Does the New Testament teach that Jesus ? |
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Angel
Senior Member Joined: 03 July 2001 Status: Offline Points: 6641 |
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Good analogy |
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~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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IslamicGirl
Senior Member Joined: 13 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 120 |
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rbaitz posted: However the Bible tells us Jesus is God. THIS IS UNTRUE. Go over the 10 commandments again in what Christains are suppose to believe. |
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*Islamic Girl*
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rbaitz
Newbie Joined: 25 March 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Salams, I worship One God. All of genuine Christendom worships One God. There is only One God, not two, not three, but One God. The Bible says there is only One God, "Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One". The Old and New Testaments both teach this. Now we as human beings are finite, we don't possess all knowledge, we are limited, in our understanding of the world and God. However God's revelation to man which is accepted by Christians does teach there is but One God. So as believers we bend our knee to scripture and accept it as true even though we may not always fully comprehend it. Next we find in the Bible that there are Three Persons co-equal and co-eternal within the One God. One What and three Who's. Different categories. One God and three Persons- Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Does the Bible teach us this? Is the Father called God? Is the Son called God? Is the Holy Spirit called God? the Father, "Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me." John 8:42 "Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father." John 6:46 "No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten God, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him." John 1:18 the Son, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:1 (the Word is Jesus, John 1:14) "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him." John 1:18 "But of the Son He says, "YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS. And, "YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS;" Hebrews 1:8-10.(The context is contrasting angels versus God the eternal Son who is said has a Throne, is called God who is forever and ever, with a scepter of righteousness which means He rules in righteousness, He laid the foundation of the earth, so He is the Creator. All this is said of Jesus.). Would you like me to continue with such verses? Jesus Himself declared Himself to be pre-existant. Existing before His own mother was born. Does Islam teach of a pre-existance before our own physical life? Listen to Jesus' own words, "Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." John 8:58. Jesus existed all the way back in the time of Abraham! How could this be? "In the beginning was the Word..." John 1:1. The Word being Jesus existed before creation itself, which He created as you see in the verse above and in others. This is why He was or existed before Abraham. the Holy Spirit, But Peter said, "Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back some of the price of the land? 4 "While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not under your control? Why is it that you have conceived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God." Acts 5:3-4 In conclusion we find the Bible does teach there is but One true God, not two or three or more. However this One true God is made up of Three distinct Persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, co-equal and eternal, yet all are in unity within our understanding of One true God. Do I understand this? No! However as a finite being not knowing everything, I must bow my knee to God's revelation and accept it. If I did any other I would be denying His own word. I cannot fully understand this teaching, but I can apprehend it from the Bible. Robin Edited by rbaitz |
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AhmadJoyia
Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647 |
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Dear rbaitz Its really strange when you started with One God, not two, not three but one God (from OT) and then conclude it with three distinct persons (from NT) ... See here is what you said
Is it not a strange equation? Secondly, is it really important to recognize the God in three "distinct persons"? Can't we just Pray to God (call it the composite God or the Ultimate God or what ever we concieve of just one true God)? How does it matters to our faith if in our prayers we simply call this one True God only and do not associate any other distinctions with Him? Do you think, He would not listen to us or would He mind for not dividing Him into three seperate ones? |
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rbaitz
Newbie Joined: 25 March 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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AhmadJoyia First thank you for participating in this discussion. You asked if this is a strange equation? As finite beings we don�t possess all knowledge. However God does because He is infinite. Therefore, we can only bow our knee to Him and what He has revealed to us. Even if this means we don�t always understand God�s purposes and revealed word in the Bible. Also as finite beings we should be humble in our questioning of God�s word because the question could be the problem versus the answer. To answer your second and third questions, yes it is important to recognize Jesus as the eternal Son of God. Why do I believe this? Because the Bible teaches it, read for yourself, "but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name" John 20:31. The whole reason why the apostle John wrote this gospel was because he knew who Jesus was and is and wanted others to know and believe in Jesus as the Son of God, the Christ. Now throughout the New Testament Jesus is always refered to as the unique Son of God. So it cannot be claimed by anyone that Jesus is a son of God as all believers are son�s of God. Next it is eternally important that you understand this because those who denied Jesus as the Son of God, the Christ, are not only denying the Son of God but are also denying the Father, God. And God will deny them who deny His only begotten Son, "Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also" 1 John 2:23. Last Jesus speaking, "But he who denies Me before men will be denied before t he angels of God" Luke 12:9. Our acceptance of who Jesus revealed Himself to be will determine our eternal state, whether in heaven or in hell forever. This is why it is so important! Read the Bible for yourself, what does God simply say?Robin |
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DavidC
Senior Member Male Christian Joined: 20 September 2001 Location: Florida USA Status: Offline Points: 2474 |
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rbaitz, all five pillars of Islam were demonstrated in the life of Jesus.
We may disagree about dogma, names, conceptualizations and history but it seems clear to this Christian that Jesus works through Islam as well as Christianity. DavidC |
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rbaitz
Newbie Joined: 25 March 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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David, The Jesus of Christianity and the Jesus of Islam are two very distinct persons. Christians know and worship the Jesus of true history. The Jesus who really lived on this earth, who really died on a cross and rose from the dead. The Jesus whom scripture speaks of as the eternal Son of God, the Christ. Does this describe the Jesus of Islam? Not at all! The Jesus that is described in Islam is a fictional Jesus. Someone who never existed in history or outside of this physical world. Though the Bible and also non-bliblical manuscripts from the 1st and 2nd Century tell us the Christian story of who Jesus was and even of His death and claimed resurrection, Islam still denies it because their Quran 7 Centuries later says so. Mythology has crept into the Jesus of Islam, the Jesus of Islam is not the one and only Son of God who became flesh and blood for the redemption of man. Do you claim to be a Christian and not see this? he who denies the Son of God also denies the Father... Robin Edited by rbaitz |
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rbaitz
Newbie Joined: 25 March 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Islamicgirl, Have you read my post that shows the Bible does teach Jesus is the Son of God? Did you not know this before and that is why you said I wasn't being truthful? Robin |
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