Query
Printed From: IslamiCity.org
Category: General
Forum Name: General Discussion
Forum Description: General Discussion
URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13432
Printed Date: 11 June 2024 at 10:58pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Query
Posted By: Gulliver
Subject: Query
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 6:57am
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I asked this before. Has anyone heard of this man or his translation of the Qu'ran ? It looks interesting. Just wondering if he is 'orthodox' ? Anyone ?
Moderator Note: The link was deleted as per the forum rules. The group doesn't represent Islam; they are non-Muslims by consensus of Islamic scholars due to their violation in the fundamental tenets of Islam. Please avoid posting anything related to them in the future. |
Replies:
Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 10:23am
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No he is not. I believe the best English translation of The Holy Quran is the Yusuf Ali version with commentary. ------------- �No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.� Eleanor Roosevelt |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 10:49am
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Sorry. The Islamic 'scholars' of course are infallible.
That's all I need to know. Thanks.
Seems there are 'too many questions' afterall Shasta. Some you just don't ask according to the all knowing, all wise 'scholars'.
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Posted By: peacemaker
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 10:57am
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Here are some links where you can find the translation of the Qur'an:
http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/SURAI.HTM - http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/SURAI.HTM
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/ - http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/
------------- Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny? Qur'an 55:13 |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 12:41pm
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Thank you peacemaker.
You have a job maintaining peace on a religious forum :-)
A question for anyone. Muslims and Christians seem to believe in God, and that the role of humanity is to submit to the greatest good for themselves and each other, which is the Greatest Good - the will of God ?
IF that is true. How do we know what God's will is and how do we submit ?
Simply if poss :-)
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Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 27 October 2008 at 7:29pm
It isn't a question of too many questions. The Forum guidelines prohibit the posting of these types of links. Nothing personal.
When you are first learning about Islam you will find the internet is full of questionable websites and sources. It is better to avoid them as they only cause confusion. Rather like learning Christianity with the Branch Davidians as your main source of info. ------------- �No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.� Eleanor Roosevelt |
Gulliver wrote:Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 28 October 2008 at 2:50am
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Point taken. I just read the intro to his Qu'ran interpretation and thought it very interesting. I am not the most 'orthodox' anyway Shasta. I was told my a very traditional Catholic once. "You will not serve". I was practically accused of being a satanist, like satan himself for not 'obey'ing what the learned of the Church had said to be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
We'll see. I suppose I have 'issues' with authority ;-) lol
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Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 28 October 2008 at 4:57am
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Just my 2cents about ur comment 'all wise' scholars... Muslims dont just 'blindly' believe in scholars - atleast, they're not supposed to, so tht they dont get mislead.
These scholars dont merely give edicts or thier 'opinions' - unlike the Pope or other such absolute figures in other religions. They are supposed to use proof and substantiate thier opinions with the Quran or Hadith - only then is thier word taken into account.
Also, a 'consensus' of scholars is even safer - since a number of scholars have researched the concept and come to the same conclusion... thus eliminating errors or chances of misinterpretation and such.
Just wanted to clarify the position of Scholars in Islam - since I get the implication that u probably dislike religious 'figures' of any religion...
Regards, ------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 2:15pm
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Who was/is Ahmed Deedat ?
I watched a VERY disturbing youtube video with this man tonight, and I am wondering how he is viewed in Islam ?
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Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 2:25pm
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Yes Chrys. I have a real problem trusting any of 'em. It's me, not them. It is general to all religions. Well those I have looked at briefly - the 'main ones'. Christianity and a little of Islam to date. I don't know that I will ever be able to reconcile again with religion. There are too many triggers that set me off. It's not 'Irish temper'. Something about religion gets me really angry at times, and I am still in process of trying to understand what/why.
I have very seriously considered, am considering leaving all of if behind me. Do what I did for years - believe in God and forget all the 'religion'. It doesn't give me the peace I am looking for.
