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Muhammad's Marriage to Aisha

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MIAW View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MIAW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 March 2018 at 2:06am
Originally posted by Tim the plumber Tim the plumber wrote:

... Who said that God said it was fine? 

Tim,

I have already explained, in detail, how you cannot use all the norms of 'today's society' and apply them on a society that existed 1500 years ago... in a far away land. You can refer to it (and this time please read it) here:

And now you are asking where God (Allah SWT) said this... when you actually don't believe in any God. What you should really be asking (and worried) about is: what does the Qur'an say will happen (on the Day of Judgement) to any person who does not believe in Allah (God)?... to which, here is an answer: [69:25]

{25} وَ�£مَّا مَنْ �£وتِيَ كِتَابَهُ بِشِمَالِهِ فَيَقُولُ يَا لَيْتَنِي لَمْ �£وتَ كِتَابِيَهْ

And he that will be given his Record in his left hand, will say: "Ah! Would that my record had not been given to me!

{26} وَلَمْ �£دْرِ مَا حِسَابِيَهْ

"And that I had never realised how my account (stood)!"

{27} يَا ‎لَيْتَهَا كَانَتِ الْقَاضِيَةَ

"Ah! Would that (Death) had made an end of me!"

{28} مَا �£غْنَى عَنِّي مَالِيَهْ

"Of no profit to me has been my wealth!"

{29} هَلَكَ عَنِّي سُلْطَانِيَهْ

"My power has perished from me!"

{30} خُذُوهُ فَغُلُّوهُ

(The stern command will say): "Seize ye him, and bind ye him,

{31} ثُمَّ الْجَحِيمَ صَلُّوهُ

"And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire.

{32} ثُمَّ فِي سِلْسِلَةٍ ذَرْعُهَا سَبْعُونَ ذِرَاعًا فَاسْلُكُوهُ

"Further, make him march in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits!

{33} إِنَّهُ كَانَ لَا يُؤْمِنُ بِاللَّهِ الْعَظِيمِ

"This was he that would not believe in Allah Most High,

{34} وَلَا يَحُضُّ عَلَى طَعَامِ الْمِسْكِينِ

"And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent!


Quote ... if I told you that God had said that you should give me all your money...

If I told you that there is an article about you in a notice that is displayed in the Town Hall, would you not go and see what it is saying?... Well I am telling you that there are Verses in the Qur'an that 'fit your description' exactly... so what are gonna do?... wait till it's 'too late'?!!














Edited by MIAW - 04 March 2018 at 2:09am
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Russell View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Russell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 March 2018 at 8:06pm

It was never right to keep slaves despite the fact that it used to be a common practice, it was never right to treat women as second class yet, again, it has been a common practice and it was never right for an old man to sleep with a 9 year old or a 13 year old, no matter that it may have once been accepted.  If anyone tells you otherwise they are, quite simply, wrong.  If you wish to claim that your god said it was OK then I’d need to hear that from him directly.

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Tim the plumber View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim the plumber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 March 2018 at 11:36pm
Originally posted by MIAW MIAW wrote:

Originally posted by Tim the plumber Tim the plumber wrote:

... Who said that God said it was fine? 

Tim,

I have already explained, in detail, how you cannot use all the norms of 'today's society' and apply them on a society that existed 1500 years ago... in a far away land. You can refer to it (and this time please read it) here:

And now you are asking where God (Allah SWT) said this... when you actually don't believe in any God. What you should really be asking (and worried) about is: what does the Qur'an say will happen (on the Day of Judgement) to any person who does not believe in Allah (God)?... to which, here is an answer: [69:25]

{25} وَ�£مَّا مَنْ �£وتِيَ كِتَابَهُ بِشِمَالِهِ فَيَقُولُ يَا لَيْتَنِي لَمْ �£وتَ كِتَابِيَهْ

And he that will be given his Record in his left hand, will say: "Ah! Would that my record had not been given to me!

{26} وَلَمْ �£دْرِ مَا حِسَابِيَهْ

"And that I had never realised how my account (stood)!"

{27} يَا ‎لَيْتَهَا كَانَتِ الْقَاضِيَةَ

"Ah! Would that (Death) had made an end of me!"

{28} مَا �£غْنَى عَنِّي مَالِيَهْ

"Of no profit to me has been my wealth!"

{29} هَلَكَ عَنِّي سُلْطَانِيَهْ

"My power has perished from me!"

{30} خُذُوهُ فَغُلُّوهُ

(The stern command will say): "Seize ye him, and bind ye him,

{31} ثُمَّ الْجَحِيمَ صَلُّوهُ

"And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire.

{32} ثُمَّ فِي سِلْسِلَةٍ ذَرْعُهَا سَبْعُونَ ذِرَاعًا فَاسْلُكُوهُ

"Further, make him march in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits!

