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Israeli Jets bomb Gaza: 1,300 Dead

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Topic: Israeli Jets bomb Gaza: 1,300 Dead
Posted By: abuayisha
Subject: Israeli Jets bomb Gaza: 1,300 Dead
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 9:16am

Eyewitness: Chaos in Gaza

A%20Palestinian%20girl%20cries%20at%20the%20site%20of%20an%20Israeli%20air%20strike%20in%20Rafah

The BBC's Rushdi Aboualouf in the Gaza Strip described the chaos as Israeli warplanes fired missiles at Hamas targets, killing at least 155 Palestinians.

Israeli planes are still flying over Gaza and they have just targeted another Hamas [security] compound in the middle of the Gaza Strip, in a place called Khan Younis.

We can see from our office here in Gaza, in the middle of Gaza City, ambulances are still evacuating the injured from buildings and school kids are trying to find secure places.

People who were going to their work were turned back and went home, and most of the residents in Gaza have been ordered by the Ministry of Health to stay indoors.

The mosques in Gaza are calling the people here to go to the hospitals and to donate blood. There is no room in the hospitals as far as we've heard from Hamas sources to treat the people.

No safe places

It's a very bad situation... There were Israeli aeroplanes everywhere, hitting everywhere. You could see smoke from north to south, from west to east. The people are really in a panic. The main object for the people now is to find a secure place to secure their family.

It's hard to find a secure place in Gaza. Gaza has no shelters, it has no safe places. The Hamas security compounds are in the middle of the city - it's not the kind of place where you see compounds outside the cities.

I have witnessed one of the compounds - which is 20m away from my house - I was standing on the balcony and I have seen the Israeli airplanes hitting the place.

Some of my balcony was damaged and my kid was injured and it's a very, very serious situation here in Gaza, the people can't do anything except stay indoors.




Replies:
Posted By: mariacanadiana
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 3:06pm
I don't understand all this senseless violence :(


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 3:50pm
It is a test!
Israel is priming the President elect to prove his allegiance to the Zionist State!
The third member of the triad India is threatening Pakistan and it is a standoff at this time......
I was appalled by the http://www.hindu.com/2008/12/27/stories/2008122758550100.htm - Saudi foreign minister Saud bin Faisal being so chummy with this mushrik towing the Indian line while in New Delhi .....Do we need any more proof of the fifth column? It is just sad scenario all around!


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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 5:10pm
Response to the Hamas attack from a few days ago.  Any country would fire back if rockets fired at them?

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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 5:12pm
Did you see the latest on the Mubai attacks?  The hostages were sexually mutilated before they were killed. uugghh!!

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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 5:20pm
Believer,
 
Do you at all see the DAvid and Goliath type of situation with the Palestinians? Do you know see that grea big military and not wonder why they cannot show any true restraint?  It is basically a war, 1 Israeli die so it is 200 Palestinians who must die.. where does this truly come about?
 
Until they allow Palestinians the rights they deserve as human beings, their recourse are but few. You stick people on terrible land,  make  their lives hell, deprive them of basic services and what in the world should the Palestinians do? Do THEY not have those rights that are being denied by Israel? And Israel has no interest in letting the media into Gaza? Why is that? Let the media in so the world can see what their lves are like.
 
If you do not think there is a media blockade you are foolin' yourself.


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When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 5:29pm

Israel showed great restraint considering they could destroy all of Gaza very easily.

Reuters - Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert on Thursday issued a "last-minute" appeal to Palestinians in the Gaza Strip to reject their Hamas rulers and stop rocket fire at Israel, warning them he would not hesitate to use force.

His comments were the clearest indication yet that Israel was preparing a possible Gaza offensive which could result in heavy casualties on both sides and fuel a humanitarian crisis.

Israeli political sources said Olmert's security cabinet approved a "staged" military escalation, beginning with air strikes against a wider range of Hamas targets in the densely-populated enclave.

A large-scale operation has yet to be authorised but could get a green light depending on Hamas's response, the sources said.

In Gaza, Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhoum said Israel would "pay the price" for any attack.

Olmert told Al Arabiya television, an Arab broadcaster widely watched in Gaza: "I didn't come here to declare war." "But Hamas must be stopped -- that is the way it is going to be. I will not hesitate to use Israel's might to strike Hamas and (Islamic) Jihad. How? I will not go into details now," Olmert said, according to a statement issued by his office.

Olmert has resisted calls within Israel for a major military operation against Hamas, but rocket and mortar fire from the coastal enclave since a six-month truce brokered by Egypt expired last week has increased pressure on him to act.

Israeli Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni, a leading candidate to replace Olmert in a Feb. 10 election, held emergency talks with Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, in Cairo, who cautioned against an escalation.

Rocket fire 'unbearable'

Livni said Hamas had to pay for "unbearable" rocket fire, declaring: "Enough is enough."

Adding to the sabre-rattling, army chief Gabi Ashkenazi said Israel would have to act with "all our force to hurt the terrorist infrastructure and change the security reality".

In a sign any fighting with Gaza ran the risk of igniting a wider war, Lebanese troops dismantled eight rockets set up for launch at Israel in a border village. Israel fought an inconclusive war with Hezbollah guerrillas in Lebanon in 2006.

Egypt appealed to Hamas leaders after the talks with Livni "to calm the situation so as to avoid an Israeli military escalation", a Palestinian official said in Gaza.

In response to world appeals and a reduction in rocket fire from Gaza, Israel agreed later to let about 100 trucks carrying food, humanitarian aid, grain and animal feed travel into Gaza on Friday through two crossings, officials on both sides said.

Israel has tried to weaken Islamist Hamas by keeping the Gaza Strip's border crossings closed, increasing hardship for the territory's 1.5 million residents. But there is little doubt that Hamas has control and can counter internal challenges.

Since the ceasefire ended on Friday, more than 200 rockets and mortar shells have been fired at Israel, causing damage but few injuries, the Israeli army said. In the same period, six Gaza militants have been killed in Israeli attacks.

But rocket fire from Gaza declined to 16 launches on Thursday, from dozens the day before.

In the Al Arabiya interview, Olmert issued what amounted to a public call to Gazans to overthrow their Hamas leaders to prevent an escalation with Israel.

I'm telling them now. It may be the last minute. I'm telling them. Stop it. We are stronger. There will be more blood there. Who wants it? We don't want it," Olmert said.

Olmert questioned whether Hamas's stance was consistent with Islam. "Is the spirit of Islam to kill innocent children, to fire rockets at kindergartens and civilians? I don't think that is the spirit of Islam," Olmert said.



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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 5:55pm
salaam alikoom wa rahamtoolih wa barakatuhu...

abuayisha, thanks for the link.

all day...it's pretty much all over nilesat - non-stop.
the images are horrifying and have family and friends here wondering what, if anything, they should or can do. it is incredible how much press that area of the world generates considering the scope of tragedies right here or elsewhere.   nonetheless, it is some powerful stuff.... and extremely depressing.

on the news -
bbc arabic's journalists kind of play it down the middle... but pointed and memorable questions to both sides were:

To Hamas - how could you not expect a military response like the one you got?
the Hamas rep blustered, unfortunately. The response was one we could post in our sleep regarding the occupation and oppression of "the people", yet it rang a bit false - because if "the people" were the concern, they could have allowed some consensus (or given Palestinians some kind of heads-up) before deciding the six month cease-fire was no longer in effect.

To an Israeli govt spokesperson...the reporter said - Yes, everyone agrees with the right to self defense...the world understands...but the widespead reaction is considered to be over-the-top.
The revolting response was this: Civilians were not killed, they were Hamas dressed as civilians.
When the reporter incredulously responded by asking if the children and mothers were also Hamas, he said yes.

God bless and protect us all,
J


Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 6:12pm
Originally posted by believer believer wrote:

Did you see the latest on the Mubai attacks?  The hostages were sexually mutilated before they were killed. uugghh!!
 
THAT was not topic of discussion


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Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent."


Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 6:32pm
Originally posted by Sign*Reader Sign*Reader wrote:

It is a test!
Israel is priming the President elect to prove his allegiance to the Zionist State!
The third member of the triad India is threatening Pakistan and it is a standoff at this time......
I was appalled by the http://www.hindu.com/2008/12/27/stories/2008122758550100.htm - Saudi foreign minister Saud bin Faisal being chummy with the mushriks towing the Indian line while in New Delhi .....Do we need any more proof of the fifth column! It is just sad scenario all around! 
 
I  was about to post of this Saudi. We shall get to read reactions of this Islamic nation, over terrorists attacks in India, or any other, but not a word over Gaza. Its sad that we {muslims} are like orphans today.


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Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent."


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 6:38pm
believer
You might be a believer of a felon Olmert ( he should be in jail for his corruption)  but give us a break on selling the occupiers standard rhetoric ...what is new here?

This has been going on for over half a century now with this net it is just traveling far and wide! How can they expect any justice from these Zionist Jews /Xtians when their own kind are being robbed blind....

 Just remember Bernie Madoff making off with $50 Billion and much of it belonged to old retired Jews in places like Israel, Florida and California; and the charities.....Poor but brave Gazans should know that these vipers eat their own... The blood of your martyrs wouldn't go unrewarded!
There is absolutely no proportionality in this situation Israel is the ruler of the dying super power that is committing suicide through these vipers!
The wars started on their behest and economy under their control has been imploded by design and that is beyond comprehension for the common person!
believer come on tell me what country do you live in?

I have a question for the Jews and their lackeys did you  forget your life in  Europe's Jewish pales?.... Such ingratesThumbs%20Down 



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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 6:53pm

"The doctrine originated with the 1907 Hague Conventions, which govern the laws of war, and was later codified in Article 49 of the International Law Commission's 1980 Draft Articles on State Responsibility (PDF). The doctrine is also referred to indirectly in the 1977 Additional Protocols of the Geneva Conventions. Regardless of whether states are party to the treaties above, experts say the principle is part of what is known as customary international law. According to the doctrine, a state is legally allowed to unilaterally defend itself and right a wrong provided the response is proportional to the injury suffered. The response must also be immediate and necessary, refrain from targeting civilians, and require only enough force to reinstate the status quo ante. That said, experts say the proportionality principle is open to interpretation and depends on the context. 'It's always a subjective test,' says Michael Newton, associate clinical professor of law at Vanderbilt University Law School. 'But if someone punches you in the nose, you don't burn their house down.' "



Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 10:40pm


Hey believer: You need to read this>>>>>>>>>>......

The House of Cards

Caution: Settlers Ahead

By HANNAH MERMELSTEIN

"As a Jew, I was ashamed at the scenes of Jews opening fire at
innocent Arabs in Hebron. There is no other definition than the term
'pogrom' to describe what I have seen." This quote from Israeli Prime
Minister Ehud Olmert came just before I returned to Palestine two
weeks ago. In Syria and in Lebanon, I watched as Al Jazeera
correspondents reported live from Hebron, showing settlers burning
houses and soldiers standing by and watching.

One of my first stops upon return to Palestine was to the Salfit
region in the north, quite far from Hebron, to visit friends. I
wasn't thinking about the settlers. I visited a friend whose house is
surrounded by the Wall, and asked how things were going. "They," she
pointed towards the settlement behind her house, "have attacked us
twice this week." In the middle of the night, the family had woken to
the sounds of stones hitting their house. This has happened before,
but not usually twice in one week. No settler has ever been punished
for throwing stones at their house, though they have broken windows
and water tanks.

I stayed in the area and woke up in the morning to the news that
settlers had attacked a nearby village, spray painting racial slogans
and stars of David on the village's mosque. I have seen stars of
David painted by settlers before, mostly on the walls of Palestinian
shops and homes in Hebron, but I am still taken aback each time I see
it. Do they not remember Kristallnacht? Or do they specifically
remember Kristallnacht?


Another friend told me she had been on a bus the week before that was stopped by Israeli soldiers. "You should turn around and go a
different way," said a soldier to the driver. "There are settlers up
ahead waiting to attack." So the bus turned around, went a different
way, and narrowly avoided a different attack by a group of settler
women gathered on the side of the road with stones.

Somehow this story is the most frustrating to me. When settlers
attack, Palestinians get punished / sent home / re-routed. It is as
though the settlers are a natural phenomenon. They could place a sign
in the road saying, "Caution: Settlers Ahead" and it would seem as
natural to the soldiers as a sign saying "Caution: Storm Conditions
Ahead" or "Caution: Road Curves Ahead." It is as though the condition
of settler attacks is unpreventable.

Of course, it is easier for a soldier to re-route a busload of unarmed
Palestinian people largely accustomed to occupation than to move a
group of armed settlers used to getting their way. But if the Israeli
government, with the 4th largest military in the world, wanted to
control a few (or a few thousand) extremist settlers, I am confident
that they could. This is not about a natural phenomenon, an
inevitable occurrence, an inability of the Israeli government to reign
in their population. It is a lack of will.

So when the prime minister of Israel says that he is personally
offended by the settler attacks, when he calls them pogroms, one
wonders why the Israeli soldiers largely stood by and watched, or even
accompanied the settlers on their attacks. One wonders why the
perpetrators are not in prison (unless they also attacked soldiers).
One wonders why the settlers have not been removed. And the answer is simple: These settlers serve the interests of the Israeli government.
I am not sure the government is always thrilled when the situation
gets out of control like this (and then reflects badly on Israel in
international media), but in general, having a small group of
right-wing extremists deflects attention from the root causes of the
problem, and deflects responsibility from the government.

Indeed, many Israelis view these settlers with disgust, and think, "If
only these people would move out of the West Bank, we would have
peace." The settler movement often retorts, "What is the difference
between land we came to control in 1948 and land we came to control in 1967?" Their conclusion (that Jews should fight for exclusive control
of all the land) is quite opposite from mine, but the analysis is the
same.

And this is why there are three Israeli soldiers for every Israeli
settler in Hebron. Because if the settlers were to be removed, and
"peace" did not magically appear, then people might start to ask,
"Wait, is there another problem?" People might start to realize that
occupation is not defined solely by presence of settlers (Gaza is
experiencing the worst of occupation right now, though the settlers
left more than three years ago). People might start to realize that
there are Palestinians inside Israel who are treated less than
equally, to say the least. People might start to realize that half of
the Palestinian population has never set foot in any part of
Palestine, and that more than two thirds are not permitted to live in
their original villages. In other words, people might get to the core
of the issue.

The ideological settler movement is, in many ways, holding together
the fragile house of cards that is Israel. It has worked for a while,
but it will not work forever. In front of this house we can add one
more sign: "Caution: Collapse of Zionism Ahead."

P.S. While settlers are not jailed, these Israelis are:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNjggLhQo6w - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNjggLhQo6w





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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 27 December 2008 at 10:51pm
 
http://smokingmirrors.blogspot.com/2008/12/its-holiday-celebration-for-synagogue.html - It's a Holiday Celebration for The Synagogue of Satan.
 
Some celebrate the holidays with giving and fellowship; making up for the rest of the year when they can�t see the profit in it or it involves that extra effort that is better spent sitting on one�s ass and being entertained in lieu of an existence. Some opt for the religious angle and enjoy recreations of events for which no historical data exists. Some opt for the spiritual and we have no way of knowing what they are doing. Some look at it as an excuse to be more lubricated than usual and for some it is an opportunity to be more depressed than usual and some� some like to war on their neighbors because that is how they celebrate their holy days. Chief among the latter is the serial killer, theme park known as Israel.

Just as they attacked the U.S.S. Liberty in an attempt to provoke a war between The U.S. and the U.S.S.R. by way of Egypt and just as they used their control of the world press to give the im�press�ion that Lebanon kidnapped their soldiers on Israeli soil when they were actually captured well into Lebanon and� conveniently had all their forces mustered on the border and just as they bombed the King David Hotel and orchestrated the 9/11 attacks, they are now showing their holiday spirit bombing the *****out of the people they have been starving to death in Palestine based on http://palestinethinktank.com/2008/12/26/kawther-salam-the-rockets-of-hunger-and-israeli-propaganda/ - rather crude evidence of Hamas related rocket attacks; this would be almost funny if it weren�t so sick. Of course, http://www.javno.com/en/world/clanak.php?id=92541 - the one who violated the cease fire was Israel.

Once again I�m going to have to give you the image of http://sabbah.biz/mt/archives/2006/05/10/the-shrinking-map-of-palestine/ - the incredible shrinking map of Palestine. And I�m going to tell you that most of those rocket attacks are being carried out by Israelis on Israeli territory and that�s why they hardly ever hit anyone or anything. This is about full bore extermination of the Palestinian people who don�t have the good sense to move� somewhere? They should damn well know better than to occupy land that the AshkeNAZI�s want.

Now, as a gift to themselves in their festival of darkness they are going to enjoy another bloodstained holiday based on another bloodstained event. While the world has been jerking off to porn and prostrating themselves before the altar of the god of self-interest, the Palestinian people are being systematically wiped out with USDA approved genocidal actions. They�ve had their power and their water cut off. They�ve had their sewers backflowed into their living quarters. They�ve had their food supply cut off and all medical supplies and treatment denied them and �you name it� they�re getting it. It ain�t pretty.

Since just about no one has the courage to say it, let me say it� Israel, you are a nation of demented, psychopathic swine. You are involved in just about every ugly thing going on across the planet from your tribal control of the porn industry; to drug trafficking, human traffic, child murder, the crashing of the world financial systems, most of the world�s terror attacks and what have you. You�re a pimple on the ass of a degenerate crack whore in the Kingdom of Hell and you will� you will fall.

If anyone else were to do the things that these rapacious, bloodthirsty swine engaged in there would be a hue and cry across the landscape� or maybe not. No one seems to give much of a *****about anything these days except what�s in it for them. Of course, they are being victimized by these same swine but can�t get it up to do anything about it.

You have no right to exist but you do exist, the same way stomach cancer does. You exist, the same way that mosquitoes do, the way flies do and the way that all of Pandora�s refugees exist. You are the spirit of Pandora�s box which� also has a number of STD�s from a little too much violent rape without a condom.

You�re pretty slick. You worked your precious holocaust as a public relations event and even when various nations wanted to do something about the situation you refused all help. The suffering of certain individuals was all good copy for the blackmail you had in mind in the aftermath. Historical truth and hard data shows that your people engineered and carried out holocausts much greater than the numbers you give and they did it over and over and over; in Russia, in The Ukraine, in Armenia and � for all I know everywhere there�s ever been one. You�re the Synagogue of Satan. This is who you are the chosen people of. This is why the Golden Calf is rampant on your coat of arms.

You caused the war in Afghanistan by attacking the U.S. by proxy. You caused the war in Iraq by manufacturing lies through your agents and made the country much worse than it ever was under Saddam. Now you�re screaming and frothing at the mouth for an attack on Iran which hasn�t attacked anyone in many centuries. All your major wars since �48 were initiated by you and made to look like someone else did the attacking but�. hard data shows you started these wars, not the other guy(s).

You�re a ***** abomination and everyone who because of ignorance, fear or money supports you, is also an abomination as well.

I don�t know what it is� occult power, money, nukes hidden in every country in the world. I don't know how you maintain your stranglehold on power in high places. I don�t know why you�ve been such a plague on humanity across the centuries which historical data shows the proof of� heck� look at who MOST of the slave traders were� by their own logs they are convicted.

