Speaking out about Bombay attacks
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Topic: Speaking out about Bombay attacks
Posted By: seekshidayath
Subject: Speaking out about Bombay attacks
Date Posted: 28 November 2008 at 9:36pm
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The TimesNovember 29, 2008
In the recent terrorist acts in Malegaon in Maharashtra, India, in September this year and in last year�s attacks on a cross-border train to Pakistan, Hindu extremists were found to be behind the plots. So it is obvious that terrorism is not a Muslim monopoly. Sometimes, �others� perpetrate a crime to demonise Muslims. So we should not put the blame on Muslims without clear evidence. If we demonise and penalise Muslims and fail to punish the real perpetrators, that will worsen the situation. Moreover, it cannot be denied that Muslims are also at the receiving end of terrorist attacks of recent years. The whole world has been rightly prompt to condemn these heinous killings in India. But let us think about the response of the world powers when hundreds of people are dying every week in Iraq and Afghanistan. It seems that the blood of Muslims is the cheapest on earth. Injustice breeds injustice. We need to address the root cause of injustice, and only then will we achieve a lasting peace. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Replies:
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 28 November 2008 at 9:46pm
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The severe blow which we received is the death of Hemant Karkaray, the ATS chief who was boldy handling the case of hindu terrorists. Inspite of getting threatens of death, he was fearless. We muslims had sparks of hope with him. I doubt if we cud get any justice. He died while battling that attacks. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: nothing
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 6:49am
Demonizing the muslims is actually the core idea, no less than that. It was so obvious that London bus and subway bombers were "killed" in action. As to whom and why is up to them to feed the public. As fiction authors they do the deciding. Therefore all the news about who they were is really meaningless. The 9/11 hijackers also were "killed" in action and the stories flowing in as though they were inside those planes witnessing the lot. And now just a minute ago I just read in the news that all those involved in Mumbai (Bombay) mayhem were all "killed" as well !!.
So there you go.
Now we going to hear only whatever the book content that is set by whoever do the talking - to tell us. If you are the author of the book you decide who lives and who dies and why.
They all live in the world of illusion, and it seems they like it.
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seekshidayath wrote:Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 7:05am
Seekshidayath, the problem with now mentioning atrocities against members of our faith, on the heels of India�s terrorist attacks, is that it may be viewed as a justification for what has taken place in India. We do in fact have a group of our co-religionists who believe, based upon twisted textual evidence, that murder on the scale of recent events in India is not only justified but praiseworthy. These misguided individuals will raise similar issues as you have mentioned. Over 195 people were murdered senselessly. Only condemnation is appropriate. What has happened in Iraq is a separate matter. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 1:36pm
| Probably response to Indian Terrorism in Kashmir |
Posted By: ops155
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 2:45pm
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Do you guys ever provide any evidence of it being the country that was attacked? It's either the CIA/Mossoud and now it's the Indians doing it to themselves? So many on this website claim to know all but have never once provided any proof of the claims. Although this post is just opinion so many others are copy/paste from website but you don't give us the link to the website you get the story from so we can check it out ourselves. Really instead of just pointing fingers at others can you at least provide some proof it wasn't muslims?
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Posted By: JihadX
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 4:24pm
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I just hope that our fellow muslims aren't behind this because we are already considered "terrorists"! ------------- �The knife that slaughtered the guards at Bagram and set us free is now on its way to other places,� _ The Mujahid, The Eminent, Sheikh Abu Yahya Al Libi |
Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 4:38pm
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Not all of you, just the ones that claim the deed - the Deccan Mujahedeen. ------------- John 3 16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 5:17pm
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Let me make it clear, that these boys, not yet represented "Islam". We are n't sure who they were. Whenever a single blast in a lane occurs, the first name that crops up in Indian Minds is "Pakistan". Even if those boys, were from pak, let those boys be crticised, instead of a country or religion. Sources say that they must be home grown. A docment belonging to Mauritius was also seen.
Different channels are coming up diff news. Few say its Al-Qaeda, few say its islamic terrorist group - Lashkar, and else say its an underworld. Its also said that they were asians, bred Europeans. A senior Indian naval officer has claimed that the attackers (who arrived in a ship, the M V Alpha) were linked to Somali pirates, implying that this was a revenge attack for the Indian Navy�s successful if bloody action against pirates in the Arabian Gulf that led to heavy casualties some weeks ago.Whoever has done it, its surely an act to be condemned, but to add spices, and to hate/ blame muslims, is surely wrong. There's no religion of terrorists. I guess its the result of mass-killings in India, or as ak_m_f says, must be result of recent happenings at kashmir.
And "believer" , there is no such group as "Deccan Mujahideen", Thank God that at this point there is no differences of opinion in India.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: nothing
Date Posted: 29 November 2008 at 10:09pm
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15 hours ago I definitely read that all the gunmen in the Mumbai mayhem were killed, and I posted it accordingly. But now the news has been modified that one was captured alive. And as people have been predicting all along - by default he is a Pakistani or from Pakistan. Naturally the Pakistani officials demand evidence.
But that's not all.
President Bush also said that the killers will not have the final word. That is they must be stated as "killed" like the rest. It seem someone or some people have made blunder here by making one "alive".
Such sad and tragic event has been made into a joke for political gains.
But Indian officials said the sole surviving gunman, now in custody, was from Pakistan and voiced suspicions of their neighbor.
Pakistan denied it was involved and demanded evidence. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hz0C0SXcxgP0NxzlqGA_EI57FBkQD94P20O00 - http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hz0C0SXcxgP0NxzlqGA_EI57FBkQD94P20O00President George W. Bush on Saturday pledged full U.S. support to India as it investigates the deadly terrorist attacks in Mumbai, saying the killers "will not have the final word."
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/11/29/world/main4638226.shtml - http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/11/29/world/main4638226.shtml
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Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 30 November 2008 at 2:17am
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Read this - 'nothing'
Mossad-CIA Connection To Mumbai Terror Attacks?
By Yoginder Sikand 29 November, 2008 �O ye who believe! stand out firmly for God, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear God. For God is well-acquainted with all that ye do.� (The Quran, Surah Al-Maida: 8) Numerous theories are doing the rounds about the dastardly terrorist assault on Mumbai. The dominant view, based on what is being suggested by the media, is that this is the handiwork of the dreaded Pakistan-based self-styled Islamist and terrorist outfit Lashkar-e Tayyeba, which, ever since it was ostensibly proscribed by the Government of Pakistan some years ago, has adopted the name of Jamaat ud-Dawah. This might well be the case, for the Lashkar has been responsible for numerous such terrorist attacks in recent years, particularly in Kashmir..... ......... ......... .................... ......... .. At the same time as fingers of suspicion are being pointed at the Lashkar for being behind the recent Mumbai blasts, other questions are being raised in some circles. The significant fact that Hemant Karkare, the brave ATS chief who was killed in the terrorist assault, had been investigating the role of Hindutva terrorist groups in blasts in Malegoan and elsewhere and had received threats for this has not gone un-noticed. Nor has the related fact that the assault on Mumbai happened soon after disturbing revelations began pouring in of the role of Hindutva activists in terror attacks in different parts of India. That the attack on Mumbai has led to the issue of Hindutva-inspired terrorism now being totally sidelined is also significant. And then there is a possible Israeli angle that some are raising. Thus, the widely-read Mumbai-based tabloid Mid-Day, in an article about a building where numerous militants were holed up titled �Mumbai Attack: Was Nariman House the Terror Hub?�, states: �The role that Nariman House is coming to play in this entire attack drama is puzzling. Last night, residents ordered close to 100 kilograms of meat and other food, enough to feed an army or a bunch of people for twenty days. Shortly thereafter, the ten odd militants moved in, obviously, indicating that the food and meat was ordered, keeping their visit in mind, another cop added. �One of the militants called up a television news channel and voiced his demands today, but, interestingly, when he was asked where are they all holed him, he said at the Israeli owned Nariman House and they are six of them here", one of the investigating cops said. Since morning, there has been exchange of gun fire has been going on and the militants seem well equipped to counter the cops fire. To top it, they have food and shelter. One wonders [if] they have the support of the residents, a local Ramrao Shanker said.� A Mossad/Israeli hand in the affair might seem far-fetched to some, but not so to others, who point to the role of Israeli agents in destabilizing a large number of countries as well as possibly operating within some radical Islamist movements, such as a group in Yemen styling itself �Islamic Jihad�, said to be responsible for the bombing of the American Embassy in Sanaa, and which is said to have close links with the Israeli intelligence. Some have raised the question if the Mossad or even the CIA might not be directly or otherwise instigating some disillusioned Muslim youth in India, Pakistan or elsewhere to take to terror by playing on Muslim grievances, operating through existing Islamist groups or spawning new ones for this purpose. If this charge is true�although this remains to be conclusively established�the aim might be to further radicalize Muslims so as to provide further pretext for American and Israeli assaults on Islam and Muslim countries. The fact that the CIA had for years been in very close contact with the Pakistani ISI and radical Islamist groups in Pakistan is also being raised in this connection. The possible role of such foreign agencies of being behind some terror attacks that India has witnessed in recent years to further fan anti-Muslim hatred and also to weaken India is also being speculated on in some circles. Whether all this is indeed true needs to be properly investigated. But the fact remains that it appears to be entirely in the interest of the Israeli establishment and powerful forces in America to create instability in India, fan Hindu-Muslim strife, even to the point of driving India and Pakistan to war with each other, and thereby drag India further into the deadly embrace of Zionists and American imperialists. In other words, irrespective of who is behind the deadly attacks on Mumbai, it appears to suit the political interests and agendas of multiple and equally pernicious political forces�Islamist and Hindu radicals, fired by a hate-driven Manichaean vision of the world, but also global imperialist powers that seem to be using the attacks as a means to push India even deeper into their suicidal axis. http://www.countercurrents.org/sikand291108.htm - http://www.counterc urrents.org/ sikand291108. htm Even i guess its Israel's Job, Allah swt knows the best ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 30 November 2008 at 5:16am
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Just got to know that two of the terrorists hailed from Bradford or Leeds and monitored reports of their murderous spree on sites, including the BBC. Mumbai's chief minister Vilasrao Deshmukh said two Britons were involved.An army source said last night: "British passports were found on two terrorist bodies - young men aged 25-30.Meanwhile British Prime Minister Gordon Brown has reportedly spoken with his Indian counterpart Dr. Manmohan Singh. Brown also warned that it was "too early" to reach any conclusions about British involvement.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 30 November 2008 at 7:58am
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Do you guys ever provide any evidence of it being the country that was attacked? It's either the CIA/Mossoud and now it's the Indians doing it to themselves? So many on this website claim to know all but have never once provided any proof of the claims. Although this post is just opinion so many others are copy/paste from website but you don't give us the link to the website you get the story from so we can check it out ourselves. Really instead of just pointing fingers at others can you at least provide some proof it wasn't muslims?
