Heaven or Hell

asep48garut60 wrote: Dear Saved, You said: ------------------------------------------------------ the Scriptures say for the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ out Lord. Ro. 3:23 and 6:23. ------------------------------------------------------ Do you mean that the sins of sinners will be redeemed by Jesus when they die? how their lives to the next ?

Of course not. You need to learn that the sinner is saved not the sins!

asep48garut60 wrote: Yes, we�ll be judged by the law, and I�ll be judged by Quran.

No argument, but I will be judged by the gospel not the Quran.

asep48garut60 wrote: I strongly believe that Jesus is not a false prophet, even Islam glorifies Jesus with all the advantages of his miracles. Jesus was saved not the opinion of Islam, but the word of Allah in the Quran 4:157-158.

This is where we have the problem. Instead of the Quran confirming the Scriptures that came before like it states it does; instead, it actually corrupts it. We are told by Allah to adhere to the revelation we received. We do. That is the gospel. How do you dare to say it is corrupted when Allah said he sent it for guidance and light? You not only come against the gospel but the Quran as well. So be judged by the Quran, but the gospel will also be your judge if you continue with what you say here. I mean you no offense; I speak the truth in love and respect to you.

asep48garut60 wrote: In Islam, all humans when they die will be responsible for everything they've done, while the Prophet Muhammad is just as intercessors (this also applies to all of Allah's Messengers), and the final decision only on Allah.

Muhammad died and can no longer be an intercessor for you. Jesus still lives and he promised he would be an intercessor for us, but you reject the grace and mercy Allah sent through Jesus the gospel reveals, by rejecting my message.

asep48garut60 wrote: Allah, the angels, the Apostles, all religions in the world, and all people who don't make or change the laws of God, they don't make fraud. But that makes fraud is those who have made or changed the word of God with the will of their hearts. Regards, Asep

The gospel didn't change anything. Why would Allah sent a corrupted gospel? How do you know Uthman didn't change the Quran you now use? What copies of the Quran do you have that trace directly back to Muhammad? Uthman recompiled the Quran after Muhammad's death.

asep48garut60 wrote: Dear Saved, In my opinion, if all the contents of Gospel now are still pure as the word of Allah, then Allah will not derive the Quran.

Well the Mormons can argue the same about the Quran or there would have been no need for the Book of Mormon. Do you see why this is not a good argument? We could look at it like Satan doesn't like the truth of the gospel and he looks to discredit it using people yielded to him to do it any way they can; for instance, by use of cults and false religions etc.

asep48garut60 wrote: Indeed, Muhammad has died, but he will give intercede on the day of calculation of human deeds in Mahsyar (a place after apocalypse).

The gospel states that Jesus is the only one who will intercede for us. I seek intercession from no one else but Jesus Christ

asep48garut60 wrote: I will only get the grace and mercy directly from Allah, because only Allah who can give it.

The gospel states the only way to get God's grace is through Christ Jesus and Jesus said: "No one comes to the father but by me." He means there is no other way to paradise.

asep48garut60 wrote: I had previously explained about Uthman and the Quran in this forum.

Fine, whatever you say.

asep48garut60 wrote: If there are people do not believe in the Quran, it is their right not to believe, maybe even Muslims who still doubt about the Quran, it is their right.

If you are under Sharia you wouldn't dare say that.

asep48garut60 wrote: However I will not be separated from the Quran, why ? because the verses in the Quran has given miracles in my life experience, including that related to health, events that outside of science, etc. Regards, Asep

My friend, I cannot deny your testimony. But I have to let you know that Satan operates in the supernatural realm and can make spiritual signs and wonders. If it happened to me, it wouldn't be enough to convince my experience with God that they are not false supernatural signs that only appear to be a miracle. Are you even aware that this can happen?

Edited by Saved - 18 December 2016 at 7:15pm

asep48garut60 wrote: Dear Saved, Satan is always calling for evil and accidents, while the angels are always calling for the goodness and salvation. Then if I survived from a disaster, did satan operate in the supernatural realm? while such disaster occurs when I was reading the word of Allah. Regards, Asep

Satan doesn't call for evil; he is evil; he is the father of lies, the destroyer and the best of deceivers. He comes to steal kill and destroy, but he does it beautifully. IOW, he makes people look like they are better off. He makes it appear that way, but that is not the way.

Surviving disaster or falling into disaster are not indicators we are doing God's will. Satan often uses circumstances to deceive people into doing his will that is contrary to God.

Satan can do nothing to me unless God gives him the permission. That is because I have Jesus living inside of me. He is the Word of Allah who was and is in flesh appearing! Not knowing Jesus puts us in spiritual turmoil and peril leaving us at the mercy of Satan who has no mercy, but only subtle deception.

Edited by Saved - 01 January 2017 at 4:41pm

asep48garut60 wrote: Dear Saved, Sorry, I was in hurry, I mean "do badness" All religions acknowledge that Satan deceive people, do you consider that the word of God in the Quran I read is a trick of Satan? Regards, Asep

Dear Asep:

No problem, I understand. I read through these Quranic scriptures, and I would like to comment on this one first: 5:17: They have certainly disbelieved who say that Allah is Christ, the son of Mary. Say, "Then who could prevent Allah at all if He had intended to destroy Christ, the son of Mary, or his mother or everyone on the earth?" And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them. He creates what He wills, and Allah is over all things competent.

We Christians understand Christ is the Word of Allah. He is the Word Allah used to create all things. He would never destroy His Word. That would be like the kingdom divided against itself. No Christian ever said Christ is Allah or the Father. We say God is one and Jesus is His Word; Muslims say Allah is one and Muhammad is his messenger.

We can associate the Word of God to God Himself without committing idolatry but not a messenger; besides, how is it Muslims can consider Muhammad the messenger when the messenger was supposed to be Gabriel? Muhammad simply recited the messenger. How does that make him the messenger? Angel means messenger! To Christians Jesus is not a messenger; He is the Message.

Lets look at 5:18: But the Jews and the Christians say, "We are the children of Allah and His beloved." Say, "Then why does He punish you for your sins?" Rather, you are human beings from among those He has created. He forgives whom He wills, and He punishes whom He wills.....

I don't speak for the Jews, but the Christians never say Allah punishes us, because Jesus took the punishment we deserved on the cross. Those who don't have Jesus as their Savior pay for their own sins in the past, present and future because God is just. It will be a horrible deserved punishment and an eternal separation from all that is called Allah/God, the life, the truth, the way and the light and peace.

I don't fear the Allah of the Quran because: Allah questions Jesus: "Did you say take you and your mother for two gods besides me... (He also says) they do disbelieve who say Allah is the third of three."

Allah alludes to a false trinity concept here about Christianity. That is an implied son, mother and father trinity and no Christian ever believed this concept. Also Allah thought that Christians consider him the third person of the trinity. That is wrong as well. All it takes is one discrepancy to convince me that I need not fear the Allah of Muhammad's Quran.

The Holy Spirit is God, because God is not flesh and blood; He is Spirit and He is Holy; therefore, He is the Holy Spirit, but Muslim believe Gabriel is God's Holy Spirit. This is not correct, but I cannot help notice that Allah has a spirit according to the Quran. I have a spirit too. I was made in God's image and likeness as you all are. My spirit is the real me. I am a soul. I have a body and spirit.

In my minds eye, Islam is mostly a reaction against Christianity.

PBUY and Happy New Year 2017,
Saved

The Gospel states: https://www.openbible.info/topics/false_prophets


Edited by Saved - 02 January 2017 at 3:06pm