None Believer interprets the Quran

Superme

If history is correct when Muhammad started his mission there were about ten people who could read and write in Arabia

Are you joking or is that a case of lowering pre-Islamic Arabs to glorify Islam?

The Nabatean Arabs had a script of their own as the Arabic kingdoms in Southern Arabia.
The Arabs of Central Western Arabia had a very defective script which was used to write the Quran.
It had eventually to be perfected in a similar way as Hebrew to note vowel sounds and end conflicting views on pronunciation.
I believe several thousands pre-Islamic Arabs knew that script.

�        Allah has appointed mansions for moon till she returns like an old withered palm leaf�36:39

 [Ya Sin 36:39] And the Moon,- We have measured for her mansions (to traverse) till she returns like the old (and withered) lower part of a date-stalk.

<More proof that Muhammad knew nothing about the moon's orbit and where it went after it sank! A smart man in 600 having seen a solar and lunar eclipse could have figured this out. Proof Muhammad was never told much by god>

 

Fogtrik, your inquiries disgust me.  You really don�t have the right perception in reading these very clear verses and neither do you understand that these are the words of Allah- not the words of Sayyidina Muhammad.  I don�t� know why in every argument you add �muhammad didn�t know��  Sayyidina Muhammad didn�t write these verses, he is illiterate!  And what he knows is what Allah explained to him about each verse in the whole Quran.  So his knowledge far exceeds our own in explaining the Quran.  If you wanted to bring prophet Muhammad in the picture, you bring sources from books of Hadith. 

 

Here is the commentary of the above verse :  �The lunar stations (or mansions)  are the 28 divisions of the Zodiac, which are supposed to mark the daily course of the moon in the heavens from the time of the new moon to the time when the moon fades away in her �inter-lunar swoon�, an expressive phrase coined by the poet Shelly.  �Urjun: A raceme of dates or of a date-palm; or the base...of the raceme.  When it becomes old, it becomes yellow, dry and withered, and curves up like a sickle. Hence the comparison with the sickle-like appearance of the new moon. The moon runs through all her phases, increasing and decreasing, until she disappears, and then reappears as a little thin curve.�

 

I suggest you get the Quran with the English translation AND COMMENTARY that would give you some more clear explanations of these verses you question. 

 

 

No more of this nonsense, your accusations are nowhere near intelligent or logical. you�re all mixed up in your perception of these very clear verses.  Once you get a Quran that has comprehensive commentary and you read the intro of what to expect before studying this Holy Book, then you might be a little bit more clear-minded. 

 

Then you wouldn�t make a fool out of yourself asking these preposterous and baseless questions.

 

 

PEACE

�        The sun and the moon run its course and Allah regulates all affairs�13:2

 [ar-Ra`d 13:2] God is He Who raised the heavens without any pillars that ye can see; is firmly established on the throne (of authority); He has subjected the sun and the moon (to his Law)!

 

<god is he who raised the heaven without pillars? This implies that the earth is the center of the universe? Earth is in the arm of a spiral galaxy, one of 100 billion stars in 100 billion galaxies. The sun and moon are not subject to allah�s laws, they are governed by gravity. Muhammad didn�t know that the same gravity pulling an apple also controls the planet. He also didn�t know how fractal the universe is, or that earth wasn�t that important. This is proof of a simple man's POV!>

 

 

foggy, is your eyesight getting a bit too fogged up? Can�t you see what these verses are saying?  Man, I don�t even need to open the Quran to look up any commentaries on the verses you question!  Your perception is what needs fixin dude.  The in space, the heavens you see above us, -do you see anything that is keeping them above us?  Like any pillars?  It comes from an understanding that a ceiling needs pillars to keep it up.  The roof of a house is built on the walls of the house.  So when the vast heavens are extended above us, and there is no �pillars� or anything physical holding it up, it�s a wonder.  Especially in the 7^th century. The Quran came down in the 7^th century.  Today in the 21^st century, we discovered the law of gravity and other laws that permit the heavens to be the way they are.  What we know today hasn�t nullified any verses of the Quran.  What we keep figuring out these days are a part of the everlasting knowledge that is out there that Allah has and that we are figuring out.  Refer back to them verses I told ya about the infinite knowledge of Allah. (meaning the infinite discoveries of His creation, His creatures, His laws etc)

 This verse DOESN�T IMPLY THAT THE EARTH IS THE CENTER OF THE UNIVERSE.

