The Final Hurdle of becoming a Muslim is

Assalam Alaik nospam001,

Sorry for the very late reply.

nospam001 wrote: By looking only at English translations, am I missing a crucial difference in meaning which would have been obvious in Arabic, even to a non-believer? In other words, why do English translations of Islamic texts use the word "just" when describing Allah(), given that it is meaningless to do so?

I'm not sure what you mean by "just". Maybe give an example from the Quran.

About reading translations of the Quran, some verses will seem to give different meanings. But it's good to read several translations to get a better understanding (you probably do this already), and even ask someone that can read arabic to explain what a word or verse means. When reading the Quran in arabic, the reader obtaines the original and obviously the most accurate meaning. Arabic is such a rich language and the holy Quran makes full use of it. And as you know, the Quran is written in classical arabic known as arabic "foss-ha" (that's one word btw).

The Quran is amazing when read in Arabic. No man-written poetry dares compete or even come close. In all those years and still, nothing has ever come close to it's quality in style, content and consistency. As they say "It's out of this world". There is no doubt that these are the words of our Creator.

Not sure if that answers your question but I tried.

Edited by Rational - 02 March 2013 at 2:34pm

Here's a bit more on divine justice, thanks to Wikipedia.

The Shias believe that there is intrinsic good or evil in things, and that God commands them to do the good things and shun the evil. They believe that God acts according to a purpose or design, and human reason cannot comprehend this design or purpose in its entirety (though man must always strive to understand as much as he can). The Sunni School of thought does not consider Justice of God as part of Uṣūl ad-Dīn (fundamentals of faith). It subscribes to the view that nothing is good or evil per se, and that what God commanded people to do became good by virtue of his command, and what he forbade became evil. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adalah

It would be a tautology for a Sunni to say "Allah() is just". That sentence is true by definition and therefore conveys absolutely no useful information. It is logically impossible for Him to do what is 'not just'. The Problem of Evil is 'solved' by declaring a word to mean something else. We may need a special Sunni dictionary, but at least it places no demands on Faith.

By contrast, the Shia does not rely on flexible semantics. Allah() could easily do what is not just, but He always chooses not to. This is acknowledged as an article of Faith. Stuff only seems unjust to the extent that we don't understand Allah's purpose or design. I don't subscribe to this view, obviously, but at least it's open to further discussion.

nospam001 wrote: Here's a bit more on divine justice, thanks to Wikipedia. The Shias believe that there is intrinsic good or evil in things, and that God commands them to do the good things and shun the evil. They believe that God acts according to a purpose or design, and human reason cannot comprehend this design or purpose in its entirety (though man must always strive to understand as much as he can). The Sunni School of thought does not consider Justice of God as part of Uṣūl ad-Dīn (fundamentals of faith). It subscribes to the view that nothing is good or evil per se, and that what God commanded people to do became good by virtue of his command, and what he forbade became evil. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adalah It would be a tautology for a Sunni to say "Allah() is just". That sentence is true by definition and therefore conveys absolutely no useful information. It is logically impossible for Him to do what is 'not just'. The Problem of Evil is 'solved' by declaring a word to mean something else. We may need a special Sunni dictionary, but at least it places no demands on Faith. By contrast, the Shia does not rely on flexible semantics. Allah() could easily do what is not just, but He always chooses not to. This is acknowledged as an article of Faith. Stuff only seems unjust to the extent that we don't understand Allah's purpose or design. I don't subscribe to this view, obviously, but at least it's open to further discussion.

Interesting. However, I don't agree with the claims from Wikipedia regarding this subject that shia believe this and sunnis believe that. There are varying opinions on both sides amongs people.

For me, a muslim trusts in Allah and submits to Him. For a muslim, Allah is the very definition of justice. He is just. He doesn't answer to us, we answer to Him. He is the judge, we do not judge Him. He knows what is just, we don't. He tells us what is just, we follow.

Rational wrote: Interesting. However, I don't agree with the claims from Wikipedia regarding this subject that shia believe this and sunnis believe that. There are varying opinions on both sides amongs people. For me, a muslim trusts in Allah and submits to Him. For a muslim, Allah is the very definition of justice. He is just. He doesn't answer to us, we answer to Him. He is the judge, we do not judge Him. He knows what is just, we don't. He tells us what is just, we follow.

I agree that one's actual beliefs are not necessarily the same as any particular set of orthodox teachings. Indeed, your own opinions on divine justice would serve as a powerful example, assuming you have ever disagreed with Sunni doctrine on any other matter.