You don�t scare me. Dying isn�t hard. Living is much harder. I�m hoping that Iran gets those S-300�s. I suspect you can�t attack even now. They�re more your size. This isn�t the same thing as faking the Entebbe rescue. This isn�t the same thing as pounding the *****out of a kid half your size or still in the crib which is your specialty. You�re stone cold evil and complete cowards as all the evidence shows.

Now, your settlers rampage through Palestinian neighborhoods; these evil lunatics who destroy orchards and kill women and children. Your IDF protects them even while they do it. When the IDF uses children for target practice, nothing happens. And all the time you talk about God and how Israel is chosen by God. It�s not God you are talking about. It�s The Devil. The Devil is your god. It is patently clear by what you do whom you serve. You serve the essential nature of evil. You talk of making war by way of deception and the devil is known as the great deceiver.

(By way of digression you http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2008/12/the-madoff-victims-they-richly-deserved-it/ - should read this for a more measured take on a related subject by a gifted writer.)

You are the children of the devil and I just needed to say it. You worship matter and your love is only that which can be given to the desire for acquisition. It�s a little more like lust if you catch my drift.

Today and tomorrow you kill hundreds more innocent people. Today you celebrate your holidays, which are all based on similar murders, by doing that which you enjoy more than anything else� evil and the things of evil� murder, theft, corruption� you name it, you do it. You are the living face of evil.

Evil will not last. Your day is coming and then there will be cause for celebration all across the world. That will be cause for a real holiday as great as any other the world has ever seen.
 

http://smokingmirrors.blogspot.com/2008/12/its-holiday-celebration-for-synagogue.html - http://smokingmirrors.blogspot.com/2008/12/its-holiday-celebration-for-synagogue.html



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 28 December 2008 at 6:41am
275 Gazans plus 7 UN workers killed so far by the Neo-Nazi Zionists and the a$$hat Arab leaders are too busy adding the filth to their riches and the UN-International politicos are waiting for the s**t to hit the fan! Whatmore, the eunuch Abu Mazen, the passive recipient of US-Israeli dic-tation had the balls to blame Hamas for the massacre.

God save the Palestinians!


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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Caprice88
Date Posted: 28 December 2008 at 11:47am
I think the whole problem is that the Israelis occupying a country where they dont even know the word 'sharing'. Most settlers are from Europe, North America etc. So basically they had everything except that their evilness made them move there and destroying Palestinas houses indiscriminately while them fat greedy Arab leaders aint doing nothing. The other problem aswell is that there is factions inside Palastine so it makes it easier for Israel to target and choose their PUPPET leader for Palastine by paying that individual faction. No Hamas or Fatah cares about the civilians is just a Big CAT AND MOUSE GAME going on there. The worst thing of all is that Egypt an Arab, Muslim country closed its boarder and even fired in air on Palastinas running from the bombarment i mean how evil is that.
 
God save Gaza and the whole Middle East! 


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A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in.



Posted By: JihadX
Date Posted: 28 December 2008 at 6:04pm
This is sad. Everone i speak to about this says that "something should be done against the Yahoudis". Does anyone agree with that statement?


Posted By: mariyah
Date Posted: 28 December 2008 at 7:07pm
 
Asalaamu alaikum...I find that the perpetrators of heinous acts Will recieve theirs on the last day.....To jews I say shame for how you lock ducks in a cage and then shoot at them for sport (not to mention they are your brothers in Abraham.)
To Christians I say you dishonor your leader in not following his teachings...whatsoever you do to the least of my brothers that you do unto me, You dishonor The ONE True God by the worship of his creation therefore you will be held accountable for your actions as we all will..
to Muslims who sit by, watch and do nothing..contact your representatives, demand that financial and aid to Israel STOP......stop the financing of terrorist actions against a imprisoned population. I am going downtown to sit ouside an embassy tomorrow in the freezing  cold, what are you doing?
 
May Allah have mercy upon us all
 
2:136 Say (O muslims): We believe in Allah and that which is revealed unto us and that which was revealed unto Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the tribes, and that which Moses and Jesus received, and that which the Prophets received from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and unto Him we have surrendered.
 
 
4:44 Seest thou not those unto whom a portion of the Scripture hath been given, how they purchase error, and seek to make you (muslims) err from the right way?
 
 


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"Every good deed is charity whether you come to your brother's assistance or just greet him with a smile.


Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 4:09am
I would like to invite forum friends here who are 'members' of Avaaz to write to the organisation and complain in the strongest terms about why they do not have the Gaza situation on their front page. They do not give it prominence in their list of activities, and wimp out with puerile actions such as putting YouTube clips up. Just as the UN wimps out, and the Vatican with their meaningless "condemnations in the strongest terms".

The Israeli-Palestine problem is THE most important geo-political conflict, it has not been resolved because there is no political will to resolve it. The knock on effects of a balanced solution would mean a renaissance in Arab-Islamic lands which would engender a new socio-economic reality there, ultimately threatening the existing 'status quo' , maintained by the Zionist banking cartel who hold the world's purse strings.

Please note: THERE IS NO POLITICAL SOLUTION to this problem. Obviously, killing each other only ensures it continues generation upon generation. Only a new paradigm thinking can confront the problem, and it appears before us like the insurmountable mountain: it involves changing the way you think, and challenging the way things are presented to you:

1. We have all swallowed wholesale the American-Israeli led propaganda which continuously blames the victims for their plight: e.g this would not have happened if Hamas had upheld the ceasefire. The antidote to such propaganda is not more propaganda (counter-propaganda), but a personal investigation into the events. Particularly important in this quest is a balanced view of the continual reinforcement of the story of persecution of Jews in recent history. By continually presenting themselves as the victims, the Jewish state of Israel is like the spoiled child who can do no wrong in the eyes of its parents.

2. Appealing to political power is as usefull as whistling in the wind. Think laterally: i.e what can you do that would make your local representative notice that you are actually his boss? What can you do that would have some real repercussion on his/her position? Telling him or her that you are "disgusted by the stance on Israel" isn't going to have much effect (it hasn't had ANY effect in the past 40-60 years) so think of something more basic. Ultimately you should abandon the existing Black & White paradigm which states you are either with us or against us, and that boils everything down to the false-dichotomy of left or right, Democrat or Republican.

I don't have time for more right now, but I'll come back later!


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 6:14am
A Gazan man said on camera - We dont want anyone's help, especially that despicable DOG of Egypt, Mubarak's - Unqoute. Thats insulting dogs.

Tzipi says Hamas came to power through a coup and are now holding Gazans hostage. Also that Israel's attacking only Hamas members and sites - Apparently, babies and children were also members of Hamas.


-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 7:47am
 
 

Mon

29

Dec

2008

Shock, Awe and Lies: The Truth Behind the Israeli Attack on Gaza http://www.chris-floyd.com/component/content/article/3/1666-shock-awe-and-lies-the-truth-behind-the-israeli-attack-on-gaza.pdf">PDF http://www.chris-floyd.com/component/content/article/3/1666-shock-awe-and-lies-the-truth-behind-the-israeli-attack-on-gaza.html?tmpl=component&print=1&page=">Print http://www.chris-floyd.com/component/mailto/?tmpl=component&link=aHR0cDovL3d3dy5jaHJpcy1mbG95ZC5jb20vY29tcG9uZW50L2NvbnRlbnQvYXJ0aWNsZS8zLzE2NjYtc2hvY2stYXdlLWFuZC1saWVzLXRoZS10cnV0aC1iZWhpbmQtdGhlLWlzcmFlbGktYXR0YWNrLW9uLWdhemEuaHRtbA%3D%3D">E-mail
Written by http://www.chris-floyd.com/component/comprofiler/userprofile/chris.html - Chris Floyd   

Here is a simple, stone cold fact. You cannot read or hear the truth about what is happening in Gaza from any corporate media in the United States. The only thing you will find there are regurgitations of Israeli spin, which are themselves only regurgitations of the kind of spin that American militarists have put on their own depredations -- for centuries now. Up and down the American media and political establishments, you will find nothing but bleatings about Israel being "forced" to launch its vicious blunderbuss attacks against heavily populated Gaza because of the "recent spate of Hamas bombings" since the end of a six-month ceasefire.

This is of course a damnable and deliberate lie. Papers in Israel -- in Israel, but not the United States -- are reporting the truth: the murderous assault on Gaza was planned not only before the six-month ceasefire ended -- it was planned before the cease-fire even took effect. Indeed, the cease-fire was part of the military plan to decimate the civilian areas of Gaza; it was a hoax, a scam, a deliberate feint to buy time for military preparations -- precisely the same strategy followed by the Bush Regime (and its bipartisan Establishment supporters) in "going to the UN" to seek a "peaceful solution" to the "Iraqi crisis" -- when the invasion was already in the works.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1050426.html - Haaretz reports on the Israel's deceit in the latest outrage, in the aptly titled piece, "Disinformation, secrecy and lies: How the Gaza offensive came about":

Long-term preparation, careful gathering of information, secret discussions, operational deception and the misleading of the public - all these stood behind the Israel Defense Forces "Cast Lead" operation against Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip, which began Saturday morning. he disinformation effort, according to defense officials, took Hamas by surprise and served to significantly increase the number of its casualties in the strike.

Sources in the defense establishment said Defense Minister Ehud Barak instructed the Israel Defense Forces to prepare for the operation over six months ago, even as Israel was beginning to negotiate a ceasefire agreement with Hamas. According to the sources, Barak maintained that although the lull would allow Hamas to prepare for a showdown with Israel, the Israeli army needed time to prepare, as well..

The story also notes that the recent racheting of tension was sparked, deliberately, by a heavy-handed Israeli incursion into Gaza:

The plan of action that was implemented in Operation Cast Lead remained only a blueprint until a month ago, when tensions soared after the IDF carried out an incursion into Gaza during the ceasefire to take out a tunnel which the army said was intended to facilitate an attack by Palestinian militants on IDF troops....

While Barak was working out the final details with the officers responsible for the operation, Livni went to Cairo to inform Egypt's president, Hosni Mubarak, that Israel had decided to strike at Hamas. In parallel, Israel continued to send out disinformation in announcing it would open the crossings to the Gaza Strip and that Olmert would decide whether to launch the strike following three more deliberations on Sunday - one day after the actual order to launch the operation was issued.

"Hamas evacuated all its headquarter personnel after the cabinet meeting on Wednesday," one defense official said, "but the organization sent its people back in when they heard that everything was put on hold until Sunday."

Not only did this deception lead Hamas to send its officials back to work -- it also meant that there was no general warning to the masses of civilians packed like sardines into Gaza's hellish confines. It meant that civilian casualties would be maximized -- especially when the initial assault was launched in the middle of the day, with thousands of schoolchildren out at their lesson.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/12/28/peretz/index.html - As Glenn Greenwald notes , Israel's massive bombing of civilian areas -- even if couched in terms of "retaliation" for scattershot strikes on Israeli territory by a political faction -- constitutes "a clear violation of the Geneva Conventions." Greenwald also adroitly turns Barack Obama's campaign kowtowing to Israeli militarism on its head:

[Obama on the campaign trail]: "The first job of any nation state is to protect its citizens. And so I can assure you that if -- I don't even care if I was a politician -- if somebody was sending rockets into my house where my two daughters sleep at night, I'm going to do everything in my power to stop that. And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing."

Can't the exact same mentality be deployed to justify everything Hamas has done and is doing, to wit:  "if a foreign power were brutally occupying my country for four decades -- or blockading my country and denying my children medical needs and nutrition and the ability even to exit -- I'm going to do everything in my power to stop that.  And I would expect Palestinians to do the same thing"?  But the last thing that our political class ever extends is reciprocal, two-sided analysis to this dispute.

What is the ultimate context of this carnage? The fact that the Arab inhabitants of Palestine had their land taken away from them by force -- not in some ancient, historic era, but within the lifetime of many thousands of Palestinians still living. I hold no brief for Hamas; http://angryarab.blogspot.com/ - like the Angry Arab , whose coverage of the conflict has been relentless and penetrating, I don't care for any party based on religious extremism. But as Greenwald notes, every action taken by Hamas and other Palestinian resistance groups could be characterized as "retaliation" for the theft of their land, not to mention the war crime of collective punishment and genocidal blockades visited upon the Occupied Territories for years.

But there is not a single peep of this perspective from America's ruling class and its media courtiers. Of course, it is a bit much to expect a nation which itself was built on land theft, repression and slaughter to see anything wrong or "disproportionate" in Israel's treatment of the Palestinians. What else are you supposed to do when those dang heathen savages come around with their war parties and tomahawks, trying to get back the land that God Almighty has granted to good white folk?

Meanwhile, here's what Israel's "Manifest Destiny" looks like on the ground in Gaza.
http://www.maannews.net/en/index.php?opr=ShowDetails&Do=Print&ID=34268 - From the Maan News Agency (via the Angry Arab, as was the photo above):

Death shrouds the hallways of Gaza City's Ash-Shifa medical compound Saturday, its smell creeping in from all corners. mputated bodies are strewn throughout hallways because morgues in the city can no longer accommodate the dead. In one corner a man stands with his seven year old son in a cardboard box because the hospital ran out of sheets to cover the dead with. This is how he will carry him home and bury him. Another man stands dazed, in shock after watching his son Mohammed killed during his graduation ceremony at the de facto police headquarters. The father of one of Mohammed's classmates stood next to his son as he was decapitated. The man is still screaming.

In the packed hospital waiting room a mother sits silently staring into the distance; her son was pronounced dead shortly after she brought him in... Forty-year-old mother Nawal Al-Lad'a did not find the bodies of her two sons in the medical compound, so she left to look amid the rubble.

Husam Farajallah, a university student, was at the hospital collecting the body of his relative. He called what happened in Gaza a "black day" in the lives of all Palestinians, and wondered how the world could watch and do nothing.

Medics in Gaza confirmed that the majority of those killed in the day's attacks were civilians, including men, women and children. Most were cut to pieces, making the job of doctors and medics difficult, and the task of giving bodies back to families painful and gruesome. The medics working in the field continue to dig up bodies from the densely populated urban areas of Gaza City.

The scenes remind many Palestinians of the images that came out of the Sabra and Shatila massacres from Beirut in 1982, when thousands of Palestinians were killed by the Lebanese Phalangist militia.

As the death toll climbs and no word on a halt to the attacks has come from Israel, Gazans fear for their lives and loved ones.
 
 
 
 


-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: JihadX
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 7:52am
Thanks for sharing Saladin. I believe you are right about the USA media.  The USA supports them in everything they do.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 8:55am
LOL!!  Immediately all of you judge me and mis-understand my post.  I am neither pro Israel or hamas.  GOD will be the judge and each will receive their just rewards.
 
Basically Hamas is a mosquito buzzing around Israel.  How long will it continue to irritate before it is slapped into oblivion? 
 
If the situation was reversed and Israel were the little irritating mosquito what would hamas do?
 
The whole situation is sad, very sad.


-------------
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 11:00am
Believer,

If its said that Israel's the mosquito, thats a major understatement. Israel's a cancerous tumor planted on the Mid East by the West and the Palestinians are suffering for the sins of erstwhile anti-semitic Europe.

Why do you hide the fact that some in your community yearn for all this carnage? Dont these bellicose evangelical dispensationalists want the Holy land and all Biblical lands to be a holy mess and two-thirds of the Jews in Israel destroyed so that these schizos can get raptured.


-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 11:07am
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-leaders-lie-civilians-die-and-lessons-of-history-are-ignored-1215045.html

Robert Fisk: Leaders lie, civilians die, and lessons of history are ignored

We've got so used to the carnage of the Middle East that we don't care any more � providing we don't offend the Israelis. It's not clear how many of the Gaza dead are civilians, but the response of the Bush administration, not to mention the pusillanimous reaction of Gordon Brown, reaffirm for Arabs what they have known for decades: however they struggle against their antagonists, the West will take Israel's side. As usual, the bloodbath was the fault of the Arabs � who, as we all know, only understand force.

Ever since 1948, we've been hearing this balderdash from the Israelis � just as Arab nationalists and then Arab Islamists have been peddling their own lies: that the Zionist "death wagon" will be overthrown, that all Jerusalem will be "liberated". And always Mr Bush Snr or Mr Clinton or Mr Bush Jnr or Mr Blair or Mr Brown have called upon both sides to exercise "restraint" � as if the Palestinians and the Israelis both have F-18s and Merkava tanks and field artillery. Hamas's home-made rockets have killed just 20 Israelis in eight years, but a day-long blitz by Israeli aircraft that kills almost 300 Palestinians is just par for the course.

The blood-splattering has its own routine. Yes, Hamas provoked Israel's anger, just as Israel provoked Hamas's anger, which was provoked by Israel, which was provoked by Hamas, which ... See what I mean? Hamas fires rockets at Israel, Israel bombs Hamas, Hamas fires more rockets and Israel bombs again and ... Got it? And we demand security for Israel � rightly � but overlook this massive and utterly disproportionate slaughter by Israel. It was Madeleine Albright who once said that Israel was "under siege" � as if Palestinian tanks were in the streets of Tel Aviv.

By last night, the exchange rate stood at 296 Palestinians dead for one dead Israeli. Back in 2006, it was 10 Lebanese dead for one Israeli dead. This weekend was the most inflationary exchange rate in a single day since � the 1973 Middle East War? The 1967 Six Day War? The 1956 Suez War? The 1948 Independence/Nakba War? It's obscene, a gruesome game � which Ehud Barak, the Israeli Defence Minister, unconsciously admitted when he spoke this weekend to Fox TV. "Our intention is to totally change the rules of the game," Barak said.

Exactly. Only the "rules" of the game don't change. This is a further slippage on the Arab-Israeli exchanges, a percentage slide more awesome than Wall Street's crashing shares, though of not much interest in the US which � let us remember � made the F-18s and the Hellfire missiles which the Bush administration pleads with Israel to use sparingly.

Quite a lot of the dead this weekend appear to have been Hamas members, but what is it supposed to solve? Is Hamas going to say: "Wow, this blitz is awesome � we'd better recognise the state of Israel, fall in line with the Palestinian Authority, lay down our weapons and pray we are taken prisoner and locked up indefinitely and support a new American 'peace process' in the Middle East!" Is that what the Israelis and the Americans and Gordon Brown think Hamas is going to do?

Yes, let's remember Hamas's cynicism, the cynicism of all armed Islamist groups. Their need for Muslim martyrs is as crucial to them as Israel's need to create them. The lesson Israel thinks it is teaching � come to heel or we will crush you � is not the lesson Hamas is learning. Hamas needs violence to emphasise the oppression of the Palestinians � and relies on Israel to provide it. A few rockets into Israel and Israel obliges.

Not a whimper from Tony Blair, the peace envoy to the Middle East who's never been to Gaza in his current incarnation. Not a bloody word.

We hear the usual Israeli line. General Yaakov Amidror, the former head of the Israeli army's "research and assessment division" announced that "no country in the world would allow its citizens to be made the target of rocket attacks without taking vigorous steps to defend them". Quite so. But when the IRA were firing mortars over the border into Northern Ireland, when their guerrillas were crossing from the Republic to attack police stations and Protestants, did Britain unleash the RAF on the Irish Republic? Did the RAF bomb churches and tankers and police stations and zap 300 civilians to teach the Irish a lesson? No, it did not. Because the world would have seen it as criminal behaviour. We didn't want to lower ourselves to the IRA's level.