I promise, I love Amreeki Whizdom! Everything in our world has to come with some website reference and as if all the folks on this planet were cast, in some American mould, with absolute inability for ever thinking for themsleves or being able to put 2 and 2 of local events and currents, together.
One other thing I fail to understand why all such characters appear as OPS with some numbers? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: abosait
Date Posted: 30 November 2008 at 9:06am
By Subhash Gatade
http://www.countercurrents.org/comm-gatade150906.htm - http://www.countercurrents.org/comm-gatade150906.htm Lesson
From The By Vidya Bhushan
Rawat
http://www.countercurrents.org/comm-rawat150906.htm - http://www.countercurrents.org/comm-rawat150906.htm |
Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 30 November 2008 at 4:44pm
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"But let us think about the response of the world powers when hundreds of people are dying every week in Iraq and Afghanistan"
No offense but it seems like it�s a phenomena here that when a tragedy is mentioned, you also have to mention ------------- "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 2:44am
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Dear seekshidayath, It is really unfortunate that such things happen. India has been blaming Pakistan for what happened, but it does not support it by any proofs. But initial reports say that they belong to a previously unknown group known as "Deccan Mujahideen" which wants a separate state for Hyderabad. I heard of separatism in Telangana, but not about Hyderabad. Any information about it? |
Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 4:15am
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I would say only one thing seeks..... Afghanistan and Iraq are war zones. Casualties are expected. People in a hospital do not expect for someone to come in blasting away or a hotel. I don't care WHO did this. Its wrong and the perpetrators will be punished no matter what justification they used. They killed innocents who they had no idea if they were pro-war, anti-muslim or had anything to be guilty of. Many here know I am very ANTI-war.... Yet, if I had been visiting friends in India or on Vacation... These men would have grabbed me because of my American passport. They wouldn't have cared that I voted against Bush or his policies. That I regularly exercise my rights to criticism my countries actions or that I have Muslim friends. I saw several pictures of these men. They all look like babies to me. The one doesn't look more than 15-16 years old. These are young disaffected boys who were probably convinced by some nutcase that this is what Islam demands of them. (FALSELY) The problem with most people is there are not enough counter actions seen for these young men. Every time this happens, instead of just condemning it and getting on with it and trying to educate Muslim men and women against these things, sane and responsible Muslims complain that other tragedies are not being covered enough. I would rather see a complete, utter and total condemnation of all violence against civilians without any ifs, ands, buts or becauses..... Children died, women died, a toddler is now an orphan...there is no excuse. Not even that tragedy is happening elsewhere. 5:32: For this reason did We prescribe to the children of Israel that whoever slays a soul, unless it be for manslaughter or for mischief in the land, it is as though he slew all men; and whoever keeps it alive, it is as though he kept alive all men; and certainly Our messengers came to them with clear arguments, but even after that many of them certainly act extravagantly in the land. 2:190: And fight in the way of Allah with those who fight with you, and do not exceed the limits, surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits. There is no excuse to kill civilians in Islam. Not even a war in another nation. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 4:53am
Hey Cadnu, how are you. I had been waiting for you. I needed, atleast one Indian to discuss all its internal politics and other happenings
And what are you saying of this "Deccan Mujahideen". Its only from you that am hearing so. Is it from "Cadnu channel"
 . I heard that they cud trace its IP address from outside India. Telangana, is anyways done. Very soon, it shall be declared a separate state. Don't you know that all those political parties did consent for it. Infact they are all fighting to take its credit. I shall give its credit to KCR, anyways. Its not that serious issue that anyone needs to blast there at Mumbai, for telangana in Andhra Pradesh. All i say is, if its Pak as India suspects, why cud it not present proofs to them. They say that these boys conversed in urdu and punjabi, and phones were traced there at Karachi, etc, then why did India, not present atleast these to them.
Anyways, these terrorists were successful in creating the differences between indo-pak. We already viewed the chairs of the ministers get staggered.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 5:15am
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Hi Angela
Thankx for expressing yourselves.
NOT JUST ME, BUT ALL THE MUSLIMS, BE IT, INDIAN OR A PAKISTANI, DO CONDEMN THIS ACT. WE DON'T JUSTIFY IT BY ANY MEANS.
u said :
Many here know I am very ANTI-war.... Yet, if I had been visiting friends in India or on Vacation... These men would have grabbed me because of my American passport. They wouldn't have cared that I voted against Bush or his policies. That I regularly exercise my rights to criticism my countries actions or that I have Muslim friends.
Likewise, even we muslims have been suffering. Irrespective of you support Bush or not, etc, you were viewed as an American and were a victim. Similarly, we muslims, inspite of holding no such views of terrorism, were termed as "terrorist". We went thru that pain and are still undergoing. Go thru, yahoo discussions, you shall find that muslims are been crticised for these blasts. People are blaming "Islam' for that.
During last six months, we muslims in India, organised many public meetings , conferences, tried to convince media as well that we have nothing to do with terrorism. Islam teaches peace etc. To some extent we were able to built up our image. But all got faded. Anyways
U said :
I saw several pictures of these men. They all look like babies to me. The one doesn't look more than 15-16 years old. These are young disaffected boys who were probably convinced by some nutcase that this is what Islam demands of them. (FALSELY)
These boys were told were between , 18-25. Here are few things to be noticed. As you said that these boys were probable convinced taht Islam demands of them -- so i had to take this sentence of yours. If you consider them as muslims and as you said, they must be 15-16 years old, then those who taught them of this, must surely be knowing that boys of such ages are n't permitted for the holy war, they were to wage. Secondly, when these boys if were between, 18-25. atleast one boy whom you consider to be a muslim, would have a beard. Not a single one doyou find them wearing a beard, which a label of every muslim. Esp, when these boys, were if in the way of Islam, practicing Islam, they would have a beard.
I just want to speak out India, with solid proofs. Just because, the media, says, i shall not take it. You shall see me to be first, to criticise, these boys, if proved that they were muslims. Islam never commands to kill cihildren and woman , even when there;s necessity of war.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 5:41am
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Beards do not make terrorists. Mohammed Atta wasn't wearing a beard when he climbed on his plane. Carrying out an attack means getting to the target. If you have a long beard, kufi and fatigues, likely the police are going to stop you long before you get to the target. There have been increasingly warnings about training Western looking men to carry out attacks. Mentally ill converts from the West. I doubt if any of these warnings turn out to be facts that these men will attack in media approved terrorist garb. India has been at a crossroad since the Mugals were removed from power by the British. The loss of power and status is harmful to any community and does not always have much to do with religion. I personally see the problems in India being more about colonialism than religion. Hindus and Muslims lived side by side for several centuries. Its the partitioning of Pakistan, the loss of Bangledesh, the limbo of Kashmir and the oppression of minorities in India. Religion is often an excuse for more mundane battles. Do you really think the Christian Crusaders were motivated by religion when there was so much gold to be had in the Holy Land? I think you will find these babies were born muslim or maybe even converts from poorer castes of Hindus. They will have been jobless, marginalized and radicalized. India has more problems than I care to count and Hinduism has had an affect on more than just Hindus. My sister is currently battling with her secretary because she labeled my sister a lower caste and does not feel she should have to obey orders. A society that breeds this kind of mentality will never have equality and justice. The whole of Gujarati Muslims would be better to move North than to ever expect justice and equality. Islam does not demand these actions. However, these boys are being taught something else and they are being told its Islam. Thus, they go into these situations thinking they are doing it in the name of God, etc, and so forth. Much like an abortion clinic bomber thinks he's doing Christ's will. However, the first words posted here contained that word I hate so much went talking to people about these things. BUT....
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Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 6:05am
Am i wrong Angela, when i say, that injustice breeds to injustice. Its the reaction you see commonly.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 6:48am
Hey, i thought you would know it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deccan_Mujahideen "A group calling itself the Deccan Mujahideen has claimed responsibility for the attacks but little is known of it." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7752173.stm And of course BBC isn't mine. :)
I know about Chandra Babu Naidu. So soon India will have 29 states.
That is the problem with India. You know, we always blame Pakistan. Our only luck is that we do not blame Pakistan even for cyclones. :))
Indo-pak relations have always been strained. I would say that we have won against the terrorists even though we lost so many lives. I would also say that your topic will be misleading when you talk about Iraq or Afghanistan. |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 8:00am
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Dear seekshidayath, (Bhai yeh banda to baqaida theek thaak post kar sakta hay. Some of his strings had created a bad odour around, specially, with me) It is really unfortunate that such things happen. India has been blaming Pakistan for what happened, but it does not support it by any proofs. But initial reports say that they belong to a previously unknown group known as "Deccan Mujahideen" which wants a separate state for Hyderabad. I heard of separatism in Telangana, but not about Hyderabad. Any information about it? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 3:25pm
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Seekshidayath: Please ignore the irony, under normal circumstances I wouldn't have referred to this writer...I found this article at morning perusal of LA Times! The article has created a fire storm of criticism on its publication from the Hindu readership online.... I am still formulating my thoughts on this! Now the addition of Zionists to the mix just wait how bad the things get!.. See if the facts and figures are correct in the article... Muslims -- India's new 'untouchables'The condition of the country's Muslims has deteriorated, and the world has overlooked the nation's problems.
By Asra Q. Nomani
December 1, 2008
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oew-nom1-2008dec01,0,2169717.graffitiboard - http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oew-nom1-2008dec01,0,2169717.graffitiboard -
The
news of the attacks in Mumbai eerily took me back to a quiet morning
two years ago when I sat in Room 721 of the Taj Mahal Palace &
Tower hotel, reading the morning newspaper, fearing just the kind of
violence that has now exploded in the city of my birth. The headlines
recounted how the socioeconomic condition of the people of my ancestry,
Muslims in India, had fallen below that of the Hindu caste
traditionally called "untouchables," according to a government report. "Muslims are India's new untouchables," I said sadly to my mother, in the room with me. "India is going to explode if it doesn't take care of them." Now, indeed, alas it has. And shattered in the process is the myth of India's thriving secular democracy.
Mumbai police said over the weekend that the only gunman they'd
captured during the attacks -- which left nearly 200 dead and more than
300 wounded -- claimed to belong to a Pakistani militant group. But
even if the trouble was imported, the violence will most certainly turn
a spotlight of suspicion on Muslims in India. Already, my relatives are
hunkered down for a sectarian backlash they expect from anti-terrorism
agencies, police and angry Hindu fundamentalists.
