Islams beliefs concerning Christianity

Robin you wrote: "There are a total of 66 books contained in the Bible from Genesis to Revelation. There was a total of 40 different authors who wrote these books over a 1500 year period from different parts of the world in different languages and last many didn't ever meet the other authors."

No wonder you have so much difficulty explaining Christianity as it is followed today. We don't have 40 different authors, we have only one AUTHOR who is the CREATOR of the universe and only ONE BOOK the QUR'AN which makes our religion clear, simple and easy to follow. If we need further explanation we take it from the life of God' messenger all of which is recorded in the Hadith.

Then you say "God created a perfect world, and man once walked and talked with God because they had a relationship with one another. But then came the fall of man because of sin that the first Adam chosen to do and as a result sin came to all mankind causing a broken relationship with God. God however has provided a way to re-enter back into that relationship with Him through the second Adam (Jesus). The first Adam brought death through sin cauing separation from God, but the second Adam (Jesus) has abolished death through the gospel, which provides a way to draw near to God."

To me this makes no sense. This is pure fiction or myth! Who were all these people with whom God walked and talked before Adam's arrival?  How can you personify God with these words "walked and talked"? To us God is everywhere and there is nothing hidden from Him, he need not walk and talk!

And what is this sin that Adam brought death with? So is God so unjust that he punishes every human being because of this sin which Adam brought? Is not God forgiving? And how does Jesus become the second Adam? Isn't Jesus supposed to be the "son of God" according to Christianity? How many forms do you give Jesus?

"Lo! the likeness of Jesus with Allah is as the likeness of Adam. He created him of dust, then He said unto him: Be! and he is."003.059

003.060 "The Truth (comes) from Allah alone; so be not of those who doubt."

Robin this kind of confusion does not exist in Islam. Only I am responsible for my sins, not my children, not my parents. I do not take the sin of anyone. Every individual is responsible for himself or herself. I seek forgiveness from God directly and I plead for His mercy directly. I don't have to go through anyone, my relationship with God is direct and it is so with every individual.

"It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is." 019.035

"And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy Mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou, art the Knower of Things Hidden?" "005.116

"Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say, to wit, 'worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me up Thou wast the Watcher over them, and Thou art a witness to all things. 005.117

 "If Thou dost punish them, they are Thy servant: If Thou dost forgive them, Thou art the Exalted in power, the Wise." 005.118

"Allah will say: "This is a day on which the truthful will profit from their truth: theirs are gardens, with rivers flowing beneath,- their eternal Home: Allah well-pleased with them, and they with Allah: That is the great salvation, (the fulfilment of all desires)."005.119

"To Allah doth belong the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is therein, and it is He Who hath power over all things"005.120

Think about this for a moment. There are a total of 66 books contained in the Bible from Genesis to Revelation. There was a total of 40 different authors who wrote these books over a 1500 year period from different parts of the world in different languages and last many didn't ever meet the other authors. However there is harmony between all the writers, between all the books, and though there are many sub-themes within it, there is a main theme that runs through the entire Bible. God created a perfect world, and man once walked and talked with God because they had a relationship with one another. But then came the fall of man because of sin that the first Adam chosen to do and as a result sin came to all mankind causing a broken relationship with God. God however has provided a way to re-enter back into that relationship with Him through the second Adam (Jesus). The first Adam brought death through sin cauing separation from God, but the second Adam (Jesus) has abolished death through the gospel, which provides a way to draw near to God.

Hebrew 7:25 "Therefore He is able also to save forever those who draw near to God through Him (Jesus), since He always lives to make intercession for them."

Not only is there similiar themes running through and harmony of all the writers penned words, there is fulfilled prophecy. For example Jesus fulfilled over 300 prophecies concerning Himself, http://messiahrevealed.org

I'll post one here,

Isaiah 40:3 A voice is calling, "Clear the way for the LORD in the wilderness; Make smooth in the desert a highway for our God

Who is this voice calling in the wilderness? This is vital because this voice is laying down the red carpet, announcing, ushering in, "the LORD"! Now notice the word "LORD" in caps, the hebrew word is YHWH which is the hebrew name for God.

At my wedding we were ushered into the party where the announcer let everyone know that Mr. and Mrs. B were here and here they are walking down then red carpet. In a similiar way this voice in the wilderness ushered or announced the LORD. Now who is this voice?

Luke 3:3-4 And he (John the baptizer) came into all the district around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins; as it is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet, "THE VOICE OF ONE CRYING IN THE WILDERNESS, `MAKE READY THE WAY OF THE LORD, MAKE HIS PATHS STRAIGHT.

So John the baptizer is the one voice in the wilderness announcing YHWH's entrance. Who did John point to? John 1:15 John testified about Him and cried out, saying, "This was He of whom I said, `He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.' " John 1:27 "It is He who comes after me, the thong of whose sandal I am not worthy to untie." John the baptizer is announcing or ushering in Jesus who existed before him. If you think this is talking about Jesus' physical birth, think again, because John was born before Jesus' virgin birth miracle. So how could Jesus have existed before John? This could only be as the prophecy says, John was preparing the way for the Son of God, YHWH.

Not only are the fulfillment of these prophecies amazing but statistically speaking they are impossible. However this is not impossible with God.

Next look at the life of the apostles. Saul, also named Paul, was killing Christians and throwing them in prison because as he saw it he was doing God's will. This man had a prominent position as a Pharasee, born a roman citizen, educated, looked up to by others. However he gave up all these things to become a Christian following Jesus. Why? What would make him completely change? Jesus!

Acts 9 1 Now ^R458 Saul, ^F203 still breathing ^R459 threats ^F204 and murder against the disciples of the Lord, went to the high priest, 2 and asked for letters ^R460 from him to the ^R461 synagogues at Damascus, ^R462 so that if he found any belonging to the ^R463 Way, both men and women, he might bring them bound to Jerusalem. 3 As he was traveling, it happened that he was approaching Damascus, and suddenly ^R464 a light from heaven flashed around him; 4 and he ^R465 fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" 5 And he said, "Who are You, Lord?" And He said, "I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, 6 but get up and enter the city, and it ^R466 will be told you what you must do."

Saul knew now whom Jesus was! He knew Jesus was more then just a man. Saul's conviction eventually lead to his death and well as all those who had these same convictions.

Then there are the eye witnesses of Jesus resurrection, over 500 witnesses saw Jesus rise from the dead over a period of days and in different places. The changed lives and attitude of the believers are astounding. Once cowardice disciples who hide at the capture and death of their Lord Jesus, were now encouraged, excited and bold in their witness of the risen Jesus. What caused such a dramatic change? Seeing with their own eyes and touching with their own hands the risen Jesus. Talk about amazing things!

Hi Robin,

You wrote: It amazes me that some people would base their beliefs on stories told around the 8th Century or so to be true from that of stories told within the close time as the gospel writers written, but whom also had first hand knowledge and experience to write those true stories.

Well, let's admit it, Faith can be an amazing thing.  For that matter, the at times irrepressible rationalist within me thinks it rather odd that Matthew could continue to report on what Jesus said and did in the garden after the disciples, according to his own admission, had not once but twice fallen fast asleep (Matt. 26:43).  

But seriously [Servetus says, deleting his little winkey face],  I don�t want to get too involved in the �actual� vs. �apparent� crucifixion discussion at this point.  Right now, I am tired of controversy.  I just thought, in response to your question, that you would be interested to review some early manuscripts. 

Best regards,     

Servetus

Hi Robin,

It�s nice to catch up with you again. 

You wrote: Is there any 1st or 2nd Century manuscripts that support Islam's claim that Jesus never died on a cross, which would also invalidate His claim of resurrection?

Ref:

http://www2.evansville.edu/ecoleweb/articles/docetism.html

I don't know if you will accept them as support, exactly, and, in my experience, Muslims do not cite them as proof, but there are, in fact, early manuscripts and books, not found in the New Testament, which were both written and promulgated by, for lack of a better term, �Christian� groups, now known to Church historians as docetists.  Some early manuscripts with docetic tendencies are found in the recently discovered and published Nag Hammadi Library.  In that collection of books, note, especially, two: The Apocalypse of Peter and The Second Treatise of the Great Seth.  As I understand, docetism appeared early in Christological controversies and one of its doctrinal variants -that which argued that Jesus did not actually have a material, corporeal body- is addressed by St. John in his (first) Epistle, fourth chapter.  

That said, I have noticed that Western Orientalists and Christian apologists, probably including CARM (your link), when writing of Islam and Muhammad, often assert that he took the docetic view.  Muslims, on the other hand, and again from what I have understood, counter that not only the docetists but also the orthodox Catholic (and later Protestant) Christians mixed truth with error, that they are thus and in some respects all heretical, and that the final truth of the matter is revealed in the Quran and is resolved by faith.

That's my book report .

Best regards,

Servetus