose to faith" because without faith it is impossible to please God. When we truly have faith, it will most assuredly show by our works, but the person that depends on works over faith will find they have come short of the glory of God. I believe God loves all of us and wants us to come to the knowledge of Truth. Jesus said: "I am the Truth..." Regards, Al |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 05 November 2016 at 3:15pm
|
Dear Saved,
In Islam, everything we done must be accompanied by faith to gain the pleasure of Allah, and to achieve the pleasure of Allah, mankind must run His commands and avoid what is forbidden by Him. Then please remember that not only Jesus who brought the truth, but also all the Messengers of God brought the truth. unfortunately, there were many people reject the truth brought by the Apostles, even among those alter the passages in the Scriptures so it caused mislead other people from the truth. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 05 November 2016 at 6:20pm
Hi Asep: Thanks for sharing. I understand what you're saying, but I must not have made myself clear. It is our faith in God that produces the works. The works have nothing to do with our salvation. The danger is us believing we need to produce works to earn salvation. Once we feel the need to supplement our faith and God's grace with our good deeds or works, we are making ourselves partners with God in our salvation. That is what will destroy us and sever us from Jesus Christ and God forever. As for all true prophets bringing truth, I agree they all brought truth, but Jesus not only brought the truth, He is the truth and not someone who only brought the truth. No other prophet before or after Jesus could claim to be the truth short of being a false prophet. The difference is being truth and showing truth. That is a big difference. It is like night and day, and death and life. PBUY, Al |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 08 November 2016 at 12:16pm
|
Dear Saved,
Sorry, your explanation on this one for me is less clear whether it can be clarified? So our discussion can be focused to the topic of conversation. Thanks. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 08 November 2016 at 7:24pm
You should read it several times, pray and think carefully to what it says. Ask your Creator to show you where I am coming from in what I have shared. It is clear if looked at carefully asking God for spiritual discernment. I promise you. Part of what it states is that salvation is a gift from God that does us no good unless we take hold of it by faith. Then our faith when mixed with God's grace we are saved from damnation which we really deserve. Faith mixed with God's grace are the conditions God gives us to obtain His mercy. We can never earn mercy or forgiveness not to mention paradise. If we think we have to earn our way to paradise then man gets the credit and not God. Man can boast or brag, God wants all the glory and he shares His glory with no man. The man who trust in doing good deeds to obtain forgiveness, mercy and paradise will not go to a better place because he had been deceived trusting a lie. Peace, Al |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 13 November 2016 at 1:37am
|
Dear Saved,
How will I trust you? (�You should read it several times, pray and think carefully to what it says. Ask your Creator to show you where I am coming from in what I have shared.�), even you are rarely put out the word of God. Due to your statements in your writing this one convoluted (unlike the others), then my answer is simply brief: Quran 2: 15-18 and 42:15 Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 13 November 2016 at 3:47pm
You can trust me by believing I am telling you what I believe to be true; just like I trust you do the same. These are the verses you gave me: Save him who stealeth the hearing, and them doth a clear flame pursue. So to that [religion of Allah ] invite, [O Muhammad], and remain on a right course as you are commanded and do not follow their inclinations but say, "I have believed in what Allah has revealed of the Qur'an, and I have been commanded to do justice among you. Allah is our Lord and your Lord. For us are our deeds, and for you your deeds. There is no [need for] argument between us and you. Allah will bring us together, and to Him is the [final] destination." These verses you quote don't leave me any hope of being guided to Islam, because according to you a flame is following me because of my inclinations. You are also saying my post don't make sense or they are convoluted. This is the verse that comes to mind: 1 Corinthians 1:18 But it doesn't have to be that way for you. Please remember you started with the hard verses first. Regards, Saved |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 16 November 2016 at 5:05pm
|
Dear Saved,
What I told to you about the convoluted does not mean I am humbled you, but because there is the answer you don�t focus on my question, even replied by question. There's nothing at all to guide you even offend you, but I only spoke about the word of Allah in the Quran. If so, I apologize if it's not pleasing to you. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 16 November 2016 at 6:33pm
