The CAUCASIAN Race will be excluded from Paradise
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Topic: The CAUCASIAN Race will be excluded from Paradise
Posted By: Abu Loren
Subject: The CAUCASIAN Race will be excluded from Paradise
Date Posted: 28 June 2014 at 3:27am
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Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala tells us in the Qur'an that He gives Mercy to whom He Wills. He also tells us that He chooses a people to Himself.
If we examine this very carefully then we find that the Caucasian race has been excluded from His Mercy.
Before you all jump on the bandwagon to hang me and say that in the same scenario one can argue for the Chinese, the Eskimo and the Native Americans in North and South America I'm excluding them for a moment to bring home the truth the Caucasians only. I am talking about the Caucasians mainly in America, Europe, Australia New Zealand etc.
Now if we look at the history of the Caucasian race religiously then what we can agree on is that before Christianity they were pagans who were worshipping god knows what. But wait a minute, you will say that as the majority are now Christian, so they claim that they have a chance for salvation as they are following the Abrahamaic faith. Wrong.
Christianity, as I've said so many times previously, is an invention of the pagan Romans. They wanted a man-god and they choose Jesus (Alayhi Salaam) as their demi god. Then Christianity was warped and twisted along the way until what we have today, so many denominations that they even argue among themselves about who is right and who is wrong.
As I see it the only salvation left for the Caucasians is to accept the truth that there is no god but Allah and that Mohammad is His slave and Messenger. However, now in the twenty first century, there are many Caucasians converting to Islam as they have found the Truth, they find this the truth mainly through the internet medium.
I ask Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala maker of heaven and earth and all that in between to forgive me if I have said anything that is wrong in this thread or there are anything here that is contradictory to His Final Revelation. Also I ask forgiveness from Him if I am assuming anything here as certain assumption is a sin.
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Replies:
Posted By: Lachi
Date Posted: 28 June 2014 at 4:11am
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You are confusing 'Christian' with 'Caucasian'. There are many Caucasians who are Muslim, and many non-Caucasians who are Christian.
Qur'an says nothing about salvation through race, only through Islam. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 28 June 2014 at 4:26am
I see the Caucasian race liken to Hollywood. Rich, vain and arrogant.
The people of Paradise will be the opposite of that. Poor and humble.
Anas b. Malik reported: The Paradise is surrounded by hardships and the Hell-Fire is surrounded by temptations
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Lachi wrote:Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 28 June 2014 at 1:53pm
Greetings Abu Loren, It is sad to have such a narrow view of any people. All groups of people are multi-faceted, with good and evil in all. It is this kind of thinking that produces so much animosity and turmoil in the world. I saw horrible evil among the Hutu's in Rwanda during the genocide... but the Hutu's also have many beautiful hearted people... I saw many horrible Germans and Polish people during the holocaust... but there were also many kind and right hearted people among them as well. You will find this true of all people and people should always be considered as individuals, not as groups. Please take time to reconsider your thinking. asalaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Lachi
Date Posted: 28 June 2014 at 4:45pm
| Allah will judge by the individual's conscious submission, not by the individual's accident of birth. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 3:35am
With this thread what I've tried to do was to point out that the white race will be few in number in Paradise. Those that will be there will be Muslims who have converted from other religions. There was no other way than to make this a 'race' issue. As I've said, the Caucasians were pagans who then converted to Christianity which is again a pagan religion. So the only way for salvation for the Caucasians is to accept Islam. By Caucasians I'm talking about the 'First World' whites in Europe, America, Australia, New Zealand etc. The Prophet (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) tells us in a Hadith that he was shown hell and the majority of the people were poor. I don't see many poor whities practicing Islam. So by deduction one can say that the majority of the people of Paradise will be poor 'coloured' people who are Muslims. By the way, the prayers of the poor are always genuine because they face hardships in life and they have nothing to be arrogant about or to be vain like you and me. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 3:37am
This is true but for this to happen one has to follow the Laws and Rules of the Most Merciful. Most whities are not doing this right now. One has to be a Muslim to have a chance of salvation. I only see a handful of Muslims whities. |
Posted By: Lachi
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 8:03am
| You cannot make that call from your limited human observation alone. Submission brings Paradise, but only Allah can judge a person's submission. To make it a 'race' issue is to ignore that Allah wishes all to accept Islam. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 10:35am
asalaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 10:42am
Greetings Abu Loren, That is an awful broad statement, and how is it for you to judge? What if I were to say, because of all the evil that is seen in the mideast right now, that 'most muslims are not doing the will of God'? Would that be a fair, or accurate, statement? asalaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 29 June 2014 at 10:45am
 or as I see it... only the Creator can judge. ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 3:36am
