earliest quran over 100 years after muham |
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defenders
Newbie Joined: 05 April 2005 Location: Bahrain Status: Offline Points: 11 |
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Posted: 17 April 2005 at 9:14am |
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It was answered by our brothers http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Gilchrist/GilHaj jaj.html Al-Hajj�j, Kit�b al-Mas�hif & Gilchrist M S M Saifullah & Muhammad Ghoniem � Islamic Awareness, All Rights Reserved. There is a rule of thumb which one must learn. Orientalists opine and Missionaries quote them as gospel truth. This will get clearer as we go a bit further. Let us begin where this issue started from. The issue was first polemicised by cAbd al-Mas�h al-Kind� in his apology and uttered by Emperor Leo.
In the footnotes, Jeffery mentions:
Jeffery also mentions about putting of diacritical marks in the Qur'�nic text by al-Hajj�j to make the reading proper because some ignorant Arabs and non-Arabs started mispronouncing the letters. To this Jeffery says:
Apart from such exagerration, the story of account attributed to Leo by Levond (or Ghevond) is mentioned as a later forgery to scandalize the question of al-Hajj�j by some later Christian writer. So, we might as well stop here and dismiss all the allegations of John Gilchrist. But let us go further to expose his deceptive tactics. In his book The Qur'�n as Scripture, Arthur Jeffery relies on Kit�b al-Mas�hif of Ibn Ab� D�w�d to say:
Jeffery, in fact, proposed the minor recension theory by al-Hajj�j. This was also propogated by other Orientalists as it can be seen from the examples below. The Orientalists take care in wording the issue whereas missionaries are as usual driven by crusade mentality to prove Islam wrong. In the book Arabic Literature To The End Of The Ummayad Period the author carefully states the issue of al-Hajj�j without throwing light on the 'variant readings'.
John Gilchrist, a Christian Missionary, who quotes both the references Arabic Literature To The End Of The Ummayad Period and The Qur'�n As Scripture as "Contemporary Books on the Qur'�n" does not even tell the whole story. In his book Jamc al-Qur'�n: The Codification Of The Qur'�n Text, Jeffery's skepticism "he seems" or "al-Hajj�j seems" is quoted as reality.
And obviously, there is no mention of the Christian polemic concerning al-Hajj�j. It is a frequent method employed by Christian Missionaries to supress the information which goes against their viewpoint. The report which is frequently quoted is mentioned in Kit�b al-Mas�hif of Ibn Ab� D�w�d which is available in Materials For The History Of The Text Of The Qur'�n: The Old Codices, 1937, Arthur Jeffery, E J Brill, Leiden. It is important to remember that:
Further research needs to be done along these lines. The report as well as the translation is given below.
The translation of the report as follows: Section: What al-Hajj�j Had Changed in cUthm�n's Mush�f?
The Nature Of Changes Which Al-Hajj�j Made Interestingly enough this report does not provide any clue of the nature of changes that were made by al-Hajj�j in the mush�f of cUthm�n(R). An in-depth study shows that they are the differences in the Qir�'�t. A crash course on Qir�'�t can be obtained from here. So, we will deal with the changes which al-Hajj�j made one by one, inshallah. Dr. cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n did research on this issue for his Ph.D thesis in University of Im�m Muhammad Ibn Saud. His thesis was published as a book from Riyadh in two volumes. The book is called Aar�' al-Mustashriq�n Hawl al-Qur'�n al-Kar�m wa Tafs�r: Dir�sah Wa Naqd (The Views Of The Orientalists About The Holy Qur'�n & Its Interpretation: Study and Criticism). After quoting the had�th of Ibn Ab� D�w�d, Dr. Radw�n mentions in his footnotes about the Qir�'�t which the changes are associated with.
Dr. Radw�n went on to say:
To conclude the issue of al-Hajj�j and the changes he made in the Qur'�n:
And Allah knows best.