I agree that there's nothing at all to guide me or offend me concerning the Quran from what you have told me thus far. It is not that the word of the Quran displeases me. The point is you appear to be using the Scripture of the Quran to judge me based on my not answering your questions and on my questions and comments to you. The truth is I didn't understand one of your questions and you don't appear to understand my questions and comments either. So, I keep trying to communicate with you although you are very slow to reply. One of the big differences between Islam and Christianity is that when it comes to salvation, Islam is more a works based religion and Christianity is more faith based. To be honest with you, I don't trust my works to always be good and even if they were, I know it would never merit me salvation. Peace, Saved |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 17 November 2016 at 5:58pm
|
Dear Saved,
Once again I say that I have no intention like that, and I already apologized if it is not pleasing to you. The reason I was slow to reply to you even to the others, it's not because I'm lazy, but there's something more important job I have to do. Only Allah knows it. Sorry, not because I do not want to trust to you, but I also had to consider to determine the truth that is in accordance with my heart and mind. Therefore, in the search for the ultimate truth, besides studied the Quran, I also studied the books of others, including the Veda (Hindu) and the Tripitaka (Buddhist), etc. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 4:53am
| Well the whole Quran urges us to do good always,but these 4 verses always keep me on my toes to do good,Allah in ch 103 v 1-4 of Quran says with token of time man is in state of loss except those who have faith,do good deeds,resort people to truth,resort people to patience and perseverance. |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 9:29am
I notice that you have not mentioned the gospel as one of the Books you should be looking at as Allah commanded. How shall you arrive at truth without fully obeying God? God never told us to look at the Veda or the Tripitaka. PBUY, Saved |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 9:44am
Deeds cannot save anyone nor are they the condition or terms that lead to salvation. As I had mentioned, it is not what we do for God that counts; it is what He does in and through us that constitutes the mercy and grace of God mixed with our faith. If these conditions are not met, there will be no paradise. |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 12:03pm
Excellent quote my brother DavidC which, IMHO, clearly shows the following: 1) Jesus, while he was physically on earth, his Father=God=Allah was in heaven. When, where, and how, the merger of the two (or three )took place? 2) The essential requirement of fulfilling the "will" of Father=Allah. Can this requirement be different than the one required by Jesus? I don't think so, simply because Jesus was the specially selected messenger (we call it Prophet) of Father=Allah. Btw what is this requirement? Again, IMHO, the first and foremost requirement is (a) Believe in his Prophet hood. (b) Do=Work as is being told by the Prophet (Here it must be noted that this Work is always good work and never the bad ones). So, coming to the topic of "Works vs Faith", it is always the combination of the two and not just one. How can anyone claim to believe in Jesus or Mohammad as the Prophet of Father=Allah, and does bad things that are not fulfilling the requirements of Father=Allah? However, again IMHO, even if someone is not a believer, his good Works would not go unrewarded by the Father=Allah, as He is the ultimate MOST Just. What do you say? Best regards. |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 12:58pm
Dear brother, it is really good to know your purpose of search about "one and only Ture God"
I fully agree with you within the commonly understood meaning of faith (ie a belief on God). But then there is something more to it where people who don't have a faith has some form of faith and we call them atheists. So, in essence, even their works are also based on their own defined faith or whatever they call it eg universal humanism etc. Thus, your question is kind of redundant when I summarize that all Works are faith based, and there is hardly anyone who can disagree with you. But was it really that you wanted to ask? I don't think so. What is important to know is how can one assure salvation in the life hereafter? Through Work or Faith? To answer this question, IMHO, Being a Muslims (ie Faith) is essential or necessary, but not a sufficient condition and Neither are the Good works. The assurance of Salvation is only through the HOPE in gaining the Mercy of God=Allah by being always repenting upon his bad works=sins. The Mercy of Allah is only for those who are humble (and not arrogant) and ask forgiveness of their sins till their last breath on this earth.
