Saudi Girl sentenced in own rape

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herjihad

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Joined: 26 January 2005
Location: United States
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Points: 2473

Posted: 04 December 2007 at 10:20am

Angela wrote:

I agree, Saladin.

My outrage at this stuff knows no bounds. There is a case going before the Supreme Court here in the US in the future. Louisiana has a law on the books that allows for the death penalty for a rapist of a child. Its finally been handed out and the rapist is fighting it.

I pray that the Supreme Court upholds this sentence and it encourages other states to enact this law on their books. Maybe if the rapists and child molesters faced death for their crimes against women and children they would think twice before they commit these crimes.

I think its too easy to blame the victims. I had a friend who was raped. The cops treated her poorly and it was never fully investigated because she had been longtime friends with the man and she had gone to his dorm room to visit him. They didn't believe her that she had said no and that he forced her. She was made to feel like a harlot and she was a good girl. She was not someone who did those kind of things.

Question for us as women/society is, how do we protect our daughters from this kind of thing? Obviously, forced segregation doesn't work? Neither does feminist rhetoric about empowerment?

Really, I think the focus needs to be on the men, not the women.

Salaamu Alaykum Sista Angela,

I agree with your outrage. I strongly believe the focus needs to be on eradicating the wrong idea that people are no longer pure when they have been raped. Raped people are shunned in America as well, especially when they are pursuing a case against someone in their community. And we've heard the stories of people becoming outcasts in Bosnia, Serbia, South American countries, Africa, just all over.

In this story, a young man was raped/sodomized as well by that group of people. We need to protect ourselves from the evil in this world by continuing to love and respect people who have been attacked and not blaming the victims. I wholeheartedly agree that this Sister, we need to remember, has suffered too much already. What was the fate of the young man? We need to be lobbying Saudi to free and apologize to both of them, and to investigate why the punishment in such a strict, overbearing country, was comparatively light for these rapists? Were they well-connected guys maybe?

Edited by herjihad

Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.

Salams_wife View Drop Down

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Posted: 04 December 2007 at 1:11pm

Though this doesn't solve the problem of rape, I have a few precautions I take if I must be out alone. If it is legal where I am, I often carry a small pocket knife. I also took some self defense classes so I can protect myself. It wouldn't save you if you are attacked by seven men, but against one at least you have a chance.

It is tought over and over again that the women most likely to be attacked are the ones who appear weaker to the attacker. Most rapists prefer to pick vulnerable women. There are many websites out there on things women can do to protect themselves from rape. Also, the vast majority of the rapes in America are conducted by known family members and friends. This is where being able to defend yourself would help a lot. I don't know if laws will ever be changed to truly effect change, but I do believe there are ways to protect ourselves. The more you convince a man he is up for the fight of his life if he attacks you, the less likely you are to become a victim. This is my suggestion, but of course there are many ways to protect yourself.

Hayfa

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Posted: 05 December 2007 at 3:50am

The more you convince a man he is up for the fight of his life if he attacks you, the less likely you are to become a victim.

Salams Wife, you are correct. I'd love to know where you took your classes. :) I teach self-defense here in Wash DC.

And yes most people are Attacked by someone they know. And being attacked by more than one assailant is not that common for women.

In one of our programs, there was a woman who was in the middle of the course, it is 25 hours, full-force self-defense, she was about 2/3 the way through. She was attacked by three men, she had her baby and a toddler. She knocked them all out

When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi

Salams_wife View Drop Down

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Posted: 05 December 2007 at 1:58pm

Hayfa, that is really great that you teach the self-defense classes. I wish all women would go to those. It is also encouraging what you said about one of your students. I think when women are tought techniques to defend themselves then it empowers them to try to save themselves and gives them more confidence.

I took my classes through one of the Royce Gracie schools for Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. It is amazing what they can teach you to do no matter how small you are or how strong.

Huzi

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Joined: 13 December 2007
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Posted: 13 December 2007 at 9:55pm

Salam alaykum,

Regarding the misinformation that the men who committed rape were given lesser sentence and allowed to let go free, but the fact is they have been given between 80 to 1000 lashes and sentences between one and five years each. Later their sentences were increased to between two to eleven years. This can be verified from http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in _article_id=498849&in_page_id=1879

In most of the articles I have read on BBC, CNN etc they have only mentioned the sentence being given to the girl and no mentioning about the sentencing of the rapist and also no mentioning on what was the justification of the judges in giving the sentence to the girl. We become emotional and feel that injustice is being done based on these biased views. The reason why that girl was awarded the lashing was she was in indecent condition having taken off her clothes and her indecent condition was the reason why the Rape took place.

If one has to believe and obey the word of Allah then it is stated in Quran

Sura 24 An-Nur Ayah 2: The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication,- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment.

So if any one says that injustice is being done after knowing that she was found to be in indecent condition and guilty of lewdness then that injustice goes to Allah. These judges are also human beings and Allah fearing and they are nothing to gain when that girls, her male accomplice and the rapist are being flogged. But still Saudi judiciary stood by its decision inspite of international outcry just to follow the commands of Almighty.