Yes, Israel deserves security. But these bloodbaths will not bring it. Not since 1948 have air raids protected Israel. Israel has bombed Lebanon thousands of times since 1975 and not one has eliminated "terrorism". So what was the reaction last night? The Israelis threaten ground attacks. Hamas waits for another battle. Our Western politicians crouch in their funk holes. And somewhere to the east � in a cave? a basement? on a mountainside? � a well-known man in a turban smiles.


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 11:29am
Yeah, pit brother against brother, nations against nations, totally screw up the World and get on the highway to Heaven.

And what do their Jewish temporary partners want? To tear down Al Aqsa, build the Third Temple, wipe out the goyims off Eretz Israel and give a Jewish only welcome party for the Messiah.

Get back to reality and live the way Jesus and Moses wanted you all to live. Leave God's work to God. He's well capable of doing His work by Himself.

-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 11:45am
Salam Alaikum Bro Jamal,

Did you see Aljazeera's 'Inside Story' today. In it Robert Fisk gave a piece of his mind to an arrogant American-Israeli loonie. I couldnt know who the guy was.


-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 12:14pm
Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

Salam Alaikum Bro Jamal,

Did you see Aljazeera's 'Inside Story' today. In it Robert Fisk gave a piece of his mind to an arrogant American-Israeli loonie. I couldnt know who the guy was.
 

Robert Fisk: Leaders lie, civilians die, and lessons of history are ignored

Monday, 29 December 2008

Reuters

A Palestinian woman walks past a destroyed Hamas police compound after an Israeli air strike

 

We've got so used to the carnage of the Middle East that we don't care any more � providing we don't offend the Israelis. It's not clear how many of the Gaza dead are civilians, but the response of the Bush administration, not to mention the pusillanimous reaction of Gordon Brown, reaffirm for Arabs what they have known for decades: however they struggle against their antagonists, the West will take Israel's side. As usual, the bloodbath was the fault of the Arabs � who, as we all know, only understand force.

Ever since 1948, we've been hearing this balderdash from the Israelis � just as Arab nationalists and then Arab Islamists have been peddling their own lies: that the Zionist "death wagon" will be overthrown, that all Jerusalem will be "liberated". And always Mr Bush Snr or Mr Clinton or Mr Bush Jnr or Mr Blair or Mr Brown have called upon both sides to exercise "restraint" � as if the Palestinians and the Israelis both have F-18s and Merkava tanks and field artillery. Hamas's home-made rockets have killed just 20 Israelis in eight years, but a day-long blitz by Israeli aircraft that kills almost 300 Palestinians is just par for the course.

The blood-splattering has its own routine. Yes, Hamas provoked Israel's anger, just as Israel provoked Hamas's anger, which was provoked by Israel, which was provoked by Hamas, which ... See what I mean? Hamas fires rockets at Israel, Israel bombs Hamas, Hamas fires more rockets and Israel bombs again and ... Got it? And we demand security for Israel � rightly � but overlook this massive and utterly disproportionate slaughter by Israel. It was Madeleine Albright who once said that Israel was "under siege" � as if Palestinian tanks were in the streets of Tel Aviv.

By last night, the exchange rate stood at 296 Palestinians dead for one dead Israeli. Back in 2006, it was 10 Lebanese dead for one Israeli dead. This weekend was the most inflationary exchange rate in a single day since � the 1973 Middle East War? The 1967 Six Day War? The 1956 Suez War? The 1948 Independence/Nakba War? It's obscene, a gruesome game � which Ehud Barak, the Israeli Defence Minister, unconsciously admitted when he spoke this weekend to Fox TV. "Our intention is to totally change the rules of the game," Barak said.

Exactly. Only the "rules" of the game don't change. This is a further slippage on the Arab-Israeli exchanges, a percentage slide more awesome than Wall Street's crashing shares, though of not much interest in the US which � let us remember � made the F-18s and the Hellfire missiles which the Bush administration pleads with Israel to use sparingly.

Quite a lot of the dead this weekend appear to have been Hamas members, but what is it supposed to solve? Is Hamas going to say: "Wow, this blitz is awesome � we'd better recognise the state of Israel, fall in line with the Palestinian Authority, lay down our weapons and pray we are taken prisoner and locked up indefinitely and support a new American 'peace process' in the Middle East!" Is that what the Israelis and the Americans and Gordon Brown think Hamas is going to do?

Yes, let's remember Hamas's cynicism, the cynicism of all armed Islamist groups. Their need for Muslim martyrs is as crucial to them as Israel's need to create them. The lesson Israel thinks it is teaching � come to heel or we will crush you � is not the lesson Hamas is learning. Hamas needs violence to emphasise the oppression of the Palestinians � and relies on Israel to provide it. A few rockets into Israel and Israel obliges.

Not a whimper from Tony Blair, the peace envoy to the Middle East who's never been to Gaza in his current incarnation. Not a bloody word.

We hear the usual Israeli line. General Yaakov Amidror, the former head of the Israeli army's "research and assessment division" announced that "no country in the world would allow its citizens to be made the target of rocket attacks without taking vigorous steps to defend them". Quite so. But when the IRA were firing mortars over the border into Northern Ireland, when their guerrillas were crossing from the Republic to attack police stations and Protestants, did Britain unleash the RAF on the Irish Republic? Did the RAF bomb churches and tankers and police stations and zap 300 civilians to teach the Irish a lesson? No, it did not. Because the world would have seen it as criminal behaviour. We didn't want to lower ourselves to the IRA's level.

Yes, Israel deserves security. But these bloodbaths will not bring it. Not since 1948 have air raids protected Israel. Israel has bombed Lebanon thousands of times since 1975 and not one has eliminated "terrorism". So what was the reaction last night? The Israelis threaten ground attacks. Hamas waits for another battle. Our Western politicians crouch in their funk holes. And somewhere to the east � in a cave? a basement? on a mountainside? � a well-known man in a turban smiles.

 



Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 12:36pm
Salam Abuayisha,

I know Robert. It was the other guy (american or israeli) that i dont know.


-------------
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 4:31pm
Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

Salam Alaikum Bro Jamal,

Did you see Aljazeera's 'Inside Story' today. In it Robert Fisk gave a piece of his mind to an arrogant American-Israeli loonie. I couldnt know who the guy was.


Yes...that show is what sent me online to find the article. (Fisk is one of my heros.) Pretty much all of his talking points were in the article; in fact, it would be good to see what the responses were to that program in particular.

from Reuters:

"PRACTICAL THINGS"


Speaking to reporters by videolink from Gaza, Karen AbuZayd, head of the U.N. agency for Palestinian refugees (UNRWA), said she did not think Gazans believed a 6-month-old truce was violated first by Hamas, which ended it on Dec. 19.

AbuZayd, an American, said they believed Hamas had observed the truce "quite strictly ... and that they got nothing in return, because there was supposed to be a kind of a deal -- if there were no rockets the crossings would be opened. The crossings weren't opened at all."

Israel had also launched an incursion to kill Palestinian militants, "so then the rockets went out and that was sort of the breakdown of the truce," she said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/featuredCrisis/idUSN29458683


Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 5:51pm
 
This brutality shall continue, as these jews know very well, that these arab leaders shall not utter a word. Yes, they shall respond when Hammas if replies with fidain attacks - "we condemn every type of terrorism ---". May Allah swt, foil all there plans against us.
 
Israel readying for ground operation as Gaza toll reaches 345

Gaza/Tel Aviv, Dec 29 : After three days of massive airstrikes in the Gaza Strip, Israel was
readying Monday to widen its offensive against Hamas by sending in ground forces.

The toll of Operation "Cast Lead" - launched Saturday to curb rocket and mortar attacks from the
strip - reached at least 345 Palestinian dead and 1,600 injured, Gaza emergency services chief
Mu'awia Hassanein said. Two Israelis have also been killed and dozens injured.

Large columns of tanks, military vehicles and buses with Israeli soldiers on board meanwhile have
moved southwards, deploying near the Israeli border with Gaza in what could indicate a possible
impending ground invasion, witnesses said.

The Israeli army also declared the area around Gaza a "closed military zone", meaning no civilians
will be allowed through roadblocks set up on key entry roads.

The Israeli cabinet Sunday authorized the call up of 6,500 reserve soldiers. A military spokesman,
Captain Benjamin Rutland, however, told DPA the soldiers had not been mobilized yet and this
could take half or up to one day.

Observers said this meant any ground offensive was unlikely to start Monday. They added Israel
was likely to get as much out of the airstrikes as long as the clear wheather, forecast to turn
Tuesday, permitted.

Israeli Defence Minister Ehud Barak reiterated Monday that the offensive in Gaza would be
expanded "as much as necessary" until its goals were achieved.

Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni said Israel would "exhaust" the offensive until it achieved a change in
the balance of power between itself and Hamas, the radical Islamic movement ruling Gaza.

The latest Palestinian deaths included at least seven killed in the northern Gaza Strip refugee camp
of Jabaliya. An Israeli military spokeswoman said the target was a truck transporting "dozens" of
Russian-type Grad rockets, which she said Hamas was apparently trying to relocate to another
hideout as a result of Israel's massive assaults on warehouses and underground bunkers storing
rockets.

Jordan lawmakers want ties with Israel reviewed: MP

Amman, Dec 29 : Jordan's parliament has urged the government to "reconsider" its ties with Israel if
the Jewish state does not halt a massive air blitz of the Gaza Strip, a prominent MP said today.

"The lower house took a decision on Sunday night to ask the government to reconsider its relations
with the Israeli if it continues its aggression on Gaza," Khalil Atiyeh, an independent, told.

"Eighty-eight deputies have signed a memorandum on the issue and the government is currently
studying it," he said.

The UN agency for Palestinian refugees said today that at least 51 civilians are among the victims of
Israel's airstrikes on the Hamas-run Gaza that have so far killed more than 310 people.



-------------
Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent."


Posted By: semar
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 6:33pm
Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

Salam Alaikum Bro Jamal,

Did you see Aljazeera's 'Inside Story' today. In it Robert Fisk gave a piece of his mind to an arrogant American-Israeli loonie. I couldnt know who the guy was.
 
Here the aljazeera program:
 
http://www.islamicity.com/aljazeera/?ref=9152 - http://www.islamicity.com/aljazeera/?ref=9152


-------------
Salam/Peace,

Semar

"We are people who do not eat until we are hungry and do not eat to our fill." (Prophet Muhammad PBUH)

"1/3 of your stomach for food, 1/3 for water, 1/3 for air"


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 7:14pm
Moroccans: If there is anyone else living in or around Fes (but just haven't posted yet!) there is going to be a protest at Florence Square, Ville Nouvelle, Fes today (dec 30) at 5:30 - bring your voice, cameras and brace yourself...


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 29 December 2008 at 7:58pm

Duende,

thank you for the suggestion of writing to your local congressman. Unfortunately where I live that is not possible but if you can give me a link where I could perhaps email a lengthy opinionated response to this horrific situation it would be helpful, thanks!
 
Believer,
 
You constantly supporting anything non-Muslim and that is apparent. Remember Israel is a country highly supported by the United states both spiritually, politically, and militarily. the Israeli army is a broadword trying to surgicially remove what it considers a "terrorist organization." the only people it truly hurts are those innocent people such as the farmers, the impoverished and those who are apolitical. Regardless of your stance on Hamas it is best you see those who are truly suffering.
 
This is not to say that Hamas is entirely innocent because violence begest violence but you have to take into consideration the population ratio. The Palestinian infrastructure to me from news reports seems to be clustered. So sending a missile to destroy a military target may infact damage and ultimately kill a non-target [such as men, women and children].
 
 


-------------
"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Caprice88
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 2:06am
Originally posted by JihadX JihadX wrote:

This is sad. Everone i speak to about this says that "something should be done against the Yahoudis". Does anyone agree with that statement?
 
 
Oh I agree fo shizzle Angry


-------------
A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in.



Posted By: Caprice88
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 2:16am
Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

A Gazan man said on camera - We dont want anyone's help, especially that despicable DOG of Egypt, Mubarak's - Unqoute. Thats insulting dogs.

Tzipi says Hamas came to power through a coup and are now holding Gazans hostage. Also that Israel's attacking only Hamas members and sites - Apparently, babies and children were also members of Hamas.
 
Did you guys hear about the aid boat coming from Cyprus, how the jews stop it and even shot fires at the boat. Oh come on! will somebody shoot them back for god sake. There evilness reached so high that they want the people of Gaza to die GRISLYShocked all in ones. They are UNFORGIVABLE nation for sure.Dead


-------------
A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in.



Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 6:52am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9piJ_BLGkEo&eurl=http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&q=george%20galloway&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wn&feature=player_embedded - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9piJ_BLGkEo&eurl=http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&q=george%20galloway&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wn&feature=player_embedded


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 6:59am
http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/egypt+refuses+gaza+crossing+move/2894917 - http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/egypt+refuses+gaza+crossing+move/2894917
 
Last Modified: 30 Dec 2008
Source: PA News

Egypt's president has hit back against critics throughout the region and said he would not fully open the crossing into the Gaza Strip unless the Palestinian Authority was in control of the border to preserve unity.

Egypt has come under heavy criticism in the Arab world for its refusal over the past year to open the Rafah crossing, which has helped complete an Israeli blockade of the territory.

Israeli Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni also visited Egypt just before the assault, leading many to accuse Egypt of giving a green light to the attack.

These news feeds are provided by an independent third party and Channel 4 is not responsible or liable to you for the same.
 


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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 7:02am
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/world/AP/story/828855.html - http://www.miamiherald.com/news/world/AP/story/828855.html
 
In Barzilai's underground children's ward, sick Gazans lay alongside sick Israelis as a clown hopped around trying to coax smiles. Lobel said that his facility had close ties with Gaza's Shifa hospital, and accepted many of its patients who need treatment the Gazan hospital cannot provide. He said it wasn't uncommon to have a colleague in Gaza call him for assistance even as rockets rained down on Ashkelon.

"It might seem completely absurd," Lobel said. "But we have the privilege to be doctors. Our medical ethics do not distinguish between patients. We treat whoever needs to be treated."

A Gaza woman, whose two-month-old granddaughter was being treated for an unidentified ailment, wept when asked how she was coping. She said she was fortunate her granddaughter was getting the best medical treatment but was worried about her daughter and other grandchildren in Gaza City. She said some of their neighbors were among the more than 280 people killed in the Israeli airstrikes.

"I am very sad and hurt," she said, in Arabic. "We want peace, not war."

She refused to identify herself or have her picture taken, for fear of retribution if her presence in Israel was discovered in Gaza.



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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 10:35am
Don�t fall for Israeli propaganda
Linda Heard I [email protected]
 

ONCE again Israel seeks to defend the indefensible in an attempt to cloak its crimes against humanity with the mantle of self-defense. As its American-manufactured bombs and missiles pound a virtually unarmed starving population, Israeli officials appear on just about every satellite news network singing from the same propagandist song sheet.

It�s all the fault of the terror organization Hamas which refused to renew the cease-fire, � �We have a duty to protect our citizens in the south from rockets and mortars�. I�ve heard several saying �When we pulled out of Gaza we hoped Palestinians would forge a functioning territory but instead they chose terror�. In answer to questions concerning so many civilian deaths, they all insist that Israel is carrying out surgical strikes against �terror infrastructure� or they will excuse Israel�s bombardment of homes with �civilians are hiding launchers in their houses�.

Israel�s former ambassador to the United Nations Dan Gillerman seemed nonplussed when one interviewer asked him whether the seven dead UNWRA student employees were launching missiles too.

Predictably, these merchants of untruths are given free rein to spin on most Western networks and disproportionate airtime as opposed to pro-Palestinian commentators.

Let�s dissect these fabricated Israeli arguments.

First, whatever one thinks of Hamas and it ideology, it was elected to office in free and internationally-monitored elections that were forced upon the Palestinian people by Washington as part of the Bush administration�s quest to democratize the Middle East.

Then, after congratulating the Palestinians on their new democracy, the US-led international community promptly condemned the new leadership as terrorist and threw its support behind Fatah, which was �ordered� to turn against Hamas. This divisive strategy worked to the extent Hamas was driven to Gaza where it has since struggled against all odds to provide its citizens with the barest minimum required to sustain life.

Those representatives of Israel who say since their country�s pullout there was no obstacle to Gaza becoming a flourishing enclave are disingenuous when Gaza�s borders are sealed and the people have no control over their coastline or airspace.

Even when the Fatah-controlled Palestinian National Authority managed Gaza, Israel did everything it could to destroy infrastructure including a $75 million airport built with donations from the EU, Japan and Morocco. And during this recent round of attacks, ministries, government buildings, police stations and a police academy were bombed which does not support Israel�s supposed wish to see a functioning Gaza.

While it is true that Hamas refused to extend the cease-fire, what incentive does it have to do so while Israel is waging a war of attrition on the people in its care? It seems residents of Gaza must choose to die slowly from starvation and lack of medicines or at the hands of the Israeli war machine. Secondly, Israel is, indeed, duty-bound to protect its citizens but just look at the numbers. Very few crude home-made rockets have resulted in casualties. I believe only one Israeli has died during this current onslaught that has robbed the lives of over 320 Palestinians and wounded up to 1,000; not including those still buried beneath rubble. Once more, Israel�s response has been disproportionate just as it was in 2006 when it slaughtered 1,200 Lebanese civilians in answer to Hezbollah�s kidnapping of IDF soldiers.

Third, when it comes to Gaza, said to be one of the most densely-populated areas of the world, there is no such thing as a surgical strike. Moreover, over half of Gaza�s population are children under 18. Even the smartest smart bombs could not cherry-pick between resistance fighters and innocents in such a packed environment. The Israeli government knows this and doesn�t care a jot, which translates to willful collective punishment, illegal under the Fourth Geneva Convention.

But like its Washington master (or is it the other way around?) Israel is not constrained by international law or the Geneva Conventions that also require an occupying nation to provide for the well being of people under its occupation and to respect their dignity. As the willful killing continues, Israel merrily ignores pleas from France, Russia, the UN, the EU and Britain to end the violence. Why should it do otherwise when it has proved time and time again that it is a law unto itself and immune from international punishment?

Unsurprisingly, the only message from the US to Israel is �try to avoid civilian casualties�, which is nothing more than lip service to international humanitarian sensitivities. In effect, the Bush administration has blessed this, by many accounts, long planned operation, cynically timed to begin during a political vacuum in Washington and close to upcoming elections when candidates need to prove they�re tough to win votes. Tragically, there may be much worse to come. Israeli government officials including Defense Minister Ehud Barak has warned the offensive could be widened as tanks line up on the border with Gaza and 6,500 IDF reservists are on standby.

Tomorrow, the Arab League is holding an emergency summit of foreign ministers to discuss the crisis. If only they will decide to do more than issue a joint statement of condemnation this time. Together they have so much clout. Now is the time for all Arab countries to gather together as one nation to say �enough is enough� before the streets of Gaza run with the blood of their desperate brothers and sisters. As the West closes its eyes and ears to Palestinian cries for help Arab leaders should heed the outraged voices on their own streets and act. Finally, the governments of Egypt and Jordan should do some soul-searching. Should they continue with peace agreements made in all good faith with a selfish, cruel state bent on destroying a people for its own ends?

