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utd4ever
Starter Joined: 11 March 2005 Location: Malaysia Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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AssalamualaikumLets not forget that my thread-setting post begins with the Islamic State vs Malay Nationalism debate in Malaysia, which is really stemming from politics. Whatever the claim, it has not deviated from that.In the nutshell, my underlying message is to highlight that its not the labelling to the ideological �ism that determines the Islamness but its consistency with the spirit of Islam and the result. Apart from mentioning of Dr Mahathir�s and Azhar�s Rector on Malaysia�s Islamic state status, the Islamic label and branding is irrelevent to me. I highlight the inextricable link of Malay and Islam. The practise of ibadah and the high level of adab (behaviour and etiquette) in our culture is reflective of this claim. I boldly put forth that the success of Malaysia as God�s will to the pragmatic and fine balancing act of �Malay Nationalism� ie achieving good governance, adhering to Islamic value, acculturing Islam and defending the ummah�s interest and development. Critique to my bold claim painted the same negative picture of Nationalism on Malay Nationalism. The refine Malay character was blatantly ignored. Some ill understood discrepencies was put forward, such as infering affirmative action as discrimination. Some fact put forth seem to come out from many of Time Warner�s media offices. Some argument were discomforting. It seems we Muslims have an obtuse obsession to talk of principle for principle sake, irrespective if it is detrimantal to the interest of the ummah. We are so narrow and fanatic with our interpretation that we are prejudice to disbelieve that with creativity, conflicting interest can be balanced. I was not born yesterday to not know that repeated evil labelling of Nationalism, emphasis to refer to Quran and Hadith (without specifics), remark of �Islam is not a pastime�, etc, ultimately leads to discussion of Islamic statehood. An idea most associated with Hassan Al Banna�s and Syed Qutb�s Ikhwanul Muslimun. So I touched on Jamaluddin Al Afghani. Scholars on the study of society long concluded that most of the thoughts on Islamic State are reactions to local problems without a holistic knowledge of the problems of the whole ummah. But I look forward for that right models of modern Islamic state that is beneficial to the well being and akidah of the ummah. Yes I agree, we should strive for unity. (There is even a Forum for it ie the OIC. Unfortunately, it is another forum for the Arabs to carry their quarrels and bickering than pondering the plight of the ummah.) Someone refered me that a Quranic passage (17:70) highlight good governance as non disriminatory, gender equality, rigths to other religion and democratic in nature. Malay Nationalism Malaysia fulfilled that, delivered the goods and Islam has flourished. Either we refuse to acknowledge due to minor discrepencies, perceived or real, or we learn from it. Till we move forward. Have a good weekend. Wassalam utd4ever PS Thank you ZamanH for highlighting prosperity is from Allah. For that matter, ilmu is from Allah too. Mockba, I concur totally with your criticism on Islamic banking. We could talk futher on a different thread. But you should see economics in totality, not just banking, but to incorporate the real-side and monetary side for a start. |
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ZamanH
Guest Group Joined: 21 July 2004 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 448 |
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Walai Kum As Salaam
What exactly do you mean??
Like??
I don't understand at all what you want to say. Most of the non-Muslims who convert to Islam are struck by the fact that Islam is practised as a way of life and not as a pastime (as they used to practise their religion). Separation of State and religion certainly relagates religion to be practised as a pastime.
Can you please elaborate on that?? I give up now. Your post contained so many insinuations and oblique references that I couldn't understand what you wanted to say. Will it be possible for you to be more forthright and sort of, more self-explanatory, when you write your posts. ZamanH
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An enemy of an enemy is a fickle friend.
There will be more women in hell than men. ..for persecution is worse than the slaughter of the enemy..(Quran 2:191) Heaven lies under mother's feet |
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Whisper
Senior Member Male Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4752 |
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Salaam Nausheen Haven't seen such a posting for a few years. Islam shuns nationality or any other sovereignity than Human Rights. |
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blond
Senior Member Joined: 30 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 218 |
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I concur. Nationalism has had terrible consequences for the Ummah. Every Muslim nation should put down its flag and pick up the Quran. |
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hkrespect
Groupie Joined: 20 March 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 52 |
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nationalism that was introduced to muslims by however was evil and is evil. look at sudan look at pakistan and bangladesh look at the arabs fightin turks kurds fightin everyone as muslims, our allegiance should lie with islam, then islam, then islam and then islam and only islam. nationalism takes away allegiance from the shahada to some man made constitution. |
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hk
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alikhlas99
Starter Joined: 06 June 2005 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Masha'Allah, tears formed i my eyes when I read these preceding posts.
"Islam unites nations" What a beautiful notion! Mere words cannot describe the love I feel for you, my brothers and sisters. May Allah unite our unworthy hearts once more. BTW, I myself am a Malay, Malaysian Muslim but I agree with everything my brother MOCKBA has posted and none that utd4ever has (May Allah SWT guide you nonetheless, akhi). Nationalism is rotten. Edited by alikhlas99 |
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Hayfa
Senior Member Female Joined: 07 June 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2368 |
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Not sure about nationalism, just that I meet many Moslems who put down ther Moslems like: "Oh those Arabs they are....." "Those Pakistanis are not good Moslems..." As if the group represents the individual. Many of these 'nation-state' boundaries were created during colonialism or post-colonialism. They are false boundries thay gives people wrong identities and focus on the wrong thing We are all one world. It does not do anyone any good if one area is doing well economically and another is going through terrible times. Yes we need organization, local social, economical and political structures. But those should not be our identity as human beings. One problem, in my mind, is that we all seperate more from each other. We lose the inter-connectedness. With technology we should be more connected not less. Nationalism continues that divide.
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When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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Whisper
Senior Member Male Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4752 |
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When real education (not mentioning "schooling" here) is lacking we stumble into all kinds of pits. Racism and nationalism are just some of those pits.
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