|
God in Evangelical Christianity |
Post Reply 
|
Page <12345 6> |
| Author | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
copenhagen 
Groupie 
Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 54 |
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote Reply
 Posted: 29 July 2005 at 9:27pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
dupe post -- too quick with the mouse click. Oops.
Edited by copenhagen |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Some people before you asked questions, and on that account lost their faith.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
copenhagen
Groupie
Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 54 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 29 July 2005 at 9:28pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Nope, sorry, you have quoted a lot of verses, and said lots of words, but the connection that JESUS = GOD is still wide open. I fail to see even the begining that would make one believe that Jesus thought himself God. This is a HUGE problem. For a man to equate himself with God, while not equating all humans with God is paradox extreme. Are you sure you are willing and fit to take the challenge? It's been fought over for centuries, amoungst the best of minds. Are you saying you are the smartest person who has ever walked the face of earth who can solve this riddle once and for all? I ALWAYS assume that the person speaking to me is smarter than myself. But, when one claims to be smarter than every human on the face of the earth for the past 2,000 years, I have to question the claim. So, Apple Pie, are you the ONE who will forever give clarity to this issue? Will you prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Jesus is the cornerstone of Faith, and that Jesus is in FACT God almighty? Just want to clarify your position. As I said, I assume you are smarter than me, so I want to know where you are taking this thread. So far, you have failed miserabley, so I just thought I should point that out. Peace, Sam |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Some people before you asked questions, and on that account lost their faith.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Orthodox
Newbie 
Joined: 31 October 2003 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 30 July 2005 at 10:31am |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Apple Pie, you have failed to acknowledge the difference between flesh and spirit ..... Jesus, the son of Mary, the son of man, was flesh, created, material, ... God is spirit, eternal, uncreated, without-material ..... Now when you refer to Jesus, are you referring to the MAN that walked the earth, ate, slept, drank, and spent 9 months in Mary's womb, and 33 years through the growth cycle of infancy-childhood-adolescance-adulthood; or are you referring to the spirit, God, who is never called Jesus, but is called YHWH, Jehovah, Elohim, Adonai, Alaha? You quote all of those verses trying to equate Jesus and God, yet don't even try to explain who and what Jesus was, and how he was what you claim he was ..... he was nothing but material-flesh-man created by God. Jesus had God, a spirit dwell with him and within him, no different than you and I ..... once you put this within the context of all of the things you quoted, than you can clearly see how Jesus is not God, because God is not a physical-man nor is God created. Nor is God flesh. So my challenge to you is to put into context what I have said regarding the difference between flesh and spirit, and put it into context with all of that which you have quoted. For example:
Remember, Jesus and God are spiritually one, and their agenda is one, and their message is one, and God dwells with and within Jesus spiritually, however, physically they are not one and the same, because God is not a physical entity, nor is God flesh; there is still that aspect of Jesus which is fleshly-carnal (ie. being tempted by satan, asking God to take the cup away from him, why have you forsaken me etc. -- according to Christian doctines) ....
Apple Pie, its been years, how are you? Remember when we had that long debate a couple of years ago, on a totally different website, and in that thread you posted about how the Quran plagerized from the Book of Revelation, and you kept posting the similarities? And then I started posting in that same thread how the authors of the NT copied and plagerized from the Torah and the Tanach, posting word for word copies, literally word for word, and also basically the same essence in message copying too ....
I also have wrath ....
Absolutly wrong, unless you admit that the Bible contradicts itself because according to the following verse, the son does not know the hour:
"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angles which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark
There is a huge difference between the Christian doctrine of Jesus being the resurrection and Allah doing the resurrection, ie. resurrecting those who have died; on the day of Qiyamah ....
What a great proof to show Jesus is God? Orthodox also abhors idols ...
I am also patient.
The verses you quoted above do not at all promote the idea "repent to Jesus" .....
The verse you quoted above do not promote the idea : "Jesus knows your deeds"
Jesus was flesh, God is spirit. You fail to revere and worship the spirit. You worship a man. You worship a creation of God. You worship the flesh of Jesus.