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=7&section=0&article=117661&d=30&m=12&y=2008 - http://www.arabnews.com/?page=7&section=0&article=117661&d=30&m=12&y=2008



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Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
Qur'an 55:13


Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 2:22pm

"Olmert questioned whether Hamas's stance was consistent with Islam. "Is the spirit of Islam to kill innocent children, to fire rockets at kindergartens and civilians? I don't think that is the spirit of Islam," Olmert said."

Playing the "God card"? This is bold, especially for an Israeli. 

 
"Tzipi says Hamas came to power through a coup and are now holding Gazans hostage. Also that Israel's attacking only Hamas members and sites - Apparently, babies and children were also members of Hamas."

Apparently she missed the elections, and the collective punishment the U.S. and Israel dealt out immediately afterward. How dare the Palestinians elect Hamas into office!

"In Barzilai's underground children's ward, sick Gazans lay alongside sick Israelis as a clown hopped around trying to coax smiles. Lobel said that his facility had close ties with Gaza's Shifa hospital, and accepted many of its patients who need treatment the Gazan hospital cannot provide. He said it wasn't uncommon to have a colleague in Gaza call him for assistance even as rockets rained down on Ashkelon."
 
   Israeli Checkpoints and Their Impact on Daily Life
 
Israel has constructed hundreds of checkpoints and other roadblocks on Palestinian land, which restrict Palestinian travel between, and sometimes, within, their cities and towns.

Many checkpoints are manned by heavily-armed Israeli soldiers and sometimes guarded with tanks. Others are made up of gates, which are locked when soldiers are not on duty. In addition there are hundreds of dirt or concrete roadblocks, which prevent the passage of all vehicles � family cars and ambulances alike.

 

An%20ambulance%20is%20detained%20and%20checked%20at%20a%20checkpoint%20in%20Nablus.
An ambulance is detained and checked at a checkpoint in Nablus. http://www.palestinemonitor.org/ - Palestine Monitor

There is a great deal of documentary evidence showing that ambulances carrying sick or injured Palestinians frequently are prevented from traveling through checkpoints, sometimes leading to deaths. In addition numerous pregnant women have not been allowed to pass through checkpoints � in many cases the mother or baby has died as a result. Between June 2003 and February 2004, 46 women delivered their babies at checkpoints � http://www.ifamericansknew.org/cur_sit/women.html - 24 of the women and 27 newborns died as a result.

An%20Israeli%20soldier%20in%20full%20uniform%20--%20helmut,%20gun,%20bullet-proof%20vest%20--%20examines%20a%20small%20childs%20backpack.

According to the http://www.palestinemonitor.org/new_web/factsheet_health.htm - Palestine Monitor , �[m]ore than 991 incidents of denial of access to Palestinian Red Crescent Society (PRCS) and Union of Palestinian Medical Relief Committees� (UPMRC) ambulances have been reported,� and at least 83 deaths have resulted from the prevention of access to medical services.

Published: September 30,2007More Palestinians Die After Being Denied Access Through Israeli Checkpoints

"An increasing number of Palestinians have died after being denied passage through Israeli checkpoints, according to the latest United Nations humanitarian report on the occupied Palestinian territory.

The latest incident occurred in August when a 76-year-old woman from Barta'a a-Sharqiya in Jenin district with heart problems died after Israeli soldiers refused to allow her to pass a gate in order to reach the hospital in Jenin, the Humanitarian Monitor Report for August said." http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=24054&Cr=gaza&Cr1 - http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=24054&Cr=gaza&Cr1 =

"According to B'Tselem, two themes clearly emerge from examination of the spectrum of human rights concerns in 2007. The first is the use of security justifications for virtually every Israeli action in the Occupied Territories . There is no doubt that Israel faces serious security threats, and is entitled and even obligated to do its utmost to protect its population. However, far too often, Israel fails to appropriately balance its security needs with equally important values, including protecting the rights of Palestinians under its control. In addition, Israeli authorities often exploit security threats in order to advance prohibited political interests, such as perpetuating settlements and effectively annexing them to Israel .

The second theme arising from the report is the lack of accountability of Israeli security forces, in all matters relating to human rights. This can be seen clearly in the reluctance of the state to thoroughly investigate violations and to prosecute those responsible for them. The lack of accountability can also be seen in the denial of most Palestinians' right to compensation when they are injured through no fault of their own by Israeli forces."

http://www.btselem.org/english/Press_Releases/20071231.asp - http://www.btselem.org/english/Press_Releases/20071231.asp



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�No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.�
Eleanor Roosevelt


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 3:54pm
Originally posted by Linda Heard from UK Linda Heard from UK wrote:

But like its Washington master (or is it the other way around?)


It is only a test for Israeli select POTUS elect by the sheeples of America!

To act as an obedient Pharaoh*** of the new United States of greater Israel....while the free food and soup lines are getting longer he is sent on a luxurious vacation package fit for a king at $30 million beach house....in the meanwhile the king makers offer the spectacle of slaughter in the Palestinian pale AKA Gaza for the impotent Arab world ....If the Jews stopped the shedding of heifer's blood  they have taken the Palestinian bloodshed instead...What have you learned by sacrificing of the heifers?
Shame, shame nothing but shame to the shameless and spineless over fed Arab so called kings and sheikhs living a life of infamy and disgrace in fancy glass houses and palaces in collusion with the Jews....
Thought after Brits left India may be it was an end of the colonialism may be for Hindus but for the Muslims it was a new game...the colonial setup changed into neocolonialism and Israel got added as a new site manager and director with US  a co-producer.... and the circus with puppet show goes on.....
Imagine the glee of these Zionists that the land of Pharaohs where their forebears were slaves now that nation is one of their puppets and complicit in the Palestinian pale's blockade and that is absolutely criminal.........for how long? .....
May be some one burns down the whole circus tentDead I am answering my own question here!

Pl. excuse my rant......


***
http://news.antiwar.com/2008/12/30/as-war-ravages-gaza-silent-barack-works-on-golf-game/ - As War Ravages Gaza, Silent Barack Works on Golf Game

20 Days Ahead of Inauguration, President-elect Seems Distant From Growing Crisis


With the death toll in the Gaza Strip still rapidly rising, incoming President-elect Barack Obama�s initial reaction of � http://news.antiwar.com/2008/12/30/2008/12/27/obama-on-gaza-no-comment/ - no immediate comment � has seamlessly segued into an official policy of no comment, period. As Obama and family continue to enjoy a luxurious vacation in Hawaii, his attention http://www.starbulletin.com/news/hawaiinews/20081230_Obama_hits_links_at_Lanikai.html - seems far more focused on his golf game than the foreign policy crisis he is poised to inherit.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/obama-maintains-silence-in-first-major-test-1218223.html - The silence from Hawaii is almost deafening , with Obama�s staff using the oft-repeated excuse that the US �has only one president at a time� to justify his lack of commentary. The silence, combined with his cabinet choices, http://africa.reuters.com/wire/news/usnLU485459.html - has punctuated what many already believe : that when the Obama Administration takes the White House next month, little will have really changed.

http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed2/idUSN30356444 - A small group of protesters at his rented vacation home hope to ensure that the President-elect is at least aware of what is going on. But if Obama saw the protesters as his motorcade http://www.starbulletin.com/news/breaking/36895759.html - took him to play a game of basketball , he didn�t show it. There was no word of how many points Obama scored, but it is unlikely to have rivaled the number of casualties in the Gaza Strip during the game. And the silence continues.





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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 10:09pm
On coverage:
The streets were packed yesterday night in Fes...
And there was nothing on our national televison reflecting the scale of the protests.
London, New York, Paris? Saw them.
Show on crafts in the old medina? Included in the news.
No Fes, Rabat, Marrakesh, Casa - blackout.




Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 10:35pm

Hamas: PA conspiring with Israel

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1230456537100&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull - http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1230456537100&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull



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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by Jamal Morelli Jamal Morelli wrote:

On coverage:
The streets were packed yesterday night in Fes...
And there was nothing on our national televison reflecting the scale of the protests.
London, New York, Paris? Saw them.
Show on crafts in the old medina? Included in the news.
No Fes, Rabat, Marrakesh, Casa - blackout.


This is neocon's total media control for neocolonial world order!
After Jewish US banksters swindled China thru MBSs and now holding her hostage with meltdown....... they almost have total control monetarily across the board.... You know no one can send monies to Hamas even for a can of soup form the states....I think in current state the TV is worthless ...... net is the way to go and people need to maximize its use if they are tech savvy if not learn it!
Why is there a wall between Egypt & Gaza?
CUZ that pig looking Hosni gets billion and half of the US sheeple's tax bucks for this dirty work, boy that is a lot of pork for his shameless crap!


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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 30 December 2008 at 11:08pm
Here are a few scores of commentaries and articles on http://www.countercurrents.org/palestine.htm - GAZA situation or massacres some of the authors might be your favorites.............

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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 31 December 2008 at 12:49am
SignReader, on other forums I've seen, I notice people just use a cyber short hand to indicate their agreement with another person's post, so I'm trying to catch up with the 21st century here when I put:

+1

Israel have the whole of the west brainwashed, and practically all of the media goose stepping to their drum: notice even in Jamal's back yard the editors refuse to report on home-grown demos against the Israeli genocide.

All of the Arab-Muslim lands are bought by US dollars, their leaders corrupt, shamefull excuses for Moslems. WAKE UP! There IS NO POLITICAL SOLUTION to this, the politicians are under Anglo-Israeli -Zionist control, changing leaders (how do all Obama's supporters here feel now?) NEVER changes the scenery.

Everywhere I read, after the article full of hand wringing and efforts at 'balanced reporting' if there are comments, the majority of posters understand this: POLITICS IS DEAD. This is the Age of Aquarius, we must de-throne the rulers we voted for, because they are not listening to us. No, I correct myself, they couldn't CARE LESS WHAT WE WANT!

Does your brain hurt if you try to imagine a world without politicians? Does your imagination fail you when you try to picture a social set up without the "buy my vote" democracy delivered by bombs? That is the challenge of the new age which confronts us: people all around the world DO NOT WANT war. Who is giving it to us? POLITICIANS. If you think we shall ever manage to get what we really truley want through voting, just watch the Obama-Rahm-Axelrod show coming soon.

Sign readers sig sums it up beautifully: In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act.

~George Orwell


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 31 December 2008 at 6:43am

December 30, 2008

Pacifying Gaza

 

by Ran HaCohen

Defense Minister Ehud Barak (the Hebrew surname means "lightning," German "Blitz") did it again: a historic record of over 200 Palestinians killed in a single Sabbath's blitz (Dec. 27). Polls now predict five additional Knesset seats for his Labor Party in the coming February general election. That's 40 Palestinian corpses per seat. No wonder he promises it's just the beginning: at this pace, it will take Labor just about two thousand additional corpses to go from rags to riches, from a dead political party to an absolute majority in parliament like in the good old days. For Barak, then, the Gaza obituaries are a matter of political survival: they are pasted up on his party's obituary. A similar sickening logic sent former Prime Minister Shimon Peres (Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, etc., etc.) back in 1996 to devastate southern Lebanon and solve the problem of Hezbollah once-and-for-all in Operation http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Grapes_of_Wrath - Grapes of Wrath , just weeks before the general election � in which he was defeated by Netanyahu. When the so-called doves behave like hawks, the voters prefer the real hawks, following the Talmudic saying "Whatever looks like an egg, a true egg is always better." But warriors like Barak never learn.

And they are not alone in that: just two days before the pounding of Gaza started, it was the allegedly "left-liberal" party http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1050015.html - Meretz that officially called for military action against Hamas. You know Meretz: the party of (Frankfurt Peace Prize Laureate, etc., etc.) Amos Oz and his ilk, those pseudo-intellectuals who always claim to have been http://www.antiwar.com/hacohen/?articleid=9486 - against the previous war . No exception this time: they're all there, right behind the bombers, or even ahead of them.


Over 200 corpses lying in open air behind Gaza's hospital, which � after more than a year of Israel's blockade � cannot offer patients anything but painkillers anyway. Guess what was the headline of Israel's most popular daily, Yediot Ahronoth, the next day. "One and a Half Million Gazans Under Fire"? Close, but no cigar. The actual headline (Dec. 28) read: "Half a Million Israelis Under Fire." Indeed, a single Israeli civilian had been killed that day by a Hamas rocket. Similarly, journalist Avirama Golan in her Ha'aretz blog devoted a whole post to the agonies of her hysterical pussycat in Sderot. Some journalists, especially those who consider themselves critical, are excellent prioritizers.

Yediot Ahronoth had six columnists on its front page and several more inside. The war's cheerleaders. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nahum_Barnea - Nahum Barnea , an over-appreciated "critical" journalist, expressed his view about the bloodbath rather succinctly: "better late than never." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dov_Weissglass - Dov Weissglass , "closely linked to the peace process" as Wikipedia puts it, was similarly outspoken: his column was called "Do Not Stop," with an exclamation mark to make things clear. "It should be just the beginning," he advises to the very government that has just vowed "it's just the beginning." Mirror, mirror on the wall. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eitan_Haber - Eitan Haber , senior aide to late former Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin (Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, etc., etc.), recycled the usual war propaganda of every Israeli government for home consumption: as always, the right-wing opposition is extremist and crazy, but we, the government, launch a moderate, responsible, and restrained war. "The political argument that we could have and should have acted long ago is neither true nor justified," Haber opens his Pavlovian service for the government.

http://www.gaditaub.com/eblog/ - Gadi Taub , an ultra-conservative young mainstreamer, wrote a column titled "Demagoguery, Anti-Semitism, Ignorance," with content too trivial to repeat, though fairly summarized by its first and last title-words. But Taub's demagoguery fades compared to Ben-Dror Yemini's (an Israeli Daniel Pipes) in Ma'ariv. In a column titled "The Most Justified Offensive Ever" (miraculously, the very words used by his Ha'aretz twin Ari Shavit for the Lebanon War just two years ago), Yemini draws a straight line from Hitler to Hamas (no coincidence they both start with an H, just like Hezbollah, Saddam Hussein, and Hemorrhoids), and explains that "Since the Nazi ideology [�], no movement has been as dangerous to world peace as political Islam." My apologies for quoting this trash; we need an Israeli demagogue to instrumentalize the Holocaust, and Yemini was born for such dirty jobs.


At the same time, excellent columnist B. Michael does raise a critical voice in Yediot:

"Here it is again, the periodical 'd�j� vu' war. The ritual bleeding poured once again into the boiling basin which has for decades been leading the entire region to hell. To be honest, our soul is weary of dividing the seventh-day's war of the Six-Day War into 'operations,' 'wars,' 'battles,' 'actions,' and 'offensives.' They are all just one ongoing war. They are all one big slaughterhouse. An occupier's war against the occupied, and the occupied's war against their occupier."

B. Michael knows what most Israelis were trained to forget: that despite the Israeli withdrawal, Gaza is still occupied. Even before the Hamas takeover, Israel retained all the measures to ensure its effective control of the Strip: from direct control of all the border crossings to Gaza, both for goods and for persons, to Israeli control of Gaza's population registry. The only apparent exception � the Rafah checkpoint � is restricted to entry into Gaza of Gaza inhabitants only, as defined by the Israeli registry, and even this is under Israeli supervision. But for most Israelis, Gaza is an independent, sovereign empire, which was occupied by Israel ages ago, and now, for no reason at all, poses an existential threat to its benevolent Jewish neighbor.


In the evening television news, careful listening � especially to serious reporters like Shlomi Eldar � could reveal the tip of the war-crimes iceberg yet to emerge: a Gazan prison was intentionally bombarded, a clear war crime. Gaza's hospital suffered damages too. All this in an overcrowded Strip in which life has already been strangled by an embargo on anything from cement and gasoline to medical equipment. A couple of months ago, journalist Amos Harel quoted an article of a leading military figure regarding Israel's next war policy, be it in Lebanon, Syria, or Gaza: "Using power without any proportion to the enemy's threat and actions, in order to damage and punish to an extent that would require long and expensive rehabilitation processes." Another Israeli general explained that villages from which shots are fired will be devastated; "we consider them as military bases" (Ha'aretz, Oct. 5; the names of the two generals � for The Hague's ICC � are Gaby Siboni and Gadi Eisenkot). Once the war started, Maj.-Gen. (Reserve) Giora Island � former head of the National Security Council � spelled it all out on television, without a shade of shame: Israel should not confine its attacks to military facilities, he said, but must hit civilian targets as well. The damage to the civil population should be maximized, because the worse the humanitarian crisis is, the better and the sooner the operation would end. It's the same major-general, by the way, who just a year ago caused outrage by urging the Israeli government to negotiate directly with Hamas. Do not to look for consistency, integrity, or intelligence where war criminals are involved.

 

 


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 31 December 2008 at 5:59pm
Duende,
 
Did you ever see my message to you? If not, please scroll back.


-------------
"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 12:09am

Hyposonic
"thank you for the suggestion of writing to your local congressman. Unfortunately where I live that is not possible but if you can give me a link where I could perhaps email a lengthy opinionated response to this horrific situation it would be helpful, thanks!"


Hyposonic, if you scroll back and read carefully, you will see that I did not reccommend you write to your representative, since I know it will MAKE NO DIFFERENCE. I am convinced there is no political will to change anything in the Israeli-Palestine conflict. This does not mean I encourage only war and killing. If you read my post again, you will see that I was talking about the problem for Americans which is that your culture invariably reduces everything to an either-or situation. That will certainly never resolve anything.

I urged people to write to the AVAAZ organisation to complain about their lack of coverage of the Gaza crisis. I was once persuaded this organisation was 'different' and actually tried to fight for justice, and they certainly present themselves as a hopefull organisation using people power to counter the politicians who go deaf once they are in office. But seeing the silence from AVAAZ, both during the blockade building up to the Israeli massacre and now, almost a week since the murderous attacks began, I can see they are ruled by the same Zionist agenda as the mainstream media throughout the West.



Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 7:22am
Today both side are acting in revenge.  There can be no endng if both sides are fighting in a revengful, eye for an eye mentality!!
 
There is a way that would be for either Israel or Gaza to follow the teachings of Jesus- turn the other cheek.  Read Matthew 5.  If one group followed all of this teaching then the world and more importantly GOD would be on your side.
 
An interesting note- In Jesus' time this did not mean that you give in and let the person slapping you free rein over your life.   Please read:
 
http://mattdabbs.wordpress.com/2007/11/05/what-does-it-mean-to-turn-the-other-cheek/ - http://mattdabbs.wordpress.com/2007/11/05/what-does-it-mean-to-turn-the-other-cheek/
 
"In the Mishnah penalties and compensation are prescribed that are due as punishments for various infractions. There was a difference in slapping someone with the back of the hand versus the palm of the hand. When Jesus says, �If someone strikes you on the right cheek,� he is talking about a slap with the back of the hand as most people are right-handed. The Mishnah lays out compensation for those who experience such a shaming action. A slap with the palm of the hand carried a penalty twice as much as a slap with the back of the hand (Mishnah, B. Ḳ. viii. 6). Why would it contain a higher fine? Because to be struck on the right cheek, with the back of the hand, would be more degrading and shameful than to be struck on the left cheek with the palm of the hand. In effect, Jesus is saying, if someone degrades or shames you greatly by a backhanded slap on the right cheek, turn your left cheek to him and see if he is willing to say you are closer to his equal than the initial slap indicated. Of course, this also would inflict more compensatory damage to the one doing the slapping.

