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What is the Anti-Christ in Islam

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Caringheart View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Caringheart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 11:51am
Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:


Originally posted by caringheart caringheart wrote:

He submitted to the Father, yes... to the Superior part of Himself.

Yikes.  So, he worshiped himself?  He was a man, a prophet, a worshiper of God, yet you think that he actually "submitted" to himself, but only to the "superior part".  That's the incoherence of Christian theology.

I think it is quite similar to the muslim concept of the higher jihad. Smile


Edited by Caringheart - 07 October 2014 at 12:22pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islamispeace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 11:54am
Originally posted by Caringheart Caringheart wrote:

Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:


Originally posted by caringheart caringheart wrote:

He submitted to the Father, yes... to the Superior part of Himself.

Yikes.  So, he worshiped himself?  He was a man, a prophet, a worshiper of God, yet you think that he actually "submitted" to himself, but only to the "superior part".  That's the incoherence of Christian theology.

I think it is quite similar to the muslim concept of the higher jihad. Smile


Please don't apply your blasphemous ideas to Muslims.  They are your beliefs, not ours. Tongue

Why have you been ignoring my post about Paul's overriding of Jesus' teaching about the prohibition of eating food sacrificed to idols? 


Edited by islamispeace - 07 October 2014 at 11:55am
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Caringheart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 11:54am
Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:


Originally posted by caringheart caringheart wrote:

if it was the teaching of Paul, it is because it comes from the words of Yshwe Himself, as has been shown many times, so I will spare us both by not going over it again. Smile  I already know that you do not see.  (the words of Yshwe are recorded in the Gospels to be read... and the Holy Spirit gives understanding)
If you take issue with the claim of Yshwe to be God, then you must take issue with Yshwe Himself... you must reject Yshwe... it was He that made the claim many times and many ways.
Why were the Jews so offended by Him that they sought to have Him killed?

 What a load of baloney, especially the part in bold.  How convenient it is that only those who have the "holy spirit" will "understand" the incoherent and contradictory Bible. 

Your qur'an says essentially the same...
allah guides...



Edited by Caringheart - 07 October 2014 at 12:22pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islamispeace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 11:58am
Originally posted by Caringheart Caringheart wrote:

Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:


Originally posted by caringheart caringheart wrote:

if it was the teaching of Paul, it is because it comes from the words of Yshwe Himself, as has been shown many times, so I will spare us both by not going over it again. Smile  I already know that you do not see.  (the words of Yshwe are recorded in the Gospels to be read... and the Holy Spirit gives understanding)
If you take issue with the claim of Yshwe to be God, then you must take issue with Yshwe Himself... you must reject Yshwe... it was He that made the claim many times and many ways.
Why were the Jews so offended by Him that they sought to have Him killed?

 What a load of baloney, especially the part in bold.  How convenient it is that only those who have the "holy spirit" will "understand" the incoherent and contradictory Bible. 

Your qur'an says essentially the same...
allah guides...


Um, no it doesn't.  The Quran urges people to use their common sense.  It only says that those people who have earned God's wrath have had their hearts "sealed" so that they will never believe.  But, people whom Allah has not condemned can still use their common sense.

Why do you keep ignoring my post about Paul's contradictory views on food sacrificed to idols?
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Caringheart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 12:00pm
Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:



Paul invented his own theology, but to give it appeal, he claimed to have received it from Jesus. 

That would be saying that Paul had all the Gospels...
which were written by different people, in different places and languages, in order to record eyewitness oral retelling of the events of Yshwe's life...
written.



Edited by Caringheart - 07 October 2014 at 12:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islamispeace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 12:03pm
Originally posted by Caringheart Caringheart wrote:

Originally posted by islamispeace islamispeace wrote:



Paul invented his own theology, but to give it appeal, he claimed to have received it from Jesus. 