{33} إِنَّهُ كَانَ لَا يُؤْمِنُ بِاللَّهِ الْعَظِيمِ

"This was he that would not believe in Allah Most High,

{34} وَلَا يَحُضُّ عَلَى طَعَامِ الْمِسْكِينِ

"And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent!


Quote ... if I told you that God had said that you should give me all your money...

If I told you that there is an article about you in a notice that is displayed in the Town Hall, would you not go and see what it is saying?... Well I am telling you that there are Verses in the Qur'an that 'fit your description' exactly... so what are gonna do?... wait till it's 'too late'?!!


I know that there are veses in the Koran that describe me, the skeptic, just as there are the same sort of verses in the Bible or the communist manifesto which says that only a fool does not believe in the victory of the politeriat.

This is becaue my argument is not new. There have always been those of us who have pointed out that there is no reason to believe any of this.

The notice in the town hall, yes I would go and see it. I would want to check the evidence, to look at it and see if it was offical, what it said, who had written it, what autority it had etc.

If you tell me that there is a notice in a place I cannot check or who's authorship i cannot check why should I take the blindest bit of notice?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote adamwert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 July 2018 at 6:52pm
paedophilia in order to follow the definition of a psychological disorder (as you see in DSM criteria) would have to mean something along these lines: The sexual obsession of prepubescent children, to an extent it is debilitating to the patients every day life.  (e.g. the patient cant stop looking at pictures of children, cant control themselves around children, does things they know will get them into trouble but they cant help themselves).  This would fit the definition of a psychological disorder.  

On the other hand finding people under the age of 18 attractive is natural and normal and people who say it's not are sexually repressed/lying.  

Islam says that it's forbidden to have sex with a girl who is sexually immature so that the sex will damage her.  This is a law Islam introduced which helped people at the time.  People have historically taken that to mean the girl must have started her period and have used that as an "age" of consent for a girl.  So whatever Aishas age, she must not have been prepubescent when the marriage was consummated, otherwise the rules of Islam wouldnt have been followed.  She must have at least started puberty.    

There are many things said about mohammads sex life which are surely false, written by enemies of Islam.  Because Islam says that a couple cannot do anything in public, not even for example kissing in public.  That's forbidden it all must happen behind closed doors.  Not only this but it's forbidden to talk about what happens.  The husband cannot tell his family and friends about his sex life, nor can the wife.  So how could anyone know details about Mohammads sex life?  The answer is it's impossible and any things written about that are surely false written by people who wish to discredit Islam.  

Now on to some concepts in Islam.  Firstly Islam states that none of us are new.  In fact we all lived before as souls, and some of us met each other.  When we are a foetus Allah sends our soul into the body at a certain time.  Then we are born.  We lose most of our memory of our other life, however we keep an innate knowledge of the existence of God.  Also when we were souls we all made a pledge to God.  Because some of us met as souls we can feel closer to each other in this life also.   Maybe Mohammad and Aisha knew each other as souls and were destined to be together, in spite of the age difference.  

Miracles are also possible, God can make anything happen.  Such as God shortened the Earth for a sinner who was between the city of his sins and the city of redemption, to make him closer to the city of redemption, so he could go to paradise and not to hellfire.  If God can do that, he could do anything, including making Aisha ready for Mohammad even if she was young.  

In the modern age, Islam not only has the law saying it's forbidden to have sex with a girl who is prepubescent as the sex could harm her, but Islam also commands us to "obey those with authority amongst you" which would include obeying the age of consent in any country you are in.  As you can see most Muslim countries have an age of consent of 18.  For example in Morocco the age of consent is 18.  If a muslim has sex with a 17 year old girl then he's going against Islam in many ways.  firstly it's zina as he cant have a valid marriage to her.  Secondly it's not obeying those with authority amongst you which is another of gods commandments.  So it's not possible to have sex with a young girl and be a good muslim.  In a country with no age of consent then the absolute minimum according to Islam would be that she is not prepubescent.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tim the plumber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 July 2018 at 9:50am
Quote On the other hand finding people under the age of 18 attractive is natural and normal and people who say it's not are sexually repressed/lying. 

If that is a 15 year old girl who is confidently sexually mature then yes.

If that is an 8 year old then no. You are a pervert if you wan to have sex with an 8 year old.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote musliman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2018 at 6:30pm
Since The Holy Qur'an is The Word of Allah (SWT) (God), and Prophet Muhammad (SAW) is the final Messenger and Prophet of Allah (SWT): Prophet Muhammad's (SAW) marriage to Aisha (RA), is completely justified and sanctioned by God; So I really don't know why there should be any debate about this matter at all! 


Allahu Akbar
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