Dealing With Doubt

Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem

I�m referring to His Shin, His Eye, His Face, His Right and Left Hand, His Finger, His Foot, His Throne,

This is a generalised way of describing his attributes [99 attributes]. His right hand depending on the context means nearness or in other contexts it means his attributes of power and justice eg Haqq just to name a few.

None of these are taken literally, have you ever come across a traditional muslim scholar who has interpreted them in such a way.

By far, these characteristics have been difficult to accept.

There have been some scholars and groups who have done this in the past but the vast majority of scholars have rejected them and in reality they are not speaking from something they know or have been taught but from there own selfs, as allah says in the Quran nothing is like him so how can his saying my foot or hand or mouth be taken literally.

Secondly, how do you approach the apparently pernicious nature of Hellfire proclaimed in the Qur�aan?

What will you do with satan when his time comes and after knowing full well what he has done to humanity. What will you do with Hitler and the countless rulers who have done the same. What of every person who has been persecuted and oppressed when will they receive justice for how they have been wronged.

What would you do to warn people away from doing wrong things, look at people now they know accept and believe in the pernicious nature hell and still behave the way they have. If hell did not exist in the hereafter then people would turn this world into hell. It serves a purpose and as punishment for those who refuse to obey Allah, he has given them ample warning and descriptions of what hell is like so they dont even think twice about how serious and horrific a place it is.

The apparent cruelty to be meted out upon disbelievers in Hellfire is quite disturbing to me.

Is disbeliefe there only crime?

I couldn�t believe in jinn or the story of Nuh. It�s strange how just the disbelief in jinn makes one a kaafir.

Its disbelief in the Quran that makes one a Kafir not disbelief in Jinn but since Allah has made there existence known in the Quran it is the same thing. If you dont have trouble believing in Satan then you should have no greater trouble believing in Jinn, the only difference being satan was from the jinn and not a fallen angel as christians believe.

I�d most likely become an extremist pushing my fellow brothers into the masjid and campaigning for the implementation of sharee�ah in my society.

You have to accept people with there faults otherwise your heart would become hard from being around them, just know inside your self what they do is wrong and that is least of what is expected of you.

Idris, Abuzaid is correct in what he says.


Edited by rami

Idris wrote: You're ignoring what my main point. It's metaphorical.

This is you who have to prove. I took Quran as it says and you are adding a point that this is metaphorical. Does Quran says that description of hell as mentioned in Quran is metaphorical? or you are adding something from your side and asking me to prove?

BTW, could you guide me from where did you take the translation.

Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem

you didnt just say it was allegorical you offered up your own explanation of what it was which is completely wrong.

We have literal description of hell in other verses and ahadith none of what you quote above says every other thing mentioned is "the allegory/the similtude/the parable/the picture" this is your own addition.

Most use the literal word description and some similitude:

Which in the above simply means similar but not exact, this does not open up the way for interpretation since they are not an allegory or parable.

Alegory: a. The representation of abstract ideas or principles by characters, figures, or events in narrative, dramatic, or pictorial form.

something cant be abstract and similar at the same time, clearly you are reading to much into this.

rami wrote: Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem you didnt just say it was allegorical you offered up your own explanation of what it was which is completely wrong.

I offered a meaning of allegorical.

We have literal description of hell in other verses and ahadith none of what you quote above says every other thing mentioned is "the allegory/the similtude/the parable/the picture" this is your own addition.

"the allegory/the similtude/the parable/the picture" is not my own addition. I advise you to think before you write. They are in the verses. Why don't you actually check?

Once again, you don't KNOW it's literal or not in the hadith. The hadith simply say stuff like "and all the unbelievers shall burn in hell". How do you know it's literal? You don't. It could so easily be metaphorical.

Most use the literal word description and some similitude:

Metaphorical language also uses literal word description.

a. One closely resembling another; a counterpart. b. A perceptible likeness.

Next time, please quote ALL of the meanings:

1. Similarity; resemblance. See synonyms at likeness.
2. 1. One closely resembling another; a counterpart.
   2. A perceptible likeness.
3. Archaic. A simile, allegory, or parable.

Yusuf Ali, Shakir,  both used parable.
Khalifa use allegory.
Lots of them used similitude, which is related to the word 'simile'.

Which in the above simply means similar but not exact, this does not open up the way for interpretation since they are not an allegory or parable. Alegory: a. The representation of abstract ideas or principles by characters, figures, or events in narrative, dramatic, or pictorial form. something cant be abstract and similar at the same time, clearly you are reading to much into this.

Clearly, you don't even understand what allegory means.
The abstract idea: "that hell is a place without God"
The similitude is the pain that comes without the presence of God. "the flames of Hell".

abuzaid wrote: Idris, The only person who used allegory is khalifa, and I think this is rashad khalifa who founded that group by name submitters. You know what it means?

Of course i do. I spent a few weeks learning everything about Khalifa and the submitters. They are not so bad. They split in half. One group denies khalifa's absurb self-claimed messengership, the other accepts it.

However, regardless of khalifa himself, his translation is excellent. He does make the occasional slip up, and even one time inserted his own name into a verse, but his translation as a whole is one of the best i've seen.

About the metaphors.. Do you think that we can take liberty of declaring anything in Quran as metaphorical? If someone comes up and say that revelation and Prophethood is only metaphorical, would you accept it just because it makes more sense to you? or if someone declare God himself is mteaphorical and prove atheism from Quran..

You are asking when to know it's metaphorical. When the Qur'an says and when it's obvious!

The Qur'an says people who cannot see the Truth because they refuse to see it are blind. Is the Qur'an literal? Are people really blind? No. It's metaphorical. It's like being blind.

The Qur'an actually says in this verse that "the parable/allegory is"... which means it IS a parable/allegory and so on.

may God bless you.

Edited by Idris