Arranged-Marriage Series |
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Saladin
Senior Member Male Joined: 04 September 2007 Location: Sri Lanka Status: Offline Points: 575 |
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Here's a scholarly opinion on how much a man can see of the woman he's intending to marry-
Looking at other than the face and hands of the woman he wishes to propose to Response: That which is apparent to me, and Allaah knows best, is that this is permissible without a previous agreement. He (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) said that which means: ((If anyone�s heart settles on proposing to a woman, then he can look at that which will lead him to marry her)), [Translators note: This is the hadeeth of Jaabir ibn �Abdillaah (radhi-yallaahu 'anhu) who said: The Messenger of Allaah (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) said: ((If any of you has proposed to a woman, and if he is able to look at that which will lead him to marry her, then he should do so))] As regards a previous agreement, then it is not permissible to look at more than the face and hands. Shaykh al-Albaanee
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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Saladin
Senior Member Male Joined: 04 September 2007 Location: Sri Lanka Status: Offline Points: 575 |
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Hyposonic : I have not once stereotyped here, if anything you (and others here) have stereotyped non-muslim culture.
Ok, show me where exactly I've stereotyped non muslim culture? ....Are you still hung up on that Britney comment? .....Seriously, you dont get the point there or just clutching on to straws?
Hyposonic : Besides from my brief understanding [and brief research] even Muslims cholars are divided on the issue here is one of the following Hadiths I found:
"From Anas that the Messenger of Allah said: And if one of the women of Paradise looked at the earth, she would fill the whole space between them the earth and the heaven with light, and would fill whatever is in between them, with perfume, and the veil of her face is better than the whole world and whatever is in it."Sahih al-Bukhari 8:572:1
Whats the point you're trying to make here?
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'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Hyposonic
Senior Member Joined: 17 November 2008 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 247 |
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Wow! Didn�t expect such detailed responses. I will have to break up my responses in order to appropriately address everyone.
Chrysalis,
Forgive me as the word methods, is confusing and not grammatically accurate in that context. I meant to say traditional gifts that are different among different ethnic peoples in these regions. For instance a Sudanese farmer may trade a certain amount of farm animals as a gift in exchange for the union between his son and another farmer�s daughter, or vice versa [or however it works]. Or, we can say a bedouin man may want to marry his daughter to another Bedouin [from a different clan] for political reasons. What I�m saying here is that arrange marriages even among Muslims are different in how they go about. It is not always systematic as you guys have made it [meaning, the family being go-betweens the man and woman or a Wali accompanying a woman]. "This hadith is enough proof that Islam does not approve of the practice" I have no doubt Islam prohibits forced marriage but I guess where I�m coming from is how much of it is actually practiced in the world? Of course there are no statistical reports as to what is considered forced and actually choice. Isn�t it possible a family can actually force their child to choose but making it look like it�s not force? Just a thought. "In another hadith, the Prophet made clear that ladies should not be married without being consulted first. Abu Hurairah quoted the Prophet as saying, "A matron should not be given in marriage except after consulting her, and a virgin should not be given in marriage except after her permission." (Al-Bukhari).
I have no doubts here. |
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Hyposonic
Senior Member Joined: 17 November 2008 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 247 |
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Saladin you said:
If you recall I mentioned niqab several times in my response. Unless there is no distinction between hijab and niqab then this would make it all the more confusing to me when explaining my points in my posts and reading them. As far as cultural interpretation I'm not sure I understand what you mean here.
Hmmmm. Consequently I have to ask, how do you know they wouldn�t keep the woman�s face hidden under their rule? Were you there in
"Here you do a 180. Women in public?? Forget the Taliban but the prospective male in this scenario aint the prospective spouse???.... I rest my case."
I�m not doing any spinning, especially a 180. I think you are misunderstanding so let me bring us back. When mentioning a woman�s face being hidden to her perspective mate whether public or private and in response to Chrysalis� earlier point on biology and human attraction I�ll ask the simple question: if niqab is common, how can a prospective mate either the woman or male, find physical attraction to each other if the woman�s face is hidden in public [public meaning in the open-even when the Wali is present]? Now the question may be suggestive as an assumption on my part but it�s strictly hypothetical, and if I�ve gotten it wrong then please explain. |
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Hyposonic
Senior Member Joined: 17 November 2008 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 247 |
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Saladin:
This is all I wanted to know.
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Hyposonic
Senior Member Joined: 17 November 2008 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 247 |
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Ok, show me where exactly I've stereotyped non muslim culture? ....Are you still hung up on that Britney comment? .....Seriously, you dont get the point there or just clutching on to straws?
You said:
"Unarranged marriages are like what Britney and Jason did.....Fiascos!" Sure looks like a generalization to me. You didn�t say something to the like of �I disagree with unarranged marriages because it leaves a window of careless behavior such as Britney and Jason� you seem to have made a generalization. So its not about being hung up on me focusing on Britney, its about making precise statements and not being misleading or stereotyping things that are not Muslim or not your culture. Can anyone explain to me if your comment in blue is true then what about the marriages in many many non-muslim countries where couples stay married after dating for so many years or were you referring strictly to Americans? This was something I found when you and I were on the veil discussion. |
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Hayfa
Senior Member Female Joined: 07 June 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2368 |
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There seems to be two aspects to the discussion:
1.What is Islamically correct and what may or may not be happening by people today.There are guidelines and rules in Islam for finding a spouse. Being alone in not an option. 2. Yes Muslims are not perfect. There are issues because people will mess up. Some abuse and use. That happens even in dating relationships. Abuse of women runs through all societies. 3. in the end it is a difference of moral codes. Period. Dating as in the west is prohibited in Islam. |
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When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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savant
Groupie Joined: 14 February 2009 Status: Offline Points: 98 |
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Below is not complete answer hower; will complete it else time. As you see respectable mufti sb allowing to see each other; now it is need to discover that how this seeing will happen and what will be rulings of this short meeting. this is available in other fatwas will explor it and will share later.
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In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Assalaamu `alaykum waRahmatullahi Wabarakatuh It is not mandatory for potential spouses to see each other before marriage. It is however encouraged. Marriage is a life long relationship and one should be happy and content with the outer appearance of the spouse. If one did not see each other, there is a possibility that one may not like the appearance of the spouse. And Allah knows best Wassalam Mufti Ebrahim Desai Edited by savant - 18 February 2009 at 10:32am |
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