And I do believe that the judges on board who awarded the sentence are Allah fearing and wouldn�t tell a lie to prove their case. They are more fearfull because they know that if they have given a wrong judgement then they would be accountable toward Allah on the day of Judgement. Allah subanallah wa'taala sees all, and if there is a grave misjustice here, they will have to answer for it. If one hears the girls account of why she met that man alone in a lonely place proves that she has made up a false story. It is hard to believe that she gave her snap to a man just because that man was threatening her on phone. Infact if any girl who gets threatening calls, she would complain to her parent or report it to police. Also no girl would get ready to go alone with any men in her car who was threatening her. She made this story to hide her illicit relationship with that men inspite of being married. Having said that I feel that her punishment shouldn�t have been doubled for appealing the previous judgment.

Please go through these links for the clarification given by saudi ministry of justice on the case
http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=501785
http://www.spa.gov.sa/English/details.php?id=502890

Finally I would like to point out that this is just one case where people out of emotion feel injustice is being done because of the baised views presented by media. What about injustice melted out to millions of Innocent people who were killed by ASS-HOLE BUSH? What about Injustice to innocent muslims being put in prison just on the basis of suspicion and the inhuman treatment melted out to them at Abu Ghraib?

Was-Salam
Huzefa

Angel

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Posted: 14 December 2007 at 4:34am

The case has gone to the high courts.

The girl wasn't married yet, she went to get the photo of her from her friend before getting married, what turned out as an innocent act, despite what she did was not lawful, she did pay the punishment, but the most outcry was because she exercised her right and then was given extra punishment for it, it is also noted that if the girls attorney was to appeal the girl would get triple the punishment. I haven't heard any more on that bit about the triple punishment, since it has gone to the high courts..

In one of the local magazines, WHO: december 17, 2007, it is noted:

"Saudi Arabian justice officals tells a story of a woman who was in the act of "illegal mingling" when she was abducted and raped by seven men. But the woman, known as the "Girl of Qatif" (she hails from the town in eastern Saudi Arabia), tells a different story. In 2006, the woman, 19, met a friend inhis car in Qatif to retrieve a photo of herself she had given the man before she has become engaged. Then, "two people got out of [a] car and stood on either side of our car," she told human rights campaigner Farida deif. "The man on my side had a knife. I screamed." The men took them both to a building where five other men were waiting. Over several hours the pair were repeatedly raped by the seven men. What proved to be as shocking and incomprehensible as the crime itsefl was that, along with her assailants, who recieved jail terms, the Girl of Qatif, now 20, was on Nov.14 also handed a punishment. For being alone with a man not related to her, she was sentenced to 90 lashes. She appealed, but her sentence was increased to 200 lashes and six months' prison. After the sentence sparked a worldwide outcry, Saudi foreign minister Prince Saudi al-Faisal told reporters the case will now go before the "highest courts." Human-rights campaigner Ali Alyami told The New York Times: "The system has to be transformed from top to botom."

Anyway who survives that amount of lashings?

~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~

Angel

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Posted: 14 December 2007 at 5:15am

Huzi wrote:

and also no mentioning on what was the justification of the judges in giving the sentence to the girl.

from what i've gathered it is illegal to be alone with a man who is not your relative, so she got punishment for that. Second the extra punishment there is no justification and shouldn't have happened, if people have a right to exercise their rights then there should be no aftermath for it.

her indecent condition was the reason why the Rape took place.

I highly doubt that is the reason. Some people need to be seriously educated!!

I do have to question why there were seven men waiting ??

If one hears the girls account of why she met that man alone in a lonely place proves that she has made up a false story.

why would she make up a story of being repeatedly raped and so was her friend, its not just her story it is also the guy's. Something like that would traumise you. There were men waiting for god's sake!

It is hard to believe that she gave her snap to a man just because that man was threatening her on phone. Infact if any girl who gets threatening calls, she would complain to her parent or report it to police. Also no girl would get ready to go alone with any men in her car who was threatening her. She made this story to hide her illicit relationship with that men inspite of being married.

Not everyone goes to their parents or the police when being threatened.

From what I gather she was friends with the guy before being engaged, whatever form of relationship it was, I will not speculate like some of you guys do. Often people (any people) will exchange photos of each other, why is it so hard to image that is what went down, why do some of you have to image that something else went down instead, were you in the car with them??

Having said that I feel that her punishment shouldn�t have been doubled for appealing the previous judgment.

I'm glad you said that.

Edited by Angel

~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~

Salams_wife View Drop Down

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Posted: 14 December 2007 at 5:54am

There are a couple questions that keep running through my mind about this case.

1. How do they know they girl was indecently dressed. Are they relying on the rapists as witnesses to that? I have not read of any witnesses outside the victims and the rapists.

2. I also wonder if the boy in the car was convicted for being alone with a non-woman relative. It seems to me he should be getting the same punishment as the girl originally recieved. Especially since you can really put the original blame of this whole incident on him. If he had never contacted the girl, none of this would have happened.

I also wonder, like Angel, how those guys knew and were waiting for them. The whole case seems suspicious to me, but I am not in the court so maybe we are misssing some details.