Edited by Orthodox |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Apple Pie
Guest Group 
Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 138 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 30 July 2005 at 7:30pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Greetings Orthodox, Thanks for your reply� Apple Pie, its been years, how are you? Remember when we had that long debate a couple of years ago, on a totally different website, and in that thread you posted about how the Quran plagerized from the Book of Revelation, and you kept posting the similarities? And then I started posting in that same thread how the authors of the NT copied and plagerized from the Torah and the Tanach, posting word for word copies, literally word for word, and also basically the same essence in message copying too .... Show us the links�. Apple Pie, you have failed to acknowledge the difference between flesh and spirit ..... Jesus, the son of Mary, the son of man, was flesh, created, material, ... God is spirit, eternal, uncreated, without-material ..... Jesus was not created. This is validated in both the Holy Bible and then later copied into the Koran� Now when you refer to Jesus, are you referring to the MAN that walked the earth, ate, slept, drank, and spent 9 months in Mary's womb, and 33 years through the growth cycle of infancy-childhood-adolescance-adulthood; or are you referring to the spirit, God, who is never called Jesus, but is called YHWH, Jehovah, Elohim, Adonai, Alaha? Jesus is the physical manifestation of God. Jesus is God in the flesh. You quote all of those verses trying to equate Jesus and God, yet don't even try to explain who and what Jesus was, and how he was what you claim he was ..... he was nothing but material-flesh-man created by God. Jesus had God, a spirit dwell with him and within him, no different than you and I ..... once you put this within the context of all of the things you quoted, than you can clearly see how Jesus is not God, because God is not a physical-man nor is God created. Nor is God flesh. You need to read your book of faith. The �conception� of Jesus, by the Holy Spirit, is the same in both the Holy Bible and in the Koran�as defined by the Book of Luke�thus, He was not �created� as normal humans are. Jesus is God . Period. This is clearly stated in both the Holy Bible and in your book of faith. Its time to stop following Islam and to start following your book of faith. So my challenge to you is to put into context what I have said regarding the difference between flesh and spirit, and put it into context with all of that which you have quoted. For example:
Remember, Jesus and God are spiritually one, and their agenda is one, and their message is one, and God dwells with and within Jesus spiritually, however, physically they are not one and the same, because God is not a physical entity, nor is God flesh; there is still that aspect of Jesus which is fleshly-carnal (ie. being tempted by satan, asking God to take the cup away from him, why have you forsaken me etc. -- according to Christian doctines) .... Perhaps these scriptures will shed some light � Phi 2:5 For think this within you, which mind was also in Christ Jesus, Phi 2:6 who subsisting in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God, Phi 2:7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a slave, having become in the likeness of men Phi 2:8 and being found in fashion as a man, He humbled Himself, having become obedient until death, even the death of a cross. Phi 2:9 Because of this also God highly exalted Him and gave Him a name above every name, Phi Phi
I also have wrath .... Do you have God�s wrath�?
Absolutly wrong, unless you admit that the Bible contradicts itself because according to the following verse, the son does not know the hour: "But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angles which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark Please tell us the vantage point of Jesus in Mark, verses the vantage point of Jesus in Revelation�
There is a huge difference between the Christian doctrine of Jesus being the resurrection and Allah doing the resurrection, ie. resurrecting those who have died; on the day of Qiyamah .... The difference being that the authors of the Koran attempted to pin this deity attribute upon their �god� allah�
What a great proof to show Jesus is God? Orthodox also abhors idols ... A proof none the less�
I am also patient. You think that you have the �patience� called-out for in the scriptures�.?
