THE BIBLE SAYS TO WORSHIP JESUS IS IDOLAT |
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minuteman
Senior Member Joined: 25 March 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1642 |
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You have agreed and then disagreed. I stress the point again for your understanding that we Muslims do not call any dead man to intercede on our behalf. We always pray to God only and ask everything from HIm. Otherwise, if we have a living leader, we may speak to him or write to him requesting him to pray to The God for our such and such need.
But your last sentence means much different. You still suggest that it is alright to call any one who has passed away to intercede with God on our behalf. That is not possible. Even some Muslims may also be believeing the same thing as you do. But I do not do that. Intercession is another matter. It is only to be done when God permits any one. Not before that. Thanks. Edited by minuteman - 17 July 2008 at 2:56am |
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thomasd
Groupie Joined: 13 July 2008 Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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I agreed that praying to saints isn't a spiritually healthy practice. I disagreed with your actual definition of prayer.
yes, me too.
I suggest that it is neither idolatrous nor blasphemous (which is what the original topic was about). |
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robin
Senior Member Joined: 17 May 2008 Status: Offline Points: 595 |
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The Bible says:-
Colossians 1:3
We thank God the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ always when we pray for YOU,
1 Thessalonians 1:2
We always thank God when we make mention concerning all of YOU in our prayers,
2 Corinthians 13:7
Now we pray to God . . .
Prayers to anyone else other than Almighty God are of no use as the Bible sets the pattern for all Christians; even Jesus prayed to Almighty God and he is:-
1 Peter 2:21
In fact, to this [course] YOU were called, because even Christ suffered for YOU, leaving YOU a model for YOU to follow his steps closely.
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thomasd
Groupie Joined: 13 July 2008 Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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Christian's firmly believe that Jesus and the Almighty God are the same, thus by our beliefs praying to Jesus is equivalent to praying to the Almighty God. |
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robin
Senior Member Joined: 17 May 2008 Status: Offline Points: 595 |
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The followers of Jesus do not agree with you, nor Jesus himself:- John 4:23-24
Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshipers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for, indeed, the Father is looking for suchlike ones to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshiping him must worship with spirit and truth."
True christians only worship the Father as Jesus said!
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PattyaMainer
Senior Member Female Joined: 03 August 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 352 |
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No, you are wrong, Robin. With all due respect, you, like many other non-Catholics incorrectly believe we pray to saints and the Holy Mother of God. That is NOT SO. We ask their help for many problems/situations in life. It is the same as asking a dear friend or relative to "please pray for me." Nothing more, nothing less. Mary is in Heaven, very close to our Lord, as are the saints. We believe they are so close to God, and if we ask them to pray for us too, we are greatly increasing our hope of having our problems, whatever they may be, solved. You should read a good Catechism because you are woefully lacking in your knowledge of what true, devoted Catholics really believe. This is not uncommon, but it is very sad! I mean no disrespect or harshness toward you....but I must speak up when I see my religion being misrepresented. I trust you understand. God's Peace, Patty |
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PattyaMainer
Senior Member Female Joined: 03 August 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 352 |
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I would humbly add this Scripture from Phillipians regarding our Lord, Jesus Christ:
1 If there be therefore any consolation in Christ, if any comfort of love, if any fellowship of the Spirit, if any bowels and mercies, 2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. 3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. 4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. 5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth. |
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Hayfa
Senior Member Female Joined: 07 June 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2368 |
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Patty it is interesting what you wrote..
Is it not St. Anthony the patron saint of lost things? There is a Saint known for this.
Still why pray to a person to help you when you can pray to God?
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When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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