Indeed, the government report I read about in the newspapers two years
ago acknowledged that Muslims in India had become "backward." "Fearing
for their security," the report said, "Muslims are increasingly
resorting to living in ghettos around the country." Branding of Muslims
as anti-national, terrorists and agents of Pakistan "has a depressing
effect on their psyche," the report said, noting Muslims live in "a
sense of despair and suspicion."India, long championed as a model of pluralism, used to be an example of how Muslims can coexist and thrive even as a minority population. My extended family prospered as part of an educated, middle class. My parents, who settled in the United States in the 1960s when my father pursued a doctorate at Rutgers University, were part of India's successful diaspora. I love India, and on that trip, I wanted to show it off to my son, Shibli, then age 4. But on that visit, across India from Mumbai to the southern state of Tamil Nadu and north to Lucknow, the hub of Muslim culture, I was deeply saddened. Talking to vegetable vendors, artisans and businessmen, I heard about how the condition of Muslims had deteriorated. They had become largely disenfranchised, poor, jobless and uneducated. Their tales echoed those I'd heard on previous trips, when my extended family recounted their humiliating experiences with bureaucratic, housing, job and educational discrimination. According to the report, produced by a committee led by a former Indian chief justice, Rajender Sachar, Muslims were now worse off than the Dalit caste, or those called untouchables. Some 52% of Muslim men were unemployed, compared with 47% of Dalit men. Among Muslim women, 91% were unemployed, compared with 77% of Dalit women. Almost half of Muslims over the age of 46 couldn't read or write. While making up 11% of the population, Muslims accounted for 40% of India's prison population. Meanwhile, they held less than 5% of government jobs. The Sachar committee report recommended creating a commission to remedy the systemic discrimination and promote affirmative-action programs. So far, very few of the recommendations have been put in place. Since reading the report, I have feared that Islamic militancy would be born out of such despair. Even if last week's terrorist plot was hatched outside India, a cycle of sectarian violence could break out in the country and push some disenfranchised Muslim youth to join militant groups using hot-button issues like Israel and Kashmir as inspiration. What has irked me these last years is how the world has glossed over India's problems. In 2006, for instance, former U.S. Defense Secretary William Cohen, whose Cohen Group invests heavily in India, said the U.S. and India were "perfect partners" because of their "multiethnic and secular democracies." When I asked to interview Cohen about the socioeconomic condition of Muslims, his public relations staffer said that conversation was too "in the weeds." But, to me, the condition of Muslims needs frank and open discussion if there is to be any hope of stemming Islamic radicalism and realizing true secular democracy in the country. India's 150 million Muslims represent the second-largest Muslim population in the world, smaller only than Indonesia's 190 million Muslims. That is just bigger than Pakistan's 140 million Muslims or the entire population of Arab Muslims, which numbers about 140 million. U.S. intelligence reports continually warn that economic, social and political discontent are catalysts for radicalism, so we would be naive to continue to ignore this potential threat to the national security of not just India but the United States. Throughout my 2006 journey, I found the idea of India's potential for danger unavoidable. On one leg, my son tucked safely in bed with my mother in our Taj hotel room, I went out to watch the filming of "A Mighty Heart," the movie about the murder of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl by Muslim militants in Pakistan. When the location scouts needed to replicate the treacherous streets of Karachi's militant Islamist culture, they didn't have to go far. They found the perfect spot in a poor Muslim neighborhood of Mumbai. ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 8:18pm
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Sign*Reader, can't you see that the article (opinion) itself is ambiguous? The article has been written just for the sake of writing it or just to show that some Asra exists. This is the problem with the Indians. Though it is theoretically secular (and i would say it is almost practically secular too), people always think of their own community. Why can't they If Asra Q. Nomani really feels for them, why can't she just do something for them rather than just writing such articles? Everyone says something must be done, but none does. |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 8:25pm
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Muslims refuse to bury militants http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7758651.stm |
Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:27pm
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Just a few random musings. . .
BBC etc were mentioning the Deccan Mujahideen. . . whoever they are. Donno how far that is true though.
They showed on BBC - that this dude who lived nextdoor to the hotel heard the 'millitants' talking in the hotel. . . and according to the dude, they had a 'North Indian' accent - and accord to him: 'we all know that north india has a link to pakistan, so they were definitely involved'
 Btw, its not in the news, but Karachi is really in strife right now....institutions closed etc because of arson attacks and all. The word on the street is that its India doing all this! Ppl killed and all.
I dont know any Indians...and what they are contemplating. But its nice to see Cadnu and Seeks think otherwise :) . I just hope there are nonmuslim indians who think the same way.
Maybe if instead of blowing each other's ppl up - we just blew up the govts on both sides ?. . . . . . . just a thought!
 ------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:30pm
I do agree, that India won against these terrorists. I salute our commandos. What do you say of Major Unni Krishnan father, not allowing CM to enter his house and made him stand at his gate for two hours ? What do you say of Mrs. Hemant Karkaray, not accepting the compensation from Modi of about 1 Crore ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:35pm
Insaan bahoth pechida hota hai, Usay samajhna, bahot hi mushkil hai. Humans are complicated machines. Anyways, you do have more experience , i guess ki aapko insaan ki pehachaan hai.
And sis Chrysallis, you are right. Blowing up both govts is the solution. But again its called a blast. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:41pm
I'm so glad you brought that up Seeks! This is something that I have not been able to come to terms with to this day! I dont think its something Non-Muslims can understand as well as we can. . .
Giving up ones life in Jihad - is a very spiritual thing. Something a concious muslim does . . . How can a person drink, visit a strip joint, and the next day blow himself up for Allah??? Nonmuslims perhaps dont realise that only the worsest/ignorant of muslims (excuse my stereotyping) drink and visit strip joints - not the kind of people you would expect to sacrifice life for 'islam' (disclaimer: not that blowing up a civilian plane falls under Islam's concept ofvJihad in any manner)
Any concious, 'good' muslim - with even a little bit of islamic understanding/awareness would NOT spend the last night of his life doing the things the media claimed they did. OR Blow themselves up, knowing FULL WELL they could be killing fellow muslims AND innocent people!!!!!! It just not fit together in the puzzle. Even the WORSEST of Muslims, were to find out they were dying the next day . . .would spend thier last night asking forgiveness from Allah. AND think twice about the lives they were going to take. The best of muslims that I know are the MOST nonviolent people I have EVER met. . .soft spoken, soft hearted and gentle. Its something that is very hard to explain to a nonmuslim who has not come across a practising muslim. And I dont blame the nonmuslims for swallowing up what thier media tells them. If I were in thier place, I would probably do the same.
It just doesnt make any sense whatsoever. ------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:52pm
I think it is too early to talk about burial while the blame game is on still! some neutral forensic experts need to analyze the DNA of these attackers, their weapons and everything else for the origins! ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 10:58pm
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Cadnu, leave the opinions of Asra Nomami apart, but when we look into the report of Sachar committee, do you deny it ? Every word of the below paragraph, extracted from the article, posted by Sign Reader, is correct
Indeed, the government report I read about in the newspapers two years ago acknowledged that Muslims in India had become "backward." "Fearing for their security," the report said, "Muslims are increasingly resorting to living in ghettos around the country." Branding of Muslims as anti-national, terrorists and agents of Pakistan "has a depressing effect on their psyche," the report said, noting Muslims live in "a sense of despair and suspicion."
According to the report, produced by a committee led by a former Indian chief justice, Rajender Sachar, Muslims were now worse off than the Dalit caste, or those called untouchables. Some 52% of Muslim men were unemployed, compared with 47% of Dalit men. Among Muslim women, 91% were unemployed, compared with 77% of Dalit women. Almost half of Muslims over the age of 46 couldn't read or write. While making up 11% of the population, Muslims accounted for 40% of India's prison population. Meanwhile, they held less than 5% of government jobs" This is the condition of muslims in India. We cannot negate it. I don't say that whole of Indian muslims are regarded as untouchables. No, not at all. Even today we live side by side. Amongst my group of friends, i do have hindus as well. But what do you say about muslims in Gujrat and Maharastra ? Are they not regarded as untouchables ? They are treated so, cadnu. Either, you must not have viewed this, or you are trying to hide away this fact.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 01 December 2008 at 11:02pm
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Cadnu, leave the opinions of Asra Nomami apart, but when we look into the report of Sachar committee, do you deny it ?
Bhai, why would he ever do that if that suites his agenda? We do happen to know the man and his kartabs. Don't we all? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 12:28am
Simple answer is, Major Unnikrishnan's father and Mrs. Karkaray did the right thing. Time has changed, if they want power, they should be ready for responsibility. |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 1:06am
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Dear seekshidayath, have you ever read the Sachar Report? It is about the financial and social status of Muslims and it in no way concerns about their psyche. And why do you want to compare Muslims and Dalits? And untouchability is a thing of the past. Untouchability is a political term and not a social term anymore. What is your meaning of 'untouchables'?
It is a totally overrated statement. No one brands Muslims as anti-national etc.
The head of Mumbai Police is Hasan Gafoor. The world's most populous city has a Muslim as its Police Commissioner and you call Muslims are regarded as untouchables. I have nothing to hide friend. If you think people aren't treated well in India, then do something for your fellows irrespective of their religion, caste, creed etc. Isn't that a better thing to do than to listen to people from neighbouring countries and considering yourself an "untouchable". Our friend from Pakistan does not live in Pakistan. Atleast we live in our country brother. |
Posted By: Angela
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 5:21am
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I read today that the Mumbai Muslim cemeteries are refusing the bodies of the killed attackers. Is it possible to nullify someone's Islam posthumously? |
Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 11:08am
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And I dont blame the nonmuslims for swallowing up what thier media tells them. If I were in thier place, I would probably do the same.
I think the idea of "good Muslim" similarly to "good person" is qualitatively subjective. There are so many definitions as to what it is to be "good" although there are core beliefs that its quite difficult to tell who is a good Muslim or a good person or a good anything. Perhaps Muslims need to redefine what it is to be a good 'practicising Muslim?' Just a suggestion.
Even the WORSEST of Muslims, were to find out they were dying the next day . . .would spend thier last night asking forgiveness from Allah. AND think twice about the lives they were going to take.