This verse does not say as much about pacifism as it has to say about the culture of honor and shame that they lived in. They heard these words totally different than we hear them today."

How do people fight with honour, as equals on a level ground?  
 
Also the bit about giving up your tunic in Matthew 5 - it is not the naked person that is sinning but the person looking at the naked person, the person that has taken the clothes from you.


-------------
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 8:52am
Originally posted by Duende Duende wrote:


Hyposonic
"thank you for the suggestion of writing to your local congressman. Unfortunately where I live that is not possible but if you can give me a link where I could perhaps email a lengthy opinionated response to this horrific situation it would be helpful, thanks!"


Hyposonic, if you scroll back and read carefully, you will see that I did not reccommend you write to your representative, since I know it will MAKE NO DIFFERENCE. I am convinced there is no political will to change anything in the Israeli-Palestine conflict. This does not mean I encourage only war and killing. If you read my post again, you will see that I was talking about the problem for Americans which is that your culture invariably reduces everything to an either-or situation. That will certainly never resolve anything.

I urged people to write to the AVAAZ organisation to complain about their lack of coverage of the Gaza crisis. I was once persuaded this organisation was 'different' and actually tried to fight for justice, and they certainly present themselves as a hopefull organisation using people power to counter the politicians who go deaf once they are in office. But seeing the silence from AVAAZ, both during the blockade building up to the Israeli massacre and now, almost a week since the murderous attacks began, I can see they are ruled by the same Zionist agenda as the mainstream media throughout the West.



AVAAZ: I think I signed up with them awhile back per your suggestion, as I just received a new letter from them today regarding Gaza.

But, I'll say in positive terms of conversing with/confronting your senator(s) -

If you can afford to make a trip...
I can endorse making a visit to DC if you represent a neighborhood association, a business and I suppose, a religious group. The older and larger, the better - obviously.
What do you do once you are in the office?
Amazingly, not all that much. It's rather informal. Just talk. If you get the senator, cool. You'll probably be talking to an informed twenty-something, but as long as you leave your well-stated grievance there after some discussion, it's very likely to get some kind of attention and response.

What to ask for...   what to demand... it all requires a bit of research into the bills that are pending; i.e, how much dough earmarked for Israel's war machine, how much for aid to suffering Gazans, etc.    

When I lived in New Orleans, I saw seemingly lost causes (poor neighborhoods vs shipping industries) get turned around by steady communal pressure on the government to get involved.   

This presupposes bro Hypo is in the US...   here in North Africa, where our governments, most being rent-a-cops for western corporations, just physically strangle opposition - we are left with the usual; political quietism, noisy useless debate, and/or war without gov't sanction... "terrorism".




Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 10:09am
Jamal, I have no doubt that on the local level, grass roots movements actually get results.

But look what happened recently with the famous 700 Billion Dollar bail out plan, known as TARP. When it was first tabled, Hank Paulson drafted a law which would have granted him and his cronies practically free hand, with NO oversight. American citizens were outraged and a concerted effort flooded, literally swamped representatives with individual messages overwhelmingly against the bankers' bail out.

It worked. The bill was rejected resoundingly in the lower house.

Then what happened? It got re-written, bloated from a simple few pages to a whopping 300 page bill which subsequently passed through the upper house, despite what the American tax payer said. The new, improved version makes it law that US banks no longer have to keep a reserve, so in the event that you want to withdraw your savings, they are under no obligation whatsoever to actually give you your money.

That, and many more small issues which add up to daylight robbery, committed under the gaze of the US citizen. So, what good did it do all those thousands of people who made the effort to contact their rep?

In such 'large' national issues, such as the TARP case, that of the money of individual citizens now held by unnacountable institutions, and the fundamentals of the US economy: politicians simply do what they 'believe' to be the right thing. This invariably turns out to be what is the right thing for bankers and the politicians who are in their pockets.

In this life-and death situation involving an individual foreign sovereign state (I mean, Israel is supposed to be a sovereign state, right? and not another US state...?) there are simply too many complex invested interests involving too many non-US national interests, (the complete geo-political tapestry which has been so cleverly woven by the Anglo-Zionist brotherhood) for the few thousand US citizens contacting their local rep to make any difference at all.

We have a long way to go: I personally am now certain that the age of professional politics is over. From what I can see, very few people would agree with me, and after all, what else can we do, but use the tools we have to hand? All I can suggest is a detailed study of a few small examples of viable alternatives, starting with Subcomandante Marcos and the Chiapa movement of Mexico.

We do not as yet have any satisfactory alternative in place. The hopeful, globally connected, internet-based 'movement' which many feel offers an alternative to the utter failure of politics as we know it, exists only in cyber space. Of the few thousand people who sign AVAAZ petitions, how many would actually turn up at a physical rally: risk arrest, imprisonment, summary judgement, police brutality, for what they believe ....? That is one reason why the PTB (Powers That Be) are not at all worried by the cyber movements and organisations. And they have carefully equipped their police with the means to quell just about any puny demo, in any case.

There are very few Rachel Corries in this world. I am not one. But I must urge everybody to start the difficult process of changing your thinking, because this is the first step towards freeing ourselves of the useless limits we have allowed to be put in place, by embracing the lie of 'democracy'. The democracy which allows for the TARP, which allowed for the first G. W Bush term, the democracy delivered to Sadaam's Iraq, the democracy practiced by the profoundly racist state of Israel currently notching up advantage points counted in the lives of murdered Palestinians ........


Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 10:54am
I think that Palestine made a big mistake in revolting against the Othman empire and siding with the British and should ask Allah for forgiveness.

The Palestinians participated whole heartedly in the battles of Aqaba and Jerusalem by being as guides and providing intelligence report to British troops, also fighting alongside with them.

Instead of demanding better conditions in the Ottoman Empire they bought the idea of "freedom" to become slaves.The sharifs of Mecca were keen on this idea and in the end got nothing except Transjordan strip and slavery for ever. A good bargain for those who love "Arab" nationalism forgetting the Prophets last sermon.


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 3:10pm
Gah! nevermind

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"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 3:45pm


http://news.antiwar.com/2008/12/31/us-leaders-staunchly-support-israeli-attacks-on-gaza/ - US Leaders Staunchly Support Israeli Attacks on Gaza

As the war in the Gaza Strip rages on, protests continue all across the world. In the United States alone, http://yubanet.com/usa/100-U-S-Protests-of-Israel-s-War-on-Gaza.php - over 100 protests have already been organized against the attacks , from a http://www.sltrib.com/ci_11345365 - small rally in Salt Lake City to much larger rallies along the east coast. Among the largest was in Dearborn, Michigan, http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=Community&article=1837 - where thousands of protesters braved freezing cold temperatures in a rally organized by the Congress of Arab-American Organizations.

But in the media these rallies are given short shrift; an interesting but ultimately irrelevant aside in a nation where the political leadership is firmly and fervently in favor of the Israeli attack. From the Bush Administration to Speaker Nancy Pelosi, http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090101/FOREIGN/191323848/1002 - the position is loud, and unified, Israel must be supported in its war at all costs .

Unique among officials in having publicly condemned the attacks is Ohio Congressman Dennis Kucinich, http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/8365 - who labeled the attacks disproportionate and has urged a United Nations investigation. The lone political voice on the side of the tens of thousands of protesters across the country and untold numbers who share their sentiment, Kucinich has raised the ire of many, including Israel Project founder Jennifer Laszlo Mizrahi, http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090101/FOREIGN/191323848/1002 - who condemned the Congressman for not understanding �the security concerns of the Israeli people,� adding that the fact that he isn�t President-elect proves he isn�t what the voters wanted.

As has been the case since the war began, http://news.antiwar.com/2008/12/31/2008/12/30/as-war-ravages-gaza-silent-barack-works-on-golf-game/ - the real President-elect has remained silent on the situation . What was he doing today instead of commenting on the hundreds of people killed in the Gaza Strip? According to the Associated Press, http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5isOFwdbq0tsqatW6vJpkDRTI1gMgD95DU3NO0 - he was getting his picture taken with a nine-month-old . That was probably fulfilling in its own way.



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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 7:12pm
Is anti-war.com an objective news source?

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"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 8:27pm
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5j-uta_l4FyVRi5LQC2nRgWLY-u4Q

Protesters worldwide keep up pressure over Gaza


PARIS (AFP) � Protesters denouncing Israel's deadly bombardment of the Gaza Strip returned to the streets in demonstrations around the world to keep up the pressure for an end to the violence.
As Israel, under increasing diplomatic pressure, mulled a proposed 48-hour truce and the death toll from its onslaught rose to at least 373 Palestinians, the protesters made their voices heard again.
In France, more than 7,000 protesters marched in a dozen cities across the country to denounce the Israeli bombardment of the Gaza Strip , which continued for the fourth day running Tuesday.
In Paris, around 3,500 people according to police -- 5,000 according to the organisers -- marched towards the French foreign ministry on the Quai D'Orsay by the River Seine, shouting slogans and carrying banners denouncing Israel.
Police said another 700 marched in the western city of Nantes, while demonstrations in at least a dozen cities and towns across the country each attracted hundreds of protesters.
In London, between 200 and 300 demonstrators protested peacefully outside the Israeli embassy, after the two previous days' rallies had descended into violence.
This demonstration was smaller than on Sunday and Monday, when scuffles erupted between police and protestors against Israel's air raids, leading to a total of 17 arrests over the two days.
Iranian demonstrators stormed the British diplomatic compound in Tehran Tuesday evening to protest London's stance towards the Israeli onslaught, state news agency IRNA reported.
"A large group of people and students entered the Gholhak gardens, which are occupied by the British embassy to protest at Britain's policies in supporting the Zionist regime and put up the Palestinian flag there," IRNA said.
A media officer at the British embassy in Tehran confirmed the report.
In Washington, between 2,500 and 5,000 people protested outside the US State Department chanting slogans like "Stop the Killing, Stop the War, Stop the Genocide of Palestinians" and with some carrying banners saying "Stop US Aid to Israel".
In Los Angeles, around 500 protestors and pro-Israel activists faced off peacefully near the Israeli Consulate.
At a separate demonstration attended by around 100 protesters in Westwood, actor Mike Farrell, a star of the hit 1970s television series "MASH", said he was "one of those people horrified by Israel's over-response."
"Not that I'm in favor of Hamas by any means, because firing rockets into Israel is not the way these things get resolved in a productive way," he said.
In Tunis, hundreds of lawyers and trade unionists joined opposition activists to defy a police ban and protest the bombing of Gaza, several sources reported.
As some protesters shouted slogans denouncing the lack of response from Arab countries in general and Egypt in particular, police headed off the demonstration as it headed towards the courthouse, said witnesses.
Tunisia's government has already condemned the Israeli bombardment of the Gaza Strip.
Saudi Arabia's interior ministry denied a report by Shiite news website Rasid.com that hundreds had demonstrated Monday afternoon in heavily Shiite Al Qatif, just west of Dammam, leading to several arrests.
Shiite news website Rasid.com reported that police had fired rubber bullets to break up the demonstrations Monday afternoon, which were attended by hundreds of people. But an interior ministry spokesman told AFP there had been no such demonstration.
Demonstrators in the Yemeni port city of Aden briefly broke into the Egyptian consulate to protest Cairo's response to the Israeli offensive, a security official said.
The protesters, mostly students from the university of Aden, "vandalised furniture before they were removed peacefully from the building," the official said, asking not to be identified.
Egypt has come in for strong criticism from Islamists and their sympathisers around the Muslim world for not fully opening its border with Gaza in the face of Israel's devastating air blitz.
In Algeria, about 100 people staged a protest in the capital Algiers after a call from politicians and editors of writers' and artists' magazines. They observed a minute's silence in memory of the dead.
In Panama City, around 200 people protested outside the Israeli embassy to condemn Israel's attacks on the Gaza Strip.
In the Bulgarian capital Sofia, about 200 protesters called on the Bulgarian government to support the peace efforts. Demonstrators carried pro-Palestinian banners and others denouncing Israel.
Earlier Tuesday, about 200 people carrying flowers and candles offered a one-minute prayer in front of the Israeli embassy, with a Buddhist monk ringing a bell for the souls of the victims.
"This is nothing but a bloodbath," organiser Hiroshi Taniyama told demonstrators, who included Arabs living in Japan.




Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 11:04pm
Originally posted by Hyposonic Hyposonic wrote:

Is anti-war.com an objective news source?


Read this article and then ask about how much objectivity has been left in the American media circus! Anti-war is people funded so it is not beholden to any vested interests .....they build on what gets reported in the controlled media and other sources .... it is getting harder by the day to get to the truth...

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-oe-stein19-2008dec19,0,7941489.column -
A poll finds more Americans disagree with the statement that 'Jews control Hollywood.' But here's one Jew who doesn't.
Joel Stein
December 19, 2008
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oew-stein19-2008dec19-gb,0,6505369.graffitiboard - � Discuss Article    http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oew-stein19-2008dec19-gb,0,6505369.graffitiboard - (84 Comments)

I have never been so upset by a poll in my life. Only 22% of Americans now believe "the movie and television industries are pretty much run by Jews," down from nearly 50% in 1964. The Anti-Defamation League, which released the poll results last month, sees in these numbers a victory against stereotyping. Actually, it just shows how dumb America has gotten. Jews totally run Hollywood.

How deeply Jewish is Hollywood? When the studio chiefs took out a full-page ad in the Los Angeles Times a few weeks ago to demand that the Screen Actors Guild settle its contract, the open letter was signed by:
News Corp. President Peter Chernin (Jewish),
Paramount Pictures Chairman Brad Grey (Jewish),
Walt Disney Co. Chief Executive Robert Iger (Jewish),
Sony Pictures Chairman Michael Lynton (surprise, Dutch Jew),
Warner Bros. Chairman Barry Meyer (Jewish),
CBS Corp. Chief Executive Leslie Moonves (so Jewish his great uncle was the first prime minister of Israel),
MGM Chairman Harry Sloan (Jewish) and
NBC Universal Chief Executive Jeff Zucker (mega-Jewish).
If either of the Weinstein brothers had signed, this group would have not only the power to shut down all film production but to form a minyan with enough Fiji water on hand to fill a mikvah.

The person they were yelling at in that ad was SAG President Alan Rosenberg (take a guess). The scathing rebuttal to the ad was written by entertainment super-agent Ari Emanuel (Jew with Israeli parents) on the Huffington Post, which is owned by Arianna Huffington (not Jewish and has never worked in Hollywood.)

The Jews are so dominant, I had to scour the trades to come up with six Gentiles in high positions at entertainment companies. When I called them to talk about their incredible advancement, five of them refused to talk to me, apparently out of fear of insulting Jews.
The sixth, AMC President Charlie Collier, turned out to be Jewish.

As a proud Jew, I want America to know about our accomplishment. Yes, we control Hollywood. Without us, you'd be flipping between "The 700 Club" and "Davey and Goliath" on TV all day.

So I've taken it upon myself to re-convince America that Jews run Hollywood by launching a public relations campaign, because that's what we do best. I'm weighing several slogans, including: "Hollywood: More Jewish than ever!"; "Hollywood: From the people who brought you the Bible"; and "Hollywood: If you enjoy TV and movies, then you probably like Jews after all."

I called ADL Chairman Abe Foxman, who was in Santiago, Chile, where, he told me to my dismay, he was not hunting Nazis. He dismissed my whole proposition, saying that the number of people who think Jews run Hollywood is still too high. The ADL poll, he pointed out, showed that 59% of Americans think Hollywood execs "do not share the religious and moral values of most Americans," and 43% think the entertainment industry is waging an organized campaign to "weaken the influence of religious values in this country."

That's a sinister canard, Foxman said. "It means they think Jews

meet at Canter's Deli on Friday mornings to decide what's best for the Jews." Foxman's argument made me rethink: I have to eat at Canter's more often.

"That's a very dangerous phrase, 'Jews control Hollywood.' What is true is that there are a lot of Jews in Hollywood," he said. Instead of "control," Foxman would prefer people say that many executives in the industry "happen to be Jewish," as in "all eight major film studios are run by men who happen to be Jewish."

But Foxman said he is proud of the accomplishments of American Jews. "I think Jews are disproportionately represented in the creative industry. They're disproportionate as lawyers and probably medicine here as well," he said. He argues that this does not mean that Jews make pro-Jewish movies any more than they do pro-Jewish surgery. Though other countries, I've noticed, aren't so big on circumcision.

I appreciate Foxman's concerns. And maybe my life spent in a New Jersey-New York/Bay Area-L.A. pro-Semitic cocoon has left me naive. But I don't care if Americans think we're running the news media, Hollywood, Wall Street or the government. I just care that we get to keep running them.



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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.



Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 01 January 2009 at 11:56pm
SignReader, you do realise that piece was a sarcastic-comic commentary? nevertheless, very enlightening, especially since comedy has always been used to 'soften the blow' of truth.....

I had fun for a moment reading in my mind the word "Arab" replacing every reference to Jews in the article, and imagining it placed in 13th Century Spain.....


Posted By: ops155
Date Posted: 02 January 2009 at 8:19am

SO can anyone tell me if they believe this latest assalt would have happened if over 200 rockets were not fired in a day? Just because they can't aim them very well doesn't mean crap. What if all those rockets hit schools and such. Would you all then still be sticking up for Hamas? No matter what you think the response should have been they came out and flat out said, if it doesn't stop you will pay and paying they are doing. Remember when you point that finger at someone else there are 3 pointing back at you. Wink

 
They started this one and now they must live with the results of their actions.


Posted By: ops155
Date Posted: 02 January 2009 at 8:35am
Originally posted by Duende Duende wrote:


Hyposonic
"thank you for the suggestion of writing to your local congressman. Unfortunately where I live that is not possible but if you can give me a link where I could perhaps email a lengthy opinionated response to this horrific situation it would be helpful, thanks!"


Hyposonic, if you scroll back and read carefully, you will see that I did not reccommend you write to your representative, since I know it will MAKE NO DIFFERENCE. I am convinced there is no political will to change anything in the Israeli-Palestine conflict. This does not mean I encourage only war and killing. If you read my post again, you will see that I was talking about the problem for Americans which is that your culture invariably reduces everything to an either-or situation. That will certainly never resolve anything.

I urged people to write to the AVAAZ organisation to complain about their lack of coverage of the Gaza crisis. I was once persuaded this organisation was 'different' and actually tried to fight for justice, and they certainly present themselves as a hopefull organisation using people power to counter the politicians who go deaf once they are in office. But seeing the silence from AVAAZ, both during the blockade building up to the Israeli massacre and now, almost a week since the murderous attacks began, I can see they are ruled by the same Zionist agenda as the mainstream media throughout the West.

 
Perhaps too many on this forum are blinded by their own hate of israel and AVAAZ can see why this is Hamas who caused this latest battle and therefor hasn't said much about it.
 
You spit in someones eye you better be prepaired to get punched in the nose and beat down. Just the way the world works.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 02 January 2009 at 3:50pm

Anyone have an opinion on who build the Gaza up to be such a desirable place to live?



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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 03 January 2009 at 12:41am
Update Post Heading:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/03/casualty-figures-civilian-dead-gaza

Reuters and the Associated Press report almost identical figures, which, as of yesterday, were between 400 and 421 dead and between 1,700 and 1,850 injured. Both cite Palestinian health officials. Al-Jazeera had the toll at 428 dead and 2,200 injured


Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 03 January 2009 at 1:00am

ops155: "You spit in someones eye you better be prepaired to get punched in the nose and beat down. Just the way the world works."

