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When is Torture Justified?

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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 August 2011 at 5:11pm
Originally posted by abuayisha abuayisha wrote:

Well than perhaps I have misunderstood your golden rule application, "If we say that it's okay for us to use torture against them, then what will we say when they use torture against us."
Perhaps, but I don't see how it could be any more plain. The Golden Rule says "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."  If the situation were reversed, i.e. if they were holding you prisoner, would you have them torture you?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abuayisha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 August 2011 at 7:22pm
Yes, but my question was regarding ideologues such as Nazis, political terrorists and their likes.  I fail to see how 'do unto others....' is applicable in that discussion. It hardly holds water with countries who are signatories to the Geneva Conventions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 August 2011 at 7:50pm
Why would it not be applicable?
Let me emphasize, because so many people don't understand the Golden Rule: it's not ""do unto others as they do unto you", it's "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."  Their behaviour has nothing whatsoever to do with it.  You do what you think is right, and the test for what is right is according to how you would react if the same thing were done to you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abuayisha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 August 2011 at 8:49pm

Fair enough Ron, however I have found life to be pretty much nuanced and not so rigid.  I think some situations call for an approach we certainly wouldn't want for ourselves, but its the right thing to do just the same.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 August 2011 at 4:48pm
Originally posted by abuayisha abuayisha wrote:

Fair enough Ron, however I have found life to be pretty much nuanced and not so rigid. I think some situations call for an approach we certainly wouldn't want for ourselves, but its the right thing to do just the same.
There's nothing "nuanced" about torture.  I don't see how we can condemn torture when others use it, while reserving the right to use it ourselves.  It sounds a lot like hypocrisy to me.

Edited by Ron Webb - 04 August 2011 at 4:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hayfa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 August 2011 at 7:02pm
I agree Ron.. how many times has there been torture to get info, and people just lie.. heck they get false confessions under all types of threats.

its a fine line between punishment and torture.. what is deemed cruel etc..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abuayisha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 August 2011 at 8:10pm
Well what I'm talking about is the "ticking bomb" scenario of possible harm to many; are we to concern ourselves with one individual at the expense of many innocents?  What is worse, to be labeled a hypocrite or slaughter of people? This is not advocacy for a policy of torture, but concern over public safety.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2011 at 3:41pm
The "ticking bomb" is the danger to all of us when we legitimize torture.  If we're using it ourselves, how much more likely do you think others would be to use it against us?  How seriously do you think our governments will be taken if they protest on our behalf?
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