IslamiCity.org Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Politics > Current Events
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - RE: Angela’s Plan  What is Islam What is Islam  Donate Donate
  FAQ FAQ  Quran Search Quran Search  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

RE: Angela�s Plan

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 910111213 17>
Author
Message
Duende View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 27 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 651
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duende Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2006 at 10:02am
While Whisper�s suggestion is the most solid thing we�ve seen on this
forum since Angela�s Plan was first mooted, it is not likely to bring
the troops out of Iraq anytime this year!

While clumsily searching for a way to do this, I have come across
several activism sites which I�ll list here, for those of us who just feel
time is running out for Iraq. I recommend you visit these sites and
add whatever you can to their cause, even if it is just a donation.
You�ll also be able to find out when and where demos and meetings
are taking place if you are able and willing to go out and swell the
visible ranks of people yearning for peace.

I�m just focussing on Iraq, which is what Angela�s plan first
addressed. Implementing Whisper�s plan will take time and will serve
for all the other global war issues, such as Afghanistan, Palestine and
Lebanon/Syria/Iran.

With Cassandra, I had agreed to gather web addresses with the idea
of somehow eventually pressurising and coordinating actions so as
to reach the critical mass necessary for the admin to pay attention.
While harvesting, I came across something which seems aimed at
doing exactly what we had talked about! It is called The World Social
Forum and I�ll add the link and brief description of their aims along
with the rest here. However, this discovery has a taste of bitterness
since it is NOT and organisation, but a forum �.

Meanwhile, to encourage those of us who feel the only way the
troops will be withdrawn soon is if the US public is seen to be asking
for it, here�s an encouraging snippet:

Gallup: 55% Now Back U.S. Pullout from Iraq Within a Year
By E&P Staff Published: August 03, 2006 11:55 AM ET

NEW YORK A new Gallup poll released today revealed another upward
bump in the number of Americans who now want a complete U.S.
troop withdrawal from Iraq in the next 12 months.

That number now stands at 55%, with 19% supporting immediate
withdrawal and another 36% wanting it done by August 2007.

"While the percentage of Americans who favour a withdrawal of all
U.S. troops either now or within a year is not a supermajority, it is a
majority, suggesting that the Democratic leadership is speaking to
an issue that resonates with many Americans," Frank Newport,
director of the Gallup Poll, writes today.

Another majority, 54%, now say that the U.S. invasion in 2003 was a
"mistake."

The partisan divided remains wide on the withdrawal question, with
77% of Democrats wanting U.S. troops out in a year and only 28% of
Republicans. Independents back a 12-month pullout at 56%.
Gallup polled 1,002 adult Americans at the very end of July.

-Now, here are the links for people to check out and act on:

www.troopshomefast.org/article.php?list=type&type=144
http://www.gsfp.org/ Gold Star Families for Peace
http://www.irishantiwar.org/index.adp
http://www.unitedforpeace.org/
http://www.mpdl.org/home.htm

And here is a way of finding more of the same:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_anti-war_organizations

What the World Social Forum is

The World Social Forum is an open meeting place where social
movements, networks, NGOs and other civil society organizations
opposed to neo-liberalism and a world dominated by capital or by
any form of imperialism come together to pursue their thinking, to
debate ideas democratically, for formulate proposals, share their
experiences freely and network for effective action. Since the first
world encounter in 2001, it has taken the form of a permanent world
process seeking and building alternatives to neo-liberal policies.
This definition is in its Charter of Principles, the WSF�s guiding
document.

The World Social Forum is also characterized by plurality and
diversity, is non-confessional, non-governmental and non-party. It
proposes to facilitate decentralized coordination and networking
among organizations engaged in concrete action towards building
another world, at any level from the local to the international, but it
does not intend to be a body representing world civil society. The
World Social Forum is not a group nor an organization.
http://www.forumsocialmundial.org.br/index.php?cd_language=2

-My intuition and experience tells me you can not force Nature to do
what you wish: reaching �critical mass� is an organic process which
has its own momentum and abides by its own enigmatic rules.
Forcing issues is rarely productive, allowing them to mature while
guiding them as one nurtures a plant, is perhaps the best way to
treat them. As for the critical mass of public opinion, there definitely
is a way to help it, and that is by joining our voices with those of
organisations which already have a �power base�.


World Social Forum is not a group nor an organization.[/
SIZE]
Back to Top
Cassandra View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar
Joined: 30 May 2006
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 293
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cassandra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 August 2006 at 7:52am

Angela's Plan was hatched around the end of the second week in June.  Within a few days it ws moved to The Pond in what seemed at the time, to be a fair and equitable arrangement which was less likely to run into problems which perhaps would have been unfiar to Islamicity:  our hosts. However, it does seem to me that this has become the natural place for it since most discussion has reverted to this Forum.  Above all else we need to consolidate opinion.

I like Whisper's ideas but I am afraid that I consider them too long reaching at this point and likely to bog down in procedure. Eventually, it presents a good structure.  I do like the idea of delegation and "training":  "each one, teach one" is the motto of the Laubach Literacy Society of the US, and it is apt here I think. It spreqds incremetally a map of individuals prepared to make some small difference "starfishwise".

