Is the Bible Still the Word of God?

Moses wrote: Hi,

Hi Moses

Moses wrote: Although you are kind, I did not find my answers.

By God's will you will find your answers by me or someone else

I'm currently travelling, hence the slow replies

I also have asked several questions which it seems you didn't answer like :

1- So you believe Jesus is a Prophet , He's not a God, or Son of God ?

2- Since you're asking this question, do you believe that Qur'an is God's words then ?

and thus following the bible because you say the Qur'an asks believers to follow it ?

Now to your questions 

Moses wrote: If the Bible was changed or corrupted in the time of Quran, why the Quran talks about that and ask the prophet to tell that for his people, See:    قَالَ يَـٰمُوسَىٰٓ إِنِّى ٱصۡطَفَيۡتُكَ عَلَى ٱلنَّاسِ بِرِسَـٰلَـٰتِى وَبِكَلَـٰمِى فَخُذۡ مَآ ءَاتَيۡتُكَ وَكُن مِّنَ ٱلشَّـٰكِرِينَ (١٤٤) وَڪَتَبۡنَا لَهُ ۥ فِى ٱلۡأَلۡوَاحِ مِن ڪُلِّ شَىۡءٍ۬ مَّوۡعِظَةً۬ وَتَفۡصِيلاً۬ لِّكُلِّ شَىۡءٍ۬ فَخُذۡهَا بِقُوَّةٍ۬ وَأۡمُرۡ قَوۡمَكَ يَأۡخُذُواْ بِأَحۡسَنِہَا‌ۚ سَأُوْرِيكُمۡ دَارَ ٱلۡفَـٰسِقِينَ (١٤٥) سَأَصۡرِفُ عَنۡ ءَايَـٰتِىَ ٱلَّذِينَ يَتَكَبَّرُونَ فِى ٱلۡأَرۡضِ بِغَيۡرِ ٱلۡحَقِّ وَإِن يَرَوۡاْ ڪُلَّ ءَايَةٍ۬ لَّا يُؤۡمِنُواْ بِہَا وَإِن يَرَوۡاْ سَبِيلَ ٱلرُّشۡدِ لَا يَتَّخِذُوهُ سَبِيلاً۬ وَإِن يَرَوۡاْ سَبِيلَ ٱلۡغَىِّ يَتَّخِذُوهُ سَبِيلاً۬‌ۚ ذَٲلِكَ بِأَنَّہُمۡ كَذَّبُواْ بِـَٔايَـٰتِنَا وَكَانُواْ عَنۡہَا غَـٰفِلِينَ (١٤٦     He said: O Moses! I have preferred thee above mankind by My messages and by My speaking (unto thee). So hold that which I have given thee, and be among the thankful. (144) And We wrote for him, upon the tablets, the lesson to be drawn from all things and the explanation of all things, then (bade him): Hold it fast; and command thy people (saying to the Muhammad-s): Take the better therein. I shall show thee the abode of evil-livers. (145) I shall turn away from My revelations those who magnify themselves wrongfully in the earth, and if they see each token believe it not, and if they see the way of righteousness choose it nor for (their) way, and if they see the way of error choose if for (their) way. That is because they deny Our revelations and are used to disregard them. (146)       If we want do not complicate anything we should accept that "All things� means all things! And, taking the better needs to be something not better but "there is something" any way. Isn�t it?! and you tell us that Bible is changed, and by this, as if you are about erasing the message of these verses from your mind and Muslim people`s mind! If disagree, tell me how you use this verses and what is the reason of Quran to talk about these things?!What is the message of these words for you? Knowing that there was something in thousands years ago and u cannot know what that was?!

you're quoting Surat Al-A'araaf ( 7 ) verses 144-146

Where exactly did you get this translation that says ( saying to Muhammad ) ?

There's no mention in these verses of Prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) , even continuing several verses after it has no mention of Prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) it's talking about Prophet Moses ( PBUH )

Anyone who understand proper arabic will know this ,

Also below are three of the most popular english translations to the meaning of the Qur'an , you will find it confirms what I'm saying

[Shakir 7:145] And We ordained for him in the tablets admonition of every kind and clear explanation of all things; so take hold of them with firmness and enjoin your people to take hold of what is best thereof; I will show you the abode of the transgressors.
[Yusufali 7:145] And We ordained laws for him in the tablets in all matters, both commanding and explaining all things, (and said): "Take and hold these with firmness, and enjoin thy people to hold fast by the best in the precepts: soon shall I show you the homes of the wicked,- (How they lie desolate)."
[Pickthal 7:145] And We wrote for him, upon the tablets, the lesson to be drawn from all things and the explanation of all things, then (bade him): Hold it fast; and command thy people (saying): Take the better (course made clear) therein. I shall show thee the abode of evil-livers.

If you still have a question after knowing this , please rephrase it

Moses wrote: What is the message of the first verses of Al-Baqara , when says : الٓمٓ (١) ذَٲلِكَ ٱلۡڪِتَـٰبُ لَا رَيۡبَ‌ۛ فِيهِ‌ۛ هُدً۬ى لِّلۡمُتَّقِينَ (٢) ٱلَّذِينَ يُؤۡمِنُونَ بِٱلۡغَيۡبِ وَيُقِيمُونَ ٱلصَّلَوٰةَ وَمِمَّا رَزَقۡنَـٰهُمۡ يُنفِقُونَ (٣) وَٱلَّذِينَ يُؤۡمِنُونَ بِمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيۡكَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ مِن قَبۡلِكَ وَبِٱلۡأَخِرَةِ هُمۡ يُوقِنُونَ (٤) Alif. Lam. Mim. (1) This is the Scripture whereof there is no doubt, a guidance unto those who ward off (evil). (2) Who believe in the Unseen, and establish worship, and spend of that We have bestowed upon them; (3) And who believe in that which is revealed unto thee (Muhammad) and that which was revealed before thee, and are certain of the Hereafter. (4)   Is she talking about believed only in that which revealed unto Muhammad? Or both, in that which revealed unto Muhammad and that which revealed before him?

Qura'an talks about those who believe in what was revealed to Prohpet Muhammad and all the Prophets before him ( PBUT )

Moses wrote: As you see, Quran will not lead everyone who does not really believe in that which revealed before Muhammad. Then if there is not any unchanged Bible or Torah, how we can believe in them?!!! Believe in something that is not in our hands?!!! Believe in books that do not exist?!!!

We believe in the books that was sent to Abraham, even though it's not available now, nor ( AFAIK ) was available at the times of the Prophet Muhammed ( PBUH )

We believe Adam ( PBUH ) was created without parents, did we see this happen ?

We believe Moses split the sea, did we see this happen ?

This is what differentiates a muslim from people of other beliefs / thoughts , such as hindus, buddhist ...etc. whom wouldn't believe in these revelations at all.

Moses wrote: On the other hand , isn`t it the same that you tell: �explains how the Qur'an is to prevail previous scriptures�   مُصَدِّقً۬ا لِّمَا بَيۡنَ يَدَيۡهِ مِنَ ٱلۡڪِتَـٰبِ وَمُهَيۡمِنًا عَلَيۡهِ‌ۖ   Puting the Quran in a battle against other scriptures, or knowing the harmony?

As mentioned above, Qur'an changes the practices, same as Jesus ( PBUH ) changed the practices that was before him

There's no battles, this why the Qur'an is endorsing the existence of these revelations

Moses wrote: Is the phrase:� Mohaimen Alaihe� (guardian over it) in the meaning of something �better�? Or this is something more powerful to be Guardian of the others? You cannot answer: both!  Because one of them is the meaning of word �Guardian� means something which support and protect from damages, isn`t it? In these verses Quran is talking about herself who confirmed the previous scriptures and Also, Protect them from changes and damages. Is it complexity of my explanation?!!  Or this is only the meaning of the words of Quran?

There's nothing is this verse that mentions protecting it from change, again where do you get this from ? Do you read it in arabic or english ? 

Moses wrote: And thanks for your advice, I read all of the Quran previously and use to read it nearly every day at present. And I did not find any better explanation to Quran, unless the holy Bible.

I'm not sure I understand the above phrase

Moses wrote: You cannot find even one verse in Quran that says Bible is changed, but every day I hear from Muslims that Bible is changed and we cannot trust on this book. Why?!!

Because as mentioned before in several verses, the Qur'an speaks about the changing of the old and new testament by the people it was sent to

Moses wrote: As Quran says everybody who does not believe in the book of Moses will be in the hell:

This is the islamic view as well, everyone is requested to believe in ALL books sent by God , whether to Abraham, Moses, Jesus, David ( PBUT )

The question to you is , where is the book of Moses ?

In the information you put below there's no mention of the old testament, when it was compiled, any references to it

Moses wrote: And in the next example: هُوَ ٱلَّذِىٓ أَرۡسَلَ رَسُولَهُ ۥ بِٱلۡهُدَىٰ وَدِينِ ٱلۡحَقِّ لِيُظۡهِرَهُ ۥ عَلَى ٱلدِّينِ كُلِّهِۦ‌ۚ وَكَفَىٰ بِٱللَّهِ شَهِيدً۬ا (٢٨) He it is Who hath sent His messenger with the guidance and the religion of truth, that He may cause it to prevail over all religion. And Allah sufficeth as a Witness. (28) This is talking about God`s will to prevail over all religion, may we say prevail the religion Islam (as the strategy or methods of Muhammad at the first years of Islam) to other fake religions which were in that time. But is not talking about prevail of Quran on Bible !!!!!

Moses wrote: You wrote: �Qur'an was sent as the final guidance, to prevail what was sent with previous Prophets� As your opinion, I respect that, but it�s not from Quran, only understanding from some other books. Because Quran says had been sent for confirmation what was sent with previous Prophets, as you read it in the previous lines upward, not to prevail!

The verse is clear that the teachings of Prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) is to prevail previous teachings,

It confirms these teachings exists, and requests believers to believe it existed, and to follow the new teachings

This is what the Qur'an says, and this is what the person who the Qur'an was sent through taught, which is how we should understand Qur'an , in the light of what Prophet Muhammad ( PBUH ) taugh

That said, what are we discussing exactly ?

Moses wrote: When I am talking about the Bible, I am talking about a book which included Old and new testaments and some letters which all of them were written by the apostles of Jesus Christ:

Moses wrote:    First, the books must have apostolic authority-- that is, they must have been written either by the apostles themselves, who were eyewitnesses to what they wrote about, or by associates of the apostles. �         Second, there was the criterion of conformity to what was called the "rule of faith." In other words, was the document congruent with the basic Christian tradition that the church recognized as normative. �         Third, there was the criterion of whether a document had enjoyed continuous acceptance and usage by the church at large.

Moses wrote: but this Book is the same that most of Christians believes that and are preaching and teaching that at present.

This is a big statement, can you refer to a copy of this book ( which you say is in the vatican library ) and a comparison between it and current version of bible ? 

Moses wrote: When Quran was revealed , there were thousands of this book in all of the world and as Quran says : in their hands.

Excellent, so can you provide a few copies of these thousands that dates to the time of the Qur'an and compare to each other, and to the copy in the vatican library ?

Moses wrote: Then if Quran confirm the Bible, definitely she does not talking about an invisible book!

Again, you send me links and statements from so-called scholars but I�m still waiting for someone to send me something that out dates the Dead Sea Scrolls authentication of the Holy Bible, the oldest manuscripts that CONFIRMS what we call the BIBLE in it�s purest form today September 19, 2009.  

Over time, some 900 separate scrolls were found. They date from the third century BCE through the first century CE. My word just Google it, you�re googling everything else!

Just sending a link or someone�s opinion on the subject just doesn�t cut it! Present facts not opinions! Can you find these links or statements at a museum, no! Do they date back before the time of Muhammad, no!

You have proven again in your world, opinions are what matters not facts not real solid evidence. Go to the Qumran Library, the library of Congress, the British Museum, Israel Museum or Google it from the comfort of your home. That�s PROOF! Not links and debates, those are ONLY opinions, one-sided because I can�t ask them question etc�

Read with an open mind **Pay specific attention to #10 and #25**

http://www.centuryone.com/25dssfacts.html

http://www.ibiblio.org/expo/deadsea.scrolls.exhibit/intro.html

 
The Dead Sea Scrolls, which date back to the events described in the New Testament, have added to our understanding of the Jewish background of Christianity. Scholars have pointed to similarities between beliefs and practices outlined in the Qumran literature and those of early Christians. These parallels include comparable rituals of baptism, communal meals, and property. Most interesting is the parallel organizational structures: the sectarians divided themselves into twelve tribes led by twelve chiefs, similar to the structure of the early Church, with twelve apostles who, according to Jesus, would to sit on twelve thrones to judge the twelve tribes of Israel. Many scholars believe that both the literature of Qumran and the early Christian teachings stem from a common stream within Judaism and do not reflect a direct link between the Qumran community and the early Christians.

The Bible as we have it today is close to those scientifically proven manuscript that dates back HUNDREDS of years before Muhammad�s birth, 100�s! Show something that dates back that far that PROVES God�s word is corrupt, all sixty six books of the Bible! Even the Prophet knew not to go THERE!

Now! If you want to make this interesting because you�re not going to be able to send me ANYTHING that out-dates the �DEAD SEA SCROLL� but read it, so many things you can learn.

Send me 3 scriptures that YOU think are corrupt and why and let us discuss it, particularly those dealing with Muhammad.

Isn't the true question whether the Bible was ever the Word of God?