I didn't understand the above statement and also, not to be a grammar Nazi but the word 'Worsest' is not a word. Sorry but I had to look it up because grammatically it didn't make sense but also, if someone is so evil or has evil intent why would they seek forgiveness and perhaps rethink what they are doing? Wouldn't the act [of seeking god's forgiveness and rethinking their evil intent] nullify the idea of these individuals being the 'worsest' Muslims? Perhaps I'm commenting confusingly but I'm curious. ------------- "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" |
Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 12:28pm
Attempting to understand why the night prior was spent drinking is incredibly insignificant when compared to the crime of the next day. How to make sense out of nonsense? Muslims really need to come to grips with the reality of evil, however well intentioned, that exists in our community. While the world was riveted to the Monica Lewinsky/Clinton affair the trial for those Muslims accused in the 'Twin Embassy Bombings' was underway in a New York courtroom. I followed the transcripts of the trial from beginning, to conviction, all the way through the penalty phase - many days crying at my computer, while one after another, family members and employees of the embassies recounted the bombing and how their lives were impacted as a result. Muslims have done evil. Muslims are killing innocent people, both Muslim and non-Muslim alike. This is simply 'call a spade a spade' stuff folks.
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Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 5:46pm
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Assalamu Alaikum
Was watchng the press conference and a channel, which i trust for been unbiased. There were hot discussions at home as well. So i feel, i shud n't go for any conclusions. My heart strongly says, its not muslims but all the proofs go against it. Islam teaches us to stay quiet at times of fitnah, when we are unable to understand and decide over a situation. . My heart goes down. May Allah swt soon, ease these tensions and let peace prevail.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 6:21pm
The head of Mumbai Police is Hasan Gafoor. The world's most populous city has a Muslim as its Police Commissioner and you call Muslims are regarded as untouchables. You have never gone thru the cities of Maharastra or Gujrat. Or are trying to appear India, innocent. The state of muslims at Gujrat has worsened, The remaining few muslims, who cud save there lives from those mass killings, are today unable to do there businesses, provide good education or go for jobs. Reason - there's no entry for them. How can we prosper when we are n't facilitated with infra-structure ?Likewise there are separate colonies of hindus at Maharastra, wherein muslims are n;t allowed to enter. You very well know of these hindu extremists associated with VHP, RSS, Bajrang dal.
I have nothing to hide friend. If you think people aren't treated well in India, then do something for your fellows irrespective of their religion, caste, creed etc. Yes, alhamdullilah, after these reports of SACHAR committee, we got awakened . Even i indiviually try my best to make minorities aware of different plans set up by the govts, try to encourage them for getting educated and employed. Also i try my best by getting associated with an organisation, which works to free up innocents as well. I wish every Indian no only holds up views like you to do something, but also ACT over it.
Isn't that a better thing to do than to listen to people from neighbouring countries and considering yourself an "untouchable".
Do you think, IC is the only source for me to view the truth ? I do not make friends, seeing the country to which they belong or the religion they belong. Its not new that i consider as "untouchable". Most of my muslim brothers experience it. Its a fact that we are ignored and hated at few cities of India.
end from Pakistan does not live in Pakistan. Atleast we live in our country brother. What do you say of all those Indians settled in various countries of the world ? Why did they leave ?
[/QUOTE] ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 8:03pm
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Dear seekshidayath, whatever you say are your own opinions just like the BJP has its own agenda. Is there any other Indian who agrees with seekshidayath? |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 9:43pm
It is so nice of you for letting brother seeksh'h have an opinion.... your likening of the esteemed brother's opinion to BJP is out of line ... How can you ask another Indian only opinion ? this an open forum originating from California so please keep that in mind! Have a seperate thread in the appropriate regional section if you want segregation! Last but not least I have a question ....do you believe in Akhund Bharat? ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 10:02pm
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Last but not least I have a question ....do you believe in Akhund Bharat?
Paa jee, not just that, he is one of those who are led to believe that India was one monlithic state in the past! We all know from history and also from Tuzkiate (Diaries) of mi familia that MahaBharata was over 500 states, which were always at each other's throat.
Not just that, one of my ex-novia's (Girlfriend's) family had a never ending family tradition of a younger brother doing in (didn't wish to use the word, kill) the older brother just for sitting on the throne.
In the end, her very own grandfather was made a ward of court by Lord Aitchison to protect him from his younger brothers. They could not or didn't wish to kill him, but made him lose the kingdom in a game of cards in a drunken state. I have seen the rooms in batala where he was forced to move after lossing his right on the palace and his other possessions.
Anyway, enugh of that. You should have seen the threads he started. "Should a Country Have a State Religion?"
We all know hitting where!
I asked him 23 times: WHY SHOULD A COUNTRY NOT HAVE A STATE RELIGION IF THE PUBLIC WISH IT TO BE SO?
He swore at me and ran away. He can't believe that anyone can ever be anything but absolutely ETHNIC. Tried telling him that some people are above and beyond the national bind.
Nope! me no understand type of an at once hardcore fun da mentalista Heen Do as one of my grandson would pronounce it. If you ever come to disagree with his, he would start to call your style of prose or the way you write into question.
Reminds me of good old Krisna Mennon as described by my father who shared a house with him and that most beautiful Shamsher Singh Bahadur in West Hampstead as a student.
Shamsher Singh Bahadur was a barrister at Law in the 20s London. He took a whole shipload of Khalsas, from Canada, complete with their well know 5 Ks including of course all the kirpaans they could lay their hands on. He was arrested and deported back to London. I met him in his last days. What a character even in his 80s! ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 10:25pm
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Bhai Seekshidayat are you ok?
Though I have my reservations about this character who is only now calling Indians as if the rest of the world is nada more than some bunch of *****.
Brother let me know if and when you need a Pathaan hitman to bleed this chap out of the place like before. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 10:32pm
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Dear seekshidayath, whatever you say are your own opinions just like the BJP has its own agenda Oye! as they would say in Spanish, not using the Indian oye.Do you always start calling people names and hurl abuse at them if they fail to agree with your absolutely limited and distorted view of India?
We have noticed it before and we will NOT tolerate it from some irritant like you. Just learn to behave here instead of starting to address just the Indians. IT IS A GLOBAL FORUM. Understand or do you want us to make you understand just a wee more properly? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 02 December 2008 at 11:20pm
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seekshidayath
Yaar fikar na karna! Chund Pathan tumhari jeb mei'n hai'n. Koi chor da puttar samnay aya to maza chkha den ge!
(worry nowt my friend. You hold the Pathans in your pocket. If you face any blighter we will make him see the daylight! ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: nadeem1423
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 2:50am
| i know bombai attack was very horrible but it was the planned attack . |
Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 3:19am
I wasnt paying much attention to my grammar I guess. Yup, Worsest is not a word. . .though I was going for WorsTest... which again is not a word.
Like I said in my post, it would be difficult for many nonmuslims to get that. . . if a person is a muslim, and an evil one at that. . . and if they knew full well they were going to die within a short span of time, they would have a very different outlook on life and last minute actions. Since accountability and death and answering to Allah are concepts deeply inscribed in muslim belief, that even a very ignorant muslim is aware of. . . . Just an e.g that popped into my mind, even the evilest of muslim criminals in jail, on death row, ask for the Quran or be allowed to pray before death. Last minute efforts you could say. Its just something deeply rooted. Im sure its the same for other believers of faith, if they knw they're life is going to end. . .they invoke thier God/gods. I hope u get what I mean.
------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 7:38am
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Mumbai Terror Attacks Watch Indian television and Would you blame her at all after how Salman Taseer treated her 20 years ago? Pakistani television channels, initially sympathetic, soon turned reactionary and hostile. Some of the more hawkish anchors are telecasting scenes from the The fact that the Indian government is accusing In each of the incidents, namely, the Chattisinghpura massacre, the attack on the Indian Parliament on In the Chattisinghpura incident, for example, on The Samjhota Express incident is more disconcerting, and one that Pakistanis remember bitterly. On 18 February 2007, two bombs went off near the Indian city of Panipat on the Samjhota Express twice-weekly train between Lahore and Delhi, initiated as its name suggests (Samjhota means Agreement in both Hindi and Urdu) to enhance cordial relations between the two countries. The terrorist attack, which killed 68 (mostly Pakistanis) and injured many others was blamed once again on Lashkare Taiba. Indian authorities claimed that the alleged perpetrator was named Rana Shaukat Ali and a photograph of the terrorist was provided. Four months later, investigations revealed that neither Rana nor Lashkare Taiba but a serving lieutenant colonel of the Indian army, Lt. Col. Purohit was responsible for the attack. Purohit, it was found, had links with Hindu militant groups and provided training to extremists. Honestly, this is really worth reading > > > For If this is a coincidence, it is definitely a godsend for the extremist Hindu groups and the right-wing BJP, waiting to unseat the Congress government in the upcoming elections. But many in It is alleged that the perpetrators of the 26/11 violence entered Mumbai by sea and arrived by trawlers from In August 1999, a Pakistani surveillance aircraft was shot down by the Indian Air Force in the But somehow the trawler dodged all patrols and made it all the way to Mumbai. Regular procedure for boats and ships docking at Mumbai entails thorough checks, but it appears that the terrorist trawler was able to evade that as well. Too many questions remain. Too few answers are being given. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Hyposonic
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 9:19am
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"the evilest of muslim"
Very cute. Yes I got it.  ------------- "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 11:14am
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�We need to carpet bomb She was right on with that comment. Pakistan's Afghan border needs to be thoroughly sterilized of islamofacists.
Update: Wait.....if she is referring to India carpet bombing Pakistan, that is foolish. Pakistan themelves should clean out their own islamofacists. America has watched Pakistan play both sides of the terrorist struggle and it is a dirty game that they are playing; publicly supporting the fight against terrorism but inwardly providing aid and comfort to the terrorists themselves. America has already found themselves getting fired on by the Pakistan military when trying to deal with the Taliban who flee over the border from Afghanistan into an apparent "save zone" in Pakistan. This is not supporting the fight against terrorism but aiding and abetting terrorists! This is why Osama Bin Laden is still alive. Pakistan is isolating themselves further and further from the rest of the world by their inaction and finger pointing.
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Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:02pm
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The Times of India had this interesting story: "Even before Maharashtra police visited Leopold Cafe, the popular watering hole where the terror attacks started, a secret Australian service police agency was there. Owner of the Colaba cafe Farhang Jehani confirmed that a police agency from The six-member team from Down Under including a woman visited the restaurant around "They stayed in Nariman house on a rental basis, identifying themselves as Malaysian students," said the source, adding that police were investigating how Chabad House rooms were rented to non-Jews. The Jerusalem Post could not confirm the report." - Url.: http://tinyurl.com/636l9q - |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:06pm
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Update: Wait.....if she is referring to India carpet bombing Pakistan, that is foolish. Pakistan themelves should clean out their own islamofacists. America has watched Pakistan play both sides of the terrorist struggle and it is a dirty game that they are playing; publicly supporting the fight against terrorism but inwardly providing aid and comfort to the terrorists themselves. America has already found themselves getting fired on by the Pakistan military when trying to deal with the Taliban who flee over the border from Afghanistan into an apparent "save zone" in Pakistan. This is not supporting the fight against terrorism but aiding and abetting terrorists! This is why Osama Bin Laden is still alive. Pakistan is isolating themselves further and further from the rest of the world by their inaction and finger pointing.