I also wholeheartedly agree with Duende: perhaps there is no need for us to re-invent the wheel, although a World Social Initiative is a truly excellent idea. What would it take to bring this about? What can we do to persuade like minded groups to work collectively and effectively forcussing on immediate issues with the viuew towards long-term solutions?

I have to confess that August is a very hard time for me to get involved as my client base is completely full, I have very little "free" time,  and I do not have internet at home.  By mid-September it will be better.

Can we have a "sign up list"?  Who truly wants to do some investigative work?  On a small but potentially larger base given the ideas above. What is our mandate?  What do we have to suggest to other already organised groups around the world which can bring a small voice to the volume of a Global Shout?

Back to Top
Duende View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member


Joined: 27 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 651
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duende Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 August 2006 at 8:47am
Hola Cassandra, I too came to the conclusion that Angela's Plan will
remain here, Islamicity hosts willing! The responses over at The Pond
have been minimal and unconstructive, but besides that, there were
one or two comments made which were negative towards moslems. I
was shocked, as these comments came from people who often post
here too.

I like the name: Global Shout, could be a good one for the future
'umbrellist' activists!
Back to Top
Angela View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Angela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 August 2006 at 10:09am

I apologize to everyone that I have been so busy.  Life seems to have kidnapped me in one of the worst ways.  I get up at 7am every morning, go to work, then from work to school and don't get home until 10pm.  Then I have to do laundry, homework and cook dinner for when my husband gets home at 10:30pm. 

The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.  I even now type this bleary eyed with lack of sleep.

As I suggested on the Pond (and havent had a moment to go back and check) we do need to understand the players in Iraq.  Tribes, Factions and Political groups.

This is important.  These are the people we are helping and we need to know who they are, what they want and how they want things to be when the US leaves.

Without their support, any Plan will fail.  Right now, they are killing each other faster than the US soliders.  If there is no plan to stop the sectarian violence, then there is no plan for peace.

And don't be naive enough to think that if the US left tomorrow the killing would stop.   If anything, I think it would increase once those not in power realised that the Iraqi government no longer had their American Guards.

So, Who are the people we are dealing with?  We have three subgroups to place all the others into....

Shia - This includes Al-Sadr's Mahdi Militia

Sunni - this includes the foreign insurgents who are non native to Iraq, like the deceased al-Zarqawi.

Kurds - This group seems to be getting forgot in the Sunni/Shia fighting.

Its not enough to get the US soldiers out, the point of the original plan was to leave a stable nation for these people as well.  If the US pulls out now...the human tragedy will be tremendous.  There needs to be a stablizing force to take over.

Back to Top
Servetus View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member

Male
Joined: 04 April 2001
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2109
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Servetus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 August 2006 at 2:32pm

A lot of us miss you when you are gone, Whisper.  Not least because when you are gone, the spice disappears and, instead of being served a nice dish of nan-kebab, we are forced to eat BigMacs instead. 

 

Speaking again of Hemingway�s biography, and though I don�t know his literary works well, I think also of how strangely unregulated must have been the lives of Americans during the era of the Spanish civil war, 1936-39!  I mean, a contingent of them, the �Abraham Lincoln Brigade,� along with volunteers from other nations, actually went to Spain, took up arms, and participated in the fight!  It�s not that I necessarily support their position, so much, or the cause for which they strove, but I simply note how apparently free they were in that process (though some later felt the political repercussions).   

 

These days, it seems, and, if it need be said, I do know that there are good reasons for heightened security in the USA, we almost have to get permission from Michael Chertoff to take a cyber-bicycle ride out beyond the Homeland to visit with auslanders [outsiders]. 

 

Serv 

 

An Empire?  America can�t even balance its own check book! 



Edited by Servetus
Back to Top
Angela View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Angela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 August 2006 at 9:01am

Is anyone here familiar with or owns Microsoft Project?

I'm currently taking a Project Management course and I can see part of the problem has boiled down to we have no plan. 

We have no clear idea of resources, time, tasks.   This class is really openning my eyes up on how to manage such a large project.

Back to Top
Whisper View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member

Male
Joined: 25 July 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 4752
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whisper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 August 2006 at 4:14pm

"A spark can start a prairy fire"

OR

"The Great Oak is born of a tiny acorn"

Angela, when you are meant to be, you simply are. All else stands by as sheer excuses. This is your hour. Only women have the wisdom and the guts to save the planet.

Do you know why you are called a woman?

Back to Top
Angela View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior  Member
Avatar

Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Angela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 August 2006 at 2:08pm

Woman.....

Because we were put here by God to say "Whoa man, slow down,  you can't do that!" 

Seriously though...

I think we really need to get at least one or two Iraqis into the beginning of this.  Anyone have an Iraqi friend they can talk into this?

I know a sister who has Iraqi friends, but they are all for the war. 

Makes me wonder what we will be dealing with in the fight to get this ended.

Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 910111213 17>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.03
Copyright ©2001-2019 Web Wiz Ltd.