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Is there an Islamic response to John 3?
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Reepicheep View Drop Down
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Points: 324 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reepicheep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 December 2006 at 6:20am

The evil, hate crazed kooks who wrote this nonsense for the "Answering Christianity" website have really outdone themselves with the level of ignorance revealed by their claims about the Book of John.

Thanks for my laugh of the day, Arab.
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Arab View Drop Down
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Points: 256 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Arab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 December 2006 at 6:23am
Laugh now .... But God is one who has no partners because he is far more exhalted then to "begett".
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BMZ View Drop Down
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Hi Arab,

From you: "The Gospel of John was written about John but not by the original "Saint John".  Big difference."

One does not need answering-christianitydot coms to come to the above conclusion.

Reading JOHN21:24-25 will itself clarify that the disciple John did not write the Gospel of John.

Otherwise John21:24-25 would have been written as "I am the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. I know that my testimony is true." instead of the printed "This is the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. We know that his testimony is true."

This must have been some other John or a team of writers, as is evident from John21:25"Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would have to be written."

Salaam Alaikum

BMZ 
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Sarita View Drop Down
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Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

Hi Arab,

From you: "The Gospel of John was written about John but not by the original "Saint John".  Big difference."

One does not need answering-christianitydot coms to come to the above conclusion.

Reading JOHN21:24-25 will itself clarify that the disciple John did not write the Gospel of John.

Otherwise John21:24-25 would have been written as "I am the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. I know that my testimony is true." instead of the printed "This is the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. We know that his testimony is true."

This must have been some other John or a team of writers, as is evident from John21:25"Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would have to be written."

Salaam Alaikum

BMZ 

Yes, in fact these verses are written by Jesus' disciple John, and written about John the Baptist. John the Baptist was a relative of Jesus and was also the man who baptized Jesus, and was later beheaded at the request of Herod's daughter. If you go up a couple of verses to John 1:19 it states at the title this stretch of verses is about John the Baptist testimony. Just wanted to clear that up.
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Points: 1852 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2006 at 4:00am

Sarita,

John 1:19 is not a couple of verses up, it is right in the beginning of John's book. I was talking about the disciple whom Jesus loved, reference Verses John 21:20-22, which are talking about a disciple of Jesus by the name John.

John the Baptist was not a disciple of Jesus. This is the disciple who wrote. John the Baptist wrote no testimony. Please read John 21:19-25 and you will know this has nothing to do with John the Baptist.

Hope my point is clear. Thanks.
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Sarita View Drop Down
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Points: 21 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sarita Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2006 at 4:22am
Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

Sarita,

John 1:19 is not a couple of verses up, it is right in the beginning of John's book. I was talking about the disciple whom Jesus loved, reference Verses John 21:20-22, which are talking about a disciple of Jesus by the name John.

John the Baptist was not a disciple of Jesus. This is the disciple who wrote. John the Baptist wrote no testimony. Please read John 21:19-25 and you will know this has nothing to do with John the Baptist.

Hope my point is clear. Thanks.

Excuse I hope I don't sound PMSy or something like that.  I don't want to come off as rude. But verse 19 was a couple verses up from the verses Arab was quoting, there should be no question there. I clearly stated who John the Baptist was, I never said he was a disciple, that would be innaccurate if I did.

Yes, there is a John who was loved by Jesus. There are a few different John's in the New Testament, I guess they couldn't have had more original names then, it is like me, my name is Sarah, many ladies my same age also have this name, if we all knew each other and wrote a book, it would be exhausting trying to figure out which Sarah was which .

I copied over the verses in question here to show you so that you will be able to see indeed this was John the Baptist testimony.

John 1:1-34 (New International Version)

John 1

The Word Became Flesh
 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.

 3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.

 6There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John. 7He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe. 8He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. 9The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.[b]

 10He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God� 13children born not of natural descent,[c] nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.

 14The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only,[d] who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

 15John testifies concerning him. He cries out, saying, "This was he of whom I said, 'He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.' " 16From the fullness of his grace we have all received one blessing after another. 17For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. 18No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only,[e][f]who is at the Father's side, has made him known.

John the Baptist Denies Being the Christ
 19Now this was John's testimony when the Jews of Jerusalem sent priests and Levites to ask him who he was. 20He did not fail to confess, but confessed freely, "I am not the Christ.[g]"

 21They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
      He said, "I am not."
      "Are you the Prophet?"
      He answered, "No."

 22Finally they said, "Who are you? Give us an answer to take back to those who sent us. What do you say about yourself?"

 23John replied in the words of Isaiah the prophet, "I am the voice of one calling in the desert, 'Make straight the way for the Lord.' "[h]

 24Now some Pharisees who had been sent 25questioned him, "Why then do you baptize if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?"

 26"I baptize with[i] water," John replied, "but among you stands one you do not know. 27He is the one who comes after me, the thongs of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie."

 28This all happened at Bethany on the other side of the Jordan, where John was baptizing.

Jesus the Lamb of God
 29The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world! 30This is the one I meant when I said, 'A man who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.' 31I myself did not know him, but the reason I came baptizing with water was that he might be revealed to Israel."

 32Then John gave this testimony: "I saw the Spirit come down from heaven as a dove and remain on him. 33I would not have known him, except that the one who sent me to baptize with water told me, 'The man on whom you see the Spirit come down and remain is he who will baptize with the Holy Spirit.' 34I have seen and I testify that this is the Son of God."



Edited by Sarita
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BMZ View Drop Down
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Points: 1852 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2006 at 4:33am

That's all right, Sarita. According to what you quoted, about John the Baptist, that was his testimony.

But I hope you will agree with me that John 21:24 speaks of the testimony of this disciple John.

BMZ

 
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Arab View Drop Down
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Points: 256 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Arab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2006 at 4:34am

It is interesting to note that:


"19 Now this is the testimony of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, �Who are you?�
20 He confessed, and did not deny, but confessed, �I am not the Christ.�
21 And they asked him, �What then? Are you Elijah?�
He said, �I am not.�
�Are you the Prophet?�
And he answered, �No.�
22 Then they said to him, �Who are you, that we may give an answer to those who sent us? What do you say about yourself?� "

This shows that the Jews were looking for THREE different prophecies to come true not just two. The Christ, Jesus, Elijah, and the Prophet. My Christian brothers only see two questions posed here, not three. Now we ask, who is "the Prophet"? Who else claimed prophecy and had to do with Jesus and John other than Mohammed?

 



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