IslamiCity.org Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Regional > Asia-Pacific
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Perso-Arabic script on Pakistani Vessel. Urdu?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login


Perso-Arabic script on Pakistani Vessel. Urdu?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message
Kashigar View Drop Down
Starter
Starter


Joined: 25 February 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 7
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kashigar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Perso-Arabic script on Pakistani Vessel. Urdu?
    Posted: 25 February 2010 at 4:49pm

Hello Folks,

Looking for some direction for the script used on a pot in my possession. The pot is either from Sindh or Multan & most likely from the late 19th century. I had one Urdu knowledgable chap take a look at it - but he could make out only a few words.  There are chips to the script that encircle the vessel which makes it more difficult. At any rate, I would be most grateful if someone could at least recognize the language that is being used. Thanks in advance for any thoughts, suggestions or input.

 
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
Kashigar View Drop Down
Starter
Starter


Joined: 25 February 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 7
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kashigar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 March 2010 at 1:04pm
Can anybody read any words at all?  Even to rule in or rule out the language as either Urdu, Saraiki, or Sindhi  - would be an immense help!
 
Shukran Gazillan  -  Bahut Bahut shukria  - Thank you very much!!!!


Edited by Kashigar - 06 March 2010 at 1:05pm
Back to Top
Chrysalis View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 25 November 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 2036
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chrysalis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 March 2010 at 8:10am
Well it is definitely in the Urdu Script (Urdu Script is almost the same as Arabic with just a few alphabet difference). Saraiki & Sindhi is also written in the same script, with common words so it may be difficult to identify unless words can be read properly.

It is very hard to read it (atleast for me, because of the chipping and the writing itself)

Picture 1 is the clearest though. And I am pretty sure it says "Dukaandar Muhammad Ishaaq" - which translates to "Shopkeeper Muhammad Ishaaq". (Probably denoting name of shopkeeper )

2nd Picture: Can only make out first word, "Wafadaari" which means "Faithfulness". The second word may be "Nu" which is used in Saraiki. Don't know meaning. Though I am not sure it says "Nu" - because it is only a "Dot" away from being "Tu" which means "You". Although if you could confirm it is indeed "Nu" - it is for sure a Saraiki word.

3rd Picture: Again, can make out first word "Yaari" - which means "Friendship" but can also denote "romantic relations".

4th Picture: Can make out second word "Duniya" - which means "World".

Hope that helps, that is all I could gather.






Edited by Chrysalis - 20 March 2010 at 8:14am
"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
Back to Top
Chrysalis View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 25 November 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 2036
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chrysalis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 March 2010 at 8:35am
PS: My father seems to think it is probably Persian ! (like I said, same script and similar words)

His version:
  • dukandar (shopkeeper) mohammad ishaq
  • wafadarai (loyalty) shaweedam
  • yari (friendship) nadeedam agaredam
So now you have one more possibility on the list. lol !


"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
Back to Top
Kashigar View Drop Down
Starter
Starter


Joined: 25 February 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 7
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kashigar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 March 2010 at 12:47pm
Hi Chrysalis - thanks so much to you & your Dad for your time & translation help!
 
I looked at the inscriptions carefully again and edited the photos by 'whitening in' areas of script that I thought might be unclear from a distant viewer's perspective. This may help(or not) to identify or confirm another word or two .... but my suspicion is that 'Shopkeeper Mohammad Ishaq' is the real gem & only identifying information provided  by he who created it - the other lines of script being some kind/auspicious words for the end purchaser of the pottery vase. Perhaps it was commissioned for a special occasion or wedding at one time - hard to say. 
 
Quite sure that it is from either Halla, Tatta or Multan though .....
 
Bahut Bahut shukria 
Back to Top
Kashigar View Drop Down
Starter
Starter


Joined: 25 February 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 7
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kashigar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 December 2010 at 8:06pm
 Hi Folks,
 
I have another vessel of Pakistani origin that needs translation. This one is almost certainly from Hala & made pre-partition. Since the calligraphy encircles the vessel, I have made a collage of photos(you will have to scroll to your right to see all the images) that follow the words in sequence around the vase. If anybody can idea the phrases, a few words, or even the language used - I would most grateful once again. Thank you all in advance.
 
hc
 
 


Edited by Kashigar - 01 December 2010 at 8:11pm
Back to Top
Chrysalis View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 25 November 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 2036
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chrysalis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 December 2010 at 9:54pm
While I could read/comprehend some words. I have no clue what it is saying.

Urdu can be ruled out.

It could be Pashto, Persian OR Saraiki. All have same script and some common vocabulary.

They do look a lot like poetic verses. From the choice of words it seems like a lovelorn poetry of some sort.

"Ya Ilaahi" Oh Lord. (used only for God)

"Sang dil" - stone-hearted/ hard-hearted/  "Mahboob" - beloved/loved one

"Pareshan" - anxious/worried

"Mom dil" - soft hearted. (Mom literally means candle-wax hence heart as soft as candle-wax. It is also used sometimes to say, my heart melted (with sympathy or love). Mom-dil is the antonym of Sang-dil. Maybe author is comparing himself to his cruel beloved....lol.

"Shams" - sun.

"Khuda khwahi" - Khuda is God in persian but don't know how to explain full word. It may mean 'spirituality'. One who turns to God.

"Khush" - happy

"Masjid guzaari" - Masjid - mosque. Full word could mean, spending time in the Mosque OR frequenting the mosque.

"Naubahar Gul" - is definitely a name. Sounds like a Pashtun/Pathhan name. Of a female I think. (means everblooming flower. However even men may be called 'Gul' flower.)

"Ya Rabb" - Oh God.

"Bhaij" - send

"Tayyar shud" - ready (manufactured, made)

"school of" - Those words simple say 'school of' in the arabic script. Why would they use an english phrase? might not be that old after all. Its not very common to mix english words in classical poetry. Strange.

"Judda" - separate.

Hope that helps. Btw just curious, why are you interested in what it says?









Edited by Chrysalis - 02 December 2010 at 10:01pm
"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
Back to Top
Chrysalis View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 25 November 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 2036
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chrysalis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 December 2010 at 10:03pm

I circled the words on the image in paint. But i cannot figure out how to upload an image....

PS: The design seems like that of classical multani pottery. It may be from Multan. And Saraiki is spoken in Multan.


Edited by Chrysalis - 02 December 2010 at 10:06pm
"O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young."
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.