Yet again you are correct. However, all I'm saying here is that the Caucasians have been living a pagan life far away from the One True God Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala. Christianity is not a way to Paradise. The only salvation open to the Caucasians is to convert to Islam. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 3:40am
How is it an awful broad statement? From my perspective the Caucasians have always been following a religion not quthorised by Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala. They have always been astray. The only solution for salvation is to convert to Islam, the only religion acceptable to our Creator. That's just it, not all of the evil in the world today is from Muslims but from the government of the U S of A. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 3:41am
I'm not judging but just observing that the Caucasians will be few in number in Paradise and will be many in hell. Unless, of course, Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala has Mercy on all of them and they enter Paradise. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 10:33am
Greetings Abu Loren, It is thinking like this that promotes hatred and destruction in the world. As Lachi has said... only God can judge a person's submission. You need to start taking a closer look at the word submission and what that means, and what that looks like. There are plenty of 'caucasians' that have submitted their lives to God and doing His will and His work. You need to be more concerned with what it looks like to serve God, and it is not just bowing down to pray 5 times a day, or the saying of certain words. Peace to you, Caringheart Yshwe said; 'Ye shall know them that are mine by the fruits that they bear' (my paraphrase) 15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. - the words of Yshwe Today there are those(many of them Christians) that are bringing good fruit to the world, and there are those(many of them so-called muslims, many of them so-called 'Christians') that are bringing bad fruit. They are just bringing different sorts of bad fruit. We must not judge by the name that they are called by, but by their fruits, if they be good or they be evil. I say, if a man is led to prejudice or hate, led to kill, or to subjugate others, then he is governed not by good, but by evil and belongs to the one who wishes destruction of the creation. If a man treats others equally, honestly, and fairly, and attends to the needs of the hurting, he is governed by good and belongs to the One who wishes good for His creation. 5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. - also the words of Yshwe Those who do the works... not just the things for show or ritual... it is they that belong to God... they that do the work of God... those that are truly submitted to doing His will... the preserving, the saving of, the caring for, creation... they that Love. 31 When [Yshwe] shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. 37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. 41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. 44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? 45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Lachi
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 4:21pm
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Why do you single out Caucasian Christians? You are making it a race, not a religious issue. There are many Muslims of Caucasian descent. There are many Christians of African descent. Do not confuse race with religion. Persistence in doing so is intentionally provocative and encourages division and narrow mindedness. This is not the Islam of Allah.
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Posted By: Reepicheep
Date Posted: 30 June 2014 at 6:56pm
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I find it interesting that Abu Loren is, on his own authority, casting all Caucasians into hell.
All Semitic people (including Jews and Arabs) are Caucasian. So, not only is Abu Loren condemning all the muslim Arabs who currently live in Saudi Arabia, the UAE, etc., he is apparently also casting Jesus (a Jew) and Mohammad (an Arab) into hell. If (as Abu Loren claims) the two most devout muslim prophets are to spend eternity in hell, what possible hope is there for the rest of the muslims??? |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 4:11am
Actually I'm only saying what has been revealed by God Almighty Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala. Ever since the first day of revelation to Prophet Muhammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) every man, woman and child should follow his teachings as they are from God Almighty. Everything else before him have been nullifed and voided.
In this thread I'm not talking about the Caucasians who are Muslims rhather if you had read the thread carefully you would have noticed that I'm talking about the people in Europe, America, Australia, New Zealand etc.
Actually all the good 'works' these Christians are doing are worthless because they do not worhsip God Almighty with the true appraisal. Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala has shown us how He wants to be worshipped and what we need to say in prayers. Everything else will not be accpeted.
Those who do the works... not just the things for show or ritual... it is they that belong to God... they that do the work of God... those that are truly submitted to doing His will... the preserving, the saving of, the caring for, creation... they that Love. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 4:13am
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Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 11:06am
Greetings Abu Loren, and what is a 'true muslim'? One who is submitted to the will of God. and who determines whether the heart is submitted to God? God judges heart. but they WILL be 'known by their fruits'... according to the very words of Yshwe, whom you say you accept as prophet equal to Muhammad. asalaam, Caringheart 2:285 The Messenger (Muhammad) believes in what has been sent down to him from his Lord, and (so do) the believers. Each one believes in All�h, His Angels, His Books, and His Messengers. They say, "We make no distinction between one another of His Messengers" - and they say, "We hear, and we obey. (We seek) Your Forgiveness, our Lord, and to You is the return (of all)."
3:84 Say (O Muhammad): "We believe in All�h and in what has been sent down to us, and what was sent down to Ibr�him (Abraham), Ism�'il (Ishmael), Ish�que (Isaac), Ya'q�b (Jacob) and Al-Asb�t [the twelve sons of Ya'q�b (Jacob)] and what was given to M�sa (Moses), 'Iesa (Jesus) and the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between one another among them and to Him (All�h) we have submitted (in Isl�m)." ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 12:01pm
Surely you are not now claiming to be a Muslim?
Yes a Muslim is a person who has submitted fully to Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala and he must follow his Laws and rules as stipulated in the Qur'an.
Let me give you this scenario.
A Christian goes to church every day and prays most of the night. Gives money to charity and other worthwhile causes, is kind to people, puts others before him and always offers assistance to his fellow human being. NONE of this will be accepted by God Almighty because he is not following the instructions given by God almighty in how to worship Him. Therefore, every man, woman and child who is not following Islam is doomed unless Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala has Mercy.
Look at the Caucasians in Europe, America, Australia, New Zealand etc they are living a life akin to Sodom and Gomorroh and anything and everything is acceptable. There is a code of conduct that our Creator has laid down for us and we must follow it to achieve salvation. Any which way will not do.
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Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 1:53pm
Greetings Abu Loren, You must have missed this?
I am, absolutely, submitted to the will of God, through Yshwe Messiah.  whom your scriptures say to accept as an equal prophet.So it seems to me, that YOU, should be able to call me muslim. Tell me do you call the ISIS brothers, muslims, even though they wage an offensive war against innocents? You think they are right, and I am wrong? That if I want to serve the Creator, I should pick up a weapon? I do not think so. Do you even know what color my skin is? A black 'Christian' to your mind will be thrown into hell as well... so will yellow, and red skinned. I think that hell will be a very color full place. Your initial premise is simply very prejudiced, hateful, and foolish. asalaam, wishing you peace in your heart, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Lachi
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 2:58pm
So anyone who isn't (or wasn't before they died) a Muslim will go to Hell. This includes most of the human race - Indian, Chinese, African, Native American, Aborigine, Inuit, etc. There seems no need to single out Caucasians, unless you are trying to make religion a racial issue, which Allah does not teach. |
Posted By: lady
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 6:51pm
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As salaamoalaikum :)
Abu Abu Abu.... A friend once told me to "be careful of what you think about a particular race because maybe there is someone from that race that Allah loves dearly." but then you quote, "I ask Allah Subhana wa ta allah maker of heaven and earth...." As far as America, if you see who is usually on welfare, it is the Caucasian woman. A lot of people are arrogant when they are wealthy. It has nothing to do with race. The word Caucasian is subjective to each person. For example an indo/paki may call themselves white but if they come to America, they may be viewed as brown, or even black people. As you get to travel and you meet all kinds of different people, then you will realize that there is almost nothing you can say about one group that cant be applied to another group. and if you can then maybe they just were not given the opportunity yet to have vainness, arrogance, and wealth. the world has not ended yet. who knows how much long we have. Let's just assume that the world may end in 200 years. Then are you assuming that there will not be an increase of causasians submitting themselves to the will of Allah? At the time of death, right before your breath becomes a gargle and before the angels come to take your soul, you still have time to repent. So you don't know during this time if there will be a lot of Caucasians submitting themselves to Allah. There are a lot of prophets that were sent in the past, and those prophets are not written down in the history books. so you don't know what kind of atrocities that went on during that time by nonwhites. So assuming that few Caucasians will enter into heaven is a sin, and it shows a touch of arrogance. When Allah mentions the human race in the quran HE (SWT) never refers to them by their race. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 01 July 2014 at 7:56pm
Greetings, This is exactly how I feel, and it made me think of this quote... Mark Twain: �Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness... " |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 3:34am
If you are submitted to the Will of God through Isa Ibn Maryam then you are in serious error. This is because Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala tells us in the Qur'an that all those nations before Mohammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Sallam) have passed on and that those believers will have their reward with the Lord. So every man, woman and child born after the time of the Prophet Mohammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) MUST follow the teachings of the Prophet (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Salaam) and the Final Revelation. This is what you just don't understand. Sahih International
Then We sent following their footsteps Our messengers and followed [them] with Jesus, the son of Mary, and gave him the Gospel. And We placed in the hearts of those who followed him compassion and mercy and monasticism, which they innovated; We did not prescribe it for them except [that they did so] seeking the approval of Allah . But they did not observe it with due observance. So We gave the ones who believed among them their reward, but many of them are defiantly disobedient. O you who
have believed, fear Allah and believe in His Messenger; He will [then] give you
a double portion of His mercy and make for you a light by which you will walk
and forgive you; and Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. [This is] so that the People of the Scripture may know that they are not able [to obtain] anything from the bounty of Allah and that [all] bounty is in the hand of Allah ; He gives it to whom He wills. And Allah is the possessor of great bounty. 57:27-29 |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 3:40am
If you go back and re-read the OP then you will know that this thread is about the Caucasians in Europe, America, Australia, New Zealand etc who are not following the True religion. Their lifestyle also is an insult to God Almighty. As for the other races you've mentioned I have no idea. You never know but may be those people who were good will receive Mercy and their reward from Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala. All I'm trying to do with this thread is to highlight the empty lives these Caucasians are leading and to give themselves a chance for salvation by becoming Muslims. Currently it is the only way to paradise. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 3:44am
Wa Alaikum Asalaam This may sound arrogant but I don't think so. Allah Subhana Wa Ta'ala tells us in the Qur'an that he only loves the believers,and these people do not believe in anything.
If these Caucasians convert then Alhamdulilah they will stand a chance of attaining salvation. This is the point of this thread. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 11:57am
Greetings Abu Loren, So you deny the surah which I/dreamtime quoted 5:48 "To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety:and go instead with this one?
Even this one says: So We gave the ones who believed among them their reward, but many of them are defiantly disobedient. (is this not the 'testing' referred to in surah 5? Surah 5, which was revealed after surah 57) asalaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 12:15pm
It seems someone is well feeding the wolf of prejudice... one that will devour any and all clear sightedness. Satan, the devil, who wants to mislead and deceive, and cause mischief and destruction among God's creation. Story of Two WolvesIt is only for the Creator to judge who it is that believes. You are correct, it is arrogant for you to say that all people of any race 'do not believe', and may the true God give you guidance and clear vision to see, and to humble yourself before Him and His grace. My God loves all of His creation, and wants all to be brought to salvation, and that none should perish in the fires of hell. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. asalaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 12:32pm
Do you know the meaning of the verse 5:48? I very much doubt it.
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Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 12:36pm
As for this thread, my intention is for the Caucasians in Europe, America, Australia, New Zealand etc to really think where they are heading. The only salvation left for human beings is to follow the revelation given to Prophet Mohammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Sallam) the Final Messenger to mankind.
If you don't, then you will miss the boat, so to speak.
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Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 02 July 2014 at 1:21pm
Greetings Abu Loren, The message that Muhammad brings, by 'allah' in the qur'an, is an extremely confused message. 5:42 Listeners for the sake of falsehood! Greedy for illicit gain! If then they have recourse unto thee (Muhammad) judge between them or disclaim jurisdiction. If thou disclaimest jurisdiction, then they cannot harm thee at all. But if thou judgest, judge between them with equity. Lo! Allah loveth the equitable.So Muhammad was 'advised, by allah', that to disclaim jurisdiction would be in the interest of his safety... but that if he were going to judge then judge fairly. Also, in the interest of his own safety... use their own scriptures to settle their disputes... this way also he could not be accused of any unfairness. and yet he (Muhammad/allah) goes on to say 5:43 How come they unto thee for judgment when they have the Torah, wherein Allah hath delivered judgment (for them) ? Yet even after that they turn away. Such (folk) are not believers.So apparently allah feels that there is nothing wrong with their own scriptures, just the unwillingness of the people to follow them. 5:44 Lo! We did reveal the Torah, wherein is guidance and a light, by which the prophets who surrendered (unto Allah) judged the Jews, and the rabbis and the priests (judged) by such of Allah's Scripture as they were bidden to observe, and thereunto were they witnesses. So fear not mankind, but fear Me. And My revelations for a little gain. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed: such are disbelievers. 5:45 And We prescribed for them therein: The life for the life, and the eye for the eye, and the nose for the nose, and the ear for the ear, and the tooth for the tooth, and for wounds retaliation. But whoso forgoeth it (in the way of charity) it shall be expiation for him. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed: such are wrong-doers.So while earlier saying... 'obey what is written in the scriptures' or else you are disbelievers... he then says... but it is more to the good of the one who foregoes the enforcement of such punishments. and yet calls those who do not enact the judgement of the scriptures, wrong-doers... So which is it? For me... Yshwe taught, 'faith, hope, and Charity, and that the greatest of these is Charity'... i.e., the forgiveness of trespasses... 'and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us'. 5:46 And We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow in their footsteps, confirming that which was (revealed) before him in the Torah, and We bestowed on him the Gospel wherein is guidance and a light, confirming that which was (revealed) before it in the Torah - a guidance and an admonition unto those who ward off (evil). 5:47 Let the People of the Gospel judge by that which Allah hath revealed therein. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed: such are evil-livers.The people of the Gospel (i.e., Christians) are to judge by the Gospel. 5:48 And unto thee have We revealed the Scripture with the truth, confirming whatever Scripture was before it, and a watcher over it. So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires away from the truth which hath come unto thee. For each We have appointed a divine law and a traced-out way. Had Allah willed He could have made you one community. But that He may try you by that which He hath given you (He hath made you as ye are). So vie one with another in good works. Unto Allah ye will all return, and He will then inform you of that wherein ye differ.The former scriptures have been confirmed and confirmed that they have been protected. Those that follow Yshwe, have the way of Yshwe, the Gospels. All is happening just as the Creator designed it to happen. and He will reveal to you at your meeting with Him, the Truth of all matters _________________________________ Now, if you will... without referring to any of what I have just posted... simply share with me what you believe surah 5:48 means. Shukran and salaam, Caringheart ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: lady
Date Posted: 03 July 2014 at 2:10am
| Abu I am saying that with u can't make that assumption that few Caucasians will enter into Jinnah because u are not Allah. |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 03 July 2014 at 2:51am
I'm not qualified to interpret the verse on my own so the next best thing I can do is point you to the tasfir of Ibn Abbas and I believe in this.
* تفسير Tanw�r al-Miqb�s min Tafs�r Ibn �Abb�s { javascript:Open_Menu%28%29 - - وَأَنزَلْنَآ إِلَيْكَ ٱلْكِتَابَ بِٱلْحَقِّ مُصَدِّقاً لِّمَا بَيْنَ يَدَيْهِ مِنَ ٱلْكِتَابِ وَمُهَيْمِناً عَلَيْهِ فَٱحْكُم بَيْنَهُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ وَلاَ تَتَّبِعْ أَهْوَآءَهُمْ عَمَّا جَآءَكَ مِنَ ٱلْحَقِّ لِكُلٍّ جَعَلْنَا مِنكُمْ شِرْعَةً وَمِنْهَاجاً وَلَوْ شَآءَ ٱللَّهُ لَجَعَلَكُمْ أُمَّةً وَاحِدَةً وَلَـٰكِن لِّيَبْلُوَكُمْ فِي مَآ آتَاكُم فَاسْتَبِقُوا الخَيْرَاتِ إِلَىٰ الله مَرْجِعُكُمْ جَمِيعاً فَيُنَبِّئُكُم بِمَا كُنتُمْ فِيهِ تَخْتَلِفُونَ } (And unto thee have We revealed the Scripture) We have sent you Gabriel with the Qur'an (with the Truth) to make plain the Truth and falsehood, (confirming) the statement of Allah's divine Oneness and some laws (whatever Scripture was before it) whatever Scriptures were before it, (and a watcher over it) a witness upon all the Scriptures before it; it is also said: a witness upon the ruling of stoning; and it is also said: a watcher over all previous Scriptures. (So judge between them) between the Banu Qurayzah and the Banu'l-Nadir and the people of Khaybar (by that which Allah hath revealed) by that which Allah has exposited to you in the Qur'an, (and follow not their desires) regarding the application of whipping and discarding stoning (away from the Truth which hath come unto thee) after the exposition that has come to you. (For each We have appointed a divine law) for each prophet among you We have exposited a divine law (and a traced out way) obligations and practices. (Had Allah willed He could have made you one community) He has made you follow one divine law. (But that He may try you) test you (by that which He hath given you) of Scripture, obligations and practices, such that He says: I have prescribed all this for you, so let not delusion creep into your minds. (So vie one with another in good works) so vie, O Community of Muhammad (pbuh) with other nations, in obligations, practices and righteous works; it is also said that this means: hasten, O Community of Muhammad (pbuh) to perform acts of obedience. (Unto Allah ye will all) all nations (return, and He will then inform you of that wherein ye differ) where you contravene in relation to religion and divine laws. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 03 July 2014 at 8:50am
Greetings Abu Loren, This is just a re-stating of the surah. Can you tell me what it means to you, in your own words? If you can not do this, how can you claim to follow it? One has to have understanding, and I am interested to know what your understanding is. Shukran and salaam, Caringheart note: Remember you were the one who accused me... "Do you know the meaning of the verse 5:48? I very much doubt it." and I have shown you my understanding. Now please show me yours. Peace. ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 03 July 2014 at 12:16pm
As far as my understanding of the verse is concerned, it simply says that it was God who sent down the Qur'an to Prophet Muhammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) confirming that it was indeed the same God who sent down the previous revelations such as the Torah. Then God tells Prophet Muhammad that if the Jews and the Christians were to come to him for judgement for crimes such as adultery, stealing etc the he can judge them using the Qur'an. Then God tells Prophet Muhammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) to not to listen to nor deviate from the Law that he was given if the Jews and Christians tells him that his judgment is wrong. Then God tells us that if He Willed then He would have made mankind one nation or one religion and that it He Who made the Jews and the Christians astray to test them (to see if they would follow Prophet Muhammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) and what he was given in the Qur'an. When we all die then we will all be resurrected and we will all return to Him then He will show us where we have erred. |
Posted By: Caringheart
Date Posted: 03 July 2014 at 1:19pm
Greetings Abu Loren, It seems to me that you overlook a great deal. What about this; 5:44 Lo! We did reveal the Torah, wherein is guidance and a light, by which the prophets who surrendered (unto Allah) judged the Jews, and the rabbis and the priests Then God tells Prophet Muhammad that if the Jews and the Christians were to come to him for judgement for crimes such as adultery, stealing etc the he can judge them using the Qur'an.I don't know how you reach this conclusion when the surah's clearly state what I've shown above as regards the Jews, and this below, as regards the Christians. 5:47 Let the People of the Gospel judge by that which Allah hath revealed therein. by what has been revealed therein... in the Gospel.. not the qur'an. and for the Jews, the Torah... which is precisely what Muhammad did... He judged them according to their own scriptures. Are you not aware of this? I believe he did this for his own protection as much as anything... If he used their own scriptures he could hardly be accused of anything. Then God tells Prophet Muhammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Wa Sallam) to not to listen to nor deviate from the Law that he was given if the Jews and Christians tells him that his judgment is wrong.5:48 ... For each We have appointed a divine law and a traced-out way. Had Allah willed He could have made you one community. But that He may try you by that which He hath given you Clearly the surah states that each has been given his own way and that they will be tried according to what they have been given. When we all die then we will all be resurrected and we will all return to Him then He will show us where we have erred.I am pleased that we agree on at least one statement. This last of yours. asalaam, Caringheart [/QUOTE] ------------- Let us seek Truth together Blessed be God forever "I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis |
Posted By: Abu Loren
Date Posted: 04 July 2014 at 2:51am
For example within verse 5:48 the statement "Had Allah willed, He would have made you one nation [united in religion], but [He intended] to test you in what He has given you; so race to [all that is] good." means, to me, that the Jews and Christians were tested to see if they would accept the Final Revelation or not, whether they were truly believers, because if they were they would have recognised Mohammad (SalAllahu Alayhi Sallam) as a Messenger of God and the Qur'an as the Final Revelation.
Regarding verse 5:44
You have to read it in context with the preceding verse of 44 to understand it.
Sahih International But how is it that they come to you for judgement while they have the Torah, in which is the judgement of Allah ? Then they turn away, [even] after that; but those are not [in fact] believers. Indeed, We sent down the Torah, in which was guidance and light. The prophets who submitted [to Allah ] judged by it for the Jews, as did the rabbis and scholars by that with which they were entrusted of the Scripture of Allah , and they were witnesses thereto. So do not fear the people but fear Me, and do not exchange My verses for a small price. And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the disbelievers. 5:43-44 |