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Divorce
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Nausheen View Drop Down
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Points: 4251 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nausheen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2012 at 10:48pm
Originally posted by Caringheart Caringheart wrote:


Greetings Nausheen,� [IMG]smileys/smiley1.gif" align="absmiddle" alt="Smile" />"It is said in the Quran that divorce is one of the most disliked things to Allah for which He has granted permissibility."Yes, in this, the Bible and the Quran are in agreement.
6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
So if we do not have hardness of heart and are truly followers belonging to God we will seek always reconciliation not divorce.�� With exceptions as you mentioned of course, legal divorce is permissable(in the terms of the law), but spiritually I believe, in the eyes of God, the union between one man and one woman is permanent and anything after is still adultery in the eyes of God depending our our spiritual condition(our hearts).� God however has the authority to forgive our sins and it will be His judgement on judgement day, whether or not our hearts were towards Him or towards our selves.Salaam and blessings to you,Caringheart


Greetings Caringheart,

Islam is not just spirituality. Its a way of life which includes spirituality, law, society etc.

Islamically a marriage contract between two people is a social contract as well. If they are not 'social' with eachother, 'lawfully' ie; according to religious laws they can divorce.
Since God gives the permisibility for divorce, this means according to the religious laws their divorce is valid, acceptable and correct. Later when such two people re-marry, this is viewed as a legal union between two people - not adultery.
I think Islam and christianity differ hugely at this point.

I would not always call it a hardness of heart between two people when they are incompatible. It is very much possible for two good individuals that they are incompatible with each other.
In cases when people have sincerely tried a number of things and their relationship does not work, its better to separate on goodly terms than to live together making life impossible for each other.

If one partner is trying hard to improve the relationship while the other is negligent of the same then, when this partner gives up ultimately, I would again not call it their hardness of heart - rather a consciousness of heart and a sensitivity towards quality of life.



<font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa

Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena

wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR]
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Abu Loren View Drop Down
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Points: 1646 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2012 at 11:00pm
Originally posted by lady lady wrote:

I personally think that in countries where divorce rates are low, it does not mean that the people are happily married. Staying married for a long time does not mean that both people are happy. I can not imagine myself being married to someone for many many years and not be happy. So I am thankful that I live in a society where I can freely get divorced if there is a need to do so.
You mentioned that in Pakistan, the divorce rates are lower than in india but due to the fact that pakistan is more of an islamic country than in india.
If this is true, it still does not mean that those who are staying married are actually happy.   Usually in these countries the mistreatment of women are so apparent that as a result it is expected for them to stay with their husbands. For example: I know in pakistan, it is frown upon for most woman in certain regions of pakistan to remarry even after the fact that her husband may have died. So can you imagine what will happened if she gets remarried to a man after divorce?
I think in any of these countries, if you give those women jobs where they can provide enough money to independently support themselves, then you will see an extreme hike of divorce rates  as well.
I have friends from all over the world, and the ones who never left their husbands when they should have, have suffered alot as a result of divorce not being allowed or frown upon in their country.
 
Now, why divorce rates are so high in certain countries? I think that there are many reasons.  One reason could be that people are marrying others for wrong  superficial or selfish reasons.  For example, let's say that my main drive for marrying a guy is that he is extremely handsome.  It is obvious that if this is my main drive for this marriage, then why would I be shocked  later when I find out that  he is not compatible with me? Or a guy nowadays, may want to marry a woman because she has money and she can help him pay his bills. At the same time, he neglects to improve himself as a husband and as a muslim.  It does not matter what the reasons are, the end result is that people are living away from practicing their true faith.  How can something work well, if we forget about our main focus in life which is to rightfully worship Allah.
I personally dont think that marriage is hard most of the times at all.  You have to work to stay happy like you have to work hard to stay physically healthy etc.
 
 
It's the other way round, divorce rates are HIGH in Pakistan and LOW in India.
 
