Aadam and Prophets before ’Eesa (Jesus)

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   Dear Israfil,
If I am not offending my christian brothers, I think, academicians have serious objections on the very advent and existance of Christ in this real world. According to them, there was no such person in entire human history with such traits as are usually ascribed to him by NT. So they were cautioned not to mix up the scientific arguments based on hypothetical (according to them) time frame of BC, so they started using B.C.E. 

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AhmadJoyia Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647	Post Options Post Reply Quote AhmadJoyia Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 7:32pm
	Dear Israfil, If I am not offending my christian brothers, I think, academicians have serious objections on the very advent and existance of Christ in this real world. According to them, there was no such person in entire human history with such traits as are usually ascribed to him by NT. So they were cautioned not to mix up the scientific arguments based on hypothetical (according to them) time frame of BC, so they started using B.C.E.

Israfil Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 08 September 2003 Status: Offline Points: 3984	Post Options Post Reply Quote Israfil Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 7:09pm
	By the Way how humans have calculated time and history used the Christian Calendar such as B.C (before Christ) and A.D (after Death) as far as human history is concerned the calculation of human history based on the advent of Jesus is incorrect timetable because for example to say the Homo Sapien came approx 100,000 B.C is not scientifically correct because B.C implies at least some type of civilization usually B.C refers to before the time of Christ but was also allocated to some type of civilization/or person. But this is all my understanding and from the professors of physics and biology in which I studied under. this is why we use the term B.C.E (Before Common Era) and C.E (Common Era)

AhmadJoyia Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647	Post Options Post Reply Quote AhmadJoyia Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 7:09pm
	Your replies seem to be more in generality to my specifics as I can't assume you don't know the few early chapters of the NT as who called on whom to form master-deciple relationship during Prophet Jesus's ministry. or probably, I should not delve more into this aspect. Ok, let us talk about your faith in one God and how you state as "Jesus continues to change souls to this day - no books, no logic involved"? Do you intend to say people still meet Jesus in their visions, the same way as Paul saw him on his trip to damascus? By the way, I am not very sure when did Jesus say that he would be coming to people in this way after he has gone to heavens?

Israfil Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 08 September 2003 Status: Offline Points: 3984	Post Options Post Reply Quote Israfil Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 7:05pm
	Hmmm has anyone decided to answer Mockba's second paragraph on evolution. I highly doubt the human being evolved after Jesus seeing how the Homon Sapien which is us came from the Homo Erectus some 100,000 years ago. So humans inclduing and after Jesus' time were already evolved creatures so I doubt the Christian interpretation of human evolution based on what you mentioned in correct.

DavidC Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Male Christian Joined: 20 September 2001 Location: Florida USA Status: Offline Points: 2474	Post Options Post Reply Quote DavidC Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 5:47pm
	AhmadJoyia, you are viewing things through Muslim spectacles. Jesus did not choose the apostles - they chose him. Any and all were accepted regardless of faults or doubts. Jesus sought out the unlikely, the downtrodden and the victimized. Jesus taught the keys to heaven were were to be given to the poor, victimized and orphaned. Many Christians, including Paul, met Jesus long after Jesus died on earth. Jesus continues to change souls to this day - no books, no logic involved. DavidC

AhmadJoyia Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647	Post Options Post Reply Quote AhmadJoyia Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 2:36pm
	[QUOTE=DavidC] And not even perfect faith at that. I am bit surprised about your comments. I thought these (12 apostles) were specially chosen people by no one else other than all by Jesus himself. That too, once he was right here on this earth where every one else (meaning their peers) were witness to this status given to them. Of course, also, they spent maximum time with Jesus learning all that can be taught by limited time Jesus had with them than anyone else. On the other hand, Paul got more faith instantly ("mircalous by any standard" you said) than anyone else, in the one (Jesus) to whom he never ever met in his whole life. Isn't it strange?

DavidC Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Male Christian Joined: 20 September 2001 Location: Florida USA Status: Offline Points: 2474	Post Options Post Reply Quote DavidC Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 1:13pm
	The apostles were the companions of Jesus. They were not the smartest or the best people - just simple people with faith. And not even perfect faith at that. There is no ranking of saints. See faq.php#idol">Saints Paul is a unique case. He persecuted and condemned Christians under his his original name Saul. Jesus (years after the crucifixion) appeared to Saul andn Saul changed his name to Saul and became the most powerful and effective Christian evangelist. A miraculous change by any standard! DavidC

AhmadJoyia Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 20 March 2005 Status: Offline Points: 1647	Post Options Post Reply Quote AhmadJoyia Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 March 2005 at 9:32am
	Very interesting topic, indeed. Can you, DavidC, elaborate on the apostleship also. What is this kind and where does it fit in the ranking of prophethood and saints etc as the NT sometimes call the diciples of Jesus as apostles so much so that "saint" paul is also sometime seems to claim to be the apostle in some of his letters.