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hey heres an idea!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Community Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 12:10pm

hey kenski70,

how do you feel about this, people who stand in the way of peace should be removed from the way.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Community Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 12:17pm
correction, those who block the way to peace should be removed from the way.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AhmadJoyia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 12:21pm
Oh ok, I see what you mean. In this sense then my question is more of as "how" in contrast to "why", is Jerusalam holy to Christians? I mean through which way this city becomes holy to Christians? Was Jesus born in that city or was Jesus buried in that city or simply put; what is the basis for this holiness for my christian brothers?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Angela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 12:49pm

Originally posted by AhmadJoyia AhmadJoyia wrote:

Oh ok, I see what you mean. In this sense then my question is more of as "how" in contrast to "why", is Jerusalam holy to Christians? I mean through which way this city becomes holy to Christians? Was Jesus born in that city or was Jesus buried in that city or simply put; what is the basis for this holiness for my christian brothers?

Jerusalem is where the atonement and resurrection happened.  In Jerusalem, the Garden of Gethsame, Jesus took on the sins of the world.  And in Jerusalem, he died, was buried and resurrected.  These to a Christian are far more important than his miraculous birth.  This was the fulfilling of his destiny and promise. 

Now, I know Muslims do not believe Jesus was crucified, but we do, therefore, Jerusalem is the Holiest City in Christendom. 

The Resurrection to Christians is the pinnacle of Holy events.  The Miracle we look to in our daily life.  In this way, Jerusalem is to us as Mecca is to a Muslim.  In Mecca, Gabrielle revealed the Quran to Mohammed.  This is the miracle that every muslim man and woman are defined by in their daily lives. 

The Kaabah, the site built by Ibrahim and his son, that would be a common point for all peoples of the Book, making Mecca Holy to all.

And since Jerusalem is the sight of the Temple, the Resurrection and the Prophet Mohammed's vision of heaven, it too is Holy to all.

In the end, we need to shed our concept that these cities belong to anyone but God.  I find it funny that immediately prior to the creation of Israel, all pilgrims were welcomed there, now we must fear traveling to our churches, synagogues and mosques. 

May God grant us peace in our hearts and love for our fellow man.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 1:17pm

Originally posted by Community Community wrote:

correction, those who block the way to peace should be removed from the way.

I got a better idea... why don't we just ignore them and walk around them.  They'll follow when God wills it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 1:18pm

Angela,

Great answer btw,

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AhmadJoyia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 2:03pm

Quote Jerusalem is where the atonement and resurrection happened.  In Jerusalem, the Garden of Gethsame, Jesus took on the sins of the world.  And in Jerusalem, he died, was buried and resurrected. 

Thanks sis Angela for your reply. However, I am little surprised from your reply. Usually a place is made holy if there is any material or spiritual thing is attached to it. Since Jesus was raised within his material body, is any thing we call him "buried"? I think, you would also agree with me that he is not buried in any grave in Jerusalam at all. Isn't it? So, what's holiness of an empty land? Secondly, if only the miracles are the criteria for such a holiness, then what Jerusalam has any exception over the Virgin birth place of Jesus and his mother. Thirdly, you say 

Quote  These to a Christian are far more important than his miraculous birth.
This again, is a very surprising statement especially in a view that whole world knows when Christmas has to be celebrated than when was he raised to God. Isn't it? Similarly, in the same token it is even more surprising to note your comments when you say
Quote This was the fulfilling of his destiny and promise
and compare it to as what Jesus was feeling at the time, according to Matthew 

"37He took Peter and the two sons of Zebedee along with him, and he began to be sorrowful and troubled. 38Then he said to them, "My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death. Stay here and keep watch with me."

 39Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will."

 40Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping. "Could you men not keep watch with me for one hour?" he asked Peter. 41"Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."

 42He went away a second time and prayed, "My Father, if it is not possible for this cup to be taken away unless I drink it, may your will be done."

With all this narration mentioned in the Bible, it would be surprising if anyone want to celebrate the occassion rather than mourn over it. Or otherwise, the Bible is to be challenged for its accuracy. Isn't it? 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 December 2005 at 3:07pm

Since Jesus was raised within his material body, is any thing we call him "buried"?

It is holy because of the events that happened there: he was crucified, died, was buried, and resurrected, all in Jerusalem.  We do not say "he is buried" in Jerusalem, be cause he raised from the dead and then ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the father.  But he indeed was buried there at one time.  Those are all "spiritual" things as you call them, that happened there and that is why it is holy to us.

It is a common misconception by non-believers that Christmas is more important than Easter, but I can assure you that Christians know the difference. 

Luke:

25
And he said to them, "Oh, how foolish you are! How slow of heart to believe all that the prophets spoke!
26
Was it not necessary that the Messiah should suffer 8 these things and enter into his glory?"
27
Then beginning with Moses and all the prophets, he interpreted to them what referred to him in all the scriptures.

Those quotes you mention about him suffering had to happen as part of his destiny but they were not the purpose or the culmination.  There are 3 parts to the significance of the celebration at Easter, his crucifixion, his death, and his resurrection.  It is what you call a bittersweet moment for us, because we do mourn deeply in the way that he died, but praise be to God, Jesus rose from the dead!!!  That is a joyous occasion for us, furthermore, his legacy was that our sins were cleansed so that we would have eternal life.

Luke

44
        He said to them, "These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the law of Moses and in the prophets and psalms must be fulfilled."

45
Then he opened their minds to understand the scriptures.
46
And he said to them, "Thus it is written that the Messiah would suffer and rise from the dead on the third day
47
and that repentance, for the forgiveness of sins, would be preached in his name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.
48
You are witnesses of these things.
49
And (behold) I am sending the promise of my Father upon you; but stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high."
50
Then he led them (out) as far as Bethany, raised his hands, and blessed them.
51
As he blessed them he parted from them and was taken up to heaven.

 

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