Hijab - Freedom NOT Oppression : Opinion |
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Caringheart
Senior Member Joined: 02 March 2012 Status: Offline Points: 2991 |
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Good point Matt. It can not be considered modest if one is calling attention to oneself, no matter in what way it is being done. Much like when Paul said, 'if it offends your companion for you to eat meat, then do not eat meat'... do not cause offense... consider the other persons position on the matter. [paraphrased] and I was thinking; We must live according to the culture in which we find ourselves. much as any non-Muslim in Saudi Arabia, or any country where Islamic law is enforced, must do. They must not cause offense. |
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hakeema
Groupie Female Joined: 10 October 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 98 |
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@Matt What are non-Muslim cultures and dress code? Do you feel that the Muslims on Islamicity don't respect non-Muslim culture and dress code? Do you feel that the Muslims that you met or congregated with disrespects non-Muslim culture and dress code? Did you a interview Muslims living in non-Muslim countries to come up with this conclusion? I am a African-American(black)muslim women living in the west who wear hijabs(not face veil)and fully covers her body. I CONVERTED to Islam by the way. I bother no one, never broken the law, and planning to go to medical school in the near future. It is many more Muslims in the west who are like me. So I would like to know how am I disrespecting the non-Muslim culture and dress code? Since I converted do you think I am showing disrespect to the west since it is not a non-Muslim country? On your profile it says that you are Christian. Are there are things in your religion that is forbidden and frowned up which is considered OK in non-Muslim countries? If so, would you disobey your religion in order to follow the culture and dress code of non-Christian countries? Do you feel that Christians should be going into non-Christian countries to try to get people to convert to their religion when they have there traditional cultural religion? Do you find their actions disrespectful? As a Christian how do feel about what Christians have done to disrespect the cultural and dress codes of Africans, Native Americans throughout history? Speaking of Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan. How do you feel about George Bush and many other oil company doing business in Saudi Arabia? How do you feel about the business relationship between the Bush Family and the Bin Laden family? What about the business deals done in Afghanistan? According to news reports U.S. companies invited the Taliban(before 9/11)to the U.S. to discussion business deal in building a pipe line through Afghanistan. How do you feel about that? Edited by hakeema - 12 August 2012 at 12:56pm |
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Matt Browne
Senior Member Male Joined: 19 April 2010 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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Hakeema, I'm fully aware that there are two groups of women when it comes to wearing face veils. One group chooses to wear it and the other group is forced by their husbands to wear it. Just because you choose to wear it doesn't mean there are no women who are forced to wear it.
The vitamin D part is a side issue, though an important one. The key issue here is that Muslims don't respect non-Muslim cultures and dress codes when living in the Dar al-harb. And we people in the West are so foolish that we even tolerate intolerance. Allah hates us. Devout Muslims hate us and we say, oh, that's their culture and we have to respect different cultures. We can't change the fact that women in Saudi Arabia and southern Afghanistan are treated like cattle. But we won't have any of this in Detroit, London, Paris, Madrid and Berlin. And that's not racist. That is defending values and our freedom and human rights. Edited by Matt Browne - 12 August 2012 at 3:51am |
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A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt |
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Matt Browne
Senior Member Male Joined: 19 April 2010 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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Honeto, covering arms and the face is not fulfilling a religious obligation. A modest dress is all that is needed. And this can be a jeans and a t-shirt.
Let's take the situation in Western countries. A modest person does not draw attention to their own real or supposed accomplishments and desirable attributes. But Muslim women wearing full-body covers including face veils are doing exactly that. They are not modest. They are boastful telling everyone: Look, here, a member of the world's best religion. |
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A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt |
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Matt Browne
Senior Member Male Joined: 19 April 2010 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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You're missing the point, Chrysalis. If the same rules apply for both men and women there is no unfairness. In windy desert areas protecting the face can make sense. In Germany when men and women drive motorcycles they both wear helmets. Inuit men and women protect themselves against icy winds covering their faces. I'm talking about places like Cairo, Riyadh, Kandahar and London. Muslim men are part of public life and women are reduced to identically looking ghosts without an individual personality. And Allah sends them to hell if they don't obey their husbands. We won't have any of this in our Western countries and good Christian men and women will continue to fight for the rights of Muslim women in our countries. Our values count too. Muslims can't assume their values replace the values of everyone else. Edited by Matt Browne - 12 August 2012 at 3:48am |
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A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt |
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hakeema
Groupie Female Joined: 10 October 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 98 |
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@Caringheart, What are you talking about? Have you ever studied the real history of Africa? Do you know about Kingdoms of Africa such Kush, Nubia, Mali, Dogon, Songhay and Kemet(Egypt)etc? Did you know that these kingdoms had there own schools, writing systems, governmental structure and wore pretty clothing etc. Have you ever gone to Africa? Did you know in Ghana and Nigeria that the average temp is 80 degrees? Edited by hakeema - 11 August 2012 at 4:07pm |
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hakeema
Groupie Female Joined: 10 October 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 98 |
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@Matt, For the record their are women who have low Vitamin D and they don't dress fully covered at all. So, is this really about Muslim women getting enough Vitamin D or do you have a problem with muslim women being fully covered? If you do have a problem with muslim women who dress fully covered what do you plan to do to muslim women who wears Hijab? For the record, Many of us(including myself) fully cover out of obedience to Allah not because men tell us to. |
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honeto
Senior Member Male Islam Joined: 20 March 2008 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 2487 |
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Fulfilling religious obligations are not for people that live on excuses. Even accepting God as their creator can be a problem for them. Human body is very capable of adjusting to environment and to food. Faith and trust in the fact that God has not put on us anything we cannot bear is a believer's best fulfilling source against any deficiencies, psychological or physical. Take fasting for example: in other months when we (muslims) don't fast, I get thirsty very easy as my body needs a lot of water ( I normally consume 6-10 glasses of water) and if I don't drink water for a few hours I cannot function properly. This year we are experiencing Ramadan (fasting month)right now (July-August). In these hot days of South Texas when the temperature stays above 100F everyday, to not to drink a single drop of water during the day light heat and functioning normal is amazing, isn't it. Not only that, the books you read will tell you its not a good thing to do. But I, like many practicing Muslims have been fasting since I was little, I still am pretty healthy. In fact during fast, somehow (I call it with the help of Allah) the day goes better, my body seem to go through a natural overhaul because the blood pressure and heart beat reading come absolute normal, better than other times. All my senses seem to respond better than other times, not to mention many many other benefits. I can tell you that despite lack of any food or water intake all day (16 hours)all of that is amazing, isn't it? I guess it all comes, when you truly believe, otherwise it can a burden hard to fulfill and can hurt you. 2:286 (Asad) God does not burden any human being with more than he is well able to bear: in his favour shall be whatever good he does, and against him whatever evil he does. Hasan Edited by honeto - 11 August 2012 at 12:18pm |
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The friends of God will certainly have nothing to fear, nor will they be grieved. Al Quran 10:62
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