That would be saying that Paul had all the Gospels...
which were written by different people, in different places and languages, in order to record eyewitness oral retelling of the events of Yshwe's life...
written.


Um, no.  It would be saying that Paul invented his own "gospel" and spread it around.  This "gospel" contradicted Jesus' teachings in more ways than one.

Why do you keep ignoring Paul's epic fail regarding the eating of food sacrificed to idols?  What are you afraid of?  Come on caringheart.  I say this with all seriousness.  You need to accept the truth about Paul.  He was not a true apostle. 
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Caringheart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 12:20pm
Allow me to share the Word of Yshwe, as recorded in the book of Matthew, chapter 15;

But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:

11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

21 Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.


and Mark, chapter 7

Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

14 And when he had called all the people unto him, he said unto them, Hearken unto me every one of you, and understand:

15 There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

16 If any man have ears to hear, let him hear.

17 And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable.

18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;

19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.


Now I could look at this as a teaching only on the washing of hands... and then say that Paul re-interpreted the meaning of the words of Yshwe... but I see that he only delivered the fullness of the meaning of Yshwe's Word, as he was chosen by God Himself to bring in the gentile people as well as the Jew. (You do have to study and know ALL of the scriptures to see the Truth)

I can see that Paul was called by God, so I have no problem with His teaching.

I can see no reason why a man of high standing would turn his life around to be persecuted for Christ unless something miraculous happened...

and there is the testimony of Ananais as well.  'By the witness of two is a thing established.'

Paul did not merely speak of his encounter on his own... there were witnesses.

You really must know the fullness of the scriptures.



Edited by Caringheart - 07 October 2014 at 12:21pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islamispeace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 October 2014 at 12:31pm
Originally posted by Caringheart Caringheart wrote:

Allow me to share the Word of Yshwe, as recorded in the book of Matthew, chapter 15;

But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:

11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

21 Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.


and Mark, chapter 7

Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

14 And when he had called all the people unto him, he said unto them, Hearken unto me every one of you, and understand:

15 There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

16 If any man have ears to hear, let him hear.

17 And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable.

18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;

19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.


Now I could look at this as a teaching only on the washing of hands... and then say that Paul re-interpreted the meaning of the words of Yshwe... but I see that he only delivered the fullness of the meaning of Yshwe's Word, as he was chosen by God Himself to bring in the gentile people as well as the Jew. (You do have to study and know ALL of the scriptures to see the Truth)

I can see that Paul was called by God, so I have no problem with His teaching.

I can see no reason why a man of high standing would turn his life around to be persecuted for Christ unless something miraculous happened...

and there is the testimony of Ananais as well.  'By the witness of two is a thing established.'

Paul did not merely speak of his encounter on his own... there were witnesses.

You really must know the fullness of the scriptures.



This is typical Christian incoherence.  Where was the "fullness" in Revelations when Jesus apparently condemned the churches for eating food sacrificed to idols?  Was Jesus contradicting himself?  It seems pretty clear to me that Jesus was talking about the washing of hands in Matthew.  You will notice that the Pharisees didn't harangue Jesus and his disciples for eating non-kosher food.  If they were eating something that was forbidden, the Pharisees would have been less concerned with the washing of hands.   

And as for the "witnesses" to Paul's encounter, the Bible offers contradictory information.  I already said that.  Does it ever occur to you that he simply made up the encounter and pretended that there were "witnesses"?  Who were these "witnesses"? 

You really must be afraid of the truth.  Oh well...

Originally posted by caringheart caringheart wrote:

I can see no reason why a man of high standing would turn his life around to be persecuted for Christ unless something miraculous happened...


There have been many people who have been willing to undergo persecution for something they believed in.  Does that mean that they all experienced something "miraculous". 

Many Muslims went to their deaths for believing in Islam.  They were brutally persecuted.  Muhammad (peace be upon him) himself suffered immense persecution.  He was stoned.  He was attacked.  He almost even died during one incident.  
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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