Some interesting long article just in one breath!
Have you ever been to that part of the world? in your entire life or you justt plan to win some Oscar or even a Nobel Prize just with your key-board?
This area had nada problems in its history till your neighbours started ti finger it. The day they leave, it will be as peaceful as the place ha been for 3000 years.
Every single of Pakistani problem is created by Washington and via the idiots running the country merely on Scripts received from the Langley head quarters of CIA.
------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:37pm
This is just pure st**idity. Blame the CIA, blame anyone but the islamofacists terrorists that you see on the video. They are actually white Americans in makeup.
Give me a break. America is good but no one is that good.
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Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:43pm
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TruthRealm: I found Justin's column just in time for you it should spark enlightenment in you...I hope
------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:47pm
Do you feel a need to post in large fonts in order to be heard? Perhaps you are the one hoping to be noticed for an oscar or nobel prize.
This is just more ingnorance. Washington had nothing to do with Pakistan fighting with India in their effort to take Kashmir. The first time they started trouble, part of east Pakistan just seceeded and became Bangladesh.
All of Pakistans problems have been from the muslims taking control of the country by force.
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Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 12:49pm
| Who is Justin? Please provide a link to that article's source. |
Posted By: nothing
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 1:21pm
ASIO is fully independent body inside Australia and they only take orders from CIA. Same as the Brittish M16. While CIA itself is zionist nest, fully independent and does not take orders from the US government. They instruct the US government instead - by providing them with set of informations that forced the government to take action exactly according to the written text provided.
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Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 1:22pm
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Never mind, I searched some of that article and found it was taken from an pacifist website called http://www.antiwar.com/justin/ - http://www.antiwar.com/justin/ .
This is some ignorant left wing loonie who is offering an opinion that fits with their agenda but contains little to no actual facts. He states in that puffy article that the "most telling detail is no doubt the fact that the Indian police simply ran for cover." Those are his words. The actual reporting states simply that they would not fire back. Perhaps they saw HOSTAGES in the mix, you know, INNOCENT people who were staying at the hotel. Does Justin think that might be possible? When the special forces got there, they didn't just bomb the place and kill everyone in sight either but did a careful surgical extraction while taking out the islamofacists one by one.
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Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 1:27pm
Total malarky. You area showing your true anti-semitic colors.
The CIA does not run the US Government. And there is no "zionist" control either. It's these kind of coments that just show you to be in bed with Islamofascism, which is the butthole of humanity. True Islam should shun these fascists just like Christianity had to shun the KKK. It's simple logic, really.
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Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 2:21pm
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ABSOLUTELY brother ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 5:46pm
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Brother { Sasha and SignReader}, i respect your emotions for me, but what i feel is cadnu, asked that questions for Indians, as he felt, i was wrong, and other Indians would so disagree with me. Cadnu, you can invite any of our Indians and ask them if
1. Maharastra has got separate colonies, wherein muslims are not even allowed to enter ?
2. In Gujrat, you shall see, hindus, reject the transactions with muslims. Neither are they allowed to get educated in there institutions, nor are they given employment.
I did watch this, over Ndtv, a documentary as "Muslims after Gujrat riots". We got to listen directly from those victims, there sufferings after riots as well.
If am wrong, am ready to leave IC, which is now one of the favorite place to visit, out of my daily schedule. We have very few Indian members. I know just 3-4 members who know INDIA well. A new member, Abosait {hope he;s reading, and i wish him to react}, Waheeda a sister from Gujrat, but she's inactive. I wished her to relate her experience over boards, but she did not, It was very touching. Brother AbuZaid, is on his journey to hajj. A new member Dai-al-Islam, limited himself to introduction---. You can invite any of these, or any new member to react to my words .
Brother Sasha, we cannot force cadnu to agree with us. But you know, i feel he is the voice of those Indians, who watch India, only thru newschannels, they were never experienced or felt the pain of the victims.
Just yesterday it happened and cadnu, you must have also watched this too, This news was over national channels, just for few minutes. It happened that Hyderabad police, had gone to arrest a suspect of SIMI {an extremist organisation of muslims. I equally hate it, as they mislead youngsters}. There, two of the other youngters, shot the police and wounded him and all the four fled away. I do condemn this. But within 2 hours, BJP and Bajrang dal activists, started there protests. To some extent i shall agree with them. BUT WHY DID THEY BURN THE FLAGS OF ISI AND PAKISTAN ?" Till yesterday i did not know that ISI had a flag . And what did Pak had to do with this incident ? Why so much of hatred is raged in these hindu extremists ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 6:34pm
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Brother {Sasha and signreader}, your posts bought back my smiles.
. The six-member team from Down Under including a woman visited the restaurant around 4pm before heading out to the Taj..Two Australian nationals were among those killed in the attacks: Douglas Markelo and Brett Taylor."
And Indian police during press conf, denied any woman amongst these terrorists. They said the investigation is on. I did not know of these Australians as well. Am very happy to know this.
Calls were made to Australia as well---- thats a very good news.
How Chabad House rooms were rented to non-Jews ?
How cud the ship escape from thorough checkings at dock ? hmm many questions arise ?
Thannx a lot brother for sharing. This evening is going to be mine, insha Allah. I shall surely discuss it with all those who feel am wrong. JazakAllahu khayr  Article of AyeshaAijaz Khan, rightly, exposed these channels. Media, plays a very important role in a society. It does bring a revolution. These channels - starnews and Aajtak, i feel are for semi-educated and uneducated ones. They enlarge the happenings. The best one i feel are Timesnow and CNN-IBN, One of them owned by Rajdeep Sardesai, who brings out the true picture. It was rightly said that Ndtv was less jingoistic. I don't understand, why was this bollywood actor invited at all ? She had no weightage in her discussions, except that she expressed her hatred.
Truthrealm - What did these so called -islamifacist, spoil yours or your country's that you hold so much of hatred for them ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 7:37pm
Seekshidayath, there is no hatred for these fascists, or anyone else. Rather, I pity these hateful fools, who are destroying the fabric of societies with their own hate filled tactics.
Spoil mine? My personal space does not have to be spoiled in order for me to speak out against these islamocist terrorists, who are taking lives of many innocents and destroying lives of many others. They have not "spoiled" me because they have not yet gotten the opportunity to.
How can you defend such evil? That is the real question here.
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Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 7:40pm
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Brother seekshidayath, i need not invite anyone to this forum. I just wanted Indians in this forum to comment. And i know they will disagree with your opinion. This is internet and we find all sorts of things out here. So just copying and pasting them in this forum is useless. Very few Hindus identify with BJP just like very few Muslims identify with the terrorists. It is only about what opinion we have about humanity in general. I still don't understand why you sympathize with Pakistan. I have nothing against Pakistan and i have nothing towards it. I am indifferent to it. It has its own history, Mohajirs, Banglas, Shias, Balochs, blashphemy laws etc. And the whole world knows about the present anarchism in Pakistan. Forget about ISI and our opposition to it. Pakistan has Dawood, Masood Azhar. Everyone knows about it. Whisper and Sign*Reader are too far away to understand our situation. They are only close to us as much as we are close to the internet. And they believe what they want to believe. Their sympathy will not relieve our problems. I have never denied persecution of Muslims in India. Even Christians are persecuted here. And taking "revenge" in the name of this persecution is the most foolish thing to do. And that is not at all the present topic. And the present topic has nothing to do with Gujarat and Maharashtra. You say Muslims are treated as untouchables, but the world's most populous city has a Muslim as its Police Commissioner, Zaheer Khan, Wasim Jaffer are Maharashtrians, Azim Premji, Irfan Pathan, Munaf Patel, Yousaf Pathan are Gujaratis. There should be some meaning to what you say. And yesterday there was a shootout in your own city. These people have no sanity. They will get you even if you sympathize with them. P.S. Whatever i say, you are bound to deny it dear seekshidayath. But there are 150 million others who agree with me. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:18pm
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:20pm
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Visit us, Lashkar front organisation tells media
Nirupama Subramanian It says it is only running educational institutions LeT founder said it would be �unfortunate� if India attacked ISLAMABAD: Jamaat-ud-dawah, the front organisation of the Lashkar-e-Taiba, the group that Indian investigators are linking to the Mumbai attacks, is opening its Muridke headquarters to journalists on Thursday. With Pakistani media reporting in the last few days that India may be planning a strike at the LeT�s headquarters in Muridke near Lahore, the JuD has come out saying that it is only running educational institutions at the complex. A spokesman for the organisation, which claims it is purely an Islamic charity involved in good work across Pakistan, said in a text message to international journalists on Wednesday that they would be given a �tour� of the Markaz-e-Taiba (the group�s headquarters) at 11 a.m. on December 4. This is to be followed by a press conference. The message did not specify who would address the press conference. It asked the journalists to bring along �other friends and colleagues� in the media. On Tuesday, Hafiz Saeed, the LeT founder and the leader of the JuD, told Geo Television in an interview that it would be �unfortunate� if India attacked his headquarters because the complex housed only educational institutions. He denied there were any training facilities for jihadis at the complex, and asked India to focus on the involvement of its own citizens in the attack. JuD leader Saeed is in the list of 20 people against whom India wants Pakistan to take action. The list also includes the names of Mumbai underworld don Dawood Ibrahim and Jaish-e-Mohammed leader Maulana Masood Azhar. The U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman, Admiral Mike Mullen, was in Islamabad on Wednesday to push the Pakistan government to cooperate with India in getting to the bottom of the Mumbai attacks. U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is arriving here on Thursday from India. Significantly, the topmost U.S. military official flagged the need for the Pakistan government and security forces to go after militant groups not just in the border areas but in all parts of Pakistan. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:28pm
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:29pm
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Do you feel a need to post in large fonts in order to be heard? Perhaps you are the one hoping to be noticed for an oscar or nobel prize. Is there any restriction on usage of fonts here? Who are you? Criticising anyone and for whatever? Some CIA or Psy-ops creep? This is just more ingnorance. When were you in that area, last, if ever? What is your so called knowledge based on? How come you just jump in our midst yesterday and start blowing the set US intell lines? All of Says who? The Fox Noose? Or your controller at Just behave yourself next time you see my fonts or something else just a wee larger. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:37pm
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Seekshidayath, there is no hatred for these fascists, or anyone else. Rather, I pity these hateful fools, who are destroying the fabric of societies with their own hate filled tactics. Spoil mine? My personal space does not have to be spoiled in order for me to speak out against these islamocist terrorists, who are taking lives of many innocents and destroying lives of many others. They have not "spoiled" me because they have not yet gotten the opportunity to. How can you defend such evil? That is the real question here. Yaar, Seekshidayath Bhai, don�t mind this creep. It�s a bit too obvious that he has been moved here, yesterday, by his We don�t even have to decipher his posts. Just watch but please PM other established members to watch out for a troll in this string. Next time the fonts will be even bigger. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 03 December 2008 at 10:53pm
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Brother seekshidayath, i need not invite anyone to this forum. I just wanted Indians in this forum to comment.
