How To Get To Heaven When You Die

islamispeace wrote: Just because "every" civilization (notice the quotation marks) mentions a flood story doesn't mean that there was a universal flood.  If the flood was global, then there should be a large gap in the historical record.  Yet, we know that Ancient Egypt has a continuous record spanning thousands of years.

Hmm, interesting... and true.....

islamispeace wrote: Man was put on earth because that was God's plan from the start.  Once human civilization started on earth, death was already preordained for all of us.  Like I said, death has always existed in the earthly life.  It did not magically appear because of man's sin.

Hmm, interesting also...
I do not believe death was intended for man, as that would negate the idea of providing him a paradise wouldn't it?
I believe in the Genesis account which is attributed to have come through the teaching of Moses.

I am always pondering, how did we come to be on this planet, and you provide me with some interesting alternative thoughts.

It is interesting that you have a completely different idea of how man came to be on earth.
Can you remind me please, why you believe Adam was sent to earth?


I don't believe man can exist in biological form elsewhere in the universe.  I believe the earth was created specifically for this biological form.
I do believe there may be other 'earths'.... as Yshwe spoke of His 'many mansions' and how He 'goes to prepare a place'.
I also believe this earth may be a form of hell, or purgatory...
but to come, to the Creator, is to leave the biological form...
the biological from must either seek its way to the Creator, working its way through the levels of purgation... 'purging the dross', seeking purification,
or it must meet its end in its total dissolution, left behind as the dross.  As a transforming energy we are either on our way up, or on our way down.

I will today be seeking to learn if Yshwe ever addressed the issue of original sin.  He did say,

⁶ ... I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

asalaam,
CH


Edited by Caringheart - 25 September 2014 at 1:22pm

Caringheart wrote: islamispeace wrote: Caringheart wrote: Greetings islamispeace, Are you saying that muslims reject the creation story given in the Genesis account of the Torah? Do they not believe in the 7 days of creation? Why is it (as muslims think) that we have a 7 day week? Do muslims observe a day of rest, or devotion to the Creator?  and if they do, why do they?  Why are they required to do so? Which leads me also to ask, do muslims reject also, the story of Noah and the ark and the flood, given in the Genesis account of the Torah? asalaam, CH The "7 days of Creation" are not to be taken literally.  In Arabic, a "day" can also mean a long period of time.  There is no "day of rest".  We have Friday prayers, but the whole day is not a "day of rest". As for the flood, there is nothing in the Quran to indicate that the flood was global and that Noah had to take two of every animal onto the ark.  More likely, it was a regional flood that affected Noah's people only.  The fossil record doesn't lie.  You can choose to accept reality or continue to live in your fantasy world. Greetings islamispeace, what I have underlined.... I agree with these things.... as I keep telling you, there is no need for casting insults, they add nothing to your credibility. Now as regards the Noah's flood story of the Genesis account in the Torah, however.... How do you account for the fact that every region and civilization in the world has a flood story? for me the jury is still out on the Noah's flood story. Now, my point on the 7 days of creation... if you believe in the 7 days of creation(however long those days may have been)... do you not also see that the earth was created for man... as his paradise... that life was created for man, and that man was to be put here as the only creature that would not die? asalaam, CH

Just because "every" civilization (notice the quotation marks) mentions a flood story doesn't mean that there was a universal flood.  If the flood was global, then there should be a large gap in the historical record.  Yet, we know that Ancient Egypt has a continuous record spanning thousands of years.  I dealt with this issue in greater detail on my blog:

http://quranandbible.blogspot.com/2014/01/normal-0-false-false-false-en-us-x-none_14.html

Man was put on earth because that was God's plan from the start.  Once human civilization started on earth, death was already preordained for all of us.  Like I said, death has always existed in the earthly life.  It did not magically appear because of man's sin.

Caringheart wrote: islamispeace wrote: Have you studied the history of life?  Life has existed on earth for over 500 million years.  Just take a look at the fossil record.  As long as life has existed, so has death.  That's reality, but I understand that you prefer fantasy. I think part of the confusion among Christians is that the Bible erroneously states that the "Garden of Eden" was on earth.  The Quran, on the other hand, states that Adam and Eve were in Paradise (not on earth) before they were cast out.  In Paradise, of course, there is no death.  But when Adam and Eve were cast out, they were forced to live on earth where life had existed for millions of years.  Death is a natural part of earthly existence.  It didn't require one man's sin to magically appear. Greetings islamispeace, Are you saying that muslims reject the creation story given in the Genesis account of the Torah? Do they not believe in the 7 days of creation? Why is it (as muslims think) that we have a 7 day week? Do muslims observe a day of rest, or devotion to the Creator?  and if they do, why do they?  Why are they required to do so? Which leads me also to ask, do muslims reject also, the story of Noah and the ark and the flood, given in the Genesis account of the Torah? asalaam, CH

Yes, Muslims reject all the contradictory and erroneous parts of the Bible. 

The "7 days of Creation" are not to be taken literally.  In Arabic, a "day" can also mean a long period of time.  There is no "day of rest".  We have Friday prayers, but the whole day is not a "day of rest".

As for the flood, there is nothing in the Quran to indicate that the flood was global and that Noah had to take two of every animal onto the ark.  More likely, it was a regional flood that affected Noah's people only. 

The fossil record doesn't lie.  You can choose to accept reality or continue to live in your fantasy world. 

Caringheart wrote: No one in their right mind would reject the free gift of someone paying their debt for them.

Except that it's not exactly "free".  Think about it, dear.  A "free" gift means you don't have to give anything in return.  If God was offering a "free gift", then salvation would be given to all people regardless of what they do or believe.  Yet, Christians believe that one has to accept Jesus as their "savior" in order to benefit from this so-called "free gift".  The price of admission is not "free". 

Caringheart wrote: If 'death has always existed alongside life' why in the universe did the Creator cast His creation out of paradise to begin with? How did his creation come to be separated from Him and trying to earn their way back to Him?

Have you studied the history of life?  Life has existed on earth for over 500 million years.  Just take a look at the fossil record.  As long as life has existed, so has death.  That's reality, but I understand that you prefer fantasy.  

I think part of the confusion among Christians is that the Bible erroneously states that the "Garden of Eden" was on earth.  The Quran, on the other hand, states that Adam and Eve were in Paradise (not on earth) before they were cast out.  In Paradise, of course, there is no death.  But when Adam and Eve were cast out, they were forced to live on earth where life had existed for millions of years.  Death is a natural part of earthly existence.  It didn't require one man's sin to magically appear.