What I was getting at is that because the reason why the divorce rate is high in Pakistan is because it is permissable and it is normal, whereas it is still a taboo in India.
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Matt Browne View Drop Down
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Points: 937 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt Browne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2012 at 11:03pm
Abu Loren,
Can you give me some examples of your sources from the Hadith showing the good relationship between the Prophet and Sawda bint Zam'a?
A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt
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Abu Loren View Drop Down
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Points: 1646 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abu Loren Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2012 at 11:10pm
Originally posted by Matt Browne Matt Browne wrote:

Abu Loren,
Can you give me some examples of your sources from the Hadith showing the good relationship between the Prophet and Sawda bint Zam'a?

 
No because there is nothing much about Sawda in the Hadiths except the one narrated by Ai'sha (RA) that Sawda gave up her visiting rights because she felt she was too old. There is no indication that the Prophet (Salallahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and Sawda were unhappy in their marriage.
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Matt Browne View Drop Down
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Points: 937 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt Browne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 November 2012 at 3:35am
Thanks for the clarification, Abu Loren. Then the other sources must indeed be wrong. That's why I asked the question.
A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt
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Al Saadiqeen21 View Drop Down
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Abu Loren  This how knowldge-able Muslims Explains things  according to the doctrine / Holy Qur'aan of Allahu Subhaanahu Wa Ta 'Ala Most Glorified And Exalted .. Without Attacking / Insulting people which only show your Insecurity
 
Talaaq , Or Divorce is from the Arabic root word Talaq meaning ''To Fill , Being Set Loose From A Bond , To Divorce ''.  Divorce in Al Islaam although permitted is made to be discouraged and only as a last Resort . Only under certain circumstances and of good cause is Divorce Accepted . Either the Wife or the Husband can claim Divorce.
 
If a Woman wised to do so , She may return Her Dowry upon the decision of Divorce. However , The Holy Qur'aan does not allow the man to take the Dowry from her . In order to file for a Divorce, According to Islamic Laws, Certain stipulation must be followed . For instance Divorce is not permissible if the Woman is Pregnant , or on her menses . Since Divorce is Frowned Upon , It is not final until Four Months after the Divorce was declared . This waiting period will allow the couple a chance for Reconciliation .
 
The Holy Qur'aan 4 ; 4 , 24 -25 Revealed In The Year 625 - 627 A.D. Al Nisaa ( The Enosite Women ) Says , And give Al Nisaa-a 'The Enosite Women , Saduqaatihinna 'Their Dowries , as a Nahlatan 'Gift -Free Will Offering ; so if they allow for you all ( males ) any of the Dowry willingly , so you , ( the males ) are welcome to it , with enjoyment . Verses 24 . And ( also , forbidden unto you are ) Al Muhsanaat 'The Chaste', from the Enosit women ( women who marry as Virgins ) , except for those who you rule by your right hand ( women under your care ) Allah has Kitaaba 'Inscribed , ( in His scriptures by his hands ; for you all and Unilla 'Make Lawful for you all that which is behind for you all , that you all should seek by way of your wealth Muhsineen 'Chaste , Virgins without haveing Musaafiheem 'Premarital Sex and as whom you all have enjoyed by way of it from amongst them , you all are to give them for a limited period .Itis a duty . And there is no crime upon you all in that which whom you all have enjoyed by way of it from after the duty . Surely , The Source Allah is Aliymaan 'Knowing Hakiymaan 'All Wise . Verse 25 . And those if you who are unable , ( not rich enought ) to marry chaste , Enosite women , who are faithful ; then marry those , from amongst the faithful maidens , young Virgins, whom your right hand possesses , ( women under your care ) , for The Source , Allah knows ( best ) your true faith ; how some of you are from others of you - ( Tribes And Families , And Kin ) . So marry them with the permission of their family , and given them their Dowries in fairness , and kindness . They must be chaste women , Virgins , not Musaafihaat 'Fornicators - ( Enosites having premarital sex ) , nor taking ( having ) Akhdaanin 'Secret Affairs . So when they had been chaste women , ( not having had premarital sex ) , so if they bring Faahishat 'Obscene ( indecncy ) , so they are only entitled to have half the punishment , ( pain of Hell . That which is inscribed for the chaste women , virgins ) , That is for hm amongst you all , who dreads falling into evil , and you should be patient ; it is good , for you And The Source , is Ghafuwrun 'Forgiving , Rahiymun 'Most Merciful .
 