Then why not leave us at peace and just be in some Heendu Forum, you will get all the agreements you ever need! ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 12:13am
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Cadnu, this shall prove you conditions of muslims in Gujrat.
This is from - "THE MARGINALIZED STATUS OF MUSLIMS IN GUJARAT:CONTINUING DEPRIVATIONS OF ECONOMIC, SOCIAL AND CULTURAL RIGHTS, SIX YEARS AFTER THE COMMUNAL VIOLENCE OF 2002"
The Muslim community in the State of Gujarat continues to suffer serious
deprivations of economic, social and cultural (ESC) rights as a result of the
ongoing legacy of the 2002 state-sponsored communal pogroms. Muslim persons, women in particular, are denied access to important rights enshrined under this Covenant, specifically the rights to work, an adequate standard of living, education, health, cultural life, and non-discrimination Muslims in Gujarat continue to endure the lasting results of the pogroms in the form of ghettoized living conditions, often in �relief colonies� that lack access to clean water and sanitation, causing severe health problems.They also suffer from unemployment, severely restricted access to schools, and social/cultural ostracism . RIGHT TO EDUCATION (ARTICLE 13)
Muslim children living in the State of Gujarat are forced to attend different schools from Hindu children.The ghettoization of Muslim children invariably deepens mistrust between Hindus and Muslims, in direct contravention to the Article 13(1) mandate that education shall �promote understanding, tolerance and friendship among all � ethnic or religious groups.�In some cases, fear of residual social instability in Gujarat has caused Muslim parents to keep children away from schools entirely.Muslim families displaced by the attacks have not been able to return to their homes and live in resettlement colonies without access to basic education.Many children in these colonies do not attend school, severely limiting the economic opportunities for many members of the next generation of the Muslim community.Muslims in Gujarat, especially the tens of thousands still living in �relief colonies,� are seriously deprived of their right to work and pursue a livelihood. Enormous economic losses, amounting to an estimated Rs. 3,800 crore, or US $760 million, were inflicted upon the Muslim community from the attacks through the large-scale destruction of homes, businesses and properties.These losses continue to economically cripple the Muslim community six years later The communal violence in Gujarat has resulted in the increased ghettoization and marginalization of the Muslim community of Gujarat. Muslims in relief colonies and across the
State have been denied almost all of the components essential to adequate housing.Many are afraid or unable to return to their previous residences in Hindu-dominated communities,yet have few choices of adequate alternative places to live. Many displaced persons who had wished to return to their former homes were in fact forced to live in separate settlements upon their return.Displaced women, many of whom were victims of sexual and physical violence in 2002, remain vulnerable to continuing violence due to their lack of adequate housing And now here's from an other site :
The VHP exhorts Hindu citizens of Gujarat to boycott all Muslim businesses and shun Muslims in every way possible, in order to make their lives intolerable and encourage them to emigrate to Pakistan. The shaping of young minds is something the Sangh Parivar takes very seriously. Murli Manohar Joshi, an old RSS hand and India�s minister for human resources, wants to "saffronize" education in India by rewriting history textbooks to reflect Hindutva�s version of India�s history. Joshi has announced that all new school books will have to be cleared by religious leaders before publication. In Gujarat, the textbooks have already been rewritten to teach a Hindu-right worldview. Students in Gujarat were asked on this spring�s final examination to join the following five phrases in a sentence: "There are two solutions. One of them is Nazi solution.[sic] If you do not like people, kill them, segregate them. Then strut up and down. Proclaim that you are the salt of the earth." Others were asked: "What is the basic difference between miyans [Muslims] and others? Textbooks in Gujarat refer to Muslims, Christians, and Parsis as "foreigners."
I did not wish to share the source. Shall send it thru PM if you wish to see it by yourself, There are still bitter facts, that may rage our readers. But yes, i shall not forget to mention that this info shared, is n't from any Islamic site, or any site which is supported by muslims.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 12:16am
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Saffronised state administration has turned its back on them. Over one lakh people have migrated to other places. But the rest live at Ahmedabad on a strip of land, along the road, stretching into graveyards. They want to return to their places but cannot do so. One of them, Ibrahim, went back to his village Marghi, near Anand. He even fulfilled the conditions laid down and withdrew the FIR and other statements. Still, the youth made his life so miserable that he had to quit. They did not want a Muslim in their midst. Hundreds of villages in the state proudly display a board: Hindu village in the Hindu Rashtra! There is hardly any protest against it. Social and economic boycott of Muslims continues. No Gujarati hires them. Bureaucrats are tainted, the police one-sided and liberals indifferent. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 1:24am
So tell me what have your warmongering gotten you so far? Dubya a neocon controlled moron has conceded his failure as war president and on Jan 20 we will have an ignorant left wing loonie for his replacement...BTW who is also a Zionist with a team of Zionists headed by an Israeli who will run his life at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave! ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Sign*Reader
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 2:04am
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A renowned Pakistani strategic defence analyst has
described last week�s terrorist attacks in Mumbai as a �botched� false
flag operation designed to imitate the 9/11 attacks on the United
States.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaid_Hamid - Zaid Hamid , a security consultant who routinely appears on Pakistani television, http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/Pak_TV_channel_says_2611_hatched_by_Hindu_Zionists/articleshow/3785654.cms - told reporters of the News One channel that the attacks were state sponsored by Indian military intelligence and carried out by Hindu zionists aided by Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency. Hamid contends that the motive is to shift attention away from India�s domestic terrorists, and to justify Western intervention in Pakistan. �They look like Hindus. No Pakistani speaks the language they chatted in,� said Hamid , claiming that the attackers wore saffron Hindu Zionist wrist bands. �The Americans executed the 9/11 attack perfectly.� Hamid continued. �They managed the media very well. The Indians tried to repeat the formula but goofed up. The idiots made a complete mess of it,� he argued. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F4_qwtM5yY&eurl=http://www.hotklix.com/?ref=content/152694&feature=player_embedded - Video of Hamid�s comments in his language have been uploaded to youtube. Hamid, who also hosts his own �Brasstacks� show on the News One channel, has long asserted that the U.S. wishes to eliminate Pakistan�s nuclear facilities which are seen as a direct threat to Israel�s sovereignty. Hamid also told viewers that during the first five minutes of the attack, http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Three_top_cops_die_on_duty/articleshow/3762023.cms - three Indian counterterrorist officers were killed by authorities in order to halt their investigations of a terror network within India�s security agencies. One of those men was India�s top antiterrorist officer http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article5248495.ece - Hemant Karkare , who was shot three times in the chest as he led his men at the Taj Mahal Palace. Karkare was http://www.indianexpress.com/news/ats-chief-hemant-karkare-dies-a-heros-death/391325/ - on the verge of uncovering the home-grown terror franchise of the Hindu extremists. He had also received death threats just hours before the attacks. Karkare was investigating a bomb attack that killed at least six people near a mosque in the western city of Malegaon on September 29. In early November his Anti-Terror Squad http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article5107111.ece - arrested senior Military Intelligence officer Colonel Srikant Prasad Purohit on suspicion of involvement in the attack which was carried out by Hindu extremists. Colonel Purohit was also http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/PoliticsNation/Purohits_links_to_Samjhauta_blasts/articleshow/3710158.cms - under investigation for the 2007 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Samjhauta_Express_bombings#cite_note-41 - Samjhauta Express bombings , which killed 68 people, mostly Pakistanis. Investigations into this will now likely be halted. Analysts claim that the Mumbai bombings represent a http://www.ccun.org/Opinion%20Editorials/2008/December/1%20o/Mumbai%20Attacks,%20Hindu%20Supremacists,%20and%20the%20War%20of%20Terror%20By%20Mohammed%20Khaku.htm - desperate move on behalf of separatists within the Indian establishment who want to shift the country away from independence and into the new world order model. ------------- Kismet Domino: Faith/Courage/Liberty/Abundance/Selfishness/Immorality/Apathy/Bondage or extinction. |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 2:17am
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Seekshidayath, there is no hatred for these fascists, or anyone else. Rather, I pity these hateful fools, who are destroying the fabric of societies with their own hate filled tactics. We are perhaps the luckiest Forum in the world. Or, should I say, just about the happiest? We are never in any short supply of the best and the most innocent gifts of our Creator and theirs also! They barge in here, blowing the usual Amreeki Ultra Right propaganda dialogues, with regal glee, as if crafted by none others than their own greatnesses! They arrive at very regular intervals. And, I love to adopt the best as my Morshed-in-Chief who never fails to provide us the entertainment we seek when things get a bit dull. Just imagine this innocenti who has landed at the doorstep just yesterday. Watch his lines, his phrases and even just the words. What do these remind us of? Not Richard Perl, really, but could just be it. If you ever asked him (sorry I am assuming it to be him because, at least, in this Forum our sisters have shown much better sense than the other variety) what�s the percentage of these Islamic Fascists? Is it any higher than the mugging experts in Promise, you could have my blue striped shirt if he can muster even a single word in response to that. Please, I will beg of you never to ask any such character about how these Hang Low Sexnon cousins, on both the sides of This sort of a male (won�t call him a man for a male is a mere half baked man and even after all that required time in the oven, always comes out with a bit of burnt brain cells) never comes with nada answers. He would rather stand up and shout something, be it just this or just that, down at us. I have become quite used to this sort of behaviour as part of the year I live in Be honest, will he ever know the reality of It has been blown as if a struggle between IT IS NOT A MATTER BETWEEN THESE TWO COUNTRIES. After all what� just 60 years and 9 months dilly dallying between friends? They should have waited a few more centuries instead of starting their The Kashmiris started their war of freedom and their relations on the other side of the border should just keep mum? What are they? Some English men or Australians who happen not to meet their sister living just 560 yards away other than for her birthday and that too if properly invited or, yes, at good old jingle bells day when Santa comes in through all the chimneys across the realm! So their relatives in Mirpur, Kotli or Bagh should just sit up in their hujras drink Yasmin tea, eat the finest local qulcheh and just mourn the Indian forces� Turky Shoots of their brethren on the other side of the Line of Control and possibly go out to the local mosque and sign a condolence register kept their with the courtesy of the State Department! No? That is the script that our half wits want us to follow. Life is a reality. It is not some exercise you find in some school books. The reality of Kashmir has been (I am not allowed to use the word that suits most) by the International Community for little over 60 years and 9 months and this man sits here and barks about Islamic Fascism. I will not insult my own intelligence by giving my recently found Morshed the chance to tell us who has been the best promoters of Islamic Fascism in these past hundred years. Loe pobre Musalmanos? Or your grand gaads who are now facing annihilation at the hands of their own greed and by the courtesy of great Cap It All itis. If you told this character anything real about life, I am convinced he would just evaporate into thin blue air. So, we better not mention that the great and noble US of A has been directing murder squads not just in If you place before him the sheer fact that the pobre Amreekis pay 3 billion $ every single year to the Israelis for liquidating los Palestinos, we will see how my morshed hisses about anti-semitism? Please don�t ask me why and how these folks come to mask everything and with what. I am no expert at that. One thing comes to mind, most who arrive here are employed and come with a script to post here. And most of these scripts are absolutely boringly predictable. Here, the US of A has become a bit frustrated by the Paki progress. Her masters demand that the Paki bomb, some call it the Islamic bomb, must be defused. Very hard for most chaps in Tel Aviv to see a full effing Moselmano with a full effing bomoba! They want But it seems it has backfired, though el Presidente would not mind delivering anything, really, to anyone, for say something like a good fe billions placed in his Swiss bank accounts. He is supported by the best caudillo our Urdu Ispeaking could ever find, our very own ElTuff Bhai who is brewing something very interesting in So it can�t be a part of the No the Amreekans have always behaved better that the heavenly angels and gaad is now considering a full training manual from the States for training the new crop of his Angels on their model!! May gaad also bless my Morshed-in-Chief. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 3:33am
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So tell me what have your warmongering gotten you so far?