The verses you quoted above do not at all promote the idea "repent to Jesus" ..... Yes�.they do�
The verse you quoted above do not promote the idea : "Jesus knows your deeds" Yes�it does� Opps�what happened to the other comparisons�.like� Jesus hands out the reward in Heaven�.allah hands out the reward in Heaven Glory be to Jesus�glory be to allah
Jesus Predestines�allah predestines Looks like the cat has your tongue on these�..as it should� Oh�.and thanks for not mentioning Jesus residing on the Throne�
Jesus was flesh, God is spirit. You fail to revere and worship the spirit. You worship a man. You worship a creation of God. You worship the flesh of Jesus. You keep forgetting to mention that Jesus is God in the flesh. This is told to us not only in the Holy Bible but also copied into the Koran as well� The God of the Holy Bible has revealed Himself as a Triune entity. This is told to us not only in the Holy Bible but also copied into the Koran as well� Perhaps you need to re-evaluate your �position� while you still can�. Take care� |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
AhmadJoyia
Senior Member 
Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 July 2005 at 10:53am |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I think, St. Apple Pie doesn't know even the basics. The final day of judgement is totally different than the day of coming back of Jesus and St. Apple Pie has not distinguished between the two and hence his comparison is totally flawed. Just for an example, though beside being of dubious authorship of Book of Revelation, St. Apple Pie has quoted Rev 3:3 to indicate as the final day of Judgement, but is it really that what St. Apple Pie thinks it is. Let us review this Rev 3:3 "3Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you." Any sane person can read the the underline sentence to understand that, if (a big if, but we shall talk about it later) it is true as what is written in this verse about Jesus, then all it is saying is about the future coming of Jesus and not the final day of Judgement. Hence the comparison is totally flawed. On the more, let see where else in the NT, it is mentioned about the second coming of Jesus and shall compare it with this verse. Mt 24:43-44 "43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him." Beside observing the similarity of the parable of "theif" in the two, note that it is the coming back of "son of man". Hence it is totally different than the last day of Judgement. Another example: "1 Thessalonians 51Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night." Here, again it is the coming back of Jesus and not the day of Judgement. Hence, from all these examples, it is now clear as how St. Apple Pie is miserably mistaken about the very basics of his own religion. But the question is, Is he really that innocent? |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
amlhabibi2000
Guest Group
Joined: 08 December 2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 447 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 July 2005 at 12:57pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Jesus does not have to come back he is here already..... |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Judgement day passes in the moment we decide something needs attention & we take positive action. Then there will be a great sorting out of people into groups, Inspired by Surah 99 Ayat 1-8
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Apple Pie
Guest Group
Joined: 21 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 138 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 July 2005 at 2:29pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Greetings AhmadJoyia, Thanks for adding your comments� I think, St. Apple Pie doesn't know even the basics. Operative word�..�think�� The final day of judgement is totally different than the day of coming back of Jesus and St. Apple Pie has not distinguished between the two and hence his comparison is totally flawed. We would like to see you bring forth Koranic eschatological material for direct comparison to the Book of Revelation. This should settle things rather quickly� Just for an example, though beside being of dubious authorship of Book of Revelation, St. Apple Pie has quoted Rev 3:3 to indicate as the final day of Judgement, but is it really that what St. Apple Pie thinks it is. Let us review this Rev 3:3 "3Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you." Any sane person can read the the underline sentence to understand that, if (a big if, but we shall talk about it later) it is true as what is written in this verse about Jesus, then all it is saying is about the future coming of Jesus and not the final day of Judgement. Hence the comparison is totally flawed. Jesus is speaking in Rev 3.3� On the more, let see where else in the NT, it is mentioned about the second coming of Jesus and shall compare it with this verse. Mt 24:43-44 "43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him." Beside observing the similarity of the parable of "theif" in the two, note that it is the coming back of "son of man". Hence it is totally different than the last day of Judgement. Another example: "1 Thessalonians 5
1Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night." Here, again it is the coming back of Jesus and not the day of Judgement. Hence, from all these examples, it is now clear as how St. Apple Pie is miserably mistaken about the very basics of his own religion. But the question is, Is he really that innocent? Please explain (with your own scriptures)�.how this would be the case� Thanks� |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Israfil
Senior Member 
Joined: 08 September 2003 Status: Offline Points: 3984 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 July 2005 at 4:35pm |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
God's Peace and Blessings, Apple Pie if I may what is the purpose of your comment (both past and present) and what do you plan on doing here on Islamicity? This is a most sincere question |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Post Reply
|
Page <12345 6> |
Tweet
|
| Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Topic Options
Apple Pie wrote: