Was muhammad's first teacher a christian?
Printed From: IslamiCity.org
Category: Religion - Islam
Forum Name: Islam for non-Muslims
Forum Description: Non-Muslims can ask questions about Islam, discussion for the purpose of learning.
URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=14317
Printed Date: 25 April 2024 at 5:56am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Was muhammad's first teacher a christian?
Posted By: owen.grandison
Subject: Was muhammad's first teacher a christian?
Date Posted: 06 March 2009 at 3:22pm
|
Yes, according to orthodox sunni muslims own writings, waraqa bin naufal (527-639) was a christian. "Then she rose and gathered her garments about her and set forth to her cousin waraqa... who had become a christian and read the scriptures and learned from those that follow the torah and the gospel". Waraqa attached himself to christianity and studied its scriptures until he had thoroughly mastered them". (The life of muhammad. A. guillaume. Oxford university press. 1980 A.D. pages 83, 99). |
Replies:
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 07 March 2009 at 6:35pm
|
Hello Owen.grandison,
I see many threads of yours. Guess, you are studying Islam. Thanks for sharing and questioning as well.
Though, this thread, does n't have any question, but would like to comment, so that it may help you to add up your knowledge.
Your first line which says acc to sunni writings. Let me tell you, that all muslims irrespective of any group, we belong to, believe that he was a christian. Before Muhammad {peace be upon him} was bestowed with Prophethood, i.e in the age of Ignorance, one of the religions existed were christianity. There were very few amongst the people of scripture { Christians and Jews } who truly followed there religions. Anyways, but to say he was a teacher of Prophet, we don't believe such. Waraqa bin Naufal, was a true christian, since he recognised, Muhammad as a prophet, as prophesised by the Gospels. Therefore it's no wonder, after when Prophet Muhammad was first visited by Arch Angel Gibreel (Gabriel) peace be upon him, and brought him the first five verses of the Holy Qur'an and declared him as the Prophet of Allah, his Noble wife, Khadija took him to her cousin 'Waraqa Bin Noufal' who knew the Scriptures of Jews and Christians (who is stated to have translated them into Arabic). When Khadija visited him after this first revelation of God's Message (about 610 A.D) and informed him about this great incidence, Waraqa bin Noufal cried out :"Holy! Holy! This is the Namus (The Holy Spirit) who came to Moses. He will be the Prophet of his people. Tell him this and bid him be brave of heart." Some time later, when he met the Holy Prophet he again confirmed the truth declared by Torah and Gospel : "I swear by Him (Means Allah) is whose hand Waraqa's life is, Allah has chosen you to be the Prophet of this people. They will call you a liar, they will persecute you, they will banish you, they will fight against you. Oh, that I could live to those days. I would fight for these." As he was very old, he died soon. We consider him the first person to accept Muhammad [peace be upon him] as a prophet.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 08 March 2009 at 3:16am
|
Waraqa bin naufal also taught muhammad the torah and gospel. So, shouldn't the orthodox sunni muslims follow this sunna and be taught by christian teachers and study the torah and gospel instead of saying they are tampered with? It was khadiyjah and waraqah who MADE MUHAMMAD A PROPHET just like people turned noble drew ali, marcus garvey, martin luther king jr., malcolm x, etc. into prophets. These leaders weren't divinely inspired. They were motivated by their followers, nor was muhammad divinely inspired. Muhammad was a prophet of revelation, not prophecy. He did not tell of future events. He merely gave revelation. Khadiyjah and waraqa worked on his EGO and built him up more and more on untruths. However, it tells you in the qur'aan, that allah is the planneer of planners (qur'aan 3:54). Allah stepped in and gave revelations to muhaamad. You can see this same thing happening with the forerunners of islam in the west, like marcus garvey, noble drew ali, and elijah muhammad because no one before them or during their time was able to uplift nuwaubian moors the way they did. They took nuwaubian moors off the streets, out of bars, off drugs and out of jails and made them respect themselves and their nation, so others will respect them. Who else can you say was able to accomplish something like this back then? Now that nuwaubians are in need of some type of real leadership, you'll find sunni muslim organizations with many negro imaams in their congregation, who are being used to destroy nuwaubian leadership. These people are being bribed with money into converting so that they can go out spreading lies and slandering for the organizations coming out of saudi arabia. Whether they know it or not they are helping to spread this new islam. Before the conspiracy, muhammad was actually following the laws (or torah) of abraham (qur'aan 2:130). He also dressed in the attire prescribed for t he hebrews: the qamiys, ephod and breastplate (exodus 28:4) and the jallaabiyyah. However the sunni muslims no longer wear this garb of t he righteous. They prefer to dress in business suites, smoke, drink liquor, and chase women. Other traditions have also changed over, such as women choosing their husbands, whereas in the past young women were bethrothed through their families, which is what KHADIYJAH DID, when she chose muhaamad as her husband. You may ask: how could it be possible for islam to be a made up religion, conspired by khadiyjah -meaning "the great one?" think about it. How could a rich business woman with a prominent family in mecca and two previous husbands choose, and marry a poor and uneducated man 15 YEARS YOUNGER THAN HERSELF, SUCH AS MUHAMMAD? Please don't say it was love! No she did not need him for financial support. It was a conspiracy! Just look at the distance between their marriage, and his call to prophethood - a total of 15 years! Do you think she actually suported him all that time with "no strings attached?" I DON'T THINK SO. THIS IS ONE BIG MESS KHADIYJAH, WARAQAH AND THE VATICAN, ST. AUGUSTINE, ETC. created and it must be cleaned up with right knowledge, right wisdom and right overstanding, because the sunni orthodox muslim world turned the old religion of peace into a new form of idol worship. Although, they claim to follow the qur'aan and the laws revealed, they don't. |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 08 March 2009 at 3:21am
| Peace and blessings i've sent a reply but i didn't click on the reply button at first so i thought i would click on it now to let you know i've put a response to your thoughts. Thanks. |
Posted By: savant
Date Posted: 08 March 2009 at 10:21am
|
Not only this; even also many signs prophet muhammad(Sallho-alihe Wassalam) and his Sahaba(companions) were to given chiristians; so that they can recognize last prophet and embrace Islam. And many saints of that time did so. And Quran also mention this point: Fatah-28 ------------- Never Give up |
Posted By: savant
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 3:16am
|
Once Hazrat Umer (Prophet Sallho-alihe Wassalam companion) was reading old testimonials at the moment Prophet came. And he teaches Umer that in existance Quran all past books are obselete now. All the orders and guidelines are cancelled.
So it will be useless effort by christian teachers to taught gospel to Muslims. ------------- Never Give up |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 3:41am
Only christians were telling muhammad's family that he was going to be special. Everybody who had came into contact with muhammad's father around the same time of his betrothal engagement were roman catholic arabs. Abdullah was approached by a woman, named qutayla, who was the sister of waraqa bin naufal, a christian, and the holder of the arabic bible, on his way to the ka'aba. Qutayla knew that abdullah was going to be the father of muhammad and she informed him of this. You see the plan was already in the works by the vatican. Qutayla had consulted some soothsayers, and they agreed that abdullah wa going to be the father of this appointed prophet. Qutayla's intentions were to offer herself to him, so that she might have the honour of being the mother of their prophet. So qutayla (a christian and cousin to muhammad's first wife, khadiyjah) asked Abdullah to marry her, as she wanted to be the mother of his son. As legend says, abdullah looked at her, a light radiated from his forehead abdullah promised to claim her after three days. Within those three days abdullah consumated his mariage to amiynah. Then he returned to qutayla. However, the light that had supposedly illuminated his forehead was no longer there it transpired that abdullah had already married amiynah from medina. Qutayla refused to be united with abdullah because the light she desperately wanted to possess had already been transmitted to amiynah. She was quoted to have said, "No! When you passed me there was a light between your eyes and when i invited you, you refused me and went to amiynah, and she has taken it away." She was mad, but that was only one small piece to the jig-saw puzzle. |
savant wrote:Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 5:52am
|
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
. Nor does any of your copy-paste from other sites, tell us that Prophet Muhammad, learnt anything from Waraqah bin Naufal. Where is the proof that he taught ?Posted By: Mansoor_ali
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 3:54pm
To owen.grandison Here is my question for you 'Where it is written that waraqa bin naufal taught Muhammad Torah and Bible?' Now let me quote the complete story of waraqa bin naufal from most the authentic source 'Sahih Bukhari' The complete story is narrated by Aisha (peace be upon her) in Sahih Al-Bukhari: "The commencement of the Divine Inspiration of Allah's Apostle was in the form of good dreams which came true like bright daylight, and then the love of seclusion was bestowed upon him. He used to go in seclusion in the cave of Hira where he used to worship (Allah alone) continually for many days before wishing to see his family. He used to take with him provisions for the stay and then come back to (his wife) Khadeejah to eat his food again as before. One day suddenly the Truth descended upon him while he was in the cave of Hira. The angel came to him and asked him to read. The Prophet (peace be upon him) replied, "I do not know how to read." The Prophet (peace be upon him) added, "The angel caught me (forcefully) and pressed me so hard that I could not bear it any more. He then released me and again asked me to read and I replied, "I do not know how to read." Thereupon he caught me again and pressed me a second time until I could not bear it any more. He then released me and again asked me to read but again I replied, "I do not know how to read (or what shall I read)?" Thereupon he caught me for the third time and pressed me, and then released me and said, "Read in the name of your Lord, who has created (all that exists), created man from a clot. Read! And your Lord is the Most Generous.'"(96):1-3. Then Allah's Apostle (peace be upon him) returned with the Inspiration and with his heart trembling. He went to Khadeejah the daughter of Khuwaylid (his wife) and said, "Cover me!" She covered him until his fear subsided. After that he told her everything that had happened and said, "I fear that something may happen to me." Khadeejah replied, "Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you. You keep good relations with your kith and kin, help the poor and the destitute, serve your guests generously and assist the deserving people afflicted with calamities." Khadeejah then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqah ibn Nawfal ibn Asad ibn AbdulUzza, who, during the pre-Islamic period became a Christian and used to write in the Hebrew alphabet. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight. Khadeejah said to Waraqah, "Listen to the story of your nephew, O my cousin!" Waraqah asked, "O my nephew! What have you seen?" Allah's Apostle described that which he had seen. Waraqah said, "This is the one who keeps the secrets (angel Gabriel) whom Allah had sent to Moses. I wish I were young and could live until the time when your people will turn you out." Allah's Apostle asked, "Will they drive me out?" Waraqah replied in the affirmative and said, "Anyone (man) who came with something similar to that which you have brought was greeted with hostility; and if I remain alive until the day when you will be turned out then I should support you strongly." |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 4:29pm
|
I am actually studying islam and have been for years. As you know it will be ongoing till the day i leave this realm. And i'm not copying and pasting i just have knowledge and truth i would like to share with the world. And i don't need to go to anti-islamic sites for my questions. I have books of my own which stirs my mind. Think about what you are saying anti-islamic. That is a ridiculous statement to say to me because islam means peace so you are suggesting that i'm anti peace. LOL Now orthodox sunni muslims would never admit that the founder of islam was recognized first by a christian. To say this is blasphemy to the orthodox sunni muslim world. Muhammad while a young boy heard koss, bishop of nejran, preach a purer creed than that of mecca, in accents which agitated and aroused his soul. Thus this is one of the proofs that he was influenced by christians! Then it was said a little later on when muhammad was nine years old, he was with his uncle abu taalib while traveling in a caravan a roman catholic monk named bahira, from busra, syria had invited them to a feast, and saw the boy and questioned him. Then he asked to see the mark on his back. He exclaimed "it is the seal of prophethood." This catholic monk warned muhammad's uncle, by telling him to take your brothers son back to his country and guard him against the jews. for by god if they see him and know of him that which i know they will construe evil against him. Great things are in store for this brother's son of yours. It was nothing but a big P.L.O.T by catholics for st. augustine and the catholic church! The monk bahira was well versed in the knowledge of christians. Bahira looked upon the prophet muhammad who said: "Ask me what you like. So he began to ask him about what happened in his sleep, and his habits, and his affairs, generally, and what the apostle of god told him coincided with what bahira knew of his description. Then he looked at his back and saw the seal of prophethood between his shoulders in the very place described in his book..." (The life of muhamamd, a. guillaume, oxford university press. 1980 A.D. pages 80) This is the same story of jesus in jerusalem with the elders as a young boy (gospel of luke 2:41-47). When muhammad was taken back to mecca, bahira kept the jews away from him. Prior to muhammad's marriage to khadiyjah (who was older than he was and had been married twice before) this event took place: "The apostle stopped in the shade of a tree near a monk's cell, when the monk came up to maysara and asked who the man was who was resting beneath the tree. He told him that he was of quraish, the people who held the sanctuary and the monk exclaimed: none but a prophet ever sat beneath this tree. (the life of muhammad, a. guillaume, oxford university press, 1980 A.D. page 82). Despite your own writings, the orthodox sunni muslims do not give the christians credit for being knowledgeable enough in the scriptures which came before the qur'aan to foretell and plan the propethood of muhammad as you have just read. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 09 March 2009 at 11:04pm
|
The monk Bahira and Warqah bin Naufal recognised Muhammad {Sallal lahu alayhi wa sallam} as a prophet. They cud recognise him easily as it was already propheised in the Gospels and Torah and signs abt him. So why don't you then recognise Muhammad as a Prophet, like those ancestors of yours did ? Even today, you have your scripture in your hand, which still contains those prophesies. Why don't you look into it and accept Muhammad as a Prophet ?
No where, is it proved that Prophet Muhammad {Pbuh} was taught by any christian ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 10 March 2009 at 6:06am
|
IT WAS CHRISTIANS WHO WANTED THE SO-CALLED PAGANISTIC ARABS TO CONVERT TO THIS NEW FOUNDED RELIGION, ISLAM? On one such feast day, four men separated themselves from the rest of the qurayshites and decided among themselves that idol worship was wrong. these men were: 1) Waqara bin naufal bin asad bin abdul uzza - who was a christian, and a distand cousin of muhammad. It was waraqa who said: "Verily muhammad is the prophet of this people." 2) Ubaydullah ibn jash ibn ra'ab ibn ya'mar ibn sabra ibn murra ibn kabir ibn ghanm ibn dudan asad ibn khazayam; - who was related to muhammad by his grandfather abdul muttalib and went t o abyssinia and became a christian. 3) Uthman bin al huwayrith bin asad bin abudl uzza ibn qusayy - khadiyjah's cousin and became a christian at constantinople as well. 4) Zayd ibn amr ibn nufayl ibn abdul uzza ibn abdullah ibn qurt ibn riyah ibn uzzah ibn adiyy ibn ka'b ibn luwaiy - he was a cousin of umar. They sought to control arabia's trade and influence muhammad religious thoughts, thus they proclaimed they did not believe that idol worship was a good way of life. Now why all of a sudden these 4 men who were christians proclaimed they sought the religion of truth, and warned of the prophecy of a coming prophet? What was wrong with christianity as the religion of truth? Did they eveer convert to islam? No! They remained christians. Christians going around arabia boosting up muhammad so he can proclaim the religion islam, made up by the catholic jesuit priests. These men saw the people as corrupted, and needed st. augustin's teachings. So you see waraqa (muhammad's main man and interpreter) was a roman catholic, originally from tama-re, descended from ancient egyptian stock. He converted to christianity in constantinople, turkey and followed the augustine doctrine and studied what you muhammadsn arecalling the injiyl "evangel, revelation," until he thoroughyly mastered it. Waraqa bin naufal also mastered the torah and was the undle of khadija (555-619 A.D.), muhammad's first wife as previously said. Waraqa had told his cristian uncle, khadiyjah who was also a rich christian an ex-nun that muhammad will be the awaited "prophet", whome they had selected and that he will be used for the plot to manipulate all the arabs of arabia and control its trad; thus eventually waraqa taught him a lot about christianity. Ubaydallah continued to search until the new religion islam held its own. He was among those arabs who later migrated to abyssinia taking with him his wife umm habiba bint abu sufyaan (who converted to christianity). Originally muhammad followed the rites of abraham which was not islam the religion or rites of abraham would had been the worship of baal, then later on alyuwn alyuwn el-the most high. This is something totally false that you muhammadans try to tie in abraham who hasn't of yet been proven to have existed. His indoctrination changed since the time he met khadijah then HIS RELIGION CHANGED. Khadijah implanted christianity into islam by way of her cousin waraqa. Being that waraq was able to manipulate and shape muhammad's thinking CHRISTIANITY was weaved into his own laws and traditions and paved the way to a new found religion - ISLAM. Remember the catholic church was influenced by MANES, A PERSIAN, AND ROMAN, GNOSTIC, PAGANISTIC DOCTRINATIONS, WHICH BECAME PART OF ISLAM! So its true when people say, "muhammad was the founder of islam"; the made up religion called islam which has been further perverted into idol worshipping, called "muhammadism." You worship him as you would worship allah who you call "father." However muhammad told his followers he was not the father of any of them (qur'aan 33:40), which stems back in time when fathers and mothers were worshipped in the form of adoration as teraphim in peoples houses. Because teraphims were statues of ancestors placed in th ehouse and adorned. People like muhammad lookedupon that as idol worshipping. In turn people eventually began calling the creator "father," ab; as in the cae of the lord's prayer - "our father ", abanaa. And although the scroll of malachi 4:6, says "and he (eloheem yahuwa, elijah) will return the hearts compassionately of the fathers to their children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers..."; muhammad with the help of the qur'aan changed that and began turning children away from their fathers (qur'aan 9:23). By doing this the name, rabb "master", sustainer" was used in reference to the name of allah which he still got from the hewbrews or jews. Although he deterred them from calling allah as well as himself "father " he told them to follow his teachings. However, you ended up looking to him as a father figure anyway giving him reverence and adoration as our ancestors did with teraphims to the point of worshipping him right beside allah. |
Posted By: Mansoor_ali
Date Posted: 10 March 2009 at 3:25pm
To owen.grandison Topic:Did Waraqa Ibn Nawfal Teach The Prophet? Waraqa is one of the four men who left the pagan faith of Mecca as mentioned in this article in search for the Hanifite roots ( the religion of Abraham(P)) and returned as a Christian. Even he was claimed to be the source of the Qur'�n. Some missionaries depended on had�ths narrated in Sahih al-Bukh�r�:
The other had�th is:
Waraqa was an old man and died shortly
after Muhammad(P) had received the revelation of the Qur'�n;
as clearly can be read from the above had�th. While the revelation of
the Qur'�n continued for more than twenty years after the death of Waraqah
bin Nawfal, the Prophet(P) was receiving the revelation in different
places and even while he was among his Companions. Also, he was answering direct
questions raised later by the Jews in Madinah. In addition, the Jews and the disbelievers
of Mecca would be very pleased if they knew for sure that there was a knowledgeable
person who was teaching Muhammad(P) the Qur'�n.
It is not surprising to see that when these points are brought together, Christian missionaries start to take refuge in the excuses that Waraqa was a heretic or on whose authority he said that he would support Muhammad's(P) prophethood? Related Articles On The Borrowing Theories Of The Qur'�n
|
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Sources/BBorientalist.html - Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 10 March 2009 at 11:15pm
|
[QUOTE=owen.grandison]IT WAS CHRISTIANS WHO WANTED THE SO-CALLED PAGANISTIC ARABS TO CONVERT TO THIS NEW FOUNDED RELIGION, ISLAM?
I wished you to prove it from your sources that it was christians who called arabs to covert to Islam. But you cud not. And let me add up to your knowledge that Islam is not a new religion. It was the religion of Adam, Abraham, Moses, Isa and Muhammad. {May peace be upon them all} It was the same religion preached by all Prophets. To say that it was "NEWLY-FOUNDED" RELIGION is totally wrong.
Waqara bin naufal bin asad bin abdul uzza - who was a christian, and a distand cousin of muhammad. It was waraqa who said: "Verily muhammad is the prophet of this people." - Waraqa bin Naufal was n't cousin of Muhammad {pbuh} but of Prophet's noble wife, Khadijah RA. Coming to his line wherein he identifies Muhammad {Pbuh} as a prophet, was because the Book, {Injeel/gospel} already prophecised it. Those signs were so clear that he cud easily identify him as a prophet. Does this line of yours prove that Muhammad {Peace be upon him} 's first teacher was a christian. There's nothing i cud recognise him as a teacher ! Now why all of a sudden these 4 men who were christians proclaimed they sought the religion of truth, and warned of the prophecy of a coming prophet? What was wrong with christianity as the religion of truth? Its a very good question. Did you notice, as why these men sought for religion of truth inspite of been christians ? That was because, the Book they followed was distorted. It was altered and made changes. So they waited for the new Prophet acc to the prophecies and warned people.
Did they eveer convert to islam? No! They remained christians.
These people must be amongst those who disbelieved inspite of knowing the truth. As said it was clear in the Books abt the signs of this Prophet. Abt first person. Warqah bin Noufal accepted Muhammad {pbuh} as a prophet. Kindly re-read the above post of Mansoor ali. Read the last part with concentration.
As Allah says in Qur'an - "And when there came to them a Messenger from Allah (i.e. Muhammad ) confirming what was with them, a party of those who were given the Scripture threw away the Book of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know"
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 12:02am
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Nausheen
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 12:04am
This is a very interesting peice.
If Qutayla and the vaticans were "planning" to name the son of Abdullah as a Prophet of God, then she would have married him anyway - that way if she had a male child, according to her clan's plan could name that child as the prophet (no?)
If she knew this was a true prophecy, only then she would have "seen" the light on his forehead, then refused to marry, when she again did not "detect' the light after it had been passed on to Aminah's womb.
So what is your point here?
------------- <font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR] |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 12:15am
|
Sister Nausheen, yeh shaqs bahot thang karr raha hai. Though its easy to answer him but needs lots of time. He's all been at the section {two-three threads} that he's active. His sharings are very similar to anti-islamic site. ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: Nausheen
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 12:40am
Either you are copying from somewhere, and there are terrible editing mistakes, or you are writing yourself without having read all of your source. Can you please explain the following:-
Waraqa had told his cristian uncle, khadiyjah who was also a rich christian an ex-nun ...
Who was the christian Uncle of Waraq ... did I miss anything from your story?
You did not tell us when Waraqa died. Can you please confirm those dates, thank you.
btw, Khadija (radiallahu anha) was a widow not sure if she was a nun ... how do you know that?
Okay let us say that Warqa was a converted christian, who taught Muhammad (sallallahu alaihe wasallam) christianity ... If this is true, how and why did Islam come in picture? When Warqa was teaching him christianity, who introduced "founded" Islam? and why?
Today Islam is the only religion on earth that condemns the worship of human beings. At least you agree that Muhammad (sallalllahu alaihe wasallam) was a human being - conceived and born between a father and a mother.
We don't worship him. Have you ever heard of the word "shirk" - it means attributing partners to the Allah - in simpler words, worshipping other than the One and Only God.
We are the only religious group existing on earth who does not uphold these practices as holy.
And all of this is because your source of the verse says; he is not the father of any of them.
while the verse says; he is not the father of any of their men.
- None of his male children survived to adulthood, so you can understand this as his generation did not carry on as of others from a male offspring.
Also we don't worship the One and Only God as "Father" of mankind.
For Muslims He is understood as the "Creator" of mankind and everything apart from Him.
Can you please tell what exactly you are angry at? Im trying to understand through your posts, but cannot really decodify. If you could please spell it out more clearly, it would be easier for us to address.
Thank you for your contributions to our discussion forum!
------------- <font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR] |
Posted By: Nausheen
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 12:43am
Iska kya karna chahiye?
Hamein to iski batein kafi mazakhiya lag rahi hain ... I hardly read any anti- websites. ------------- <font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR] |
Posted By: Nausheen
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 1:05am
Excuse me, there is no knowledgeable Sunni Muslim, or for that matter even the shia who will not believe that Bahira or Warqa were Christians.
It is only the Christians and the Jews who don't give credit to the knowledge of Bahira and Warqa.
According to your own story they were plotting something.
Muhammad sallallahu alaihe wasallam never accepted paganism which was common in arabia in his time. There were very few Jews or christians at that times. Many of them who recognised the prophesies of their own scripture accept him as the prophet of God and accepted Islam.
Are to telling us what Sunnis believe, or you are confirming from us?