Paa jee, what a question and from some pobre who doesn't seem to know nada + has jumped in just yesterday, most probly sent by those ones.
The war mongering has done a lot. It has bankrupted the Hang Low Sexnon eekanomy since all the chaps who had Real Money in their banks have taken it to their banks.
He talks of every place under the sun as if he holds the Title Deds to those places! ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 8:30am
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Dear Jamal Morelli has given a wonderful reply in another topic. That is what i would like to say to all. ".... try using news for something more than handy-wipes. Spare this (mostly) discerning community your rotten research hygiene, with the blog-like-derivative-news that information bottom-feeders like yourself wallow in. For you, the internet is a magic mirror: making all your lubricious paranoid fantasies come true ...." That is really a wonderful observation dear Jamal and it has been put wonderfully. It seems China is trying to make Pakistan's arse-nal look good and Afghanistan's e-cono-mics has been hit because of reduction in poppy harvest. What a coincidence! http://pakistantimes.net/2008/12/02/top.htm http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-opium28-2008nov28,0,4532484.story |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 8:54am
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Cadnu, this shall prove you conditions of muslims in Gujrat.
I love your optimism brother. Bhenss ke agay been bajao, chltay chalay jao!
I smelt the mentality of the chap ages ago. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Servetus
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 10:04am
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Truthrealm wrote: �Never mind, I searched some of that article and found it was taken from an pacifist website called http://www.antiwar.com/justin/ - http://www.antiwar.com/justin/ . This is some ignorant left wing loonie who is offering an opinion that fits with their agenda but contains little to no actual facts ...� From out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks and the fingers type. I think that the redoubtable Justin Raimondo, self-described disciple of Murray Rothbard and recent endorser of Ron Paul, would be amused to hear himself described as a left-wing anything. What�s more, and it probably ought to be stated, a �non-interventionist� �based upon the old Republican model- does not strictly a �pacifist� make (ref., for instance, Pat Buchanan�s A Republic, Not an Empire). The site, one of my favorites, is run (and edited) by paleoconservatives, generally to the right of Jonah Goldberg, to be sure- who stubbornly refuse to support interventionist wars of petroleum aggression, waged under false pretexts, and guided by dodgy intelligence reports. Long live antiwar.com! Jamal Morelli wrote: �� try using news for something more than handy-wipes. Spare this (mostly) discerning community your rotten research hygiene, with the blog-like-derivative-news that information bottom-feeders like yourself wallow in. For you, the internet is a magic mirror: making all your lubricious paranoid fantasies come true ��
Serv ___________________________________ Hey you! Democratise this (the House of Lords)! |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 10:33am
I have changed the last part of my response to delete the negative reference that could be taken for Allah, that wasn't intended.
|
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 12:08pm
|
I pity these hateful fools, who are destroying the fabric of societies with their own hate filled tactics.
And you hava nada for the fools who have destroyed society more and for much longer time with their agenda? May we just ask and will thou answer pobre Hamlet? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 1:43pm
Destroyed society more? How is anyone destroying society more than terrorists & suicide bombers?
Why can't you just denouce this evil and not point the finger at someone else? It's like a child saying, "But Daddy, Johnny picks on innocent people too." It's evil and it's WRONG, in any culture, in any race, in any religion, in any society, period.
A group is only as great as its willingness to speak out against the evils of its own members.
|
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:28pm
Dear TruthRealm, for these guys it is the Americans, Jews, Hindus doing those thing in the name of Islam. Have you heard of CIA, Mossad and RAW? It seems they do it and they blame Afghanistan and Pakistan for it. Haven't you read the whole topic? They have given enough "proofs" that it was Mossad who killed Indians and the foreigners and RAW who killed the Jews in the Nariman House. The people who we call terrorists were just visitors who are being blamed. It seems we represent Joker in the movie The Dark Knight.  Just read the first post in the topic itself (it was written without giving any source to it), "The TimesNovember 29, 2008 In the recent terrorist acts in Malegaon in Maharashtra, India, in September this year and in last year�s attacks on a cross-border train to Pakistan, Hindu extremists were found to be behind the plots. So it is obvious that terrorism is not a Muslim monopoly. Sometimes, �others� perpetrate a crime to demonise Muslims. So we should not put the blame on Muslims without clear evidence. If we demonise and penalise Muslims and fail to punish the real perpetrators, that will worsen the situation. Moreover, it cannot be denied that Muslims are also at the receiving end of terrorist attacks of recent years. The whole world has been rightly prompt to condemn these heinous killings in India. But let us think about the response of the world powers when hundreds of people are dying every week in Iraq and Afghanistan. It seems that the blood of Muslims is the cheapest on earth. Injustice breeds injustice. We need to address the root cause of injustice, and only then will we achieve a lasting peace." The topic is about Mumbai blasts without any reference to Mumbai itself. It talks about Iraq and Afghanistan and about the Muslim blood. How ironical? |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:30pm
|
Destroyed society more? How is anyone destroying society more than terrorists & suicide bombers?
Why can't you just denouce this evil and not point the finger at someone else? It's like a child saying, "But Daddy, Johnny picks on innocent people too." Mi pobre Johnny, come talk to us after your 17th birthday and specially when you begin to UNDERSTAND who has done what's at hand.
Go and sleep now, the poor computer needs a bit of rest at times, it has something like a brain. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:39pm
|
Dear TruthRealm, for these guys it is the Americans, Jews, Hindus doing those thing in the name of Islam. Have you heard of CIA, Mossad and RAW? It seems they do it and they blame Afghanistan and Pakistan for it.
Each time India has shouted blame against Pakistan or Islamists, it has proven to be OTHERWISE. Just stand up and PROVE that it was done by who your foul mind wishes it to be or just stop barking at us.
------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:39pm
I am still waiting for your pm. Where do you stay in Hyderabad? I will be there next week and i would like to meet you just to understand why you have soft corner towards Pakistan. You can even pm me your number, it would be easy to locate you. |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:43pm
|
I am still waiting for your pm. Where do you stay in Hyderabad? I will be there next week and i would like to meet you just to understand why you have soft corner towards Pakistan. You can even pm me your number, it would be easy to locate you. Or make pobre Seekshidayath understand how not to have a soft corner for Pakistan! Seeks, I always knew this one was from the RAW. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:48pm
|
Injustice breeds injustice. We need to address the root cause of injustice, and only then will we achieve a lasting peace." Are there any other blank idiots also who hold grudge against this statement?------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 7:56pm
|
Specially posted again for the foul smelling Hindu fundamentalista and our pobre 17 years old kid from Canada. Each time the Indian Finger Pointing HAS BEEN PROVEN WRONG!
Mumbai Terror Attacks Watch Indian television and Would you blame her at all after how Salman Taseer treated her 20 years ago? Pakistani television channels, initially sympathetic, soon turned reactionary and hostile. Some of the more hawkish anchors are telecasting scenes from the The fact that the Indian government is accusing In each of the incidents, namely, the Chattisinghpura massacre, the attack on the Indian Parliament on In the Chattisinghpura incident, for example, on The Samjhota Express incident is more disconcerting, and one that Pakistanis remember bitterly. On 18 February 2007, two bombs went off near the Indian city of Panipat on the Samjhota Express twice-weekly train between Lahore and Delhi, initiated as its name suggests (Samjhota means Agreement in both Hindi and Urdu) to enhance cordial relations between the two countries. The terrorist attack, which killed 68 (mostly Pakistanis) and injured many others was blamed once again on Lashkare Taiba. Indian authorities claimed that the alleged perpetrator was named Rana Shaukat Ali and a photograph of the terrorist was provided. Four months later, investigations revealed that neither Rana nor Lashkare Taiba but a serving lieutenant colonel of the Indian army, Lt. Col. Purohit was responsible for the attack. Purohit, it was found, had links with Hindu militant groups and provided training to extremists. Honestly, this is really worth reading > > > For If this is a coincidence, it is definitely a godsend for the extremist Hindu groups and the right-wing BJP, waiting to unseat the Congress government in the upcoming elections. But many in It is alleged that the perpetrators of the 26/11 violence entered Mumbai by sea and arrived by trawlers from In August 1999, a Pakistani surveillance aircraft was shot down by the Indian Air Force in the But somehow the trawler dodged all patrols and made it all the way to Mumbai. Regular procedure for boats and ships docking at Mumbai entails thorough checks, but it appears that the terrorist trawler was able to evade that as well. Too many questions remain. Too few answers are being given. |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 8:08pm
|
India names Pakistani masterminds, date plot to 07
By SAM DOLNICK, Associated Press Writer Sam Dolnick, Associated Press Writer � Thu Dec 4, 6:32 pm ET NEW DELHI � A Pakistani militant group apparently used an Indian operative as far back as 2007 to scout targets for the elaborate plot against India's financial capital, authorities said Thursday, a blow to Indian officials who have blamed the deadly attacks entirely on Pakistani extremists.
