A fair discussion on my beloved Kashmir |
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Whisper
Senior Member Male Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4752 |
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brother Whisper, i never said pakistan is india's enemy nor i posted this topic against muslims. My post didn't imply anything of the sort. there are millitant hindus and muslims who do not want us to be peaceful. come to india and you will find as many masjids as there are temples. I am often in India and am quite at ease about understanding India.
If poverty breeds such behaviour then we would have a huge problem in India with or without the Kashmiris. Poverty is used as a mere excuse and almost as a lid to keep the truth from oozing out in the open, by our civilised masters. Injustice and militaristic arrogance breeds terrorism. Brother, weren't they okay before we turned the Kashmiri into an enemy? then what did hindus or buddhists do in afghanistan? why were those temples and monastries destroyed? How shall we hold what happened in Afghanistan against the poor Kashmiris? this is why i say kashmir will be another taleban. why can't the religion and the state kept separate? Right now penalising Kashmiris for something they haven�t as yet done is a bit like Sardar jee�s hore choopo ganay. Have you heard about that? Right now, it�s us, the entire global community that has failed them. We are the culprits. Let�s correct ourselves and give them their right, let them exercise their right of self �determination. Once, we have done that and they start to misbehave with us then we would all get together and beat them up!
My friend, best to befriend all our neighbours. The west is keeping these swords hanging over our heads to keep our actual potential in check. Sit up one day, see beyond the interesting headlines and we will find that both the Indians and the Pakistanis have a common enemy. They have far more than just a few languages, customs or a range of cuisine in common.
My point is that Talibanisation comes in a whole range of colours. All the countries of the region must grow up and start acting in own best interest. It�s in the best interest of India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Central Asian States + Iran to form something like the union you described earlier - with a common friend, Kashmir, in their middle. Brother, Kashmir was an independent sovereign state. The Brits messed it up. I can�t tell you here, but I will PM you the secret why the Brits can�t stay without messing things up! interesting brother Whisper! Kashmir was an independent state centuries before Yelderum appeared on the Indian scene. History of Kashmir pre-dates the Muslim arrival in the sub-continent and it was a much bigger state than quite a few others, at one point. It was a whole country. Some Muslims have to learn a few lessons, Spain was never �occupied� by just the Muslims. The Toledo Effect �Muslims, Christians and the Jews ran it jointly. Shall we say, almost, as it was the communities that ran India. The chap in the Lal Qilla was almost like a life President of this union. Kashmir has every right to become an independent state. brother, who would guarentee the well being of the hindus and buddhists there? Bhai, that is a very interesting question. The Buddhists, Hindus and the Muslims lived together in Kashmir for a long time. Was it a problem before we violated the Kashmiris� basic right of self-determination?
P o l u t i c i a n s create problems and when people have �found� each other, they always get together to put p o l u t i c i a n s in their right place.
It�s a process. It does take its time, but we must start from somewhere. If ever anything goes wrong, I will personally ask Javed Akhtar, Gulzar or Shabbana Azmi to fix it. You know, India is the only country in the world where people believe more in what Shah Rukh Khan or Aswiriya Rai says than even its Prime Minister!
Is the present situation of turmoil more loveable?
We now live in the day of Human Rights and a few other sensitivities. The concept of lands and countries is becoming obsolete. We must strive to create comfy situations for all beings. India is a huge country, make peace with the Kashmiris and then send Aswiriya Rai there. See what happens1 But why should China wish to colonise Kashmir? Specially, when it holds the US to ransom? |
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mohammad
Senior Member Joined: 15 September 2005 Location: Pakistan Status: Offline Points: 385 |
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" The negotiations have just been dragging the Kashmir issue since about the past 50 years, without any solution. People have been dying on both sides of the border. Have negotiations helped to calm the situation? No. The situation gets tense and worse day by day."
You are quite right. |
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s666
Senior Member Joined: 07 June 2006 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 214 |
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brother mohammad, i doubt you. so dont want to reply to any of your posts. you sometimes post with good english and some other times feign to be not so good at english.
can a non-muslim be the head of the state of pakistan? if kashmir were made independent or given to pakistan, people will definitely not be treated equally. |
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s666
Senior Member Joined: 07 June 2006 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 214 |
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yaar, what do you mean by "My friend, best to befriend all our neighbours.".
thats good brother, hope to meet you one day.
thats good! that might be the difference. didn't you hear about Operation Gibraltar? did you ever go to kashmir brother? (not pakistan's kashmir)
brother, it already happened. most of the temples in kashmir have been desecrated and their are no non-muslims in pakistan's kashmir. and kashmiri is spoken by few in pakistan's kashmir.
just look at it brother, you keep calling kashmir and kashmiri all the time. but who is protecting the kashmiri culture? when you say kashmiri, i am afraid that you do not include a non-muslim.
brother, the problem is india does not have a state religion whereas others do. the OIC hasn't approved india to be its member though it has the second largest muslim population. so at one point of time or another, i fear they may desert india.
brother, do you know what "Kashmir" means? why does anyone call that part of the world "Kashmir"?
if someone violated something, why should be the natives murdered? aren't the buddhists and hindus kashmiris? why should their temples be desecrated?
i love india!
brother, partition was really a bad thing. but seriously, were muslims alone? what about the hindus and sikhs? yet there are more muslims in india than in pakistan. by the way did you see amir khan starrer "Sarfarosh"?
brother, now i live far away from kashmir in the heart of india where people live peacefully. here you need not be from a particular community to do a particular thing. but whenever i hear about kashmir in the news, i feel ashamed. pakistan has already given some of kashmir to china. |
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Whisper
Senior Member Male Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4752 |
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Both the countries know very well that the third party {US} is in advantage and it does not want us to finalise something. The most interesting thing is that even a panwala in Dilli or a Lahori chatwala knows that, but somehow our �lidders� interests lie elsewhere! You and me talk of numerous solutions and suppose even if we come to a final one its of no use. They enjoy blood shed at both the sides. Brother, no one enjoys bloodshed. It�s just that the vested interests make huge profits in wars. We need to counter that through thorough informal education. A pakistani family who visited our neighbours, said the same, that its the media which is fanning the hatred amongst both the countries. Media survives with �Crown� patronage. Those in power supply its bread n butter. Let�s set up our own full time Peace Media. In this day and age we don�t really need huge printing presses to place anything in the public domain. We can start a small web based group, which is convinced that we have no better option than peace. I remember, once I was at a conference. I propose peace between these two neighbours. It was a time of hot irons on the both sides. My suggestion was simple � let�s denounce arms on both the sides and IF we don�t find it more profitable for our people we can always get or laathis out and start bashing one n other! That family had a school going boy who spent his time with us. Naturally we had a good bond of friendship. Before he left us we asked him, "When will u b back Khurram?" We all were awstruck by his answer. He said, " I will return India only as a soldier" Poor Khurram! He didn�t know that there are far better things than soldiering in our world. Teaching just as an example. Am not blaming any country men but what i want to say is we achieved nothing except HATRED with those white collar meetings. And as "Mohammed" suggested war is the solution--------, But i feel no. It again spreads hatred for muslims in India. I respect Mohammad. I hold him very dear, he is one the finest Kashmiris I have met in my years. What option has the great civilised community left him other than to believe that war is the only way out? Its happening that during any of the blasts or even a small incidents occur, innocent muslims are put in jails naming then as "Terrorist". May be one amongst 50 is a wrong person but the rest 49 are put in jails with the same proofs and verifications. I should think, one out of 500 Indian Muslims would behave in any odd way. Lets leave this issue for some more years and the coming generations will forget it. Yaar, you mean our Masters will let us forget bones of contention thrown by them? "Being neighbours thodi bahoth khit- pit tho jayaz hai" It may be jayez for some Amjad Khans, the Indians have been living in comfort with each other for a thousand years. If we shoot all lidders on both sides � the truth will come out that people are basically people and they want a bit of peace at the end of their day�s toil. The Lidders keep the lid on this truth. Also Hats Off to the knowledge of our member "Whisper" . Being from a different place he has got a very deep knowledge of India. Thanks for your compliment, but India is the biggest reality in my street? |
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Whisper
Senior Member Male Joined: 25 July 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 4752 |
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Where have all the Kashmir lovers gone?
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s666
Senior Member Joined: 07 June 2006 Location: India Status: Offline Points: 214 |
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you haven't answered my post Whisper bhai... (last post in page 2)
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skygazer
Groupie Joined: 17 October 2005 Status: Offline Points: 65 |
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Here's a silly suggestion: why not have the people who live there vote on what kind of country they want?
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