A friend of mine said to me last night, "Religion is for those afraid of hell. Sprirituality is for those who've already been there and don't want to go back." Much truth in it. Religion was the cause of my 'going to hell' and I don't want to go back there. So I really don't think I will be able to stay 'with religion'. I only came back cause I was looking to share with others again - a community of faith/believers. Maybe I need to look elsewhere for that and that is not anything against Islam or Christianity itself. Just me - and the journey I made and must finish.
Religion is the only thing that seems to be able to get me 'angry'. LOL
It's not really funny though. Maybe one day again Chrys - Inch Allah. I really don't know at this stage.
But I won't lose my faith in God. If that were going to happen it would have happened a long time ago. So.... there you go :-)
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Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 10:08pm
Hi Gulliver,
Which of his videos did you watch ? And can u share us the points you felt disturbing in his videos ? ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 4:01am
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Him making derogatory and 'humorous' remarks about people with, and dying from AIDS. You reap what you sow. And it looks like he did.
It's putting it mildly to say he was/is ignorant and a bigot.
Not remotely interested in anything he said Seeks.
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Posted By: believer
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 7:34am
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King of mis-information!! ------------- John 3 16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 9:22am
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I see you fell for the bait. You know who you are, and so do I :-)
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Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 31 October 2008 at 2:34am
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, |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 31 October 2008 at 2:35am
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I would love to see Muslims and Christians coming together more and realising they have the same God, and share prayer etc. But that's just me. Maybe I am being naieve. I don't think so. Just needs an open mind and willing heart.
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Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 31 October 2008 at 2:41am
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Seeks I am sorry if my comments re Deedat offended you.
But I was enraged listening to his drivel on that youtube about people with AIDS. I have worked with such people and that man, Deedat, as far as I am concerned, is an utter, complete, total ignorant hypocrite, and a bigot, and if he were still alive I'd tell it to his face.
May God forgive him.
I hope the last 8/9 years of his life taught him more compassion, when he was brought to a place of utter dependence on the care of others, being afflicted with his own physical suffering.
I doubt, unless he was a heartless 'b'td' - that had he had to be with the suffering and dying in such a way, he'd have said those things. But typical 'ivory tower' - 'scholarly' b'sh''ters' - never had to wash a sick person's ass in their lives and have not right to speak on certain matters.
I was heartily disgusted with that man yesterday. Truly.
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Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 31 October 2008 at 2:49am
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If Jesus had believed that people afflicted with any kind of sickness, illness etc, were suffering 'God's punishment' - a "horrible filthy disease" - Jesus would not have set out to heal those people from those diseases and counteracted the supposed 'god's will' that they were being punished.
Dunno what Muhammad's views, beliefs were on such matters.
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Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 31 October 2008 at 11:34pm
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You did not name that video Gulliver. I would like to listen it. Kindly share it here at this thread. If you have other questions, you can post them here
http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13456 - http://www.islamicity.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13456
And Gulliver, you must be knowing this prophet - Ayub [Job], why did he suffer from diseases ? What does bible say about this ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 01 November 2008 at 3:21am
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Seems there are 'too many questions' afterall Shasta. Some you just don't ask according to the all knowing, all wise 'scholars'.
Unfortunately, nada like that at all.
It's just a bit like we have in Ireland and also in most of Europe, to safeguard aganist counterfeits. Los numero dos goods, pirated DVDs, Videos, brand name hand bags, designer T-shirts and all of that!
We have safeguards against all such things. You are taken out and thrown in jail for promoting, possesing these?
We do the same to anyone promoting numero dos prof8s (won't give them the joy of being called Prophets!) ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 01 November 2008 at 3:30am
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I would love to see Muslims and Christians coming together more and realising they have the same God, and share prayer etc.
What an absolutely beautiful thought!
It has been in practice far longer than we are allowed to know.
Hola! Gulliver, just a Lilliputian here.
The Muslims, the Christians and los Judeos (jews) were like fingers of one fine sensitive creative hand for say a good ten centuries. They created two of the finest civilisations - el-Andalus and the Ottoman Turkey. These both were created and also run by these Three almost like a joingt venture.