As investigators sought to unravel the attack on Mumbai, stepping up questioning of the lone captured gunman, airports across India were put on high alert amid fresh warnings that terrorists planned to hijack an aircraft. Also Thursday, police said there were signs that some of the six victims of the attack on a Jewish center may have been tortured. "The victims were strangled," said Rakesh Maria, a senior Mumbai police official. "There were injuries noticed on the bodies that were not from firing." Members of an Israeli rescue group which had a team in Mumbai said it was impossible to tell if the bodies had been abused, however, because no autopsies were conducted in accordance with Jewish tradition. The surviving gunman, Ajmal Amir Kasab, 21, told interrogators he had been sent by the banned Pakistani militant group Lashkar-e-Taiba and identified two of the plot's masterminds, according to two Indian government officials familiar with the inquiry. Kasab told police that one of them, Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, Lashkar's operations chief, recruited him for the attack, and the assailants called another senior leader, Yusuf Muzammil, on a satellite phone after hijacking an Indian vessel en route to Mumbai. The information sent investigators back to another reputed Lashkar operative, Faheem Ansari, who they hope could be key in pulling together different strands of the investigation. Ansari, an Indian national, was arrested in February in north India carrying hand-drawn sketches of hotels, the train terminal and other sites that were later attacked in Mumbai, said Amitabh Yash, director of the Special Task Force of the Uttar Pradesh police. During his interrogation, Ansari also named Muzammil as his handler in Pakistan, adding that he trained in a Lashkar camp in Muzaffarabad � the same area where Kasab said he was trained, a senior police officer involved in the investigation said. In Pakistan, Interior Ministry chief Rehman Malik told reporters he had no information on Lakhvi or Muzammil but that authorities would check. Ansari "told us about a planned Lashkar attack on Bombay, on southern Bombay," said Yash, referring to Mumbai by its previous name. "He gave us eight or nine specific locations where the attack would be carried out," he said, adding that Ansari had detailed sketches of the places and escape routes from the sites. Ansari said he carried out the reconnaissance in the fall of 2007, which also included the U.S. consulate, the Bombay stock exchange and other Mumbai sites that were not attacked. Ansari is now in Indian custody, according to Yash. It was unclear if he was being questioned again, but Maria said they were working to determine if Ansari played a role in how the attackers "got such intricate knowledge of the sites." Indian authorities have faced a torrent of criticism about missed warnings and botched intelligence, and revelations that Ansari disclosed details of the Mumbai plot 10 months ago will be added to the list. Linking an Indian national to the plot also undermines India's assertion that Pakistan is solely responsible. Yash said during extensive interrogations Ansari confessed to scouting Mumbai, arranging a safe-house there for Lashkar militants and provided details on his involvement in the group. "We got everything out of him, whatever he knew," he said. Ansari linked up with Lashkar while working at a printing press in Dubai. He was taken by sea to Pakistan to the Lashkar camp in Muzaffarabad and received a false Pakistani passport and citizenship papers, which police recovered when he was arrested. In 2007, Ansari said, he traveled to Katmandu, Nepal, and then crossed back into India and settled in Mumbai, where he conducted reconnaissance for a future attack, Yash said. He was arrested Feb. 10 in the northern city of Rampur after suspected Muslim militants attacked a police camp, killing eight constables. He said he was there to collect weapons to bring to Mumbai for a future attack. Yash said Ansari's arrest did not derail Lashkar's plans for an attack. "When they found that their mole in Bombay had been caught...they carried out the operations in a different way," he said. Meanwhile, police officers said they were trying to get as much detail as possible from Kasab. "A terrorist of this sort is never cooperative. We have to extract information," said Deven Bharti, the head of the Mumbai crime branch. Indian police are known to use interrogation methods that would be regarded as torture in the West, including questioning suspects drugged with "truth serum." Bharti provided no details on interrogation techniques, but said "truth serum" would probably be used next week. He did not specify what drug would be used. During questioning, details of Kasab's recruitment by Lashkar began to emerge, said police, describing him as fourth grade dropout from an impoverished village who was gravitating to a life of crime. "Lashkar recruited him, preying on a combination of his religious sentiments and his poverty," said Maria. The revelations came as Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice met with leaders in Islamabad after visiting India's capital � part of a U.S. effort to pressure Pakistan to share more intelligence and pursue terrorist cells believed to be rooted in the country. Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari promised Rice his country would take "strong action" against any elements in Pakistan involved in the siege. On Thursday, the U.S. Treasury Department designated as terrorists four individuals who hold leadership positions in Lashkar, including Lakhvi, and ordered any of their U.S. assets to be frozen. Also named were Muhammad Saeed, the group's leader; Haji Muhammad Ashraf, its chief of finance; and Mahmoud Mohammad Ahmed Bahaziq, a financier with the group. Meanwhile, India put its airports on alert following threats of possible airborne attacks. Security forces swarmed New Delhi's international airport early Friday after the sound of gunfire was heard, police said, but no one was injured or killed. Police said it was not a terrorist incident. The warning received by the airports "spoke of possibility of aircraft being hijacked by terrorists," India's air force chief, Fali Homi Major, told reporters Thursday. The alert focused on three major airports � New Delhi, Bangalore and Chennai � but security was stepped up across India. Several extra layers of security were set up and some passengers' bags were scanned for explosives. "Passengers have been asked to pass through six-stage security checks," said Brij Lal, a senior police official organizing security at the airport in the northern city of Lucknow. Nirmala Sharma, a passenger who flew from New Delhi to Lucknow, said her bags were checked a half dozen times and she went through a metal detector three times. "Sometimes it seemed tedious, but it seems to be the need of the hour," she said. ___ Associated Press writers Ramola Talwar Badam and Muneeza Naqvi in Mumbai, Ashok Sharma and Tim Sullivan in New Delhi, Biswajeet Banerjee in Lucknow and Anne Gearan in Islamabad contributed to this report. |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 8:40pm
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How very interesting! And each time they did that it proved to be false. I did tell you to come back after you have finished school and also to give your poor computer a little rest, it does have a brain. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: TruthRealm
Date Posted: 04 December 2008 at 9:13pm
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You have a brain too, Whisper....but see if it can comprehend this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avYtAyCxUbA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avYtAyCxUbA ------------- �Moses dragged us for 40 years through the desert to bring us to the one place in the Middle East where there was no oil.� -Golda Meir |
Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 12:21am
Is it un-Indian to sympathise with Pakistan? And you got to meet seeks to understand that? ------------- 'Trust everyone but not the devil in them' |
Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 12:30am
Its just the usual, by the ones who dont use that '6 inches between their ears'. I could only comprehend the st**idity of those who made this video. ------------- 'Trust everyone but not the devil in them' |
Posted By: cadnu
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 3:25am
Did i say "un-Indian" if one sympathizes with Pakistan? I supported Pakistan in my initial posts. Does that mean i am "un-Indian"? In another topic he himself was requesting me to meet a few Hyderabadis. "If you stay in and around Hyderabad, you can visit those houses and meet there parents." "Its not a gossip brother, I really wish you meet this family." So i think it's none of your business dear Saladin. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 5:35am
You did not answer my questions ? Or is it that you don't have answers to them, or guts to answer it ?
PS : MY FONT IS LARGE. HOPE YOU GET ME !!
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 5:44am
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Cadnu, i don't understand why would you like to know my reason of being soft for Pak. Perhaps, you did not read my post well. I shall repeat my line again - EVEN IF IT WERE United States, INSTEAD OF PAK, I WOULD HAVE SUPPORTED "US". {Let me tell you, i hate US, for its policies} But if i place that country which i hate , i would support it. REASON - I DON'T LIKE INNOCENTS TO BE KILLED. India is yet to give a solid proof that Pak was responsible for the attacks. Even calls were traced there at UK, and Australia. Why does India, not deal with them in the same manner. When the UK , said, sternly to speak with solid proofs, we are quiet. Why is Pak a soft target ? Just because of the old rivalries ?
And when you read that line of mine, i said, i shall PM if you wish to. And i was waiting for your consent. Well, i shall now share it here at boards. Let the other members too go thru. Members like, "TruthRealm", shall also get to know the truth of extremists in India. Let them also know taht these victims, now have no hope of justice. Its been 6 years and look at justice, democracy of India, that this TERRORIST is a chiefminister. And yes, you wished to meet me. But before that, let me tell you, that its a general discussion. If you wished none to get involved in it, you shud have sent a PM to me. Its wrong to say, "None of your business". Brother, Saladdin, am sorry foryou been hurted. Due to unavoidable circumstances, i cannot meet you. But its my invitation to you, to kindly meet a brother, who runs a dawah organisation. I just spoke to him. Because of shootings and other important meetings, he may be unable to give you time on Friday, Monday. Tuesday and Thursday. This organisation shall welcome you. Just think, that its "me", you are meeting. I really wish you to discuss all those, you wish, and those we discussed. Its a place where the discussions are very social and friendly. Do let me know if you are intrested to meet us there. Waiting for your consent, only then shall i send you those contact numbers http://www.worldpolicy.org/journal/articles/wpj02-3/kamdar.html - http://www.worldpolicy.org/journal/articles/wpj02-3/kamdar.html
http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/cescr/docs/info-ngos/Gujarat_India40.pdf - http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/cescr/docs/info-ngos/Gujarat_India40.pdf {This was the site, which opened the other day i posted. Kindly try to open it, It has got lots of content} Brother, Signreader, pls try to get this opned http://www.deccanherald.com/archives/nov22005/nayar.asp - http://www.deccanherald.com/archives/nov22005/nayar.asp
http://www.expressindia.com/news/fullstory.php?newsid=35886#compstory - http://www.expressindia.com/news/fullstory.php?newsid=35886#compstory
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Saladin
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 6:15am
I didnt know that but let me recollect your words that prompted me to ask that question - [....i would like to meet you just to understand why you have soft corner towards Pakistan]. I'm curious cadnu, what do you find thats so difficult for you to understand, in an Indian's sympathy for Pakistan? ------------- 'Trust everyone but not the devil in them' |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 05 December 2008 at 6:56am
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Is it un-Indian to sympathise with Pakistan? And you got to meet seeks to understand that?
Yes, brother, absolutely, for the likes of thugs he is addressing!
I have loads of Idian friends. India was quite a civilised place, the Hindus, the Mosleys and all the others lived in comparative harmony for almost 1100 years. Then appear the great Hang Low Sexnons, divide and rule via the District Gazzettes started in 1894 after the Mayo Report - to kill any chances of a 1857 repeat.
Our friend here is one of those Indians who would rather sit in the lap of some Washington thug rather than befriend a Moselmaan or a Moselmaan country. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |