A question to all my Christian friends

Annie,

All of us are in agreement that there was not and there is not a single prophecy about Paul in the past scriptures. Good! Let's move on till someone comes and answers my questions as you do not seem to understand where I am coming from.

For Jesus to call him from the heavens by striking him down with a light or flash in the broad day light, should have been an event to have witnesses or someone to testify with his testimony.

When similar happened to Jesus, John the Baptist is said to have been the witness and it was his testimony. Even Jesus did not ever talk about the day the spirit went down into him after he came out of water, like a dove or lightning.

And here we have Paul who comes to Gentiles and impresses them with his own one-man testimony and we don't see him working for years, with the elders of Jerusalem who learnt direct from Jesus and who had first-hand knowledge.

We do not find him teaching and explaining what Jesus taught. Instead, we find him talking of salvation through the suffering, blood and death of Jesus on the cross only by just believing in Jesus, a salvation which Jesus himself never spoke of and a salvation of the kind that even the gospels do not mention. He talks about the particular sin which even Jesus never talked about.

Instead of Christianity being taught by the elders in Jerusalem, the Pauline Christianity came back from Rome and Greece to Jerusalem after all were silenced. Had he not gone West, there would have been no Trinity, no triune God, no Son of God. Only the Lord Almighty God of Jesus would have been prayed to!

What Paul did was to please the Romans and the Greeks.

Believe me.

 

Annie,

Before I retire for the night, I refer to the following from you:

"James, the brother of Jesus, was very prominent in the early church.  Mark is the testimony of Peter; Peter wrote two books and James wrote one."

In fact, James and Peter should have written the most. Why was Paul's material chosen, when in his own words he is the lowest of all the apostles? By the way, he appointed himself. Jesus never appointed him and there is no proof.

"Paul's writings represent the issues facing the early church.  If we didn't have them we would not know what those issues were."

I don't agree with that. In fact, the early church should not have had any issues as Jesus had just left. The early church had everything crystal clear, except that it had not been built where Jesus exactly wanted it built, i.e., on the rock. Paul built it in Rome. 

"It is enough that Jesus appointed Paul an apostle."

What proof is available there? Just Paul's own testimony? Did the elders James, Peter and others know of that. All they knew was that there was a Paul who was a missionary among Gentiles. It is not enough, Annie.

Here is how Rome, the Vatican, feels about the dalits and India.  At least the Muslims and Christians are working together there, which I feel is GREAT!!!

INDIA: HINDU CAMPAIGN AGAINST MISSIONARIES' "DIABOLICAL" PROSELYTISM
Accuse Church of Helping Poorest Caste

NEW DELHI, MAR 8 (ZENIT).- The largest Hindu organization in India launched a campaign against the "diabolical proselytism" of Christian missionaries, carried out under the guise of "social service." The Holy See's agency "Fides," reported that more than 15,000 members of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS) [Volunteers for National Association], engaged in a 15-day door-to-door campaign throughout the city of Delhi, to "enlighten" the population about the Christian missionaries' plan to conquer India. The campaign began on February 22 and ended on March 7.

According to the RSS, which inspires the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) currently in power, the Christian strategy has three phases. The first is to discredit the Hindu image of peaceful tolerance. Then the Christians trigger conflict between Hindu organizations, and manipulate the media to give broad coverage to this conflict. Finally, they distribute thousands of Bibles in the local regional languages.

The RSS began in 1925 as a religious army to protect Hindu communities from the influence of Islam and Christianity. It provides its members with basic military training and holds camps for ideological discussion. It was the RSS that assassinated Mahatma Gandhi for his policy in support of Moslem minorities in India. Although Moslems are the primary target, eight months ago the RSS started an anti-Christian campaign denouncing "forced conversions." Its members were responsible for the numerous violent incidents against Christians in 1998.

Moslems and Christians have joined forces to face Hindu fundamentalism. The "Harmony Center," a Catholic institution for inter-religious dialogue, and the Jamia Islamia Moslem University of New Delhi, have launched a joint campaign to counter the fundamentalism that characterizes the pro-Hindu policies of the federal government. The campaign began with a demonstration on February 24 at Delhi University Students' Center, and moved on to Trikona Square in front of the University Library. Five thousand youths participated.

According to Fr Sebastian Vempany, a Harmony Center expert on Islam, "it is important to inform the student community and the ordinary people about the fundamentalist policies of the federal government." "The poor want to live in peace and harmony," Father Vempany told "Fides." He said the government "has destroyed the confidence of Dalits [Untouchables], Tribals, women and minorities, both Christian and Moslem, in the secular character of the State."

There are 17 million Christians in India. They run numerous schools, hospitals, and charitable institutions. The higher caste Hindus see Christian missionaries' endeavors, in education and aid to the poorer castes as a threat to India's rigid social hierarchy.

http://www.zenit.org/english/archive/9903/ZE990308.html

God's Peace,

Edited by Patty

Annie,

BMZ wrote: All of us are in agreement that there was not and there is not a single prophecy about Paul in the past scriptures. Good! Let's move on till someone comes and answers my questions as you do not seem to understand where I am coming from.

I do understand where you are coming from.