Yes, my brother!! It is exactly for this reason for the knowledge of Truth, that I may ask you to walk us through the historical evolution of Biblical books, that you of course quote them as the ultimate source of Truth whereby looking at their authenticity as original containing divinely inspired message. Can you name any single book including both OT and NT (other than of St Paul) that contain 100% original message without doubt, as per your own research and within your understanding of your own faith? Best regards |
Posted By: DavidC
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 1:38pm
1) The general Christian belief was that Christ always existed as an aspect of God. As Jesus, he set aside his divinity in order to experience suffering, fear, doubt, temptation, hunger - the human experiences an omnipotent God can not experience. Christians believe that Christ directly ascended into heaven some weeks after his resurrection and reassumed his divine status. This is not unlike the common story of a prince who assumes a disguise in order to experience directly the world he rules. 2) Good deeds are required in Christianity. See the Epistle of James. However, we distinguish between an person who does good deeds simply because he is a decent person, and a person who does good deeds because he trusts in Christ and those good works are the natural product and evidence of his faith. Islam and Christianity are very close here imho. ------------- Christian; Wesleyan M.Div. |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 18 November 2016 at 7:39pm
Additionally, it is not possible to do the will of God not believing Jesus is the son of God and Lord! It is the Lord that puts in us the will to do according to his good pleasure. It is not what we do for God that counts; it is only what God does in and through us that counts by faith that works by love. |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 20 November 2016 at 1:33am
I fully respect your views DavidC, how some may differ from it, simply because what Allah has told us in Quran. For your info, here are few verses of Quran relating specifically to Christians: 005.082 YUSUFALI: Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant. 005.083 YUSUFALI: And when they listen to the revelation received by the Messenger, thou wilt see their eyes overflowing with tears, for they recognise the truth: they pray: "Our Lord! we believe; write us down among the witnesses. 005.084 YUSUFALI: "What cause can we have not to believe in Allah and the truth which has come to us, seeing that we long for our Lord to admit us to the company of the righteous?" 005.085 YUSUFALI: And for this their prayer hath Allah rewarded them with gardens, with rivers flowing underneath,- their eternal home. Such is the recompense of those who do good. Best regards. |
Posted By: DavidC
Date Posted: 20 November 2016 at 8:01am
Thank you, AhmadJoyia. Christians and Muslims in the US got along perfectly well until 2001. Still, most Christians are accepting of Islam and it is common for smaller Muslim communities to use Christian churches until they can organize a mosque. Believing in God is the most important thing. Freedom of religion is lawfully defined as a human right. ------------- Christian; Wesleyan M.Div. |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 20 November 2016 at 9:47am
The gospel tells us what the will of God is. It is to believe on Him whom he sent meaning Jesus specifically yesterday, today and forever Jesus is the same. Putting our faith in any other prophet today would not be obeying the will of His father (Allah) according to the gospel and the context of that verse. For instance, Jesus is saying calling Him Lord, Lord is not enough; we must have Christ not just in our life as a prophet, but He must be the captain of our life siting on the throne of our hearts not just as one of the prophets. David C knows this, and he cannot deny this is the gospel message without compromising his faith. There are those who call Jesus Lord, Lord that are lost, but all those who refuse to call Him Lord are lost and their good deeds will only benefit them here and now, because we all reap what we sow; it is a the law like gravity. It is clear according to the gospel that if you place your trust in good deeds or feel you must be the one to combine good deeds with faith to inherit salvation, eternal life, and paradise, all life will be lost to that individual. I speak the true intention of the gospel. Let me say if we truly make Jesus the Lord of our life then we are doing the will of God and good works will be done through us naturally like a tree bears fruit in its season because only God can put in us the will to do according to His good pleasure when we meet Him on His terms not ours.. Don't be deceived bro in what true Christianity is about.. If you understand it then you can make an informed decision. Let me put it another way. You can have good deeds without belief in God, but you cannot have faith in the God of the gospel without good deeds. IOW, Faith is the fire and good deeds is the incense or smoke pleasing to God. Without the fire of faith in Christ, the incense will profit you nothing in eternity. That is the gospel! The good news is that He who has begun a good work in you will complete it because Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith and not we ourselves. Basically, the gospel of Christianity tells us that Jesus is not honored unless he is honored above all prophets and messengers and our own life. Finally, the gospel states it would have been better that we never heard this message than to have heard it and reject it. |
Posted By: Budain
Date Posted: 23 November 2016 at 2:22pm
| Does Islam accept Jesus as a spiritual being aka God as an equal to Allah? |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 24 November 2016 at 4:29pm
