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kometa2
 
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Quote kometa2 Replybullet Topic: Crucifixion of Jesus
    Posted: 24 September 2014 at 1:20am
I attended a secular school and I was taught at hitory class that Jesus died on tje Cross. Because cricifixionof Jesus is a historical FACT, it is historical event. So why does islam deny what really happened and what Jesus predicted in His teachings to his desciples- many times speaking and foretelling His deah on the Cross and telling His desciples He wil be raied from the dead.
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islamispeace
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 24 September 2014 at 9:04pm
Originally posted by kometa2

I attended a secular school and I was taught at hitory class that Jesus died on tje Cross. Because cricifixionof Jesus is a historical FACT, it is historical event. So why does islam deny what really happened and what Jesus predicted in His teachings to his desciples- many times speaking and foretelling His deah on the Cross and telling His desciples He wil be raied from the dead.


Please read the following:

http://quranandbible.blogspot.com/2014/01/the-crucifixion-of-jesus-in-bible-and.html


In this article, I analyzed the story of the crucifixion.  I also show that the Quran merely denies that Jesus was the one who was crucified.  The Quran does not a deny that a crucifixion occurred and that the enemies of Jesus did boast that they had killed him.  Rather, the Quran states that God saved Jesus and raised to Himself.  I don't why Christians have such a hard time understanding this. 

 
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Caringheart
 
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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 24 September 2014 at 9:26pm
Originally posted by islamispeace

Originally posted by kometa2

I attended a secular school and I was taught at hitory class that Jesus died on tje Cross. Because cricifixionof Jesus is a historical FACT, it is historical event. So why does islam deny what really happened and what Jesus predicted in His teachings to his desciples- many times speaking and foretelling His deah on the Cross and telling His desciples He wil be raied from the dead.
the Quran states that God saved Jesus and raised to Himself.  I don't why Christians have such a hard time understanding this. 

the Bible states that God gave the one known to us as His Son(Yshwe) to die for us and later raised Him to Himself.  I don't why muslims have such a hard time understanding this.  Wink

The name Yshwe means, YHWH saves

Yshwe gave His will to God ('nevertheless Lord, not My will but Yours be done')
and gave His life ('into Your hands I commend My Spirit')
and on the third day was raised from dead to walk again on the earth, as witnessed by many
and after 40 days with them was raised before their eyes up to the Father.

from the book recorded by Luke:

42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

43 And he took it, and did eat before them.

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

50 And he led them out as far as to Bethany, and he lifted up his hands, and blessed them.

51 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven.


from the book of the Acts of the Apostles:

To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:

And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.



Edited by Caringheart - 24 September 2014 at 9:33pm
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
"I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis
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Quote kometa2 Replybullet Posted: 25 September 2014 at 1:05am

There is no greater truth in all the world — God Loves People! We read from the Word of God in John 3:16 the following precious words:

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”

What a wonderful truth!!! The verse doesn't say that the great heart of God only loves Christians or religious people. The verse doesn't say that God only loves righteous people or churchgoers. The verse doesn't say that God only loves Bible-thumpers. The Word of God is clear that God loves “the world” (and that includes everyone). No matter who you are, God truly loves you.

“And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.” —1st John 2:2

Jesus died on the cross for all humanity, because God loves the whole world. This means that God loves the murderer. This means that God loves the adulterer. This means that God loves the homosexual. This means that God loves the crooked politician and the corrupt banker. This means that God loves the vilest sinner and the worst criminal. This means God even loves you. This means that God loves the Pope. Yes, God loves people! God loves all people, of all faiths, and all backgrounds. 

“God loves you. It doesn't make any difference who you are. You can't keep Him from loving you. Now you can get into a place where you won't experience the love of God. When you put up an umbrella of sin, the sunshine of God's love sure won't fall on you. But it's still there for you.”

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islamispeace
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 25 September 2014 at 6:28am
Originally posted by Caringheart

the Bible states that God gave the one known to us as His Son(Yshwe) to die for us and later raised Him to Himself.  I don't why muslims have such a hard time understanding this.  Wink


LOL Oh I don't know...maybe it's because the Bible contradicts itself on the matter?  Why would I believe an extraordinary story when the ones telling it cannot even agree amongst each other?  Your so-called "witnesses" offered contradictory testimony, as I show in my article.  Not only that, but the so-called "eyewitness" accounts are written by anonymous people.  Even a child would know better than to blindly accept the ramblings of such people.  I guess you don't qualify.  Tongue   
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Quote Caringheart Replybullet Posted: 25 September 2014 at 11:36am
Originally posted by islamispeace

Originally posted by Caringheart

the Bible states that God gave the one known to us as His Son(Yshwe) to die for us and later raised Him to Himself.  I don't why muslims have such a hard time understanding this.  Wink


 Even a child would know better than to blindly accept the ramblings of such people.  I guess you don't qualify.  Tongue   


 Even a child would know better than to blindly accept the ramblings of a single man with no witnesses.  I guess you don't qualify. Wink

I accept as much more credible, the testimony of many witnesses, told to many people, and in many places, eventually written down in many places, and yet tell the same story,
over the words of one man who says he had a vision in a cave to which there were no witnesses... and one whose own words and actions often change and contradict themselves.

I can understand why many people might tell a story slightly different, yet with the same underlying message...
but a man who contradicts his own self while claiming to be speaking with the words of God?

asalaam,
CH



Edited by Caringheart - 25 September 2014 at 11:36am
Let us seek Truth together
Blessed be God forever
"I believe in Jesus as I believe in the sun... not because I see it, but because by it, I see everything else.: - C.S.Lewis
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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 25 September 2014 at 11:55am
Originally posted by Caringheart

Originally posted by islamispeace

Originally posted by Caringheart

the Bible states that God gave the one known to us as His Son(Yshwe) to die for us and later raised Him to Himself.  I don't why muslims have such a hard time understanding this.  Wink


 Even a child would know better than to blindly accept the ramblings of such people.  I guess you don't qualify.  Tongue   


 Even a child would know better than to blindly accept the ramblings of a single man with no witnesses.  I guess you don't qualify. Wink

I accept as much more credible, the testimony of many witnesses, told to many people, and in many places, eventually written down in many places, and yet tell the same story,
over the words of one man who says he had a vision in a cave to which there were no witnesses... and one whose own words and actions often change and contradict themselves.

I can understand why many people might tell a story slightly different, yet with the same underlying message...
but a man who contradicts his own self while claiming to be speaking with the words of God?

asalaam,
CH



LOL No, no, dear.  There is no "contradiction" in the message of Islam.  Unlike your Bible, which has contradictions on almost every page, the Quran is consistent. 

Your so-called "witnesses" contradicted each other even in terms of the "message".  The Gospels exhibit a gradual deification of Jesus.  From Mark to John, Jesus is transformed from a man into a god. 

Then there is the contradiction between the Gospels on whether Jesus was sent to the Jews or to the Gentiles.  The Gospels can't even agree on that!       
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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Quote islamispeace Replybullet Posted: 25 September 2014 at 8:04pm
Originally posted by kometa2

There is no greater truth in all the world — God Loves People! We read from the Word of God in John 3:16 the following precious words:

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”

What a wonderful truth!!! The verse doesn't say that the great heart of God only loves Christians or religious people. The verse doesn't say that God only loves righteous people or churchgoers. The verse doesn't say that God only loves Bible-thumpers. The Word of God is clear that God loves “the world” (and that includes everyone). No matter who you are, God truly loves you.

“And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.” —1st John 2:2

Jesus died on the cross for all humanity, because God loves the whole world. This means that God loves the murderer. This means that God loves the adulterer. This means that God loves the homosexual. This means that God loves the crooked politician and the corrupt banker. This means that God loves the vilest sinner and the worst criminal. This means God even loves you. This means that God loves the Pope. Yes, God loves people! God loves all people, of all faiths, and all backgrounds. 

“God loves you. It doesn't make any difference who you are. You can't keep Him from loving you. Now you can get into a place where you won't experience the love of God. When you put up an umbrella of sin, the sunshine of God's love sure won't fall on you. But it's still there for you.”



We have actually been discussing this on other thread.  You claim that God "loves" all people, but if that were true, then no one would go to hell to burn therein for eternity. 

And if God really loved us, why would He send His son to die for our sins?  Why didn't He come Himself?  If I loved someone, I wouldn't send my son to show my love.  I would go myself to the person I love. 

And if you say that the "son" was "God", then you are saying that "God" sent "Himself".  From there, you fall into an unending maze of circular logic.
Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

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