And, then, some pot bellied, bald or balding, bored and at once impotent Whitehall chaps decided to set our great old Churchill's dream - Divide and rule the Middle East! into practice.
In fact the Special Services started long before poor Churchill (el Warmongero) was even born - around 1832 soon after the Greek wars. They stand divided simply because the secular London and New York Bankers can not afford to let their Finacial centres slip in to Beirut and Tel Aviv and Riyadh.
Try and work out why was such beautiful Lebanon destroyed? Soon after those Arabs started to place their funds in Beirut banks? What was the first one? Intra Bank if I remember correctly? ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 02 November 2008 at 3:08am
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What an absolutely beautiful thought!
It has been in practice far longer than we are allowed to know.
It's true too Whisper. And who'd stop us ? Priests, popes, minsters, imams - scholars ?
A few months ago I was sitting somewhere and the tele was on. There was a movie about the life of Mother Theresa. She works in this school - teaching. And then she is on a train one day, and offered to sit in a certain compartment - separate from the other human beings on the train. She refuses. She sees this man in the street reaching out to her looking assistance, and in that she sees Christ - Christ in each and every human being. One day she is working with the poor. Can't remember all of it. But there are Muslims, Hindus and Christians at their 'temple's. And something is said to her about this. And she says, "we all pray to the same God anyway." The same God who made us all and loves us all. How very true. We can spend so much time, waste so much time on irrelevances - that we have not time left to love our neighbour or God. Even here in Ireland, not that long ago really - Catholic and Protestants we not supposed to share their faith experiences - worship God together - go into each other's churches. It was insane. Maybe one day we will all grow up.
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Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 05 November 2008 at 10:56am
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It's true too Whisper. And who'd stop us ? Priests, popes, minsters, imams - scholars ?
No one stops them or resists and contact between any faiths with the exception of State! And, the state, in almost 65% of global human mass, in these past couple of centuries was controlled from those cold, dark Whitehall corridors, you know who wanted all such divisions.
Yaar, just for a moment try and work out what they had done to the Irish in their own backyard and you will be able to see what they did elsewhere, clearly. But, please, don't leak these Whispers to my frined Minuteman, he thinks that the world never had anything better than the British Rule!
I have lead mass at Lahore Cathedral when we set up a society, at the uni, with my Christian brothers. Specially this family of faiths has much more for sharing than otherwise. ------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |
Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 05 November 2008 at 4:50pm
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"Specially this family of faiths has much more for sharing than otherwise."
I am behind you all the way on this one. :-)
I know all about their 'rule'. Pulled out of our beds at 5 in the morning when kids, lined up, body searched and questioned - suspected 'terrorists'. Holy God. When I think on it now - it's like it all happened to someone else. Where I grew up - all Catholics were suspected 'terrorists' and treated as such. So I can relate to Muslims who are treated that way. Best not get into that Whisper ;-)
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Posted By: Gulliver
Date Posted: 05 November 2008 at 5:05pm
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I told my friend once that I thought we came together to understand we both believed in the same God, and to share faith, and grow strong in that and supporting each other, and helping others see the real good 'fruit' of such faith. After hearing you, I am convinced of it. To make an effort now not just to reach out to non Catholics. Not that I was ever like that anyway. I hate 'labels' But now there are more people here from other countries, cultures and faiths - to seek them out too, and see that we cannot grow in understanding of each other, and share and strengthen our faith in God. I don't doubt it's what God wants and I tell the truth when I say I have never known anyone in my life to pray to the 'created' as Creator. We all need to take the ol' blinkers off and open our hearts.
Cause God knows - the way the world, society is headed, Ireland going 'down the toilet', and fast - I think we are badly in need of it.
God bless Whisper and thanks for the reminder :-)
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Posted By: Whisper
Date Posted: 06 November 2008 at 7:14pm
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Cause God knows - the way the world, society is headed, Ireland going 'down the toilet', and fast - I think we are badly in need of it.
------------- Sasha Khanzadeh |