No, really? Then that must explain the New York and Pentagon attacks on September 11th. Just the way the world works, nothing to see here, move along please.

believer:"Anyone have an opinion on who build the Gaza up to be such a desirable place to live?"

I love this question! So lacking in any ulterior motive, so innocent and sweet. Such a concerned citizen seeking answers to the burning questions in his life. It warms the heart.



Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 03 January 2009 at 3:22am
"Let us get one thing perfectly straight. If the wholesale mutilation and degradation of the Gaza Strip is going to continue; if Israel�s will is at one with that of the United States; if the European Union, Russia, the United Nations and all the international legal agencies and organizations spread across the globe are going to continue to sit by like hollow mannequins doing nothing but making repeated �calls� for a �ceasefire� on �both sides�; if the cowardly, obsequious and supine Arab States are going to stand by watching their brethren get slaughtered by the hour while the world�s bullying Superpower eyes them threateningly from Washington lest they say something a little to their disliking; then let us at least tell the truth why this hell on earth is taking place.

This crisis has nothing to do with freedom, democracy, justice or peace. It is not about Mahmoud Zahhar or Khalid Mash�al or Ismail Haniyeh. It is not about Hassan Nasrallah or Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. These are all circumstantial players who have gained a role in the current tempest only now that the situation has been allowed for 61 years to develop into the catastrophe that it is today. The Islamist factor has colored and will continue to color the atmosphere of the crisis; it has enlisted the current leaders and mobilized wide sectors of the world�s population. The primary symbols today are Islamic � the mosques, the Qur�an, the references to the Prophet Muhammad and to Jihad. But these symbols could disappear and the impasse would continue.

Strip away the clich�s and the vacuous newspeak blaring out across the servile media and its pathetic corps of voluntary state servants in the Western world and what you will find is the naked desire for hegemony; for power over the weak and dominion over the world�s wealth. Worse yet you will find that the selfishness, the hatred and indifference, the racism and bigotry, the egotism and hedonism that we try so hard to cover up with our sophisticated jargon, our refined academic theories and models actually help to guide our basest and ugliest desires. "


%20 - http://www.counterpunch.org/loewenstein01012009.html


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 03 January 2009 at 7:33pm

So what is your answer?

 


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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 03 January 2009 at 7:55pm
Originally posted by believer believer wrote:

So what is your answer?

 


Who were you addressing your question to?

Answers Price Sheet

Simple Answers -- $1
Answers requiring thought -- $5

As usual, dumb looks are still free
You seem to project yourself as Mr. know it all....
So what was your question?



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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 5:40am
Originally posted by believer believer wrote:

So what is your answer?

 
 
Hi Believer,
 
I would like to ask you a question, If Jesus were to be alive now, whose side will he be with? The Israelis or the Palestinians?
 
My answer will be the Palestinians. And Jesus alaihissalam would be very ashamed of the so-called Christians who support war, torture, rape, grabbing of lands, killing of innocent women and children who are defenceless without any weapon whatsoever.
 
He would definitely say - Same on you Christians for believing a group of people who worship The Anti-Christ - The Devil.
 
Shame on you Christians (like you Believer) who sided with the Evil Group of people who worship my biggest enemy - The Anti Christ = The Devil!
 
What will be your defence?


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 5:55am

Ops 155 wrote - Perhaps too many on this forum are blinded by their own hate of israel and AVAAZ can see why this is Hamas who caused this latest battle and therefor hasn't said much about it.

How can one not hate Israel who loves killing, robbing, pillaging not only a village, but the whole country?

How can one not hate Israel for letting vineyards, olive farms being demolished and in place build settlements for a group of people who love Evil?

How can one not hate Israel who uses bombs, weapons of mass destruction on defenseless people whose fault is only to live peacefully in their own homeland.

How can one not hate Israel who let their IDF gleefully torture Palestinians at gunpoint, roll over a defenseless anti-war volunteer with a bulldozer, let a poor pregnant Palestinian woman being harassed in checkpoints and kill innocent children haphazardly?

Only people who do not understand LOVE, who are being fed with EVIL their whole lives, will stand behind these group of EVIL people.

You spit in someones eye you better be prepaired to get punched in the nose and beat down. Just the way the world works.

No my dear boy, it is not to get punched in the nose and beat down, but being bombed with weapons of mass destruction, not only to the person who spit (I am sure for a good reason) but to the whole village of poor defenseless people.

For this group of people with a sick mentality, this is JUSTICE. Tsk tsk tsk�



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:25am
Nur Ilahi -your statements reek of prejudice- not all of Israel would support the things that IDF has done.  Just as not all U.S. citizens support all the things Bush has done.
 
Nur-you are forgetting that it is Hamas that started this latest rocket firings.
 
You spit in someones eye you better be prepaired to get punched in the nose and beat down. Just the way the world works.
 
That is the eye for eye mentality.
 
What would Jesus say?
 
Matthew 5
 
An Eye for an Eye
 
 38"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' 39But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. 41If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
Love for Enemies
 43"You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.


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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.


Posted By: Nazarene
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:34am
Originally posted by believer believer wrote:

Nur Ilahi -your statements reek of prejudice- not all of Israel would support the things that IDF has done.  Just as not all U.S. citizens support all the things Bush has done.
 
Nur-you are forgetting that it is Hamas that started this latest rocket firings.
 
You spit in someones eye you better be prepaired to get punched in the nose and beat down. Just the way the world works.
 
That is the eye for eye mentality.
 
What would Jesus say?
 
Matthew 5
 
An Eye for an Eye
 
 38"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' 39But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. 41If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
Love for Enemies
 43"You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
hebrews 8:13   By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear .
 
 the jews had their covenant taken from them.
 and they are still "lost"
peace leland


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love for all conquers all


Posted By: Duende
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 9:52am
believer: "Nur Ilahi -your statements reek of prejudice- not all of Israel would support the things that IDF has done. Just as not all U.S. citizens support all the things Bush has done."

---Nur Ilahi's alleged prejudice is irrelevant. As is the alleged lack of unanimous support for George W. Bush's invasion of Iraq.

Since when have the views of the dissaproving minority in the US or Israel counted for anything? Nur is not expressing prejudice, she is expressing reality:

"Israelis are totally unfamiliar with the Palestinian cause. Hence, they can only interpret the Palestinian struggle as a murderous irrational lunacy. Within the Israeli Judeo- centric solipsistic universe, the Israeli is an innocent victim and the Palestinian is no less than a savage murderer."

http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/01/03/gilad-atzmon-living-on-borrowed-time-in-a-stolen-land - Gilad Atzmon: Living on Borrowed Time in a Stolen Land


believer: Nur-you are forgetting that it is Hamas that started this latest rocket firings."

Even if she were 'forgetting' this oft-repeated propaganda, it would not make it any less a lie:
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2009/01/top-5-lies-about-israel�s-assault-on-gaza - Top 5 Lies About Israel's Assault on Gaza

"Lie #2) Hamas violated the cease-fire. The Israeli bombardment is a response to Palestinian rocket fire and is designed to end such rocket attacks.

Israel never observed the cease-fire to begin with. From the beginning, it announced a �special security zone� within the Gaza Strip and announced that Palestinians who enter this zone will be fired upon. In other words, Israel announced its intention that Israeli soldiers would shoot at farmers and other individuals attempting to reach their own land in direct violation of not only the cease-fire but international law.

Despite shooting incidents, including ones resulting in Palestinians getting injured, Hamas still held to the cease-fire from the time it went into effect on June 19 until Israel effectively ended the truce on November 4 by launching an airstrike into Gaza that killed five and injured several others.

Israel�s violation of the cease-fire predictably resulted in retaliation from militants in Gaza who fired rockets into Israel in response. The increased barrage of rocket fire at the end of December is being used as justification for the continued Israeli bombardment, but is a direct response by militants to the Israeli attacks."



Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 10:38am
Originally posted by ops155 ops155 wrote:

SO can anyone tell me if they believe this latest assalt would have happened if over 200 rockets were not fired in a day? Just because they can't aim them very well doesn't mean crap. What if all those rockets hit schools and such. Would you all then still be sticking up for Hamas? No matter what you think the response should have been they came out and flat out said, if it doesn't stop you will pay and paying they are doing. Remember when you point that finger at someone else there are 3 pointing back at you. Wink

 They started this one and now they must live with the results of their actions.
 
Hello ops 155,
 
This thread is about Israeli attack on already suffering Palestinian people who have been subjected to brutal occupation for the last many decades. No one in this thread supports the idealogy of Hamas. I have always maintained in this forum as a participant and a moderator that Islam forbids killing of innocent civilians; in fact, most of the scholars in Islam support this notion. Period.
 
You may also like to see the link below that clarifies that it is Israel that broke the truce:
 
Gaza: Colonial Violence and Flawed Justifications
by Rachad Antonius, December 31 2008

http://www.tadamon.ca/post/2373 - http://www.tadamon.ca/post/2373

The Israeli government's propaganda about the war in Gaza has been
uncritically accepted by Canadian media, becoming the dominant discourse
in most news reports. The violence we are witnessing is explained by
declaring that Hamas has broken the truce with Israel, and therefore it is
responsible for the current level of Israeli violence, which is thereby
represented merely as a reasonable and justified retaliation. According to
this view, Israel is only defending itself against a vicious enemy which
is still intent on destroying it. At best, the excesses of the attacks
against Gaza are deplored, but their presentation as retaliation is not
even questioned.

The meaning that the government of Israel wants to give to the event is
thereby internalized, becoming the frame through which the present
situation is perceived and understood. The principle of using violence to
resolve a dispute is not put in question, so long as it is Israel that
uses the violence and the dispute is one with Palestinians. In this case
violence is seen as legitimate, but illegitimate if committed by Hamas.
This remains the case even if the means at the disposal of each of the
protagonists are not comparable and even if neither the damage they suffer
nor the capacity each has to inflict damage are not at all comparable.

This logic suffers from two fundamental flaws. First it contradicts the
empirical facts on the ground, which are well documented and are not so
much called into question as they are conveniently forgotten. Second, this
logic is openly a colonial logic.

Who broke the truce ?

Contrary to what has been repeated in editorials and in the TV interviews
of various experts, it was not Hamas who broke the truce, but Israel. On
November 4, 2008, a truce that had lasted for four months was broken by
Israel in a bombardment that killed six Palestinians. Only after these
killings did Hamas resume its rocket-launching against Israeli localities.
On November 17, Israeli planes bombed once again, killing four more
Palestinians, bringing the total number of Palestinian casualties since
November 4, to 15. These facts are well documented. (See, for instance,
the report of former Jerusalem Post correspondent, Joel Greenberg, in the
Chicago Tribune of November 17, 2008, among many others.) Immediately
after the first bombing of November 4, Israel started its full blockade of
Gaza, preventing the entry of food and medication. Between November 5 and
November 30, only 23 trucks of food and supplies were allowed into Gaza,
whereas the average in the preceding period was about 3000 trucks monthly
for a population numbering 1.5 million. The humanitarian situation,
already a disaster, and described as such by the United Nations' envoy,
became even more catastrophic as a result of the blockade. Yet neither the
bombings nor the blockade are considered to be aggressions.

A colonial logic

What is it that gets the opinion-makers to "forget" these "minor"
details?
In reality the government of Israel gives itself the right to use violence
against a population that it considers inferior. It considers that these
inferior people should not even be allowed to protest. With such colonial
logic, nothing is considered as an aggression if it is conducted against a
subaltern population. Any movement of revolt, on the part of the
subaltern, is considered a challenge to the colonial order and must be
severely punished. Accordingly, there is no need to respect international
law, as inferior people are deemed to understand only the language of
force.

Fortunately this logic is not shared by all Israelis, and movements, such
as Gush Shalom, challenged it vigourously; they also called for an
immediate ceasefire. Unfortunately the Canadian political elite seems to
have accepted Israeli propaganda fully. But the language of force will not
ever get us out of the dead end we're in; only respect for international
law will.
* Rachad Antonius is a professseur at the Universit� du Qu�bec � Montr�al.
 
It is imperative that we stick to the thread and comply with guidelines.


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Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
Qur'an 55:13


Posted By: Ron Webb
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 2:12pm
Originally posted by Nur_Ilahi Nur_Ilahi wrote:

I would like to ask you [believer] a question, If Jesus were to be alive now, whose side will he be with? The Israelis or the Palestinians?
Pardon me for interjecting, but what makes you think He would be on either side?  Jesus made it quite clear that that aggression is equally wrong on both sides, and it doesn't matter who started it or how evil your opponent is.  
 
Quote You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 
Matthew 5:38-39
Quote But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. Do to others as you would have them do to you.
 "If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' love those who love them. And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' do that. And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' lend to 'sinners,' expecting to be repaid in full. But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked.
Luke 6:27-35
 
The fundamental difference between Christianity and the other Abrahamic religions is the principle that while "an eye for an eye" may seem like justice, in the long run it is no way to solve anything.  Not that most Christians themselves understand it, mind you.  Jesus died on the cross as a dramatic illustration of non-resistance and non-violence, but still most of His followers managed to miss the point. Ermm


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Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.


Posted By: hat2010
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 2:58pm
Ok... here is some news from neighboring city, Rabat -

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2009/01/04/africa/AF-Morocco-Gaza-Protest.php

Tens of thousands of Moroccans march in solidarity

RABAT, Morocco: A demonstration against the Israeli offensive in Gaza has drawn tens of thousands of people to the streets of the Moroccan capital.

Police have put the number of demonstrators at 50,000, according to the official MAP news agency. But organizers say even more turned out for the peaceful march in this Muslim kingdom on the Atlantic coast.

Protesters emphasized their solidarity with the Palestinians in general and with Gaza residents in particular during Sunday's four-hour march, which coincided with large demonstrations in Turkey and Lebanon.

It closed with call to the Arab world to continue supporting the Palestinian cause and denouncing Israel's air and land offensive against the militant Hamas organization that controls Gaza.


Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 5:02pm
"Nur-you are forgetting that it is Hamas that started this latest rocket firings."
 
And here is why, from an Israeli article that I posted here, which apparently went unread. You can actually read it, I posted the link below.
 
"Since Nov. 4, when Israel effectively broke the truce with Hamas by attacking Gaza on a scale then unprecedented � a fact now buried with Gaza's dead � the violence has escalated as Hamas responded by sending hundreds of rockets into Israel to kill Israeli civilians. It is reported that Israel's strategy is to hit Hamas military targets, but explain that difference to my Palestinian friends who must bury their children.

On Nov. 5, Israel sealed all crossing points into Gaza, vastly reducing and at times denying food supplies, medicines, fuel, cooking gas, and parts for water and sanitation systems. A colleague of mine in Jerusalem said, "this siege is in a league of its own. The Israelis have not done something like this before."

http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13879 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13879


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�No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.�
Eleanor Roosevelt


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:29pm
Believer, you are evading my question. Are you too afraid to face reality that no matter what, Jesus alaihissalam will never ever side with the Evil Dajjal Worshipping Zionists?
 
That is the eye for eye mentality. - If that is so, why must a harmless rocket that never did kill any Israelis (of course it did not kill any Israelis because it was shot by Israelis themselves as what their motto says - BY DECEPTION THOU SHOULD DO WAR) be returned with WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION BY THE IDF?
 
 
 
Picture from ORF website of supposed 'militants'
http://thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=9896 - http://thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=9896
 
Quote from the above website - The rockets shown on Austrian TV looked to me like the fancy Bengala Rockets which are shot here while celebrating new year, and the clips shown on TV raise many questions:

* The picture published at the
http://tv.orf.at/program/orf2/20081225/431316201/257801/ - ORF website is credited to "MOHAMED SABER/EPA". Those are two first names and no family name. Who is this person? Why does he not present himself with a family name as any Arab would do? Does he exist at all or is he a fabrication?

* The rockets depicted in that picture (and on the video) look more like the fancy bengalas which can be bought in many shops all over the world before festivities than any known weapon.

* These so-called "rockets" appear to not have place for fuel or an engine, but they are supposed to fly 10-15Km ? How do they accomplish this miracle?
The quotes from the Bible that you provided are just that quotes only, in reality, it is not being practised by majority of Christians. As most of the law in the Bible.


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:34pm

Ron Webb point well taken�..

 

I also agree with Peacemaker�s post, very insightful. But again, this is about both sides as there is an action and reaction. I continue to believe that Israeli military and Hamas are harming their own people.

 
Nur_Ilahi, no offense but your comment regarding why they shouldn't be upset about Palestinians shooting rockets if it didn't hit nothing is kinda derranged, no offense. To say it was Israelis not Palestinians means you hold the Palestinians [those who are aggressive] as innocents because they don't exists, its the Jews? Right!


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"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:34pm
Ron Wrote - Pardon me for interjecting, but what makes you think He would be on either side?  Jesus made it quite clear that that aggression is equally wrong on both sides, and it doesn't matter who started it or how evil your opponent is. 
 
Of course. As a leader, Jesus has to be impartial, intelligent, honest, respectable, decent, trustworthy and many other traits of a human being. These traits are not found in Israeli mentality. Theirs is a sick mentality that loves gory, bloody, evil and all other traits of a devil worshipping people.
 


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:36pm

Hyposonic, please read this link - http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/05/2458911.htm?section=justin - http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/05/2458911.htm?section=justin

Here is the excerpt -

Israeli army trained in Gaza mock-up

Posted 5 hours 26 minutes ago

The Israeli army spent 18 months training for its ground attack against Gaza on a model of the main city built at a desert army base, a military spokesman said.

"Our soldiers know all the back streets where their targets are," military spokesman Avi Benayahou told Israeli public television.

"For a year and a half our soldiers trained on a reduced model of Gaza City built on the Tsehilim base" in the Negev desert of southern Israel, near the frontier with Gaza, he added.

Gaza City was virtually surrounded on Sunday, one day after tens of thousands of Israeli forces entered the territory on a mission to halt militant rocket attacks.

"We have already dealt some very major blows on Hamas but we will have to hit again and the operation could take time," the spokesman said without giving details.

-AFP



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:47pm

Hyposonic, you wrote

To say it was Israelis not Palestinians means you hold the Palestinians [those who are aggressive] as innocents because they don't exists, its the Jews? Right!

Would you not be agressive, if your mother is killed right in front of you by the IDF with 100 rounds of bullets? Would not you be agressive if your daughter is being raped right in front of  your eyes? Would not you be agressive if your whole house is being bombarded by weapons of mass destruction? Would you not be agressive, if your whole country is being plundered, pillaged, robbed by people who have no sense of decency at all?
 
But of course these emotions are alien to you, you are not there, satan worshipping people are fed with satanic traits that is totally devoid of LOVE. These emotions of the Palestinians are foreign to you.
 
And the best part is the Zionists always hide behind the Jews. They were the one who worshipped Satan and created satanic havoc, yet it is the Jews that got blamed. But of course, I must remind others, what is their motto? BY DECEPTION THOU SHOULD DO WAR.


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Ron Webb
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 7:13pm
Originally posted by Nur_Ilahi Nur_Ilahi wrote:

But of course, I must remind others, what is their motto? BY DECEPTION THOU SHOULD DO WAR.
AngryAngry
Nur, you're still LYING!
 