The Holy Qur'aan 2 ; 237  Revealed In The Year 624 - 626 A.D. Al Baqarah ( The Heifer )
, Says ; And if you Divorce them before you have Touched Them ( sexually ) , but after having decided the Dowry , then you should give them half of the promised payments , except if they pardon it or he , ( the groom ) , relinquishes the whole Dowry by way of him who holds the marriage contract . To relinquish his way is more righteous for those who tremble at the mention of The Source Allah and don't forget the favor between yourselves Surely , The Source , Allah sees all that you do .
 
The Holy Qur'aan 2 ; 227, 230 -231,  Revealed In The Year 624 - 626 A.D. Al Baqarah ( The Heifer ) , Says ; And if they decide on Al Talaaq 'Divorce , then surely He The Source , Allah is a Samiy'un Hearing , 'Aliymun All Knowing Allah . Verse 230 , So if , he Divorces her , she is not lawful for him until after ( his former wife ) marries a husband other than him . So if ( the second husband ) Divorces her, then it is not a crime ( sin ) on them , ( the Divorce woman and her formal husband ) , if they return ( to each other ) ; if they think that they can unkeep the limits of The Source , Allah ; He makes them clear for a kindred who know . Verse 231 . And when you Divorced women and they had reached their prescobed time ( for Divorce , which is Four Months ) , then either retain them ( to live in your house ) in fairness , or set them free in fairness ; and don't retain them ( the Divorced women ) to hurt them or to exceed ( the time ) and as for him who does this , indeed his spirit is in a state of unjustness ; and don't take the signs of Allah , as something to mock and remember the grace of The Source on you , and what He The Source sent down to you all of the scriptures ( Qur'aan ) , and Al Hikmah 'The Wisdom , He admonishes you by it ; and tremble at the mention of The Source and know that in all things , Allah is Aliymun 'Ever Knowing . ( Also refer to verses 232 - 241 , Refering to Remarriage After Divorce Provision For Divorces ) .
 
The Holy Qur'aan 65 ; 1 Revealed In The Year 627 - 628 A.D.  Talaaq ( The Divorce ) , Says ; O you , Al Nabiyy 'The Newsbearer ( Muhammad ) when ( you and your followers ) Tallaqtum 'Divorce , Al Nisaa 'The ( Enosite ) Women so Talliquwhunna 'Divorce Them for 'Iddatihinna 'Divorce Them for Iddatihinna 'Their Prescribed Term ( which is three months ) and count the prescribed term ; and tremble at the ment of The Source Allah your Rabb ; don't make them go from their Buyuwt 'House , and they shouldn't leave except if they come with clear Faahishat 'Abominable ( Dishonorable , Evils ) Deeds ; and these are the Huduwd 'Limits , of The Source Allah and whoever transgresses the limits of The Source , Allah , so indeed he has made himself Dhalama 'Unjust . You don't know that perhaps The Source Allah will brings a Hadiyth 'Tale after that Amr ' Affair , Command ( he may change the situation and you want to get back together ) .
 
The Prophet Muhammad ( Pbuh ) and his followers are to count ( The Enosites Women 'Iddah ) , If they Divorce Them , Be kind to ( The Women ) after their Iddah , The Source is Sufficient for he who puts his trust in him , For the ( Women ) , Who have reached Menopause , Their fixed term is Three Months , And the Ahmaal is after their pregnancy , Have two male watchers who will be just , The Source has the power to make everything happen , You are to let The Women dwell whereever you dwell , The Source will make things Yusraam , After the Usr , The Heavenly Host will hold account the villages that disobeyed with a shadiyd chastisement , The Source Allah has sent The Holy Qur'aan as a reminder , Also refer to Holy Qur'aan 2 ; 1 - 10 .
 
Ahmad recites The Holy Qur'aan , So perhaps you all will perfect yourselves and get out of the zulumaat , There is jannat for those who work to perfect themselves , The Source is he who Khalaq The Samaawaat And Earth , The Source is qadiyr over everything , He surrounds everything with his Knowldge . Also refer to Holy Qur'aan 2 ; 11 - 12 ,
 
One doesn't go to school let His / her's mind to die , They go to school so that their mind will come alive .

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