ishak & ismael isue |
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Nazarene
Senior Member Male Joined: 05 September 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 298 |
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for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely hebrews 8:13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear Gospel of Peace http://www.essene.com/GospelOfPeace/peace1.html And Jesus answered: "Seek not the law in your scriptures, for the law is life, whereas the scripture is dead. I tell you truly, Moses received not his laws from God in writing, but through the living word. The law is living word of living God to living prophets for living men. In everything that is life is the law written. You find it in the grass, in the tree, in the river, in the mountain, in the birds of heaven, in the fishes of the sea; but seek it chiefly in yourselves. For I tell you truly, all living things are nearer to God than the scripture which is without life. God so made life and all living things that they might by the everlasting word teach the laws of the true God to man. God wrote not the laws in the pages of books, but in your heart and in your spirit. They are in your breath, your blood, your bone; in your flesh, your bowels, your eyes, your ears, and in every little part of your body. They are present in the air, in the water, in the earth, in the plants, in the sunbeams, in the depths and in the heights. They all speak to you that you may understand the tongue and the will of the living God. But you shut your eyes that you may not see, and you shut your ears that you may not hear. I tell you truly, that the scripture is the work of man, but life and all its hosts are the work of our God. Wherefore do you not listen to the words of God which are written in His works? And wherefore do you study the dead scriptures which are the work of the hands of men?" Jesus said: "You do not understand the words of life, because you are in death. Darkness darkens your eyes and your ears are stopped with deafness. For I tell you, it profits you not at all that you pore over dead scriptures if by your deeds you deny him who has given you the scriptureses
my point is the same as stated by our bro. minuteman below .
we must understand where your infomation comes from. as stated above corrupt, outdated and rendered irrelevent by that writen by amens' own hand.
also i belive the story of the prodical son relates to the leaving of isaac. ishmael and abraham remained together.
Edited by Nazarene - 29 September 2008 at 8:55pm |
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love for all conquers all
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robin
Senior Member Joined: 17 May 2008 Status: Offline Points: 595 |
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Isaac is firstborn my God's promise and God's miraculous help to have children when they were both past the age of having children, Abraham was about a 100 yrs. old (Gen 17:17). So from God's viewpoint he is first by God's Will. Ishmael was according to the flesh (not the will of God), and not of God's promise, so I time he was first, but not according to God's will, and is thus not in the line of the promised one to come! |
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Nazarene
Senior Member Male Joined: 05 September 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 298 |
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NOTICE WHO'S NAME IS MENTIONED AT THE BOTTOM. AND REMEMER THE DATE OF THIS.
Thereupon said the disciples: 'O master, it is thus written in the book of Moses, that in Isaac was the promise made.' Jesus answered, with a groan: 'It is so written, but Moses wrote it not, nor Joshua, but rather our rabbins, who fear not God. Verily I say unto you, that if ye consider the words of the angel Gabriel, ye shall discover the malice of our scribes and doctors. For the angel said: "Abraham, all the world shall know how God loveth thee; but how shall the world know the love that thou bearest to God? Assuredly it is necessary that thou do something for love of God." Abraham answered: "Behold the servant of God, ready to do all that which God shall will." 'Then spoke God, saying to Abraham: "Take thy son, thy firstborn Ishmael, and come up the mountain to sacrifice him." How is Isaac firstborn, if when Isaac was born Ishmael was seven years old? Then said the disciples: 'Clear is the deception of our doctors: therefore tell us thou the truth, because we know that thou art sent from God.' Then answered Jesus: 'Verily I say unto you, that Satan ever seeketh to annual the laws of God; and therefore he with his followers, hypocrites and evil-doers, the former with false doctrine, the latter with lewd living, to-day have contaminated almost all things, so that scarcely is the truth found. Woe to the hypocrites! for the praises of this world shall turn for them into insults and torments in hell. 'I therefore say unto you that the messenger of God is a splendour that shall give gladness to nearly all that God hath made, for he is adorned with the spirit of understanding and of counsel, the spirit of wisdom and might, the spirit of fear and love, the spirit of prudence and temperance, he is adorned with the spirit of charity and mercy, the spirit of justice and piety, the spirit of gentleness and patience, which he hath received from God three times more than he hath given to all his creatures. O blessed time, when he shall come to the world! Believe me that I have seen him and have done him reverence, even as every prophet hath seen him: seeing that of his spirit God giveth to them prophecy. And when I saw him my soul was filled with consolation, saying: "O Mohammed, God be with thee, and may he make me worthy to untie thy shoelatchet, for obtaining this I shall be a great prophet and holy one of God." ' And having said this, Jesus rendered his thanks to God. Edited by Nazarene - 22 September 2008 at 7:38pm |
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Nazarene
Senior Member Male Joined: 05 September 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 298 |
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peace
Edited by Nazarene - 21 September 2008 at 7:18pm |
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love for all conquers all
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robin
Senior Member Joined: 17 May 2008 Status: Offline Points: 595 |
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This dramatic episode proved the faith and obedience not only of Abraham but also of his son Isaac. Jewish tradition, recorded by Josephus, says that Isaac was 25 years old at the time. At any rate, he was old enough and strong enough to carry a considerable quantity of wood up a mountain. So, he could have resisted his 125-year-old father when the time came to bind him if he had chosen to be rebellious against Jehovah�s commandments. (Jewish Antiquities, I, 227 [xiii, 2]) Instead, Isaac submissively let his father proceed to offer him as a sacrifice in harmony with God�s will. For this demonstration of Abraham�s faith, Jehovah then repeated and enlarged upon his covenant with Abraham, which covenant was transferred by God to Isaac after the death of Isaac�s father.�Genesis 22:15-18; 26:1-5; Romans 9:7; James 2:21. |
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buddyman
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How interesting that you forget in th eprevious chapter of Genesis, Sarah turns agains Hagar and Abrahams sends her on her way; Gen 21:14 So the truth is as it states in Genesis 22:2 2He said, "Take now (A)your son, your only son, whom you love, Isaac, and go to the land of (B)Moriah, and offer him there as a (C)burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I will tell you." |
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buddyman
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ALL based on the Quran and your opinion. What about the Torah? |
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Saido
Groupie Joined: 28 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 64 |
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An He (God Almighty) said, Take now thy son, THINE ONLY SON...whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering.. &n bsp; &n bsp; Genesis 22:2 If at anytime an offspring of Abraham (pbuh) can be described as "thine only son" it could only be Ishmael, because for thirteen years, he was the only son and seed of Abraham. Ahmed Deedat's The Choice Islam and Christianity "Combat Kit" volume 2 page 53 |
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