BMZ wrote: For Jesus to call him from the heavens by striking him down with a light or flash in the broad day light, should have been an event to have witnesses or someone to testify with his testimony.

There were witnesses.

Acts 9: 7 And the men who journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice but seeing no one. 8 Then Saul arose from the ground, and when his eyes were opened he saw no one. But they led him by the hand and brought him into Damascus. 9 And he was three days without sight, and neither ate nor drank.

<>Acts 9: 10 Now there was a certain disciple at Damascus named Ananias; and to him the Lord said in a vision, �Ananias.�  And he said, �Here I am, Lord.� 11 So the Lord said to him, �Arise and go to the street called Straight, and inquire at the house of Judas for one called Saul of Tarsus, for behold, he is praying. 12 And in a vision he has seen a man named Ananias coming in and putting his hand on him, so that he might receive his sight.�

13 Then Ananias answered, �Lord, I have heard from many about this man, how much harm he has done to Your saints in Jerusalem. 14 And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call on Your name.�

15 But the Lord said to him, �Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel. 16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name�s sake.�

<>17 And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and laying his hands on him he said, �Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.� 18 Immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once; and he arose and was baptized.

19 So when he had received food, he was strengthened. Then Saul spent some days with the disciples at Damascus.

BMZ wrote: When similar happened to Jesus, John the Baptist is said to have been the witness and it was his testimony. Even Jesus did not ever talk about the day the spirit went down into him after he came out of water, like a dove or lightning.

You are mixing apples and oranges.

BMZ wrote: And here we have Paul who comes to Gentiles and impresses them with his own one-man testimony and we don't see him working for years, with the elders of Jerusalem who learnt direct from Jesus and who had first-hand knowledge.

Follow the dots.

<>Acts 9: 26 And when Saul had come to Jerusalem, he tried to join the disciples; but they were all afraid of him, and did not believe that he was a disciple. 27 But Barnabas took him and brought him to the apostles. And he declared to them how he had seen the Lord on the road, and that He had spoken to him, and how he had preached boldly at Damascus in the name of Jesus. 28 So he was with them at Jerusalem, coming in and going out. 29 And he spoke boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus and disputed against the Hellenists, but they attempted to kill him. 30 When the brethren found out, they brought him down to Caesarea and sent him out to Tarsus. 

Acts 11: 25 Then Barnabas departed for Tarsus to seek Saul. 26 And when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. So it was that for a whole year they assembled with the church and taught a great many people. And the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch.

Acts 11: 29 Then the disciples, each according to his ability, determined to send relief to the brethren dwelling in Judea. 30 This they also did, and sent it to the elders by the hands of Barnabas and Saul.

Acts 15: 22 Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas, namely, Judas who was also named Barsabas, and Silas, leading men among the brethren.

BMZ wrote: We do not find him teaching and explaining what Jesus taught. Instead, we find him talking of salvation through the suffering, blood and death of Jesus on the cross only by just believing in Jesus, a salvation which Jesus himself never spoke of and a salvation of the kind that even the gospels do not mention. He talks about the particular sin which even Jesus never talked about.

Paul did teach what Jesus taught.

JESUS: He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" Simon Peter answered, "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God". And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father in heaven". (Matthew 16:15-17)

PAUL: Paul was occupied with proclaiming the word, testifying to the Jews that the Messiah was Jesus. (Acts 18:5)

JESUS: All of them asked, "Are you, then, the Son of God?" He said to them, "You say that I am". Then they said, "What further testimony do we need? We have heard it ourselves from his own lips!" (Luke 22:70-71)

PAUL: Immediately he began to proclaim Jesus in the synagogues, saying, "He is the Son of God". (Acts 9:20)

JESUS: Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!" Jesus said to him, "Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have come to believe". (John 20:28-29)

PAUL: From them, according to the flesh, comes the Messiah, who is over all, God blessed forever. (Romans 9:5)

And on and on and on and including:

Matthew 20:28 just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many.�

From Peter: Acts 2: 22 �Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a Man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through Him in your midst, as you yourselves also know� 23 Him, being delivered by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you have taken by lawless hands, have crucified, and put to death; 24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it.

Again from Peter:

<>Acts 4: 8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, �Rulers of the people and elders of Israel: 9 If we this day are judged for a good deed done to a helpless man, by what means he has been made well, 10 let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole. 11 This is the �stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief cornerstone.� 12 Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.� 

BMZ wrote: Instead of Christianity being taught by the elders in Jerusalem, the Pauline Christianity came back from Rome and Greece to Jerusalem after all were silenced. Had he not gone West, there would have been no Trinity, no triune God, no Son of God. Only the Lord Almighty God of Jesus would have been prayed to!

Sounds like just your opinion and nothing else.  Your opinions do not reflect the history of the Church or the accounts in the New Testament

BMZ wrote: What Paul did was to please the Romans and the Greeks.

What Paul did was preach the Gospel of Jesus.  If he hadn't the Apostles would never have sent him to the Gentiles.

What Paul did was show the pagans that there is only one God and the gods the pagans believed in had no power.

What Paul did was preach a crucified and risen Messiah.

It seems that you need to study the New Testament, BMZ.