Dear Saved, You said: ---------------------------- I notice that you have not mentioned the gospel as one of the Books you should be looking at as Allah commanded. ---------------------------- The answer is Quran (3):3 This verse explains that Allah has given books to the messengers, and Muslims must believe in the books before the Quran that these books are coming from Allah. But it does not mean Muslims should follow religious rituals performed by them because Muslims own Quran and Islamic Shari'a to perform ritual worship. You said: ------------------------------------ How shall you arrive at truth without fully obeying God? God never told us to look at the Veda or the Tripitaka. ------------------------------------ Now and forever, I only believe in the Quran and not the other books. Yes, God never told us to look at the Veda or the Tripitaka. I read these books because I was so want to find the real truth which one is right ? And my choice is Quran. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 29 November 2016 at 8:17am
Well come aboard my brother! "God" by definition is ONE who has none equal to, and who is OMNIPOTENT, all powerful, and empowered over each, every, and all things that exists in Uni/Multiverse, seen or unseen. With this definition, I guess no one can compare Allah with any of His creatures, at all. With this being said, how can Prophet Jesus, who came to this earth as human, can be considered aka God?? You tell me!! Best regards |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 29 November 2016 at 10:13am
You didn't address the point I was trying to make. You said you read these books so you can find the real truth. So why aren't you reading and searching the gospel Scriptures when you know in them Jesus said, "I am the Truth...?" Besides even Allah said he sent the gospel for guidance and light. If "Now and forever, (you) only believe in the Quran and not the other books." Why are your searching for real truth, and since you looked at other books to find real truth, why didn't search the gospel first and foremost next to the Quran? Simple question |
Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 01 December 2016 at 11:44am
Dear Saved, I say just believe in the Quran after I read a lot of religious books, and after that my only choice is Quran. Hopefully I can find the Gospel first, and according to the news, now has been found in Turkey a Gospel of approximately 1,500 years old, and was written in Aramaic (the language used by Jesus). Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 11 December 2016 at 11:01pm
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Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 18 December 2016 at 3:21pm
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Dear Saved,
I select the Quran because the others books only derived for the people of each Prophets, whereas the Quran to all mankind. Quran 3:138 �This is (the Quran) a plain explanation for all mankind, and a guidance and an admonition for those who fear Allah (Muttaqiin).� Quran 68:52 �In fact, the Quran it is nothing but a warning for all of nature.� Moreover, in the Quran there is Allah's promise about maintaining the purity of His words. Quran 15:9 :�Verily, We who are lowering the Quran, and We also preserve it.� Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 18 December 2016 at 7:22pm
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Posted By: asep48garut60
Date Posted: 01 January 2017 at 3:51pm
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Dear Saved,
I am glad if God set you free from the deception and corruption of religion. Regards, Asep |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 02 January 2017 at 7:21am
Do you really think it makes sense for Allah to preserve the last revelation but not the first revelation that's needed to support it; then, all I can say is "Good luck to you?" How do you know it was Gabriel that acted as Allah's messenger? Didn't you know that Satan and his demons can appear as angels of light to deceive? Even Muhammad doubted his revelation; it was his wife that convinced him he was a prophet. Didn't Allah tell Muhammad to ask the "People of the Book" regarding any doubts about his prophet hood? Didn't Eve beguile Adam. Satan is always up to his old tricks and people still fall for it, because they don't know Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. A question for you, why do you call Muhammad a messenger when the messenger was Gabriel if he was really Gabriel? All Muhammad did was recited what the messenger said. Prophets have always heard from God directly. We are told not to trust angels that go against the previous Scripture. How do you do it, I know how Muhammad did it; he listened to his wife? I question Mormons in the same way, but like you, they remain convinced they are on the right and straight path. Don't you find it a discrepancy that the Quran was suppose to confirm the Scripture that came before, but instead it usurps them and contradicts them? Don't you think something is terrible wrong here? I cannot just follow a religion without thinking about it or thinking it through first, and then if it makes sense to me, I pray about it, because what makes sense to me is not always something that can be trusted. Do you believe everything and anything that makes sense to you? To be honest with you, it doesn't even come close to making sense to me to even bother praying about it. I would even pray about what doesn't make sense to me only if it were in the Scriptures that came before, but not for contradictory scripture that come after the fact. The Scriptures state that we should not lean to our own understanding for that is the way to death. True Biblical Christians such as myself are the people of the Book. We are monotheistic believers. We say God is one and Jesus is His Word. We don't associate a prophet with God directly unless that prophet is the Word of God Himself that God Himself used to create all things seen and not seen... If you know Jesus, you know life; no Jesus, no life; that is the gospel (good news) to those that believe this. Thank God for the gift of Jesus. thank you and Happy New Year to you and yours 2017. PBUY, Saved |
Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 19 February 2017 at 12:31am
| Allah in ch 103 v 1-4 of Quran says with token of time man is in state of loss except those who have faith,who do good deeds, resorting people to truth, resorting people to patience and perseverance |
Posted By: Saved
Date Posted: 18 March 2017 at 8:12pm
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