This is the third time I have told you that the Mossad motto is taken from Proverbs 24:6, which says "By WISE COUNSEL shalt thou make thy war, and in multitude of counsellors there is safety."
 
And don't bother telling me about whatever lying source you got your slanderous misquotation from.  It's the Bible, dammit!  Go look it up!


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Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 9:13pm
Would you not be agressive, if your mother is killed right in front of you by the IDF with 100 rounds of bullets? Would not you be agressive if your daughter is being raped right in front of  your eyes? Would not you be agressive if your whole house is being bombarded by weapons of mass destruction? Would you not be agressive, if your whole country is being plundered, pillaged, robbed by people who have no sense of decency at all?
 

These questions are hypothetical, therefore I cannot give you my answer because I have not been presented with these situations.

But of course these emotions are alien to you, you are not there, satan worshipping people are fed with satanic traits that is totally devoid of LOVE. These emotions of the Palestinians are foreign to you.

Nur_Ilahi, your tone is extremist tone. You are an extremist and I've held my tongue but your posts are quite grandoise, illogical, and devoid of anything comprehensibly sound. Your manipulation of what I say is amusing and then you make personal attacks to me without any sound knowledge of who I am. You think because I don't believe as you do I am devoid of emotion?
 

To me, you need help psychologically, because you seemed to be a pissed off armchair warrior not to mention crazy. How about this Nur_Ilahi, get off Islamicity and go help your brothers and sisters if you aren't doing that now. Stop screaming "Zionist" and stop screaming Jews this and Jews that poor poor me. Excuse me but my tone is like this because you have decided to make this personal since, you obviously know me and know I have no heart. Stop whinning here and get off your butt and go there and be with your brothers.



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"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 11:02pm
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

 
AngryAngry
Nur, you're still LYING!
 
This is the third time I have told you that the Mossad motto is taken from Proverbs 24:6, which says "By WISE COUNSEL shalt thou make thy war, and in multitude of counsellors there is safety."
 
And don't bother telling me about whatever lying source you got your slanderous misquotation from.  It's the Bible, dammit!  Go look it up!

George W. Bush - Terrorist in the White House

MOSSAD



"By Way Of Deception Thou Shalt Do War."

- the official motto of Mossad

"There has been since almost the earliest days of the Israeli state and the earliest days of the http://www.nogw.com/cia.html - CIA a secret bond, basically by which Israeli intelligence did jobs for the http://www.nogw.com/cia.html - CIA and for the rest of American intelligence. You can't understand what's been going on with American covert operations and the Israeli covert operations until you understand this secret arrangement."

- Andrew Cockburn

This picture was a press release from Israeli sources purported to show Palestian terrorists. However one of the suspected terrorists forgot to take off his star of David before being photographed. The sunglasses are most likely to hide his blue eyes also.

http://www.nogw.com/mossad.html - http://www.nogw.com/mossad.html


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 04 January 2009 at 11:06pm
Reply to Hyposonic -
 
Would you not be agressive, if your mother is killed right in front of you by the IDF with 100 rounds of bullets? Would not you be agressive if your daughter is being raped right in front of your eyes? Would not you be agressive if your whole house is being bombarded by weapons of mass destruction? Would you not be agressive, if your whole country is being plundered, pillaged, robbed by people who have no sense of decency at all?

These questions are hypothetical, therefore I cannot give you my answer because I have not been presented with these situations.

Hypothetical? Why not you click this link and see for yourself if this is hypothetical. http://sg.images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?_adv_prop=image&va=gaza&sz=all - http://sg.images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?_adv_prop=image&va=gaza&sz=all

Hyposonic, I also am not presented with these kind of situation, but I can feel, I can emphatize, symphatize, that is the least that a normal person can do. This is a normal feeling of a human being. Why do you think that there are many protests all over the world in regards this senseless killing of Gazans?

But of course these emotions are alien to you, you are not there, satan worshipping people are fed with satanic traits that is totally devoid of LOVE. These emotions of the Palestinians are foreign to you.

Nur_Ilahi, your tone is extremist tone. You are an extremist and I've held my tongue but your posts are quite grandoise, illogical, and devoid of anything comprehensibly sound.

Extremist? Yes my feeling is at the moment is anger to the extreme. Angry at the inhuman people who acted inhumanely, acting animal-like. Without any remorse whatsoever. How can the world be at peace if we have these kind of people around us? How can the world be at peace, with people who do not know what is the meaning of LOVE?

These kind of evil people like the Israelis that should be eradicated from the face of the earth. Not the Palestinians. To you my posts seems grandiose, illogical devoid of anything comprehensibly sound, because you and your ilk are not taught the meaning of LOVE, the meaning of peace, the meaning of honesty and sincerity. Instead your ilk are fed with lies, deceits, blood and killing, war and torture and many others that are not compatible with the pure soul that God had equipped us with.

Your manipulation of what I say is amusing and then you make personal attacks to me without any sound knowledge of who I am. You think because I don't believe as you do I am devoid of emotion?

See this picture below? Let�s say that this is your child, what would your emotion be?

Image%20Preview

To me, you need help psychologically, because you seemed to be a pissed off armchair warrior not to mention crazy.

A person who can symphatize, who can emphatize with the mother of the child above,do not need psychological help, instead those who does not know the meaning of LOVE should get one.

How about this Nur_Ilahi, get off Islamicity and go help your brothers and sisters if you aren't doing that now.

We the Muslims here are doing our best to teach to the general masses as to who is the real Terrorists. By doing so, we are helping our brothers and sisters who are intensely suffering from the evilness of the Dajjal worshipping Zionists.

Stop screaming "Zionist" and stop screaming Jews this and Jews that poor poor me. I always use the word Zionists rarely Jews. Please take note of that.

Excuse me but my tone is like this because you have decided to make this personal since, you obviously know me and know I have no heart.

I am only practicing what Islam taught. AMAL MAKRUF NAHI MUNKAR - UPHOLD GOOD AND FORBID EVIL. However, the evil Dajjal Worshipping Zionists has a totally opposite outlook, UPHOLD EVIL, FORBID GOOD.

Stop whinning here and get off your butt and go there and be with your brothers.

And miss debating with you? Tsk..Tsk..Tsk�As I mentioned before, we the Muslims here in Islamicity and all the Islamic forums in the internet are like the MUJAHIDEENS OF CYBER SPACE. We know we will win and we know that we are on the True Path because we have ALLAH AL-HAQ - ALLAH THE TRUTH!



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Ron Webb
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 4:53pm

Originally posted by Nur_Ilahi, January 4 at 8:34 pm Nur_Ilahi, January 4 at 8:34 pm wrote:

Theirs is a sick mentality that loves gory, bloody, evil and all other traits of a devil worshipping people.

Originally posted by Nur_Ilahi, January 5 at 1:06 am Nur_Ilahi, January 5 at 1:06 am wrote:

These kind of evil people like the Israelis that should be eradicated from the face of the earth.

I see you have moved beyond slanders and lies to outright hate speech.  I don't know what the laws are like in Singapore (or in whatever country the Islamicity server resides), but here in Canada you can go to jail for advocating genocide.

I think it's time the moderators took some action, unless they want Islamicity to be considered a hate site.



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Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.


Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 6:08pm
Ron
 You don't need to get bent out of shape for an angry utterance on this site which is in correspondence with the genocide Zionist entity is committing in her  prison AKA Gaza Strip....The Zionists have the wherewithal furnished by the western hegemonic powers to commit genocide and you are getting upset for Nur just mentioning the reverse is really perverse!
If you don't find the happenings of Gaza reprehensible and don't make you furious that may be normal behavior of colonial mentality; I am sorry to disappoint you that is not so amongst the colonized / neocolonized and particularly people in Malay peninsula!
You don't need to tell us what the Canadian laws are! Do we give a hoot for that?
Need to know why your feathers are so ruffled?
You know so do lots of others that Israel is untouchable with guarantees from POTUS on down and well protected with weapon of mass destruction so what is the big deal for a rant?

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Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction.


Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 6:30pm

Sign Reader,

 

Obviously you are Muslim and biased and can�t see behind what she is saying. Nur_Ilahi is promoting hate. I made a minor disagreement with her and in one of the previous threads she calls me a Zionist and states I lack emotion.

 
Nur_Ilahi states:

 

 Hypothetical? Why not you click this link and see for yourself if this is hypothetical.
 
Is that how you spend your time? Looking at pictures of injured people on Yahoo and getting mad about it?
 
Nur_Ilahi states:

Hyposonic, I also am not presented with these kind of situation, but I can feel, I can emphatize, symphatize, that is the least that a normal person can do. This is a normal feeling of a human being. Why do you think that there are many protests all over the world in regards this senseless killing of Gazans?

Well I feel sorry for a lot of people. i wonder where you were when the  "Janjaweed" were killing many muslim men and raping muslim women? Or in Somalia where tribesmen were killing innocent people. I say i'm not there because I cannot comment on something I'm personally not witnessing. Last time I checked independent reporters were barred from being in the region so I question whether there were 500 Gazans dead. I wonder how many of them were "combatants" and how many of them non-combatants?
 
These kind of evil people like the Israelis that should be eradicated from the face of the earth.
 
I thought you were talking about zionist? Now its back to Israelis now?
 
To you my posts seems grandiose, illogical devoid of anything comprehensibly sound, because you and your ilk are not taught the meaning of LOVE, the meaning of peace, the meaning of honesty and sincerity.
 
Who is my ilk? So now you suggest I get upset from looking at pictures of hurt children? I have seen my share of suffering from the many children I see at the local hospital. I have seen dead children, dead men, and women. I have seen amputees. I have seen people who have chronic pain until they die. I have seen cancer patients, and many patients who suffer from neurodigenerative diseases. So when I see innocent Gazans I suddenly have to feel fury and rage?
 
I am not discounting any of the suffering going on in Palestine. My heart goes out to the people there, but at the same time I don't need you or anyone else to comment on what I feel. You need help and I hope the moderators can see how hateful your posts have become.
 
Instead your ilk are fed with lies, deceits, blood and killing, war and torture and many others that are not compatible with the pure soul that God had equipped us with.
 
Who are you first of all? Pure soul? If this is the impresassion of Islam I'm glad I'm not Muslim. you have not only shown me and others how hateful you have become but you proceed to be a spokeswoman for Muslims [or Islam].
 

See this picture below? Let�s say that this is your child, what would your emotion be?

how about not googling pictures or searching for pictures from yahoo to convince me.
 

A person who can symphatize, who can emphatize with the mother of the child above,do not need psychological help, instead those who does not know the meaning of LOVE should get one.

 
Who says i don't sympathize or empathize? I just don't behave in the same fashion as you. you are acting irrational not logical your hate speech is evident.
 
I always use the word Zionists rarely Jews. Please take note of that.
 

I have already uncovered your contradiction since you have indicated Israelies should be eradicated.

 

And miss debating with you? Tsk..Tsk..Tsk�As I mentioned before, we the Muslims here in Islamicity and all the Islamic forums in the internet are like the MUJAHIDEENS OF CYBER SPACE. We know we will win and we know that we are on the True Path because we have ALLAH AL-HAQ - ALLAH THE TRUTH!

Mujahideens of  cyberspace? Wow, I honestly think you need to relax. You should stay away from the computer for a few days and recuperate from the exhaustion of hate.



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"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"


Posted By: Ron Webb
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 6:35pm
Originally posted by Sign*Reader Sign*Reader wrote:

You don't need to get bent out of shape for an angry utterance on this site which is in correspondence with the genocide Zionist entity is committing in her  prison AKA Gaza Strip....The Zionists have the wherewithal furnished by the western hegemonic powers to commit genocide and you are getting upset for Nur just mentioning the reverse is really perverse!
Just to be clear: I am annoyed that Nur continues to lie about the (former) Mossad motto, after I have twice given her the correct translation.  The hate speech doesn't upset me personally (I've seen worse), but I think it ought to worry the moderators, whose reputation is tainted by it and who could be legally liable for it.

Quote If you don't find the happenings of Gaza reprehensible and don't make you furious that may be normal behavior of colonial mentality; I am sorry to disappoint you that is not so amongst the colonized / neocolonized and particularly people in Malay peninsula!
Of course I find the happenings in Gaza reprehensible.  I also find the actions of Hamas reprehensible.  There's plenty of blame to go around.
 
This is not primarily a conflict between Israelis and Palestinians.  It is a contest between moderates on both sides, who want peace, versus extremists on both sides, who want war.  Right now the warmongers are winning, and I find that upsetting.


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Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 7:56pm
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

 
This is not primarily a conflict between Israelis and Palestinians.  It is a contest between moderates on both sides, who want peace, versus extremists on both sides, who want war.  Right now the warmongers are winning, and I find that upsetting.
 

This is an excellent point, and like USA attacking Iraq, warmongers were winners.  Why is this?  Now sadly, as not to repeat what happened in Lebanon, Israel must seek an exit strategy, which will only likely prolong the suffering on both sides.

 



Posted By: Israfil
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 9:35pm
I see nothing has changed. Unhappy


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 05 January 2009 at 9:44pm
Smile Welcome Israfil!  What's up?  Where ya been?


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 6:48am

           Daoud Kuttab: Ten Myths about Gaza

 

It is known that truth is the first casualty in wars. The current war on Gaza is no different. Below is a list of 10 myths perpetuated by Israel and repeated ad nauseum by many in the media.

Myth # 1 Israel had no alternative

Ever since starting the air campaign the Israelis have been stating that they had no choice but to carry out this invasion. Acting Israeli prime minister repeated this myth saying that Israel had no alternative but to begin the ground war on the Gaza strip.

The truth is that Israel had a clear alternative. The Islamic Hamas movement and the various Palestinian factions in Gaza offered to extend the truce in December if the Israelis agreed to lift the massive blockade and siege on Gaza. Israel also had an even easier alternative, they could have agreed to talk to Hamas and worked out a true and lasting ceasefire, but they choose to refuse to legitimize the rulers of Gaza backed by the so called global war on terror that Israel's main ally, the Bush Administration has been implementing.

Myth # 2 Hamas rockets were targeting Israeli civilians without provocation

Ever Israeli spokesman repeats the myth that Hamas has been attacking Israeli communities with missiles coming out of Gaza without any provocation. International leaders, media anchors repeated ask how could any country tolerate its citizens being attacked without provocation such as what is happening to the citizens of south Israel.

The truth is that Palestinians and Israelis have been at war since 1948 when nearly 500 Palestinian villages were erased, its residents became refugees (the refugees constitute more than 50% of the population of Gaza). The UN has resolved that the refugees should be allowed to return and the Arab countries have offered a peace agreement that includes an agreed upon resolution of the refugee problem. Furthermore Israel occupied Gaza in 1967 and has not (according to international standards) ended its occupation of Gaza. As stated above, Hamas has offered short and long term truce with Israel but the latter has rejected these offers.

Myth # 3 Israel is acting in self defense

This myth has been repeated enough times that the na�ve rotating head of the European Union initially stated that Israel's ground invasion is a defensive act (he later recanted). Emerging from a security council meeting that failed to stop the Israeli ground attack, the United States' deputy chief at the UN stated that the UN charter allows member countries to defend themselves and that "Israel's right to defend itself is not negotiable."

The truth is that the Israeli offensive against a population still legally under its occupation is anything but defensive. Countries do have a right to defend themselves but they don't have the right to occupy and continue to occupy. The same charter that the deputy US official was quoting also states in its preamble:

We the peoples of the United Nations determine to:

� save succeeding generations from the scourge of war, which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and

� to reaffirm faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person, in the equal rights of men and women and of nations large and small.

Myth # 4 That Israel is only targeting Hamas fighters not Palestinians

Foreign minister Tzipi Livini regularly repeated the term that the Israeli army is targeting only what she called Hamas terrorists and that her country has no fight with the Palestinian people.

The truth is that by shelling the densely populated Gaza strip (1.5 million living in a 350 square km area) the Israelis hit both Hamas combatants and civilians. One of the best proofs of this is in the fact that about one third of the casualties in the first week alone were children- hardly members of Hamas. International law is very clear about the responsibility of warring parties to limit deaths of civilians. The Israelis totally destroying a four story building in which a Hamas leader and his wives and children living with F16 planes is a clear example of a lack of effort to distinguish between civilians and fighters.

Myth # 5 Israel ended its occupation of Gaza in 2006

Part of the well weaved Israeli narrative is that Palestinians are not really interested in land for peace because they have continued to attack Israel after the Israelis ended the occupation of the strip in 2006. Again the truth is different. The UN Security Council resolution 242 which called the occupation of Gaza 'inadmissible' called on Israel to withdraw from occupied territories, to acknowledge the sovereignty and territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace with secure and recognized boundaries and it also affirmed for 'achieving a just settlement on the [Palestinian] refugee problem.' By all standards and as agreed by neutral international observers the occupation of Gaza that was established in 1967 continues with all the responsibility that befalls on the Israeli occupying authorities.

Myth # 6 Hamas is the military arm of Iran

As part of justifying the local attack, Israel and its apologists paint a much larger regional picture with Hamas and Hizbullah as the military arm of Iran and the Iranian Islamic revolution.

The truth is that whereas as a Shiite movement Hizbuallah might have natural relations with Shiite Iran, Hamas is a Sunni Islamic movement and in general Sunnis look down at Shiites and reject them theologically. True Hamas leaders have visited Iran, but it is a long shot to say that they are the military arm of Iran.

Myth # 7 Hamas uses the Palestinian population as human shields

The difficulties that Israel has had in locating and destroying Hamas leaders has led to this myth. The Israeli PR machine uses quotes made by Hamas leaders that the Palestinian population is not afraid of death as proof that they are using Palestinians as human shields.

The truth is that the international law that forbids the use of human shields is referring to militants who use captured enemy civilians as hostages to prevent an attack. There is no evidence that Hamas is forcing their own population against their will to be where they are. In fact the irony is that Palestinian civilians have no where to go within the Gaza Strip even if they wanted to leave.

Myth # 8 There is no humanitarian crisis

Speaking in Paris, the Israeli foreign minister insisted that the attacks on Gaza are not causing a humanitarian crisis. Israeli Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni said there was no need for a ceasefire on humanitarian grounds as more lorries containing aid were entering Gaza than before the conflict began last Saturday.

The truth as quoted by according to the latest bulletin from the Gaza office of the UN office for the coordination of humanitarian affairs:

"The military incursion compounds the humanitarian crisis following more than a week of shelling and an 18-month long blockade of the territory. There is an increased threat to civilians due to combat in densely populated urban areas. "Hospitals continue to be overstretched because of the large number of casualties that have accumulated since the beginning of Israeli attacks, and ambulances and medical personnel face difficulties in accessing casualties. Electricity and telecommunications are down over much of the Gaza Strip. Food distributions have been suspended and all crossing points remain closed."

A flash appeal issued by the United Nations Relief and Works Agency this month said that the bombing was "destroying what remains of Gaza's crumbling infrastructure and public service capacity," and "threatens dramatically to worsen an already dire food security situation for the entire population.

Myth # 9 Israel wants to weaken Hamas

Another Israeli myth is that the campaign aims at weakening Hamas. Amos Gilad, a senior Israeli Defense Ministry official, told Israel Radio the goal is to weaken the movement.

While the Israelis will certainly weaken the movement military at the present time, it has already raised their public stature in Palestine and the Arab world. Hamas whose public standing was deteriorating because of its difficulty to govern has now become popular as they are seen as heroes who are standing up to the Israeli military machine. As a movement Hamas can't be destroyed even if many of its leaders are killed. Furthermore, Hamas's hard-line political position has caused a major set back to moderate Arab leaders especially those in Arab countries who have a peace treaty with Israel.

Myth # 10 Hamas is not only a danger on Israel but also on the Arab world

As part of the effort to dehumanize their enemy, the Israelis justify their attacks against Palestinians in Gaza by saying that somehow they are encouraged to do so by Palestinians and Arabs who disagree politically with Hamas.

The truth is that while Palestinians and Arabs have had differences with Hamas, the Palestinian Authority and Arab leaders have been consistent in their repeated and constant denunciation of the Israeli actions. In fact the Palestinian president has released all Hamas prisoners and an effort for national unity has taken place.





 


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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 6:51am
The Lie That Justifies Mass Murder: "Hamas Hit Us First"
Charles E. Carlson  Jan 01, 2008


The White House�s press release is exactly the same as the Zionist Israel position, blaming the victims. It is imperative that we know why. Here is the official Israeli line, directly from Washington:

�It was "completely unacceptable" for Hamas, which controls Gaza, to launch attacks on Israel after a truce lasting several months, said Gordon Johndroe, a spokesman for the National Security Council. "These people are nothing but thugs, so Israel is going to defend its people against terrorists like Hamas that indiscriminately kill their own people."

The reason the US Administration parrots Zionist Israel�s story is that there is a common agenda that calls for more war in the Middle East. As we have written for some years, ours is a war-based economy, and Israel plays a large part in it because the USA�s targeted enemy is Islam.
 
War, to those who direct our course from above and beyond presidential politics, is not about religion, but is a vehicle to force economic growth where there is now stagnation.  Broader, bigger and more permanent wars is a part or the �Dilution Solution� planned to save our economy, much as World War II was thought by many to be a planned solution to the �Great Depression.�

We Hold These Truths opposes this policy, which will end only when citizens demand it.

The USA, also, uses Israel to further the war agenda. Israeli politicians willingly play their part in the US war schemes, that necessitates many secret meetings between the two. Israeli citizens will eventually be blamed for wars in the Middle East and could one day become the victims.

Zionist politicians have their own political reasons for the unreasonable brutality which has been discussed in the Arab press. Israel wants to regain political control over the Philistines, so to their way of thinking, Hamas must go. This writer uses the biblical �Philistine� in place of the popular �Palestinian� to emphasize that Arabs are the historic occupants of the land, and they presently do not even have a state. Paradoxically, they are like the unarmed David, a stateless people wondering in the land of the Philistines, but with the slingshot, versus Israel, the militarist Goliath.

As a practical matter, Israel cannot kill all three or four million Philistines, although it has been officially considered.  And, Likud politicians will do it if they can.  Past Prime Minister Ariel Sharon actually stated he was capable and willing to kill all Palestinian Arabs if the Zionists could handle the world heat it would generate. Israel�s objective, instead, is to eliminate Hamas, so they can once again control the Philistines, as they have in the past, by controlling its leaders.

Israel with the help of the USA, trained Yassar Arafat to be its kind of Arab leader and helped him to become a billionaire. In exchange Arafat created a terrorist image for his peace-seeking people, but he never attacked Israeli political figures, as he would have done if he was their enemy.

Before the spasms of violence by Philistine youths in the 1980s called �Intifada,� the Arab population of some three million was in effect a low cost labor pool for Israel. Philistines did the menial labor and farming, commuting from gulags called refugee camps in Gaza and the West Bank. Israel could and did build industry around this desperate labor force much as Germany provided its war materials from slave labor camps populated by prisoners, many of whom were European Jews. This writer wonders if Zionists did not borrow the idea from the National Socialists (NAZI). South Africa was criticized and embargoed for using its black labor pool to build its industry, called Apartheid, but it never bombed the slums where the laborers lived.  

Israel�s forced labor pool declined with the Intifada from the early 1980�s on.  The youth uprising started with Philistine children throwing rocks and the subsequent Israeli Defense Force policy of deliberate bone-breaking of children. Eventually the desperation led to human bombs.

The PLO�s role was that of a controlled terrorist�controlled in that it made lots of press, but never really gained any constructive ground for the Philistines. The PLO made everyone think Philistines were terrorists, but it never really harmed the government of Israel. As an example, the PLO killed members of the Israeli Olympic team in Munich, which only helped the Zionists with world sympathy.

Had the PLO desired to use its ample resources to hurt Zionists it could have organized general strikes, peaceful sit and other non violent methods of revolt.  It had lots of people who needed a way to participate, but it did not.  The PLO could also have been affective as a terror group by assassinating Zionist political and military leaders, or intimidated wealthy donors to the Zionist cause in New York, Paris, and London. This would have had an impact. Instead the PLO killed an aged couple on a cruse ship, slaughtered 20- year old Olympic athletes, and hijacked airlines from other countries making enemies out of them, and damaging the reputation of every Arab from every land. Arafat was left alone to live a lavish lifestyle in Paris, married a young wife there, and amassed an unknown personal fortune. Affectively he was an Israeli agent.

The Philistines knew all this, but the PLO had no competition until Hamas came along . Israel�s stated agenda is to get Mahmoud Abbas back in power as the Philistine leader. According to reliable members of the Arab Press Abbas�s term runs out on January 9. This gives Israel and the USA but one week to destroy Hamas so they can keep Abbas in power.

It should surprise no one that Bush has praised Abbas as a fine leader for the Palestinians.

On the first day of 2009 Israel bombed a 4 story apartment building in Gaza to kill one Hamas leader. They were willing to kill eight members of his family, all women and children, plus four more non-family members who lived in the same building! The USA networks did not report the event. And, the US Administration supports these Zionist acts of terrorism, as the President�s press release indicates. Unfortunately many Americans, especially evangelical Christians, choose to believe him.

Those who have been inside Gaza know Israel struck first, and Hamas�s response is only a token for lack of serious armaments. On December 29, 2008, on CNN, A united Nations official in Gaza, an English woman named Karen, stated she has lived in Gaza for six years, and whose job it is to organize distribution of UN purchased food. She set a Zionist friendly reporter straight. His loaded question was, �do the Gazans know that only Hamas is to blame for their sufferings?�

Answering from her office in Gaza, Karen, the UN official, stated that her assistant, a Gazan, was killed that very day by an Israeli bomb while doing his job delivering food, and that it was Israel, not Hamas, who broke the six-month peace truce by keeping the border entrances sealed for months after the "truce" began.

She put the reporter in his place about who bombed first, noting she was in Gaza under attack several hours before Hamas retaliated with some sixty homemade rockets. She affirmed that Israel has destroyed Gaza hospitals, mosques, schools, police stations, and private homes, all based on the excuse of one lone homemade rocket the week before that hit no one, and did no damage. Our leaders know all this but the truth does not further their agenda.  The �Hamas hit us first� lie does.

Israelis often refer to Palestinians as �animals� in private conversation. Israel�s military started the slaughter by starving the Gazans in hopes the victims would blame and reject Hamas. When this did not work Israel trumped up a homemade, one rocket excuse to start bombing the Gaza City, and is still trying to blame Hamas. In summary, there are a few simple truths that Israel cannot stand, and that US politicians and the press never recognize:

1.  Hamas is the lawfully elected government of Gaza and the West Bank as well. It still has the respect of the people.  It not only has the right to lead but has the responsibility, which Hamas recognizes.

2.  Israeli and American officials lie about Hamas routinely, it�s strictly business to lie, and they are not ashamed when they are caught. A recent official Israeli statement claimed "Hamas came to power in a bloody coup." In fact, the Palestinian election was supervised and certified to be fair and free by an international team lead by a former US President, James Earle Carter.

3.  Gazans do not train their children to be suicide bombers anymore than Americans do; "Human Bombs" are the product of lost dreams and the frustrations of 40 years of occupation. Some children who grow up without hope become dangerous adults. Anyone who goes to Gaza, as I did, will learn they are not trained to hate us, nor to carry bombs. They learn to hate by being bombed.

4.  Gaza children are considered a blessing. Most families have lots of them and half the population is sixteen or under. As an example, abortion is practically unknown in Gaza; but in Israel it is a government provided utility. It is fair to say the Gazans practice a life culture; Israelis practice a death culture.

5.  Gazans co-exist side by side, race and religion, Muslim and Christian, church beside mosque. Their Children often go to the same school, Hamas and Muslim kids with Catholic, Orthodox, and a few Baptists, until Israel bombs the school with US weapons. I have seen it and talked to the parents. A massive USA/Israeli propaganda campaign has the objective of convincing Christians that Muslims hate them.

The United States Agenda:
The annihilation of the Gazans is a step in a general war plan often referred to as the Neo-Con plan of Richard Bruce (Dick) Cheney, and Paul Dundes Wolfowitz and others. The war plan is called the Project For the New American Century (PFNAC), which seeks to engulf the entire Arab world into permanent wars of mass occupation. PFNAC postulates that more wars will bail out our staggering economy.

History shows serial wars always destroy the morality and the currency of the aggressor.  Your writer described this agenda in 1994, in a magazine feature story, Attacking Islam1. Gaza is viewed as a trigger to spread World War III against Islam everywhere. The Bush Administration wants Israel to pull the trigger on the Philistines and set the Islamic world off to violent retaliation in which the USA will quickly be �forced� to be involved.

We Hold These Truths appeals to those who consider themselves moral and spiritual to speak out, making the cause of the Philistines a moral issue.  Many of us want to be involved but are frustrated about finding an effective venue. We have chosen America's churches as our target because theirs is the biggest block of voters. The Philistines are not allowed to choose their leaders; we are, and there is no excuse for or silence or assent.

Christian Zionists, not corrupted politicians, are the biggest obstacle to peace in the USA. America has an almost uncountable number of churches that meet regularly, but most do not fulfill the role that Christ gave them, to stand for decency.

Our general rule is, go after World Zionist�s base of support. We for our part have taken on well over sixty churches and national religious groups. The Roots of Christian Zionism DVD explains our program from top to bottom. 2

Don�t forget our own children and families...our total influence is required. That means your children�s' war and kill games that always seem to make the enemy to look like an Arab, should go. Tough job?�it does not get easier. Jesus Christ never said it would. If you don't know what to do, help us.3




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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 6:52am
Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

           Daoud Kuttab: Ten Myths about Gaza

 

It is known that truth is the first casualty in wars. The current war on Gaza is no different. Below is a list of 10 myths perpetuated by Israel and repeated ad nauseum by many in the media.

 

 
And you can find them right here in this thread. Thanks for the post.
 


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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 6:58am

These kind of evil people like the Israelis that should be eradicated from the face of the earth.

I see you have moved beyond slanders and lies to outright hate speech. I don't know what the laws are like in Singapore (or in whatever country the Islamicity server resides), but here in Canada you can go to jail for advocating genocide.
I think it's time the moderators took some action, unless they want Islamicity to be considered a hate site.

First I have to thank Sign*Reader for his support. I was thinking on the same line. Funny, when a whole evil nation of Israel tries hard to eradicate a whole race of people, people like Ron and Hyposonic, only have a gentle reproach. However when it comes to me letting go off my steam, by saying eradicated from the face of the earth, someone got up angrily and accuse me of hate speech. Well, at least, I am only barking, but look at the Israelis, they are continuously eradicating the poor Palestinians right at this moment. How many millions of lives had they freed from the bodies of the Palestinians? This is not only hate, but murder in broad day light. Yet, some people still accuse these defenseless people as culprits, while the one with the WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION get away with only a rap on the knuckle? Is this how justice were taught to some people?

I feel so sad, so sad indeed.

Is that how you spend your time? Looking at pictures of injured people on Yahoo and getting mad about it?

I don�t know, but I guess, the pure soul that Allah had equipped me with, are on the surface and can see, can hear, can feel the sufferings of these poor people who bravely oppose brutal occupation with all their might. Unlike some people who are fed with evil from young and their fitrah or the pure soul being suppressed deep inside - caged in - helpless to do the right thing.

Well I feel sorry for a lot of people. i wonder where you were when the "Janjaweed" were killing many muslim men and raping muslim women? Or in Somalia where tribesmen were killing innocent people. I say i'm not there because I cannot comment on something I'm personally not witnessing.

Whoever, wherever people are being brutalized, tortured, oppressed, a normal human being will feel sympathy, empathy and hatred towards the criminal who had caused all these sufferings. That is a sign of LOVE. Like what happened during 911. I cried too when I see children losing their parents, mothers losing their sons, wives looking out for their husbands, I felt their agony, their sadness, their loss. Love is universal, Love is what makes this world comfortable to live in.

Last time I checked independent reporters were barred from being in the region so I question whether there were 500 Gazans dead.

The reason why the reporters were barred is because I believe, is that the cruel evil Dajjal worshipping Zionists army can have a more freer hand in killing and maiming and torturing, poor defenseless Palestinians.

I wonder how many of them were "combatants" and how many of them non-combatants?

We are combatants when you hold 1 rifle and I hold 1 rifle. If you have a tank and I only am weilding a stick and you calling me a combatant, there must be something wrong with you �upstairs�.

I thought you were talking about zionist? Now its back to Israelis now?

Who are Israelis? Are they Jews or are they Zionists or are they both? What is the difference? Whatever the difference is, killing innocents defenseless people are an act of coward, bully, murderer. Am I wrong?

Who is my ilk? So now you suggest I get upset from looking at pictures of hurt children? I have seen my share of suffering from the many children I see at the local hospital. - Sounds like someone I knew before.

I have seen dead children, dead men, and women. I have seen amputees. I have seen people who have chronic pain until they die. I have seen cancer patients, and many patients who suffer from neurodigenerative diseases. So when I see innocent Gazans I suddenly have to feel fury and rage?

People who sees these happenings in hospitals rarely feel fury or rage. Whatever for anyway? The situation is different, cant you see or you pretend not to see?

I am not discounting any of the suffering going on in Palestine. My heart goes out to the people there, but at the same time I don't need you or anyone else to comment on what I feel.

The shills, the spies and the trolls of the Zionists in every Muslim or conspiracy sites have the same agenda. To make it appear as if cruelty, brutality, killing, murdering, plundering is normal and no one is supposed to feel any sympathy, any empathy, or any anger towards these evil doers. However, we are born with the Pure soul that will refuse these reality. Only those whose Pure soul had been suppressed by evil will enjoy and support these actions.

You need help and I hope the moderators can see how hateful your posts have become. Are my posts a pain in the bu..t? And the only way is to ask the moderators to �eradicate� me?

Who are you first of all? Pure soul? We are equipped by Allah Our Creator with the Animal soul and the Pure soul. If we are taught evil all our lives, we are only feeding our animal souls and suppressing the Pure soul. So the opposite is True. Whether we are born Muslim or non-Muslims, these natural behaviour are present in us.

If this is the impresassion of Islam I'm glad I'm not Muslim. you have not only shown me and others how hateful you have become but you proceed to be a spokeswoman for Muslims [or Islam].

I am thankful to Allah that I am not born a Zionist who are being hated all over the world.

Nah�These are my personal sentiments that I believe are not only felt by Muslims all over the world, but by normal human beings who are not controlled by the animal soul in them.

See this picture below? Let�s say that this is your child, what would your emotion be?   how about not googling pictures or searching for pictures from yahoo to convince me.

How about answering directly my simple question?

Who says i don't sympathize or empathize? I just don't behave in the same fashion as you. you are acting irrational not logical your hate speech is evident.

I hate the evil character, the evil actions, the evil doings. If the evil doer repents, I have no reason to hate. Right?

I always use the word Zionists rarely Jews. Please take note of that.

I have already uncovered your contradiction since you have indicated Israelies should be eradicated. Sometimes, I do not know who is more evil, the Jews, the Israelis or the Zionists. They seem to be the same to me.

Mujahideens of cyberspace? Wow, I honestly think you need to relax. You should stay away from the computer for a few days and recuperate from the exhaustion of hate.

Yeah, I need to relax, and stay away from the computer. Because debating with you gives me stomach flu.

 



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 7:00am

Just to be clear: I am annoyed that Nur continues to lie about the (former) Mossad motto, after I have twice given her the correct translation. The hate speech doesn't upset me personally (I've seen worse), but I think it ought to worry the moderators, whose reputation is tainted by it and who could be legally liable for it.

Oh Oh, one more person who wants me to be �eradicated�. Wonder why?

By the way you should click the link that I gave you and read the many articles that describes the motto - BY DECEPTION THOU SHOULD DO WAR.

Like -

KILLING ARAB SCIENTISTS

http://www.iraq-war.ru/article/173187 - BREAKING: 44 Iranian Scientists and Engineers were on board Kyrgyz 737 � http://www.nogw.com/download2/%5E8_44_ir_scientists_crash.pdf - PDF By: Bulov on: 26.08.2008

Also see the http://www.nogw.com/shadow.html#deadms - Dead Microbiologist Scientist section on the Fema's Shadow page

N.O.S. (Novus Ordo Seclorum)

The only terrorist group capable of controlling the editorial content of the New York Times is N.O.S. [Novus Ordo Seclorum], which draws its funding from Wall Street, its intelligence from B'nai B'rith, and its depraved Special Forces muscle from Tel Aviv. - Joe Vialls

http://joevialls.altermedia.info/myahudi/embassynuke.html - Zionists Nuke The Australian Embassy in Indonesia

http://joevialls.altermedia.info/myahudi/madrid.html - Myahudi Monsters Maul Madrid Joe Vialls, 15 March 2004 - Every one of the four trains were 'first service', i.e. each was making its first run of the day from its respective overnight depot, after being serviced and cleaned.

GENERAL ARTICLES

MOSSAD IS THE "AL QAEDA"

Check out the article in http://www.nogw.com/index.html#ilops - CLANDESTINE ISRAELI OPS on the main page, the articles in the http://www.nogw.com/cia.html#ilspies - Spies for Israel section and the http://www.nogw.com/9_11.html#il911 - Israel and 9/11 section

http://www.the7thfire.com/new_world_order/zionism/mossad/mossad_death_squads.htm - Mossad Death Squads http://www.nogw.com/download2/%5E8_mossad_death_squads.pdf - PDF     http://www.nogw.com/mossad.html - http://www.nogw.com/mossad.html

Of course I find the happenings in Gaza reprehensible. I also find the actions of Hamas reprehensible. There's plenty of blame to go around.

Don�t bother to try to be fair. You obviously are not fair, blaming a defenseless group of people against a Goliath of an occupier. Tsk �tsk�tsk�

Right now the warmongers are winning, and I find that upsetting. - Right, a side that only wields stones versus a side with the latest sophisticated WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION.



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Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention.


Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 8:08am
2nd UN school giving refuge to Gazans hit by Israeli missile. At least 40 civilians murdered and 45 injured. And there's the usual lie - 'rockets fired from school'.



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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'


Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 06 January 2009 at 8:43am

The IDF seems to have a special disgust for the UN. 

"Where it is found that international humanitarian law has been violated, those responsible must be held to account. Under international law, installations such as schools, health centres and UN facilities should be protected from attack. Well before the current fighting, the UN had given to the Israeli authorities the GPS co-ordinates of all its installations in Gaza, including Asma elementary school."

  http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/06/gaza-israel-death-un - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/06/gaza-israel-death-un




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