References [1] Arthur Jeffery, Ghevond's Text Of The Correspondence Between 'Umar II and Leo III, 1944, Harvard Theological Review, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, Mass., p. 298. [2] Arthur Jeffery, Op.Cit, p.298. [3] Ibid. p.298. [4] Arthur Jeffery, The Qur'�n As Scripture, 1952, Russell F Moore Company Inc., New York, p.99. [5] A F L Beeston, T M Johnstone, R B Serjeant and G R Smith (Editors), Arabic Literature To The End Of The Ummayad Period, 1983, Cambridge University Press, p.243. [6] John Gilchrist, Jamc al-Qur'�n: The Codification Of The Qur'�n Text, 1989, MERCSA. [7] For Kit�b al-Mas�hif see Arthur Jeffery's, Materials For The History Of The Text Of The Qur'�n: The Old Codices, 1937, E J Brill, Leiden, pp. 117-118. [8] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, p. 117. [9] Dr. cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Aar�' al-Mustashriq�n Hawl al-Qur'�n al-Kar�m wa Tafs�r: Dir�sah Wa Naqd, Volume I, 1992, D�r T�bah, Riy�dh, pp. 430. [10] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 117. [11] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.430 [12] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 117. [13] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.430 [14] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 117. [15] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [16] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [17] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [18] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [19] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [20] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [21] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [22] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [23] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [24] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [25] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [26] Arthur Jeffery, Kit�b al-Mas�hif, Op.Cit, p. 118. [27] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.431. [28] cUmar Ibn Ibr�h�m Radw�n, Op.Cit, p.430-431. [29] Abu Ameenah Bilal Philips, Tafseer Soorah Al-Hujuraat, 1990, Tawheed Publications, Riyadh, p.32. ------------------------------------ For Tawhid. Keep cut and paste. The refutation will be there. Please learn more the argumentation. |
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Shams Zaman
Senior Member Male Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 135 |
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This is not only a false claim but a cynical propaganda and not a new one. Such desprate pepole like Jhon Gilchrist once can't find any contradictions in Quran and can't reply to what those contradictions existing in Bible resort to these ignorant claims. Regarding Quran was compiled 20 years after Muhammad�s (MPBUH) death or 100 years, who told them that? Indeed it is news for all those Muslims who have read Islamic History. Well sir Quran was compiled almost two years before the death of Prophet Muhammad. The sequence of Surahs or chapters was told by the Prophet and it was placed in the room of Lady Aysha (wife of Holy Prophet and daughter of first caliph Abu-Bakar). This happened in 9th year after Hijrat or Exodus from Makkah. The Quran was in proper written form but on palm leaves, piece of cloths etc in a bag. Prophet died in 11th year after exodus and there were some problems in the Islamic state outskirts. In one battle War of Yamama some 70 hufaz (who had memorized Quran by heart) died in one day so there was a need to re-write Quran on one medium in one binding. During the first few years of the first Caliph Quran was written on one medium, binded and placed with Lady Aysha. Later once Islam was spreading in the times of Caliph Usman (the 3rd Caliph) it was felt to fix the writing font of Quran as there were reports that at some places people are reciting Quran with changed spellings. Like if you are in The original copy which was arranged by Caliph Usman still lies in Turkey, Istanbul musem with the blood stains of his wife who once tried to save him got injured. There is not a single word which is different from today's Quran and Mr. Jhon can try and visit the whole world to find two different copies of Quran. Shams Zaman Pakistan
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AhmadJoyia
Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647 |
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Hi Tawhid, Probably you need to know about your own scriptures than worrying about the others. Preservation of Quran doesn't mean it must exist as in the bound form right from the time of its first written down. That is the reason Prophet Mohammad never had it in the bound form from its inception. What matters is variations in it from time to time or from places to places. Of course we can never ruled out the possibiltity of not having the complete first copy of Quran. But what is important is its textual accuracy. The claim or challange in the Quran still holds good. So instead of looking around it, it would be prudent to look directly into the challange. BTW, have you ever tried to open up your own pandora of gospels with regard to their authorship and their timeline origin? Do you still trust them to spend you whole life on them even though many human hands have played their role in evolving them to the present state? And you want to challange Quran? But on what basis? Classical case of anonymous authorship of gospel of John must not be forgotten in the minds before going any where else. Hope this shall keep the path straight for everyone of us. May God of Jesus bless us all. Amen. |
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tawhid
Groupie Joined: 28 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 82 |
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angel im sorry...i saw your post... ill respond after work blessings to you angel! tawhid |
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Angel
Senior Member Joined: 03 July 2001 Status: Offline Points: 6641 |
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yesha, tawhid was speaking to me as I hadn't replied
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~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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yesha`
Newbie Joined: 26 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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I agree completely. But's what's really late is the adhadith, which seems to me to be the source of most muslim beliefs. |
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Angel
Senior Member Joined: 03 July 2001 Status: Offline Points: 6641 |
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hey I do have others things to do besides here and there is the time difference to for the time being:
What is fragile is the paper not the words. You're saying just because something is fragile to handle cannot be, in this case God's word (or maybe not God's word)
Where do you get that from my statement ? I never said that because its fragile to reproduce is not God's word. |
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~ Our feet are earthbound, but our hearts and our minds have wings ~
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tawhid
Groupie Joined: 28 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 82 |
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bump up
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