 

Also, when you say �the sun and moon are not subject to Allah�s laws but are governed by gravity� it�s like saying a kid is not subject to his momma�s rules but is governed by her jurisprudence.   Gravity, fogtrik, is part of the framework of the laws that Allah created.  He created gravity so yes, you are right to say that the sun and moon are governed by gravity.   The verse doesn�t negate that fact. 

 

Yes, the people at the time didn�t know �that the same gravity pulling an apple also controls the planet. [and they] also didn�t know how fractal the universe is�.  Let me remind you they are ppl of the 7^th century.  Whatever they knew is what was stated in the Quran and explained by Sayyidina Muhammad in the books of Hadith.  They �submit themselves to Allah and His messenger�.  That�s what Muslim means dude.  �The one who submits� 

 

 

Besides, the people at the time (1400 years ago) were extravagant in faith, deed and wisdom more than extravagant in astronomy, math, physics, etc.  that doesn�t lessen the veracity of the Quran in any way though.  The Quran is a universal message.

 

The Quran didn�t specify the word gravity when relating the movement of sun and moon.  The word �law� was used.  And over the centuries, we humans were curious to learn specifically what laws are out there that these planets are governed by.  And we figured out: gravity.  A 7^th century person would take this verse and understand that there are laws that Allah created that govern the movement of sun and moon. 

, a 21^st century person on the other hand, when reading this verse, �gravity� comes to mind as one of the laws of Allah that He set the standard for movement of sun and moon.

 

You see what I mean? 

 

 

~Amal

 

ps: what�s POV?

[an-Nahl 16:15] And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you; and rivers and roads; that ye may guide yourselves;

<This implies that allah made the rivers, but he never, rivers are self organising systems they don�t need a creator. Early man knew nothing of geology time scale, neither did muhammad.>

 

we all know how rivers developed through natural processes. that doesn�t dismiss the existence of a creator.  It is Allah who governs the laws and methods of nature that in turn through changing environments brings about rivers, streams, forests, deserts etc.  it is He who controls the laws of nature and therefore it is only logical to connect Allah to the generation of these rivers and streams.

 

�        Allah set mountains firm for earth not to shake�31:10

 [Luqman 31:10] He created the heavens without any pillars that ye can see; He set on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you; and He scattered through it beasts of all kinds. We send down rain from the sky, and produce on the earth every kind of noble creature, in pairs.

 <Not all animals exist in pairs, simple animals reproduce by asexual reproduction. There is no male- female sponge. Muhammad didn�t know this! A god would have>

 

hmmm.. simply put: a true statement doesn�t override or deny another equally true statement.  This verse relates a very true and viable fact: the existence of male and female parts.  It doesn�t negate the fact that there is also asexual reproduction.  Additionally I don�t think it is quite fathomable to introduce this additional info to a 7^th century people with a 7^th century mind capacity.  Tools have only gotten high tech just in these recent decades.

 

Nonetheless, Allah always makes it clear that there is a lot out there that He knows of and we still don�t know.  So Allah commands us to explore and find out (I think I told you this before):

 

Read! And they Lord is Most Bountiful. He to taught use of the pen, Taught man that which he knew not.  (96:3-5)

 

There are a number of verses that relate the endless knowledge that is out there that we humans could only grasp only so much of it.  Here is an example:

 

Say, �if the sea were ink for [writing] the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of m Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement.�  (18:109)

 

This verse relates the infinite Knowledge of Allah.  If one were to write out all the knowledge that Allah has, using an ocean full of ink- the ocean would be used up before the knowledge of Allah has been completely written. The verse ends with saying- even if He (Allah) filled up the ocean a second time, and one continued to write down the extensive knowledge of Allah, one will use it up again and the knowledge of Allah will not have ended.

 .  

 

Although �Muhammad didn�t know this!� he never preached to know all anyways.  He just preached that he knows best. (That�s why we Muslims follow in his footsteps in character and deed).  Remember Fogtrik, our prophet was illiterate.  He didn�t know how to read or write.  He did however know that there is more knowledge out there and preached that fact.  Why then do you have ancient Muslims scholars as those who contributed most to the foundation in the fields of  medicine/astronomy/mathematics?  Simply, Islam teaches to excel in knowledge.