If you are trying to educate us about these stories, we already know them :-)
------------- <font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR] |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 2:29am
Where does it say in the qur'aan the injiyl is tampered with. Where does it say this in the qur'aan. To make it easier for you i will tell you all the places in the qur'aan the word injiyl can be found: the qur'aan: 3:3, 48, 65, 5:49,50,69,71,113, 7:157,9:111,48:29,57:27 So if it does not say that the injiyl is tampered with why don't you orthodox sunni muslims read it? Not the torah as you say the jews changed, altered or tampered with but show us any place in the qur'aan where it says the christians tampered with, altered or changed the injiyl. If you can't you better start reading allah's book. |
Posted By: savant
Date Posted: 11 March 2009 at 7:57am
|
This person is wasting time. Koi kaam di gaal pochay tay bandaa chaloo jawab bi dewaaay. do chaar hoor vi hegaay naay isaaay; vellay ------------- Never Give up |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 12 March 2009 at 12:13am
|
Koi baat nahi, sabr se jawab tho dena hoga, warna naye readers sonchege ki Islam mein iska jawab nahi. Bata dein ki hum issay bhi chaloo hai.
By the way, Owen.g, that was not the point of discussion. Your topic, contradicts completely with your question. Anyways, i wish you would have seeked helped of any muslim, while studying Qur'an . Else all these doubts would n't get so firm. Anyways, its not late. YOu can ask us, anything you don't understand, but in a better manner.
If you had studied Qur'an, you must have come across the words "People of Book", right !
People of Book are both bestowed with Books { Torah and Injeel}. Now, go thru it with this understanding, insha Allah, you shall get your answers.
By the way, are you now satisfied that Waraqah was n't teacher of Muhammad {Peace be upon him} ?
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 12 March 2009 at 5:22am
|
The blashemous 17th century inscription found in the magazine called "aramco world," the september-october 1989 A.D. issue reads "muhammad is the guide". One of your god's/allah's name is "the guide" the 94th attribute which is not to be attributed to mortals as it says in the qur'aan! (al qur'aan 7:180, 59:24) to call the prophet muhammad "al haadi" is t ocall him allah. You muhammadsn have given muhammad attributes in previous scriptures thanks again to the vatican such as mukhtaar meaning "chosen or elect" (isaiah 42:1), al mu'izziy meaning "the comforter (john 15:26), ruwhul haqq "the spirti of truth," (john 16:13) These are his self mad attribues for himself. However muhammadans has compiled a listing of 104 attributes for the prophet muhammad which is 5 MORE than those attributed to allah. My master teacher published this list in edition 124, beginner's arabic, simplified arabic reading," pages 45-47 and muslim creeds, scroll 71. This isan example of "muhammad worship" evident more than 300 years ago. You all have been worshipping a man all along and you will go to your hell for this according to your qur'aan for it is a great sin to bind partners with allah as you say. |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 15 March 2009 at 5:07am
|
Again, Owen.g, you can start a new thread. The above post of yours does n't match the topic of thread at all. Acc to guidelines of Islamicity, you are going wrong.
The topic is all over. You are proved wrong that Waraqah bin Naufal was not a teacher at all. Even before going to him, Muhammad {Pbuh} was bestowed with Prophethood and also was revelation of Qur'an started, thus proving all the prophecies made in Gospels and Torah come true.
Just for the sake of clearing your post above, let me tell you in short that
Haad (The Leader)
Mahd (The Guided One) Rasheed (The Guided) - These are the the names given to Prophet, wherein you shall find that Muhammad {Peace be upon him} was never attributed as "the guide". He is GUIDED. So better write up to that magazine to correct that instead of taking the words wrong and getting misconcepted.
The attributes of Allah swt related tp the word "guide" are
Ar-Rasheed (The Guide To The Right Path)
Al-Haadi (The Guide)
Here you shall find that Allah swt is the one who guides and Muhammad {Pbuh} was the Guided. Its the time that you and me pray that Allah swt guides all of us to right path and save ourselves from being mis-guided. Ameen.
Hope it gets clear that we don't worship Muhammad {Peace be uponhim} at all. Also correct you that there are 99 names of Prophet Muhammad not 124.
------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: seekshidayath
Date Posted: 15 March 2009 at 5:11am
|
Did you check in 'People of Book". Did you get know as where it says that the books were tampered ? ------------- Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: �All the descendants of Adam are sinners, and the best of sinners are those who repent." |
Posted By: owen.grandison
Date Posted: 15 March 2009 at 10:35am
| i was replying to someone saying that they are not muhammadans that is why it doesn't match the topic. i like to try and answer everything if i can. peace and blessings. |
Posted By: _ALI_
Date Posted: 16 March 2009 at 12:16am
|
You guys speak urdu? nice.... |